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Old 10-01-2016, 02:14 PM   #26
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Default Re: FULL SEASON ONE Discussion (NO SPOILER TAGS NECESSARY)

I'm a little disappointed in the season. Don't get me wrong a lot of great stuff, but just too many things that just either dragged on or too quickly over shadowed.

Mariah was such an inconsistent character with her motivations and plans that with ending up on top just didn't make sense. I kinda of get that they wanted her to be a reluctant gangster just keep getting pushed in that direction. But it was so floppily handled.

Diamondback made very little sense, I get that he's crazy, but it went of the deep end to fast and too much. When he first showed he seemed almost like a joke which undermined him as an big criminal mastermind that was being built up.

Misty Knight, while I love that character just kept making so many bad decisions because of plot devises instead of her own character. She's either portrayed as the best cop on the force or a rookie making a ton of mistakes. The series felt like it was always going for a "the system will fail you" path with her when really, she fails the system multiple times. Which makes her seem wildly inconsistent. It also goes back to make Mariah not look like a threat, just stumbling ass backwards into the criminal hierarchy. I still love her character, just hope she doesn't keep making bad choices for sake of the plot.


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A few other random thoughts on the season:

-I don't have a problem with Luke/Claire, but I still can't help but root for Luke/Jessica. Especially now that he's not viewing Reva through rose-colored lenses anymore, I feel like he'll probably be able to forgive her.
I didn't like it just because it felt so forced and slightly out of character for both of them. It was built and portrayed as a platonic friendship and just became romantic. It just didn't seem natural at all. With Jessica and Misty you saw a spark between them, with Claire there was no spark.

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-Didn't love it how, in one episode, we're told the Judas bullets are super duper ridiculously expensive, just for one or two. And a few episodes later an entire NYPD squad is armed with them.
They did specifically say instead of one really expensive bullet they diluted the metal to spread it out over more ammo. So instead of one bullet will a large explosion, you get a bunch of bullets with smaller explosions.


I don't know why they would have the climax of the finale happen so early in the episode. Kind of a poor decision. Also the fight wasn't as great as it should have been. Love the setup but it wasn't as epic as it should have been.

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Old 10-02-2016, 11:41 AM   #27
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i thought it was a good season overall. introducing harlem and black culture to the masses was required and i thought the show did a good job with that.

i still rank daredevil season 1 as the best comic to video presentation ever. and i felt season 2 was almost as good, if not better.

i rank cage and jessica jones around the same.

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Old 10-02-2016, 12:19 PM   #28
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Am I the only one who really liked the last episode?
You are most certainly not. I liked it very much. Mariah was the ultimate *****. Her performance at the police station and her back at the club now running things made for satisfying villainy. She made my blood boil in a good way and I hope we get to love to hate her a lot more going forward. Misty as always was fantastic. Her losing her **** again after finding out about Candice really solidified her as not just the best character on this show but arguably the best character of the Marvel/Netflix shows in general.

I thought we'd get to see some sweet coffee action between Claire and Luke but nevermind. Also, I thought Diamondback in his costume looked more like Cottonmouth from the comics.

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Old 10-02-2016, 12:24 PM   #29
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Am I the only one who really liked the last episode?
Sometimes you gotta go backwards to move foward. Always. Forward.

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Old 10-02-2016, 05:45 PM   #30
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-Didn't love it how, in one episode, we're told the Judas bullets are super duper ridiculously expensive, just for one or two. And a few episodes later an entire NYPD squad is armed with them.
In one of the eps, Diamondback talks about how the bullets can be broken down and the alien metal used for many smaller bullets. "Mass production!" he gloats.

And then when we see the police loading up, they are indeed using much smaller rounds (if still large rifle rounds!) than the big clunkers Diamondback was using.

It's still questionable, since it suggests that Diamondback has an operation somewhere capable of breaking down those alien metal rounds and dividing up the metal into many smaller rounds for this mass production of his, when all we see of his operation is a warehouse full of boxes, which just further begs the question of where the heck he's getting all of this Hammer Tech in the first place. With Hammer in jail, are his employees just selling boxes of military hardware off the back dock?

