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Old 10-26-2017, 06:58 PM   #51
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

John Malkovich-Ventriloquist
Michael Rooker-Black Mask
Anthony Hopkins-Riddler
Peter Dinklage-Penguin
Brian Cranston-Hugo Strange

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Old 10-30-2017, 03:29 PM   #52
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

I really want to see an Arkham style Penguin. Doesn’t even need to be the big bad. Could just be a persistent background gangster character.

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Old 11-03-2017, 10:35 AM   #53
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

I've been warming up more and more to the idea of Clayface.

- He's a literal monster, which provides a palette cleanse from the verisimilitude of the Nolan films
- He's a shape-shifting serial killer, which provides opportunities for mystery, suspense, and horror
- He has some element of tragedy to him
- He's never been adapted on film before

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Old 11-03-2017, 10:49 AM   #54
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

Riddler would be the ideal villain with Two Face being the secondary villain

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Old 11-03-2017, 10:51 AM   #55
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

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I've been warming up more and more to the idea of Clayface.

- He's a literal monster, which provides a palette cleanse from the verisimilitude of the Nolan films
- He's a shape-shifting serial killer, which provides opportunities for mystery, suspense, and horror
- He has some element of tragedy to him
- He's never been adapted on film before
I'd want him if they could do him right. That's the hard part obviously.

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Old 11-03-2017, 11:14 AM   #56
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

Since we just had a trilogy of Batman films that were a lighter on the supernatural/fantasy side of the mythos, I'd like Reeves to steer his film/s more towards that direction.

I've been thinking about some angles Reeves could take, and the villains that fall under them:

The "monster" movie
Pretty self explanatory. This movie would deal with a mystery with a monster at its core. The obvious choices are:

Basil Karlo/Clayface
Kirk Langstrom/Man-Bat
Waylon Jones/Killer Croc

I think Croc works best as a hired thug, so I'd rule him out. Between Clayface and Man-Bat, I would give the edge to Clayface. While Clayface has supernatural elements to him, he is not nearly as heightened fantasy as Man-Bat is, so he might prove the more palatable concept.

The "occult" movie
This movie would deal with a mystery involving cults, devil-worshipping, and/or the existence of spiritual evil. Something along those lines. Characters that fall under this category right off the top of my head:

Brother Manfred
Deacon Blackfire
Simon Hurt

This is where things get a bit tricky, because now we are getting into very obscure Batman villains here. Blackfire and Manfred are one-off characters appearing in graphic novels, and Simon Hurt is a fairly new addition to the Batman mythos. I wouldn't want Reeves to do a straight adaptation of any graphic novel, so unless he came up with a new story for Manfred, I'd rule him out. I was originally leaning towards Blackfire, but him being the leader of a fanatic cult lurking in Gotham's sewers may be too similar to Bane and The Dark Knight Rises conceptually. So again, unless they changed things up a bit with Blackfire's plot, I'd rule him out too. Simon Hurt seems a good fit here.

The "haunted house" movie
While I would not want a straight adaptation of it, I would love to see a film inspired by A Serious House on Serious Earth. Arkham Asylum has been sorely underutilized on film. It is the "heart of darkness" in Gotham City. It's an old institution with plenty of legends, stories, and superstitions surrounding it. Not to mention the evils that lurk within its walls. I'd very much like a movie where Batman has to solve a mystery inside the asylum. Also, because you have an opportunity to have cameos from Batman's more iconic villains, you can afford to go a bit more obscure with the main antagonist. Any of these would do:

Dr. Cavendish
Hugo Strange
Jeremiah Arkham

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Old 11-03-2017, 11:41 AM   #57
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

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Originally Posted by Boom View Post
Since we just had a trilogy of Batman films that were a lighter on the supernatural/fantasy side of the mythos, I'd like Reeves to steer his film/s more towards that direction.

I've been thinking about some angles Reeves could take, and the villains that fall under them:

The "monster" movie
Pretty self explanatory. This movie would deal with a mystery with a monster at its core. The obvious choices are:

Basil Karlo/Clayface
Kirk Langstrom/Man-Bat
Waylon Jones/Killer Croc

I think Croc works best as a hired thug, so I'd rule him out. Between Clayface and Man-Bat, I would give the edge to Clayface. While Clayface has supernatural elements to him, he is not nearly as heightened fantasy as Man-Bat is, so he might prove the more palatable concept.

The "occult" movie
This movie would deal with a mystery involving cults, devil-worshipping, and/or the existence of spiritual evil. Something along those lines. Characters that fall under this category right off the top of my head:

Brother Manfred
Deacon Blackfire
Simon Hurt

This is where things get a bit tricky, because now we are getting into very obscure Batman villains here. Blackfire and Manfred are one-off characters appearing in graphic novels, and Simon Hurt is a fairly new addition to the Batman mythos. I wouldn't want Reeves to do a straight adaptation of any graphic novel, so unless he came up with a new story for Manfred, I'd rule him out. I was originally leaning towards Blackfire, but him being the leader of a fanatic cult lurking in Gotham's sewers may be too similar to Bane and The Dark Knight Rises conceptually. So again, unless they changed things up a bit with Blackfire's plot, I'd rule him out too. Simon Hurt seems a good fit here.

