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Old 04-30-2018, 02:22 PM   #76
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

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Originally Posted by m1ll3r View Post
Well done, mate. This is very good.

I don't think Nolan would have allowed the shared universe nods in his movies, but other than that, this could have been a perfectly reasonable game plan for DC. One that would have easily challenged the MCU's dominance.
Thanks.

One could argue that, by accepting the job of making a Batman movie, Nolan would have no choice but to allow little nods to a shared DC universe. After all, you can’t have a Batman movie without setting it in the fictional city of Gotham. Since Gotham exists in the Nolan-verse it stands to reason that other fictional cities like Metropolis and Central City also exist. And the nods to an extended DC universe don’t have to be overly obvious. Have Bruce Wayne reading a copy of The Daily Planet with his morning coffee, for example. Maybe the front page article could be covering Lex Luthor’s presidential campaign, and be written by either Clark Kent or Lois Lane. A very small detail, but one that fans might notice none the less. Besides, the character of Batman belongs to DC comics, which in turn belongs to WB. If WB tells Nolan “You absolutely HAVE to make this movie open for a crossover with Superman movies” then he’ll either have to do what he’s told or find another movie to work on. It’s just the way the industry works.

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Old 04-30-2018, 03:10 PM   #77
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

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Recasting batman was big mistake not alot of people talk about. Also batman being old was a mistake when everyone else in the league is just starting out. Except diana
I don't think they had any choice about recasting. Nolan was done and I remember Bale saying that he'd only consider returning if Nolan decided to. As for going with an older Batman, I thought it was an interesting move at the time - and still do for a standalone non-extended universe story - but with hindsight for an extended universe I agree it was a mistake.

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Old 04-30-2018, 04:44 PM   #78
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

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BVS should have been maybe 10 movies into the dceu. You need a few movies showing who batman and superman are and why them clashing is a big deal to the fans. Now if bale had stayed on as batman then it would have worked when we got bvs because bales batman had 3 movies under its belt. Recasting batman was big mistake not alot of people talk about. Also batman being old was a mistake when everyone else in the league is just starting out. Except diana
Or at least 5 movies into the franchise. There should have been at least one movie for each member of the JLA, or at least the top three or four. Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman can all have their own stand alone movies. The Flash could probably have his own movie as well. Aquaman and Cyborg are probably the two least likely to have successful individual movies, and should be introduced as secondary characters in the movies of the other three or four JLA members. Then do a BvS movie, minus the introduction of Doomsday (that should be saved for a JLA movie).

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Old 04-30-2018, 04:58 PM   #79
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

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Thanks.

One could argue that, by accepting the job of making a Batman movie, Nolan would have no choice but to allow little nods to a shared DC universe. After all, you can’t have a Batman movie without setting it in the fictional city of Gotham. Since Gotham exists in the Nolan-verse it stands to reason that other fictional cities like Metropolis and Central City also exist. And the nods to an extended DC universe don’t have to be overly obvious. Have Bruce Wayne reading a copy of The Daily Planet with his morning coffee, for example. Maybe the front page article could be covering Lex Luthor’s presidential campaign, and be written by either Clark Kent or Lois Lane. A very small detail, but one that fans might notice none the less. Besides, the character of Batman belongs to DC comics, which in turn belongs to WB. If WB tells Nolan “You absolutely HAVE to make this movie open for a crossover with Superman movies” then he’ll either have to do what he’s told or find another movie to work on. It’s just the way the industry works.
Completely agree. And I’m pretty sure Nolan would have walked away, if he’d been forced into helping to build a shared universe. Then who knows what would have happened?

In fact, if the whole notion of a shared comic book universe had existed back then, I doubt we would have got the Dark Knight trilogy at all. Which would have been a bad thing in one respect, but if WB had had a game plan like yours in place back then, then we’d be looking at a globally successful DCU right now instead of the MCU, I think.

Ah, it’s all just such a shame WB are so comprehensively awful at handling the DC IP. I continue to pray for a sell off.

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Old 04-30-2018, 05:02 PM   #80
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

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Completely agree. And I’m pretty sure Nolan would have walked away, if he’d been forced into helping to build a shared universe. Then who knows what would have happened?

In fact, if the whole notion of a shared comic book universe had existed back then, I doubt we would have got the Dark Knight trilogy at all. Which would have been a bad thing in one respect, but if WB had had a game plan like yours in place back then, then we’d be looking at a globally successful DCU right now instead of the MCU, I think.

Ah, it’s all just such a shame WB are so comprehensively awful at handling the DC IP. I continue to pray for a sell off.
Have you ever looked at that 'alternate history' website? It sounds like one for them!