Eh. Who knows. I turned my brain off when they dunked him in boiling acid, using such sophisticated and measured medical techniques as 'pour in all the salt we have!' and 'turn it up until the circuits blow!' Ugh.


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Old 10-02-2016, 06:00 PM   #31
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Eh. Who knows. I turned my brain off when they dunked him in boiling acid, using such sophisticated and measured medical techniques as 'pour in all the salt we have!' and 'turn it up until the circuits blow!' Ugh.

It's ****ing comic books man. This ain't ER/Grey's Anatomy. You're lucky we got the abalone skin explanation.

If Luke Cage leaned further from blaxploitation/crime-drama and closer to science fiction like say The Flash, then your disgust would have a little more weight.

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Old 10-02-2016, 08:16 PM   #32
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It's still questionable, since it suggests that Diamondback has an operation somewhere capable of breaking down those alien metal rounds and dividing up the metal into many smaller rounds for this mass production of his, when all we see of his operation is a warehouse full of boxes, which just further begs the question of where the heck he's getting all of this Hammer Tech in the first place. With Hammer in jail, are his employees just selling boxes of military hardware off the back dock?
Well they made it seem like Diamondback was the big time arms dealer, he didn't bring his entire organization into Harlem, just came in to personally take on Luke Cage and then became more unhinged. So the idea of him having capabilities for that isn't far fetched.
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Eh. Who knows. I turned my brain off when they dunked him in boiling acid, using such sophisticated and measured medical techniques as 'pour in all the salt we have!' and 'turn it up until the circuits blow!' Ugh.
That whole sequence did take way to many turns. It's like they had several ideas of stuff to happen for that and instead of streamlining it just did them all.

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Old 10-02-2016, 09:02 PM   #33
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Really, really loved this show, I still like DD S2 more but, I might end up preferring this to JJ S1. I really liked the levity this show had, it wasn't Ant-Man funny but it had some really funny moments that I felt JJ lacked.

I wish we had gotten a true happy ending, with Luke turning the Barbershop into his Heroes for Hire office, Pro-Bono edition, but I'll take it. Can't wait for Iron Fist!!!

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Old 10-02-2016, 10:56 PM   #34
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One other thing I want to add. I thought Cottonmouth was a much more compelling villain than Diamondback. I didn't dislike Diamondback, but Cottonmouth seemed like a more layered character. He seemed cut more from the Netflix cloth in a villain you sort of had empathy for.

Diamondback was more like a human reptile. I get that he has a bit of a tragic backstory, but he came off more like your typical villain. Cottonmouth I thought had the better dialogue and speeches to work with. Meanwhile, they make Diamondback a bible-preaching, Warrior quoting bad guy. And look, who hasn't seen that before. Even as a gangster character, Cottonmouth seemed to have his own flavor and style. Diamondback felt like more of a B-movie villain.

I get there is this pain behind all his actions, but I would've liked to see more of that pain come out instead of just pure cruelty.

Just by comparison, I feel like in Daredevil, a lot of Fisk's actions are still rooted in pain and anguish. Pain of his sort of mental frailty in that he's still that little kid under the boot of an abusive father who ended up killing his own father to protect his mother. I feel like in everything we see Fisk do, you can see a little bit of that pain of his past coming through.
I think the problem with the villains was Cottonmouth felt like a complex character who posed no threat to Luke, while Diamondback was a threat to Luke, but was also a one note cartoon villain. If they had a villain who was threatening and interesting at the same time, the series would have been better.

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Old 10-02-2016, 11:16 PM   #35
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They did specifically say instead of one really expensive bullet they diluted the metal to spread it out over more ammo. So instead of one bullet will a large explosion, you get a bunch of bullets with smaller explosions.
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In one of the eps, Diamondback talks about how the bullets can be broken down and the alien metal used for many smaller bullets. "Mass production!" he gloats.

And then when we see the police loading up, they are indeed using much smaller rounds (if still large rifle rounds!) than the big clunkers Diamondback was using.

It's still questionable, since it suggests that Diamondback has an operation somewhere capable of breaking down those alien metal rounds and dividing up the metal into many smaller rounds for this mass production of his, when all we see of his operation is a warehouse full of boxes, which just further begs the question of where the heck he's getting all of this Hammer Tech in the first place. With Hammer in jail, are his employees just selling boxes of military hardware off the back dock?
Thanks guys, I must have totally spaced out during that part. I did struggle to find Diamondback's scenes interesting, so I'll blame that, lol.

