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Old 09-20-2017, 07:16 PM   #1
KevTravels
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Default Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero Serie

http://variety.com/2017/digital/news...ut-1202564402/

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DefendersNETFLIX
SEPTEMBER 20, 2017 | 11:22AM PT
Turns out that as a crime-fighting quartet, Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Luke Cage and Iron Fist together may be weaker than they are as solo vigilantes.

“Marvel’s The Defenders,” featuring the street-hero characters, was the least-watched Netflix Marvel original series premiere in the U.S. as measured over the first 30 days of viewership, according to an analysis by Jumpshot, a marketing-analytics firm.

For the comparison, Jumpshot created an index benchmarking each of the Netflix Marvel series against the top-viewed of the bunch, which was “Daredevil” season 2 in March 2016. Following its Aug. 18 premiere, “The Defenders” clocked in with just 17% of the viewership that “Daredevil” season two received in the first 30 days. The study looked at Netflix U.S. subs who watched at least one episode of each series.


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Compared with “The Defenders,” the previous premieres of “Iron Fist,” “Luke Cage” and “Jessica Jones” performed relatively equally in the first 30 days, accounting for 28%, 27% and 26% of “Daredevil” season 2’s viewership, respectively. In addition to being the least-viewed of the group, “The Defenders” also had the largest week-over-week drop in viewership, declining by 67%, 48% and 41%, respectively, over the 30-day period, per Jumpshot.

Netflix doesn’t release viewing data, leaving industry players to rely on estimates from third parties. But execs from the streaming-video company have routinely questioned the validity of attempts to gauge consumption on its global platform.

Moreover, Netflix evaluates the full performance of its content on its VOD service over a longer span than just 30 days. But the initial consumption of a series is often a good indicator of its long-term performance, and it’s worth noting that “The Defenders” showed a significant drop in viewers in the first month on the service.

The eight-episode miniseries “Marvel’s The Defenders” tells the story of Daredevil (Charlie Cox), Jessica Jones (Krysten Ritter), Luke Cage (Mike Colter) and Iron Fist (Finn Jones), who reluctantly band together to save New York City from criminal mastermind Alexandra Reid (Sigourney Weaver).

Why did “The Defenders” mashup get a colder shoulder than its predecessor series? One explanation may be that each of the individual street heroes appeals to different kinds of viewers, at least among Netflix members who had never watched content tagged as in the “superhero” genre before.

According to a Netflix news release, one-eighth of the viewers for the Marvel street-hero series were new to the comic-book genre. Among this group of newbies, “Daredevil” viewers gravitate toward storylines featuring antiheroes and moral ambiguity; “Jessica Jones” attracted those attuned to “sharp humor and dark crime”; “Luke Cage” watchers tended to prefer stories about “dangerous worlds and complex consequences”; and “Iron Fist” drew in fans of coming-of-age tales.



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Old 09-20-2017, 08:04 PM   #2
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero Serie

That sucks!

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Old 09-20-2017, 08:32 PM   #3
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero Serie

This wouldn't surprise me logically because the solo series have been on a general decline...except that I kept hearing Iron Fist broke some sort of record for viewership in its first week and also I am confused how Daredevil's second season had more viewers than the first.

Either way, I think they are getting what they deserve. Daredevil S2 wasn't good enough, the second halfves of JJ and LC weren't good enough and Iron Fist and The Defenders weren't good enough.

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Old 09-20-2017, 09:21 PM   #4
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

Also plausible: People want to watch all four series before seeing Defenders or they didn't like one of the characters so they didn't care about Defenders.q

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Old 09-20-2017, 09:34 PM   #5
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

The study looked at Netflix U.S. subs who watched at least one episode of each series.

I think this is a problem as well. Many might not have watched even one episode of the other 5 seasons.

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Old 09-20-2017, 09:49 PM   #6
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

Is it possible that Iron Fist hurt the momentum of Defenders among viewers who watched all the prior series?

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Old 09-20-2017, 11:42 PM   #7
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

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The study looked at Netflix U.S. subs who watched at least one episode of each series.

I think this is a problem as well. Many might not have watched even one episode of the other 5 seasons.
It's also not factoring in international data.

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Old 09-22-2017, 10:31 AM   #8
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero Serie

Its also done by a third party, who is most definitely not Netflix. I am highly dubious of the data, thus. Its just the latest round of outsiders trying to grapple with that Netflix doesn't actually need to truck in traditional ratings. *They* know how many people watch their shows, they don't need to broadcast it to the world. . . or bend the knee to Nielsen.