The "haunted house" movie
While I would not want a straight adaptation of it, I would love to see a film inspired by A Serious House on Serious Earth. Arkham Asylum has been sorely underutilized on film. It is the "heart of darkness" in Gotham City. It's an old institution with plenty of legends, stories, and superstitions surrounding it. Not to mention the evils that lurk within its walls. I'd very much like a movie where Batman has to solve a mystery inside the asylum. Also, because you have an opportunity to have cameos from Batman's more iconic villains, you can afford to go a bit more obscure with the main antagonist. Any of these would do:

Dr. Cavendish
Hugo Strange
Jeremiah Arkham
Part 1 then I would go with Clayface, sequel villain for Part 2 I would go with Joker & Harley and then Part 3 I would go with Dr Hugo Strange

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Old 11-03-2017, 12:00 PM   #58
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

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Riddler would be the ideal villain with Two Face being the secondary villain
Because that certainly went well the first time....


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Old 11-21-2017, 06:13 AM   #59
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

In going back and watching TAS, I think we really need a movie where Scarecrow has a chance to shine & really show what he can do. I'd like for them to go either an Arkham video game route with him or something along the lines of the redesign he was given for The New Adventures.

Actually, I'd really, really prefer the latter. I love that western gothic monster feel that was applied to Scarecrow & on film, if handled properly it could be very effective.

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Old 11-21-2017, 08:40 AM   #60
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

Hugo Stange
Zsasz (a proper version... not what we got in Batman Begins or Gotham)
Rupert Thorne
Poison Ivy

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Old 11-21-2017, 09:20 AM   #61
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

I’ve always wanted to see the more “fantastical” villains as I feel we’ve only really gotten the more grounded ones on film thus far, besides Croc in SS. I don’t see Reeves going that route, though.

I’d love to see Clayface, Man-Bat, Ivy again with some really crazy plants and vines that she controls, Mr. Freeze, and a really twisted Scarecrow.

As for the more grounded, the only one I truly care to see is Catwoman.

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Old 11-21-2017, 09:37 AM   #62
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

I have a feeling we'll end up seeing Red Hood. I'm hoping we also get the Court of Owls at some point too. I think they're unusually perfect and ripe for cinematic adaptation.

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Old 11-21-2017, 09:39 AM   #63
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

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I’ve always wanted to see the more “fantastical” villains as I feel we’ve only really gotten the more grounded ones on film thus far, besides Croc in SS. I don’t see Reeves going that route, though.

I’d love to see Clayface, Man-Bat, Ivy again with some really crazy plants and vines that she controls, Mr. Freeze, and a really twisted Scarecrow.

As for the more grounded, the only one I truly care to see is Catwoman.
I kind of have my doubts that Reeves will choose a "high fantasy" concept villain, as well.

I don't think he'll push verisimilitude quite as hard as Nolan did, but by the same token I expect his take on Batman will be more grounded than what we've seen in the DCEU.

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Old 11-21-2017, 09:46 AM   #64
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I kind of have my doubts that Reeves will choose a "high fantasy" concept villain, as well.

I don't think he'll push verisimilitude quite as hard as Nolan did, but by the same token I expect his take on Batman will be more grounded than what we've seen in the DCEU.
For me, I think the thing is that Reeves is probably going to go after the more "personal" villains in Batman's gallery. It's just a reflection of how he seems to generally work as a director and his sensibilities for storytelling. And the issue is that most of the "personal" villains in the Bat-Rogue Gallery aren't very "high fantasy."

It's the difference between a villain like Two-Face or Hush and a villain like Solomon Grundy or Killer Croc. There's stuff about the latter villains that certainly leave their mark and make you remember them, but they don't have the same sort of emotional pull needed to be a film's main antagonist, while the former two do.

It's why I'm thinking Reeves is bound to look at Red Hood and probably villains like Hush or the Court of Owls.

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Old 11-21-2017, 09:56 AM   #65
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

In terms of villains with personal connections that haven't been used yet:

Court of Owls (Talon)
Hugo Strange
Hush
Red Hood
Simon Hurt

Without prior setup, I think using Red Hood right out the gate is risky. That story really only works if you're invested in Jason Todd as a character.

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Old 11-21-2017, 10:39 AM   #66
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Throwing out a crazy idea here, but imagine the potential with using Clayface, Hush, and Hugo Strange all in one movie (or 2). All of those villains can mess with Bruce with their identity theft, and there could be a gnarly detective story there. Something inspired and ambitious like Memento or Inception.

Doubt anyone could pull something like that off though.

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Old 11-21-2017, 10:50 AM   #67
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I like the idea of a Hugo Strange / Simon Hurt pairing. Batman vs psychologists. Have them as members of the Black Glove and introduce a city wide conspiracy.