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Old 04-30-2018, 05:05 PM   #81
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

Cyborg should be a member of the Teen Titans. John Stewart should be in the Justice League instead.

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Old 04-30-2018, 05:06 PM   #82
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

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Cyborg should be a member of the Teen Titans. John Stewart should be in the Justice League instead.
Definitely.

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Old 04-30-2018, 05:12 PM   #83
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God it was so shortsighted for WB to release Batman begins and Superman Returns back to back like that and not place them in the same universe. So much squandered potential

Rough and Bale would’ve been so much better than Cavill and Affleck.

Joss should’ve polished up his script and done Wonder Woman. Angelina Jolie’s would’ve been perfect.

We could’ve had Begins in ‘05, SR in ‘06, and Wonder Woman in ‘07.

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Old 04-30-2018, 07:47 PM   #84
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

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So you would just copy the MCU formula?
It isn’t just the MCU formula though. It’s the formula for all extended cinematic universes. That formula has been used since the 1930’s. Marvel tweaked it a bit due to the large number of characters that they were trying to integrate into their MCU, but it’s the same formula.

Let’s look at the Universal Monster Movies from the 1930’s and 1940’s. First there was Dracula. Then Frankenstein. Then The Wolf Man. Then The Mummy. The Invisible Man. Doctor Jekyl and Mister Hyde. The Creature From The Black Lagoon.

Then came the crossovers. Dracula vs The Mummy. Frankenstein Meets The Wolf Man. The Invisible Man vs Doctor Jekyl and Mister Hyde, etc. And then finally after all of that we got House Of Frankenstein.

What WB did was give us Dracula, then Dracula vs The Mummy, and then went right to The House Of Frankenstein. That is NOT the way to build a cinematic universe.

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Old 04-30-2018, 08:13 PM   #85
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

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It isn’t just the MCU formula though. It’s the formula for all extended cinematic universes. That formula has been used since the 1930’s. Marvel tweaked it a bit due to the large number of characters that they were trying to integrate into their MCU, but it’s the same formula.

Let’s look at the Universal Monster Movies from the 1930’s and 1940’s. First there was Dracula. Then Frankenstein. Then The Wolf Man. Then The Mummy. The Invisible Man. Doctor Jekyl and Mister Hyde. The Creature From The Black Lagoon.

Then came the crossovers. Dracula vs The Mummy. Frankenstein Meets The Wolf Man. The Invisible Man vs Doctor Jekyl and Mister Hyde, etc. And then finally after all of that we got House Of Frankenstein.

What WB did was give us Dracula, then Dracula vs The Mummy, and then went right to The House Of Frankenstein. That is NOT the way to build a cinematic universe.
What WB did was Dracula, then Dracula vs Frankenstein, then Frankenstein's other monsters, then Wolfman since he hypothetically showed up briefly in the 2nd one, and then House of Dracula.

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Old 04-30-2018, 08:30 PM   #86
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

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Completely agree. And I’m pretty sure Nolan would have walked away, if he’d been forced into helping to build a shared universe. Then who knows what would have happened?

In fact, if the whole notion of a shared comic book universe had existed back then, I doubt we would have got the Dark Knight trilogy at all. Which would have been a bad thing in one respect, but if WB had had a game plan like yours in place back then, then we’d be looking at a globally successful DCU right now instead of the MCU, I think.

Ah, it’s all just such a shame WB are so comprehensively awful at handling the DC IP. I continue to pray for a sell off.
Well they might not have insisted on there being a shared cinematic DC universe. But they might have insisted that some of the fictional cities and countries from the DC universe should be included. Like I said earlier, have Bruce Wayne read a copy of The Daily Planet with his morning coffee. Have a news report on the TV about the civil war in Corto Maltez (or however you spell that fake country’s name). Little things like that which tells the audience that Gotham isn’t the only fake city in this cinematic version of the DC universe.

And then maybe after The Dark Knight (which, in my opinion, is the best of the three films in The Dark Knight Trilogy) they can spring it on Nolan that they want to do crossovers with other movies set in the DC universe. If he walks, replace him with Joss Whedon and watch the money start rolling in.

