Coleman Reese is the Riddler

[kewlmatto]

While Ed Nygma may have been at least partial inspiration for Coleman Reese, I think it's quite a stretch to say the character we see in TDK is the Riddler or a proto-Riddler.

I am glad too. He was a fairly pathetic character, and while sometimes Edward Nygma has been shown this way, it certainly doesn't do the character justice.

As much as I like Cillian Murphy, his Scarecrow is really just a lackey. It would have been disappointing to see Riddler the same way.

[Holiday]

Originally Posted by Changeling

I can believe that Mr Reese was supposed to be a nod to the Riddler, in fact, watching The Dark Knight with that in mind, it has actually helped me enjoy the movie a little more (hard to do) if I trick myself into thinking he is supposed to be The Riddler.

I really wish they wouldve just named him Edward Nashton, John Blake shouldve had the same name as a Robin (Dick WAS on the Police Force...I wouldnt be mad if John Blake was called Dick Grayson)

And the chubby cop in TDK shouldve been called Bullock, and the latina one (even though she sold out) shouldve been called Renee Montoya

No. Just... no.

That would be an insult to all of those comic characters except in the case of naming John Blake Dick Grayson, which would have given away what Nolan and Co.'s plans for him were right away.

[Rocketman]

Originally Posted by Changeling

I can believe that Mr Reese was supposed to be a nod to the Riddler, in fact, watching The Dark Knight with that in mind, it has actually helped me enjoy the movie a little more (hard to do) if I trick myself into thinking he is supposed to be The Riddler.

I really wish they wouldve just named him Edward Nashton, John Blake shouldve had the same name as a Robin (Dick WAS on the Police Force...I wouldnt be mad if John Blake was called Dick Grayson)

And the chubby cop in TDK shouldve been called Bullock, and the latina one (even though she sold out) shouldve been called Renee Montoya

Yeah, I never understood this either. The characters are right there. Just give them the damn names.

[shauner111]

They could have just given them their names from the comics. But i can accept it if Reese was a nod to the Riddler, or Barsad was a nod to Deadshot, Stephens/Bullock, Ramirez/Montoya, Jen/Holly.

A nod is good enough i mean..people would expect too many things for the future of Mr. Reese if they called him Edward Nashton from the get-go.

In the case of Barsad or Jen we never hear their names from the script uttered in the movie, so they're whoever you want them to be. Especially Jen, to me that's Holly Robinson and i dont care what they wrote in the script..it's goddamn Holly! Barsad on the other hand is only getting attention because of 1 little scene where he's like a sniper. Even Detective Stephens doesn't really remind me of Harvey Bullock. That's just people desperately wanting the character in the movie.

I've heard even more speculation. One was that Thomas Schiff was Nolans version of MadHatter, since he was a schizophrenic from Arkham LOL. Or that Tiny Lister's character (Huge black dude with the tattoos who was on the ferries) is Amygdala. Which is more believable because of his behavior. I've heard people say he might be Killer Croc (Brian Azzarello style) or even a henchmen of Black Masks. I still don't see that comparison no matter how many times i hear ppl say "LOOK AT THE BLACK MASK TATTOO ON HIS NECK!". Maybe i dont have good eyes?? lol.

I remember another one......
Gambol could be Black Mask (his name is Roman Sionis and he starts out with Gambol as a nickname until his face gets disfigured). I remember it came out of an argument in a different forum. "Joker couldn't have killed him by just slashing his mouth". And that Tiny Lister from the ferries (see above^) was his henchmen. It probably came from the people who wanted Black Mask in the 3rd film.

The Reese stuff i can buy into but not the Thomas Schiff/Gambol speculation for instance. That's a little too much. In fact when i watch TDK now the Reese & Riddler nods are actually more clear.

[Baramos]

Honestly Wuertz was more like Bullock. Bullock was dirty when he first was introduced. He also disliked Batman (Stephens never shows a dislike of Batman, he even claps for Dent when he thinks Dent is Batman on the way to the armored car) On the other hand while Ramirez is definitely a stand in for Montoya I don't think Montoya was ever dirty.

Of course, Stephens represents the good side of Bullock.

Basically I think they just change the names and create new characters while keeping the same archetypes because 1. the archetypes are convenient (Gordon needs a right-hand man, so we get Stephens, but we also need a dirty cop in his department, so we get Wuertz) and 2. so we are in the dark as to their eventual fate (Wuertz is killed off--if he were named Bullock, he would never have gotten iced. Same with Ramirez, if she were Montoya we'd never be scared that she'd get killed).

I think Reese easily fulfills the archetype of the Riddler (someone who is intelligent, figures out Batman's identity, seeks to use it against him), but they don't go ahead and name him Edward Nygma because they want to be flexible about what they do with him and leave us guessing as to what the character's ultimate fate is.

[shauner111]

Good point Baramos.

[BlueLightning]

Talking about it, I guess it was made in service of of the story they wanted to play. Could they made Reese the Riddler? Yes. Could they made Wuertz and Ramirez into Bullock and Montoya? Of course! But in the end, naming the characters as such could be made into greater deviations that we wouldn't like. For example, giving prominency to Reese as The Riddler would require us to want to see him a little more. Same thing with Wuertz and Montoya. For example, I wouldn't want Bullock to be like Wuertz, and Montoya as Ramirez, even if I liked Ramirez character.

The only one who could had a comic book counterpart would be Jen. Why didn't they used the name? But all in all, they are just nods at most.

[shauner111]

I dont remember if Jen's name was uttered in the movie. Maybe it was just in the script, which means she can still be called Holly Robinson if you like. I believe "Barsad" was just in the script as well.