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Old 10-02-2016, 11:23 PM   #36
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This season had more Justin Hammer references then Iron Man 2
lol I was really expecting the Diamondback's suit to **** up pretty early in the fight.

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Old 10-03-2016, 01:01 AM   #37
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lol I was really expecting the Diamondback's suit to **** up pretty early in the fight.
I'm still having issues on understanding as to how Diamondback's suit is supposed to work.

We know there's a power cell/battery attached to his back that's giving him super strength, but I don't know how it's supposed to protect him as well since the fabric that he was wearing (aside from his helmet) didn't look like something believable enough that it could repel things.

And I hope Cottenmouth and Diamondback are the last Netflix villains that are presented as ones that became evil because they were abused when they were young.

Could we please get a new kind of villain who's origin is different from child abuse?

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Old 10-03-2016, 01:04 AM   #38
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I kept waiting for Luke to go for the obvious power source on the back of the suit during that fight, and he never did, despite having PLENTY of opportunities to.

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Old 10-03-2016, 01:29 AM   #39
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I enjoyed the season overall. Mike Colter shined once again in the role! The origin was solidly laid out. Pretty much all the actors did well in their parts. The chemistry with Luke, Claire, and Misty was charming. There were scenes that dragged quite a bit. The finale left me with a mixed feel(the tone seemed a bit wobbly). Still, a show worth watching, as the ups outdo the downs.

......ready for Iron Fist!

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Old 10-03-2016, 01:40 AM   #40
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I'm still having issues on understanding as to how Diamondback's suit is supposed to work.
Once you figure out the science for how Luke gets unbreakable skin, the suit is a cinch. Trust me.

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Old 10-03-2016, 01:48 AM   #41
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I have to contradict the folk suggesting Cottonmouth was killed too early. I thought he was killed at just the right time. From about the 2nd or 3rd episode I had predicted the season ending with Black Mariah and Shades established as the big villains going forward.

I think I've probably watched excessive enough amounts of TV to get a feel for structure e and pacing in a season, and Mariah always felt more like a character built to last the Lon haul than Cottonmouth. While they were taking their time unfolding Mariah's darkness, with Fittinmouj I was quickly conscious of how quickly they were burning through his arc. I felt conscious of him not having the juice to be a Big Bad for the whole season, and of him mainly being significant as a facilitator of Mariah's development. Plus I never really
bought him as a threat to Luke Cage, well acted as his part was.

Similarly, Diamondback didn't feel built for the long game. Biggest shock for me was him surviving the season, especially since he didn't live past his first battle with Cage in the comics. And I didn't really like the character. Too OTT and heavy-handed. With how he was built up in the first half of the season as this grand, Fisk-style overboss, once he showed up that deflated, I couldn't buy him as someone able to run a huge criminal operation and stay in the shadows. Honestly, Shades seemed more professional and built for leadership than either Cottonmouth or Diamondback, so I appreciate that he outlasted both and ended up on top.

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Old 10-03-2016, 01:51 AM   #42
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Shades was definitely my favorite of the three. Really looking forward to see him again.

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Old 10-03-2016, 02:08 AM   #43
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I should add that, though I guessed Cottonmouth not making it past midsession, Mariah being the one to off him was a shock. I thought Diamondback would show up and kill him, prompting Mariah to take Diamondback out in retribution by season's end and filling the void herself.

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Old 10-03-2016, 02:43 AM   #44
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I did struggle to find Diamondback's scenes interesting, so I'll blame that, lol.

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Old 10-03-2016, 04:09 AM   #45
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Now I wonder though if they'll ever address the fact, later on of course (most likely in Season 2) that the NYPD are now armed with Judas Bullets. So if those bullets are now easily accessible to the cops, what's to stop the higher corrupted officials from obtaining them and dropping Luke like a fly with them? Sort of defeats the purpose of having bulletproof skin.