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Old 09-22-2017, 11:04 AM   #9
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero Serie

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Its also done by a third party, who is most definitely not Netflix. I am highly dubious of the data, thus. Its just the latest round of outsiders trying to grapple with that Netflix doesn't actually need to truck in traditional ratings. *They* know how many people watch their shows, they don't need to broadcast it to the world. . . or bend the knee to Nielsen.
This third party also is probably being paid by someone with an agenda.

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Old 09-22-2017, 04:12 PM   #10
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

Yeah but would you trust the numbers if they got put out publicly by Netflix?

Just for example, we never get actual firm concrete numbers from them at all. Unless they are available somewhere, and I just don't see them?

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Old 09-22-2017, 05:58 PM   #11
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

This is odd. Is it measuring percentage of viewers of Netflix? The Defenders was 8 episodes. I finished it the day of.

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Old 09-22-2017, 08:56 PM   #12
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

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This wouldn't surprise me logically because the solo series have been on a general decline...except that I kept hearing Iron Fist broke some sort of record for viewership in its first week and also I am confused how Daredevil's second season had more viewers than the first.

Either way, I think they are getting what they deserve. Daredevil S2 wasn't good enough, the second halfves of JJ and LC weren't good enough and Iron Fist and The Defenders weren't good enough.
Yeah supposedly IF was the biggest hit initially. I'd imagine most folks dumped it mid-season run. Probably hoped it might improve and then finally gave up.

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Old 09-22-2017, 08:58 PM   #13
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

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Is it possible that Iron Fist hurt the momentum of Defenders among viewers who watched all the prior series?
This is something that will need to be taken into account.

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Old 09-23-2017, 02:51 PM   #14
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

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This is something that will need to be taken into account.
Until Iron Fist hit, I didn't recall people saying that they only liked the first season of Daredevil. Now people complain all the time about the second halves of Luke Cage and Jessica Jones and the entirety of Daredevil's second season and The Defenders. Critics tend to disagree. IGN didn't like Defenders but virtually everyone else did.

The idea that all five shows are different shades of horrible wasn't a sentiment that anyone was espousing until Iron Fist got ruined by Scott Buck. They were all completely watchable and Defenders wasn't bad either.

Defenders had a lighter tone and weak villains but that's not all that different from Guardians of the Galaxy. Remember how Ronan was one-dimensional and then killed off? Same goes for Defenders but nobody dumps on GOTG.

Like it or not, Iron Fist tainted the brand and did so in a way that many cases were retroactive.

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Old 09-23-2017, 03:00 PM   #15
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero Serie

That sounds bad. This isn't the streaming hit I thought it would be.

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Old 09-23-2017, 04:33 PM   #16
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero Serie

Most people love the two seasons of DD, and the first 8 episodes of JJ are as good as anything in these shows, but I will acknowledge that LC and IF were pretty average by comparison. The Defenders falls more in line with these shows, at times entertaining, but a failure in terms of living up to expectations (unless your standards are low) due to shoddy writing and the general feeling that Marvel/Netflix are resting on the rep of DD. I've lost a lot of respect for the TV department, and was never big on Loeb to begin with. He's just part of the old boys club over on Ike's side if the fence.

I think the Punisher and Runaways could break out big and make this all seem like a blip, but I'll no longer expect greatness from Marvel TV and Loeb, I'll just be happily surprised when I get it.

Glad Feige was able to break free of these people.

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Old 09-23-2017, 06:59 PM   #17
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

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Most people love the two seasons of DD, and the first 8 episodes of JJ are as good as anything in these shows, but I will acknowledge that LC and IF were pretty average by comparison. The Defenders falls more in line with these shows, at times entertaining, but a failure in terms of living up to expectations (unless your standards are low) due to shoddy writing and the general feeling that Marvel/Netflix are resting on the rep of DD. I've lost a lot of respect for the TV department, and was never big on Loeb to begin with. He's just part of the old boys club over on Ike's side if the fence.

I think the Punisher and Runaways could break out big and make this all seem like a blip, but I'll no longer expect greatness from Marvel TV and Loeb, I'll just be happily surprised when I get it.

Glad Feige was able to break free of these people.
Here's what I understand based on what I've read:

Back when Marvel Studios was still part of Marvel Entertainment, Kevin Feige had to keep fighting Ike Perlmutter and his Marvel Creative Committee. Back when Captain America: Civil War was filming, Ike threatened to fire Robert Downey Jr, which forced Feige to ask Disney for help. Which resulted in Marvel Studios splitting off from Ike and his Committee. If you have seen the newer movies and rewatch the older Marvel movies, this split is clearly demonstrated by the new Marvel intro.