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Old 11-21-2017, 11:00 AM   #68
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You guys who want monsters will be waiting a long time. The movies will probably be a scaled down, noir version of Nolan's style with a different aesthetic. The options are Riddler, Penguin, Black Mask, Hush, Court of Owls, Red Hood, Joker, Catwoman, Harley, Deadshot, Strange, Two Face. Some of those names won't appear, some will, and some will have cameos. Don't expect Reeves to go into the metahumans direction, because I don't think he's interested, and especially after Justice League, he and the studio will want to avoid that. You also have to consider Jake's taste. Do you think an actor like him (just like Bale) will sign up for some batman movie that features Man Bat or Clayface? I just don't believe it.

Reeves loves Nolans films. And he said he wants to do something closer to Fincher's Zodiac, Se7en and The Game. So get the monsters out of your head!

I don't see Hugo Strange working now that the general audience is getting used to a Dr Strange from Marvel. It's fine for us, but it will confuse the general audience.

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Old 11-21-2017, 11:09 AM   #69
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I hope WB is able to go into the project without having a billion dollars in mind. While it may not set records, a smaller-scale Batman film could still turn a nice profit. Something in a similar ballpark as Logan.

If they are expecting Reeves to deliver on the same scale that Nolan did, I think we may be in for a rough ride.

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Old 11-21-2017, 11:19 AM   #70
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

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I have a feeling we'll end up seeing Red Hood. I'm hoping we also get the Court of Owls at some point too. I think they're unusually perfect and ripe for cinematic adaptation.
Agreed. The Court of Owls is just about perfect for a cinematic presentation. A unique underground "cult" that has ties to the city as well as the Waynes with undead assassins at their beckoned call?! Yes, please. I'll have that.

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Old 11-21-2017, 11:22 AM   #71
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Throwing out a crazy idea here, but imagine the potential with using Clayface, Hush, and Hugo Strange all in one movie (or 2). All of those villains can mess with Bruce with their identity theft, and there could be a gnarly detective story there. Something inspired and ambitious like Memento or Inception.

Doubt anyone could pull something like that off though.
Reeves made an army of overly intelligent CG apes more charismatic than most directors can Oscar winners. I think if that's what he wanted, he could pull it off.

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Old 11-21-2017, 11:23 AM   #72
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I think its kinda sad that Red Hood,Court of Owls,Hush and Dr Hurt are being tossed around as potential villains. These characters were literally created in the last decade and none of them are classics. The only recent villain I'd call a classic is Professor Pyg. Now I love Dr Hurt, huge Morrison fan but Pyg and Prometheus are superior candidates. Hush just sucks and so does Black Mask frankly. Red Hood is overused and overdone at this point and the Court I cant take seriously at all. Every comic and tv show and animated film they starred in ends up fodderizing them.

I'd personally like if the Reeves trilogy of films kick off with an intro villain. Say Batman fights off Pyg in the opening scenes of the first movie, then Man-Bat in the next film and so on.I think monsters can be done in that manner. As for main villains I'd like Poison Ivy, Hugo Strange and Deathstroke. Also I wouldn't mind a reverse Knightfall film where Batman goes to Santa Prisca, infiltrates Pena Duro and takes down Bane who is operating an international criminal empire from there. I know its like Tom King's I am Suicide story but that one had shoddy execution. Court and Hush though? I probably wont even watch it in cinema.

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Old 11-21-2017, 11:23 AM   #73
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Default Re: Villains we need to see in this Batman solo franchise

Yes, the Court of Owls would be great. I’d love them to rip right from the comics and have Batman start losing his mind and give us some weird camera angles.

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Old 11-21-2017, 11:26 AM   #74
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I hope WB is able to go into the project without having a billion dollars in mind. While it may not set records, a smaller-scale Batman film could still turn a nice profit. Something in a similar ballpark as Logan.

If they are expecting Reeves to deliver on the same scale that Nolan did, I think we may be in for a rough ride.
Well, with JL not even breaking 100 mil, I'd hope they'd adjust ALL of their expectations. I didn't expect massive numbers, but I sure expected more than...well...more than that.

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Old 11-21-2017, 11:27 AM   #75
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You guys who want monsters will be waiting a long time. The movies will probably be a scaled down, noir version of Nolan's style with a different aesthetic. The options are Riddler, Penguin, Black Mask, Hush, Court of Owls, Red Hood, Joker, Catwoman, Harley, Deadshot, Strange, Two Face. Some of those names won't appear, some will, and some will have cameos. Don't expect Reeves to go into the metahumans direction, because I don't think he's interested, and especially after Justice League, he and the studio will want to avoid that. You also have to consider Jake's taste. Do you think an actor like him (just like Bale) will sign up for some batman movie that features Man Bat or Clayface? I just don't believe it.

Reeves loves Nolans films. And he said he wants to do something closer to Fincher's Zodiac, Se7en and The Game. So get the monsters out of your head!

I don't see Hugo Strange working now that the general audience is getting used to a Dr Strange from Marvel. It's fine for us, but it will confuse the general audience.
Yeah...because having metahumans was what went wrong with JL

Alas, studie execs always learn the wrong lessons so I'm sure that's what they're thinking.

Also, how are Hugo Strange and Dr. Strange related at all besides sharing a last name? Fox and Marvel literally used the same character

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