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Old 10-03-2016, 05:15 AM   #46
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I did struggle to find Diamondback's scenes interesting, so I'll blame that, lol.
That man needed a warm glass of shut the hell up, stat. All those creepily-delivered Bible quotes. And that smile, he really did look kind of reptilian when he did that, all dead-eyed. Great casting and acting, I'll grant, but the character itself was so unpleasant that you kind of wanted him to go away the entire time he was creeping up the screen.

Still, in a roster of bad-guys who are a bit more complex, and that you can understand, or even kind of feel some empathy for, like Mariah and Cornell and Scarfe, I suppose someone like Diamondback, who was just uncomplicated and *bad,* was necessary. Less moral Ping-Pong players like Magneto or von Doom, more unapologetically irredeemable like the Red Skull, someone whom it's 'okay' to hate.

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I kept waiting for Luke to go for the obvious power source on the back of the suit during that fight, and he never did, despite having PLENTY of opportunities to.
Tell me about it! Every time that thing on his back whined and glowed and charged up, I was waiting for Luke to just punch it or rip it off, and let Diamondback see what it was like to face him without his fancy Hammertech. It seemed very much like a Chekov's gun moment, and then, a whole lot of nothing...

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Now I wonder though if they'll ever address the fact, later on of course (most likely in Season 2) that the NYPD are now armed with Judas Bullets. So if those bullets are now easily accessible to the cops, what's to stop the higher corrupted officials from obtaining them and dropping Luke like a fly with them? Sort of defeats the purpose of having bulletproof skin.
And yet, while we saw how effective the bigger bullets were on Luke, he never actually got shot with the smaller mass-produced rounds, IIRC (each of which only contained a fraction of the alien metal in the larger rounds), so it's entirely possible that the 'mass-produced' Judas rounds won't work nearly as well.

That could be quite the disappointment for someone trying to use them on him, to find out that they, at best, give him scrapes and bruises, but don't tunnel their way in and certainly don't explode or anything...

"Oh crap. We paid how much for these?"


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Old 10-03-2016, 08:58 AM   #47
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Just reposting my review


Finished this on Saturday.
TL;DR: It's pretty good but definitely the weakest first season to any of the Marvel Netflix Shows.

1) The villains were lackluster. Surprising considering they gave us Kilgrave and Kingpin. Cottonmouth was pretty good, but they killed him off in the stupidest way just when things were getting good. And his performance was kinda off some times. (You could make a drinking game everytime he laughed and then went "intimidating)
Shades was ok but wasn't giving much to do other than looking cool/intimidating.
Mariah was ok. I liked her performance.
Diamondback I think they shouldve saved for season 2 and sometimes he was just too cartoonish (I avoided spoilers and a lot of casting news and didn't even know Diamond back was in the season. I thought he would just get teased by Shades)

2) The action wasn't that good. The big action scene is probably the Crispus Attucks building raid. I love Wu Tang Clan. Enter the 36 Chambers is my favorite album, but the action in the scene itself was so boring. Luke just ripping through people with little challenge was boring to me. I mean you know Daredevil, JJ, Iron Fist, or Cage aren't gonna die but at least when DD is fighting a swarm of enemies he get's challenged a bit. In subsequent seasons they need to give Cage more of a challenge.
The Diamondback fight was pretty good but should've come at the end of the finale instead of wrapping it up in like the first 20 minutes and then just have it be all epilogue for the remainder.

3) People in this were really, really stupid. And yes I know, Hollywood Stupidity and all that. But in LC it was too much.
People have their target dead to rights and then they don't do anything. For instance Diamondback had Cage cornered with the Judas Rifle and then for some reason he doesn't aim for his head. Okay, fine that's a harder target. But I don't even think he aimed for his heart or anywhere that could kill him and then he let the garbage truck carrying Luke to get away. Don't put your hero in situations like that if you aren't going to handle it right
And that's just one example, other than Luke so many of the main characters had a moment that completely took me out of it because they were really stupid. Shades not knowing that Luke was/is Carl Lucas was just baby town frolic