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Old 05-01-2018, 12:16 PM   #87
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Or another way to do it:

Man of Steel (1st film of the DCEU)
The Batman (2nd film of the DCEU)
Batman vs Superman: Dawn of Justice (3rd film of the DCEU)
The Flash (4th film of the DCEU)
Green Lantern Corps (5th film of the DCEU)
Aquaman (6th film of the DCEU)
Wonder Woman (7th film of the DCEU)
Justice League (8th film of the DCEU)

Phase 1 Complete

Then my Phase 2 would have looked like this:

The Batman 2 (1st film of Phase 2)
Man of Steel 2 (2nd film of Phase 2)
Green Lantern Corps 2 (3rd film of Phase 2)
Aquaman 2 (4th film of Phase 2)
Flash 2 (5th film of Phase 2)
Shazam (6th film of Phase 2)
Wonder Woman 2 (7th film of Phase 2)
Justice League 2 (8th film of Phase 2)

Then Phase 3 would look like this:

Blue Beetle & Booster Gold (1st film of Phase 3)
Zatanna (2nd film of Phase 3)
Hawkman & Hawkgirl (3rd film of Phase 3)
The Batman 3 (4th film of Phase 3)
Wonder Woman 3 (5th film of Phase 3)
Flash 3 (6th film of Phase 3)
Kingdom Come (7th film of Phase 3)

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Old 05-01-2018, 11:17 PM   #88
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

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Then my Phase 2 would have looked like this:

The Batman 2 (1st film of Phase 2)
Man of Steel 2 (2nd film of Phase 2)
Green Lantern Corps 2 (3rd film of Phase 2)
Aquaman 2 (4th film of Phase 2)
Flash 2 (5th film of Phase 2)
Shazam (6th film of Phase 2)
Wonder Woman 2 (7th film of Phase 2)
Justice League 2 (8th film of Phase 2)

Then Phase 3 would look like this:

Blue Beetle & Booster Gold (1st film of Phase 3)
Zatanna (2nd film of Phase 3)
Hawkman & Hawkgirl (3rd film of Phase 3)
The Batman 3 (4th film of Phase 3)
Wonder Woman 3 (5th film of Phase 3)
Flash 3 (6th film of Phase 3)
Kingdom Come (7th film of Phase 3)
Would Hawkman and Hawkgirl be the first appearance of the Hawks, or would you have them seen/teased in any of the earlier films?

I'd love the DCEU to finish with a full-on adaptation of Kingdom Come. I know a lot of people don't like Snyder (and he's pretty much gone now anyway) but honestly I think all that apocalyptic imagery and battle is just made for him! But then I loved his Watchmen

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Old 05-02-2018, 08:54 AM   #89
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Would Hawkman and Hawkgirl be the first appearance of the Hawks, or would you have them seen/teased in any of the earlier films?

I'd love the DCEU to finish with a full-on adaptation of Kingdom Come. I know a lot of people don't like Snyder (and he's pretty much gone now anyway) but honestly I think all that apocalyptic imagery and battle is just made for him! But then I loved his Watchmen
They would be teased in my Zatanna post credit scene pretty much building up to their solo film

Then Kingdom Come would basically be my Infinity War of DC

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Old 05-02-2018, 10:43 AM   #90
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They would be teased in my Zatanna post credit scene pretty much building up to their solo film

Then Kingdom Come would basically be my Infinity War of DC
And Kingdom Come should be the end. That's it. Fin. I mean there'd be more DC films in the future obviously, but KC should be the coda for your plan IMHO. And seriously, how could you follow that anyway.

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Old 05-02-2018, 12:43 PM   #91
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And Kingdom Come should be the end. That's it. Fin. I mean there'd be more DC films in the future obviously, but KC should be the coda for your plan IMHO. And seriously, how could you follow that anyway.
Kingdom Come would be my Infinity War with Darkseid as villain but I would split the movie in 2 parts especially given how big of a spectacle it would be; JL1 villain would be Steppenwolf of course and JL2 would be Stereo

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Old 05-02-2018, 07:24 PM   #92
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

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Kingdom Come would be my Infinity War with Darkseid as villain but I would split the movie in 2 parts especially given how big of a spectacle it would be; JL1 villain would be Steppenwolf of course and JL2 would be Stereo
You'd insert Darkseid into Kingdom Come? Why?

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Old 05-02-2018, 11:53 PM   #93
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Kingdom Come would be my Infinity War with Darkseid as villain but I would split the movie in 2 parts especially given how big of a spectacle it would be; JL1 villain would be Steppenwolf of course and JL2 would be Stereo
That doesn't make any sense. Superman is the bad guy in Kingdom Come.

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Old 05-03-2018, 12:56 AM   #94
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I'll just do a "Phase 1"

1) Man of Steel - It's probably the only DC movie I thought had any replay value. I was never the biggest Superman fan but I thought the story was laid out perfect and laid out a nice story arc for him/Metropolis/Earth for later movies. I would have teased Lex stuff throughout the movie and for a post credit scene, Atlantis tease.