Which leaves us to Jeph Loeb and the Netflix shows. By all accounts, Jeph Loeb still has to answer to Ike and possibly his committee and we all know that when executives meddles on other people's development, it makes things worse more times than it improve things.

So far I have no problem with Jeph. Daredevil was great, as were Jessica Jones and Luke Cage . Hiring Scott Buck for Iron Fist was of course a mistake. But considering how Ike seems to be rumored to have a stingy personality, it is not far-fetch to assume that he pressured Jeph to hire Scott Buck again for The Inhumans, because he has a low-budget approach as well as fast delivery.


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Old 09-23-2017, 07:22 PM   #18
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed

I think Iron Fist certainly hurt the momentum going into Defenders.

Also keep in mind that large parts of the country were kind of busy dealing with major hurricanes during this period.

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Old 09-23-2017, 07:25 PM   #19
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

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Defenders had a lighter tone and weak villains but that's not all that different from Guardians of the Galaxy. Remember how Ronan was one-dimensional and then killed off? Same goes for Defenders but nobody dumps on GOTG.

Like it or not, Iron Fist tainted the brand and did so in a way that many cases were retroactive.
Defenders' sins were dragging out a pretty nonsensical plot as much as it was carried over from Iron Fist and DD s2
+ the action wasn't as good as what came before.

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Old 09-23-2017, 07:36 PM   #20
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero Serie

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Most people love the two seasons of DD, and the first 8 episodes of JJ are as good as anything in these shows, but I will acknowledge that LC and IF were pretty average by comparison. The Defenders falls more in line with these shows, at times entertaining, but a failure in terms of living up to expectations (unless your standards are low) due to shoddy writing and the general feeling that Marvel/Netflix are resting on the rep of DD. I've lost a lot of respect for the TV department, and was never big on Loeb to begin with. He's just part of the old boys club over on Ike's side if the fence.

I think the Punisher and Runaways could break out big and make this all seem like a blip, but I'll no longer expect greatness from Marvel TV and Loeb, I'll just be happily surprised when I get it.

Glad Feige was able to break free of these people.
The first 7 episodes of LC was among the best of the entire MCU tv series IMO. But it was very superhero-lite. Diamondback shows up and it dropped massive quality. But I only recall major criticism of LC this year. I don't remember many complaining in late '16 (months after it having dropped).

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Old 09-24-2017, 01:26 AM   #21
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

Well, there you go, the entire second half dropped off, which was then followed by Iron Fist. That's close to 20 straight episodes leading into the Defenders which were hovering around mediocrity. And then the Defenders added another 8 to that. The shows have been entertaining for the most part and I even liked Iron Fist A LOT more then the critics, but I certainly expected MUCH MORE from a Netflix show. I'm not alone in that. Just not good enough.

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Old 09-24-2017, 08:37 AM   #22
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

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Well, there you go, the entire second half dropped off, which was then followed by Iron Fist. That's close to 20 straight episodes leading into the Defenders which were hovering around mediocrity. And then the Defenders added another 8 to that. The shows have been entertaining for the most part and I even liked Iron Fist A LOT more then the critics, but I certainly expected MUCH MORE from a Netflix show. I'm not alone in that. Just not good enough.
The irony is that I think Iron Fist probably would've had much better reception if it wasn't coming out on the heels of the other Netflix shows.

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Old 09-24-2017, 09:56 AM   #23
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

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Yeah but would you trust the numbers if they got put out publicly by Netflix?

Just for example, we never get actual firm concrete numbers from them at all. Unless they are available somewhere, and I just don't see them?
Well, sure, you can distrust numbers from Netflix, if they published them. The point is, you *don't* need to trust Netflix in this regard. . . because they *don't* generally publish numbers. Because they don't care what anyone in the public believes about their shows' viewership. They know how many viewers each one gets, and how much money its making by their metrics, and that's what counts.

I'm not even sure they need to tell *content providers*, even. They know how valuable a given show is to them, and can use that in setting their negotiating positions. If a network or studio thinks their show is worth more than it actually is, and demands a higher than allowable cost. . . well, the thing about a show having low value is that losing it doesn't hurt Netflix very much. They can play chicken just fine.

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Old 09-24-2017, 10:17 AM   #24
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

So its safe to say that MCU Netflix already peaked?

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Old 09-24-2017, 12:19 PM   #25
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Default Re: Netflix ‘Marvel’s The Defenders’ Is Least-Viewed Among Marvel Street-Hero S

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The irony is that I think Iron Fist probably would've had much better reception if it wasn't coming out on the heels of the other Netflix shows.
I agree, but some of it had to do with politics as well. The whole "controversy" was idiotic.

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