4) The "messages"/socio political commentary wasn't handled that well. Now don't get me wrong, I love the messages they were trying to send but sometimes they were handled so hammily. Like the speech Luke gives before the Crispus Attucks raid to the guy trying to rob him. Again, I love the message he was saying but it came off so corny and over the top. The whole prison flashback couldve been used to show in a better way how messed up this whole mass incarceration, for profit prisons are. But instead they used it to show a prison fight club with Coulter rocking one of the worst wigs I've seen. And coming off of The Night Of, the way LC handled the prison system was just laughable
I get not everything can be the Wire, but The Wire is a great example of showing socio political commentary without being corny or over the top about it. Again, I love the messages. Didn't like how they most were handled. The bullet hole hoodie thing was great though

5) Luke Cage as a character has a very boring personality to me. In a lot the comic stories Ive read with Cage, he usually comes off as a jerk with a "F*** you, pay me" mentality. And while I'm glad they didn't do that, they still shouldve gave him some bite, some attitude. I've been saying that since he appeared on JJ season 1. He was just corny sometimes too and I get that was just part of his charm but for me sometimes it was too much

6) They killed off some of their most interesting performances/characters

7) I dont think the tone served the story well. And then if I compare it to DD or JJ the tone for this just wasn't good at all. If they wouldve gone with a darker tone it couldve helped them with those socio--political themes.
Some moments like the Method Man scene (Method Man is in my top 5 rappers of all time but his invovlement as playing himself was kinda wonky. Especially that freestyle), "Bye Felicia", and the "he just talked about your momma" scene from the final fight just showed how off the tone was for me.
The whole blaxploitation angle (other than the score) was not the way to go for this imo.


I know that's all bagging on the show, but I did enjoy it. Nothing in this was terrible, some things just weren't handled well. After DD, Cage was the character I was really interested in seeing on the Netflix universe (until Punisher was announced). I hope they kinda course correct a bit because just some small fixes will make this great.

My current ranking (after only watching DD S2, JJ, and LG one time)
1. Daredevil season 1
2. Jessica Jones
3. Luke Cage
4. Daredevil season 2

What seems to be the general consensus? From what I've seen black people love this but most of everywhere else seems to think this is good not great

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Old 10-03-2016, 10:04 AM   #48
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I liked Luke Cage. It may be the worst of Netflix shows, but that isn't a shame. I think the tone was the best thing about it. One episode has a cliffhanger of Luke getting shot and the very next cliffhanger has him getting shot again! Lol, I enjoyed that.

Some complaints:

- I felt Claire was acting out of character, when she encouraged Luke to go after Diamondback alone and wounded. What? Misty is relatively fine, don't let Luke get himself killed!

- It was silly that Stryker survived Domingo's ambush. He was completely surrounded! But I can forgive that, because I believe it was meant to be campy moment.

- "Old guy with shield" What? Things have names so that you wouldn't have to describe them. Just say Captain America!

- Apparentally Jessica is Luke's rebound.

- Oh Netflix, you just had to tease Misty's arm.

On other hand:

+ Luke is the ultimate cool guy.

+ The music!

+ Turk is so amazing. Of course he complains about baby diapers.

+ I actually liked all of the four bad guys. I liked Cottonmouth's sense of humor. Mariah had an interesting arc. Shades was actually pretty smart, which is rare for villains. Diamondback was deliciously insane cartoon villain.

+ Diamondback also looked just like one of my teachers at my university. Except black.

+ Tons of continuity between the shows. For example Trish talk.

+ I was worried that heavy emphasis on Harlem's culture would feel too foreign for me. But it was actually a joyful discovery. I'd like to visit there some day.

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Old 10-03-2016, 10:25 AM   #49
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Default Re: FULL SEASON ONE Discussion (NO SPOILER TAGS NECESSARY)

I agree that this was probably the weakest of the Netflix Marvel shows

that said, it's still streets ahead of any of the network TV superhero shows

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Old 10-03-2016, 10:36 AM   #50
Sterling Archer
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Default Re: FULL SEASON ONE Discussion (NO SPOILER TAGS NECESSARY)

Was it just me that was feeling throughout the entire show that things were happening for no reason and characters would just do things without there really being a reason why?

I don't know, it's really hard to explain what felt wrong about the writing in this.

Like Luke Cage becomes a celebrity, kind of, about 4 or 5 episodes in. And everyone knows that he's a bulletproof vigilante. And people are just fine with this? Shouldn't he have been arrested way sooner in that case?

There were tons of other moments where I was just asking myself "wait, why is this happening?".

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