2) I would have had Arrow/Flash on CW, set in the DCU.

3) Aquaman Origin Story - tease a Throne of Atlantis storyline at the end

4) Wonder Woman Origin Story - at the end of the movie she meets Clark for the first time. No convo, movie ends with that.

5) Batman - a story set before Man of Steel takes place but also a few years into Bruce being Batman. I think Hush could be adapted well. No post credit, at this point, we'll know a JL movie is coming out

6) Justice League: Throne of Atlantis - Pretty self-explanatory. Team would insist of Superman, Wonder Woman, Batman, Aquaman, Flash and Arrow. You could tease a lot in this film. I would probably do a GL post credit scene here.

So, yeah, something along those lines I thought could have worked. Another possibility, if they wanted to differ from Marvel and just jump right into thing....

INJUSTICE...

I mean, look, everyone knows who all these characters are at this point, without an Origin movie or not. Why not just adapt the that story? I know it would be pretty hard to do but in the right hands, a 3 part Injustice story could possibly work.

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Old 05-03-2018, 03:18 PM   #95
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

Then my Phase 2 would have looked like this:

The Batman 2 (1st film of Phase 2)
Man of Steel 2 (2nd film of Phase 2)
Green Lantern Corps 2 (3rd film of Phase 2)
Aquaman 2 (4th film of Phase 2)
Flash 2 (5th film of Phase 2)
Shazam (6th film of Phase 2)
Wonder Woman 2 (7th film of Phase 2)
Justice League 2 (8th film of Phase 2)


Thinking about my Phase 3 I realized that I did it all wrong this is how I would do it instead:

Then Phase 3 would look like this:

Blue Beetle & Booster Gold (1st film of Phase 3)
Zatanna (2nd film of Phase 3)
Hawkman & Hawkgirl (3rd film of Phase 3)
The Batman 3 (4th film of Phase 3)
Wonder Woman 3 (5th film of Phase 3)
Flash 3 (6th film of Phase 3)
Justice League 3 (7th film of Phase 3)


* My JL2 back in Phase 2 if you see my original post; in JL2 at like the beginning of the film of JL2 the villains would be the Legion of Doom but they wouldn't be the big threat in this film; the big threat would be Starro after they defeat the Legion of Doom

* Justice League 3 would be Darkseid's big appearance basically split into 2 films like think Deathly Hallows how it was split into 2 films; Justice League 3 would be split into 2 films so Part 2 would essentially be Justice League 4

* I wouldn't do Kingdom Come after all

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Old 05-04-2018, 12:21 AM   #96
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Ah, it’s all just such a shame WB are so comprehensively awful at handling the DC IP. I continue to pray for a sell off.
Could you imagine if Disney were to buy DC from WB?

Not only would we finally get the first decent live action DC movies in decades, but there would even be a possibility of a DC/Marvel Movie crossover (either live action or animated).

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Old 05-04-2018, 07:42 AM   #97
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

I actually think re-writing the DCEU would be quite easy. It'd only require two changes on WB's end, and we'd be looking at a successful cinematic universe that could compete with Marvel:

1) Get rid of Snyder after Man of Steel

2) Kick Wonder Woman into development several years earlier to be released as the second film in the DCEU.

Boom, done. Problem solved. From there you introduce a new Batman and the rest of the Justice League in whatever way you want.

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Old 05-04-2018, 08:46 AM   #98
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

Or a brand new Phase 1 redone by me:

Man of Steel (1st film of the DCEU)
Wonder Woman (2nd film of the DCEU)
The Batman (3rd film of the DCEU)
Green Lantern Corps (4th film of the DCEU)
Flash (5th film of the DCEU)
Aquaman (6th film of the DCEU)
Justice League (7th film of the DCEU)

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Old 05-04-2018, 09:48 AM   #99
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

I've long thought that introducing Batman into the DCEU through a solo film would be a bad idea given how close it is to Nolan's trilogy, but Spider-man has shown that the audience will accept a rebooted version if it's done well. So I think I'm on board with that slate.

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Old 05-04-2018, 10:02 AM   #100
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Default Re: If you could rewrite history as far as the DCEU

I think my ideal Batman series would consist of six interconnected movies. A modern trilogy with Gyleenhaal and a future trilogy with Keaton. It'd go something like this:

Batman 1
Batman 2
Batman 3
The Dark Knight Returns
Batman Beyond 1
Batman Beyond 2

I want to see Batman's story from beginning to end. Rises wasn't an ideal conclusion for me.

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