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Old 01-18-2018, 08:02 PM   #551
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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That's interesting. Could you point out any scenes like that? I can't remember ever feeling like that while watching a movie or TV show.
Only God Forgives. The entire film.

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Old 01-18-2018, 08:05 PM   #552
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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I think the MCU has largely improved over time but it’s a(nother) testament to how successful they’ve been that two of the best superhero films ever made (Iron Man and the Avengers) came in phase 1. They’ve brought the median higher but they were still able to knock it out of the park during their growing pains.
IM and Avengers were the 2 films that created the MCU craze. Iron Man served up the ball and Avengers hit it out the stadium. The other phase 1 films were supports but those were the 2 gamechangers. Since then, aside from a few missteps, the level of the support films has gradually strengthened and we’ve still had films like TWS, Guardians, CW and Ragnarok do beyond what is expected. If AoU had been as good as it could have been, we would have reached orbit even faster but I think we’ll be passing that point by the time we’re done with IW and Avengers 4.

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Old 01-18-2018, 08:07 PM   #553
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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You've never heard Bay brought up in these conversations....? Well, here's a video made by that exact same channel lauding Bay:


You might wanna watch the last minute of the bayhem video. The whole point of the video is that he does one thing well but misapplies it to every inappropriate situation. Not good cinematography.

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Old 01-18-2018, 08:27 PM   #554
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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Only God Forgives. The entire film.
Ah, I haven't watched that one. So you think it's a good movie? It seems Only God Forgives was quite disliked by both critics and the general audience. Would it be fair to say that most people did not see the movie as dramatically powerful because of the correct use of composition, color and lighting?

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Old 01-18-2018, 08:43 PM   #555
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

There are many scenes in the film that would be silly if you break them down, but the sheer force of the cinematography keeps them hypnotic and engaging. I am ambivalent about the movie, which is besides the point. There is no doubt there is a litany of great scenes in it, mainly on the back of the visuals.

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Old 01-18-2018, 08:45 PM   #556
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

The cinematography really did make that movie watchable.

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Old 01-18-2018, 08:47 PM   #557
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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Really? Other than the car scene, Spider-man might be one of their most point-camera-at-actors-in-a-brightly-lit-set movie ever.
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The MCU is a great argument for the factory line.
Yep, most MCU movies (with exception to the Guardians films and Thor 1 and parts of Iron Man 1) have a very factory like feel, which I critique (perhaps too much, heh). But they're mostly solid movies. It bothers some viewers, including myself, but the vast majority don't care. And frankly it isn't a deal breaker because SMH does have average or below cinematography--by big budget Hollywood standards--but it is a VERY good movie. I can't deny it is wonderfully enjoyable and its visuals hamper it not at all.

Funnily enough, this does remind me though of how good the cinematography is in the Raimi Spider-Man movies, at least SM2 and SM3. Those sequels are beautifully photographed movies by Bill Pope, but it doesn't change the fact that SM3 is a mediocre movie.

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Old 01-18-2018, 08:49 PM   #558
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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There are many scenes in the film that would be silly if you break them down, but the sheer force of the cinematography keeps them hypnotic and engaging. I am ambivalent about the movie, which is besides the point. There is no doubt there is a litany of great scenes in it, mainly on the back of the visuals.
Sums up Neon Demon too, come to think of it.

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Old 01-18-2018, 08:51 PM   #559
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

In the video I linked to Alfred Hitchcock has a great quote. "It's like a lot of films today, they are what I like to call photographs of people talking, it bears no relation to the art of cinema". A quote from 1964 even more relevant today.

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Old 01-18-2018, 08:53 PM   #560
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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Sums up Neon Demon too, come to think of it.
I thought Neon Demon had a more meat to chew on, personally.

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Old 01-18-2018, 08:56 PM   #561
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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Only God Forgives. The entire film.
Nothing could have saved that film.

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Old 01-18-2018, 08:57 PM   #562
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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Collider represents all critics now? And even if they placed it too low on their list, they still placed this "Crappy movie" on their list.

Point is a lot more people appreciate Rises than you do. A lot more people like superhero movies I am ambivalent about more than me. No need to get defensive about it.
I already pointed out where I stand on Rises. You are the one who is being defensive here. I am simply looking at that poll results and drawing conclusions of who may have voted on the poll. As I keep repeating, I am simply saying "Rises" is one of the many examples from the poll that informs me it is not to be taken seriously as any kind of representative voting.

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Old 01-18-2018, 09:02 PM   #563
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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There are many scenes in the film that would be silly if you break them down, but the sheer force of the cinematography keeps them hypnotic and engaging. I am ambivalent about the movie, which is besides the point. There is no doubt there is a litany of great scenes in it, mainly on the back of the visuals.
Fair enough. I guess I'm just of the opinion that good cinematography alone can't turn a poorly written movie into something dramatically powerful. And it would seem that based on Only God Forgives's reception, you could make the argument that most people might share that opinion.

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Old 01-18-2018, 09:04 PM   #564
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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Fair enough. I guess I'm just of the opinion that good cinematography alone can't turn a poorly written movie into something dramatically powerful. And it would seem that based on Only God Forgives's reception, you could make the argument that most people might share that opinion.

But it can turn scenes powerful. Nobody denies that Only God Forgives or Neon Demon don't contain amazing scenes which on paper seem toothless.

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Old 01-18-2018, 09:31 PM   #565
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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But it can turn scenes powerful. Nobody denies that Only God Forgives or Neon Demon don't contain amazing scenes which on paper seem toothless.
Are they truly amazing scenes though, or are they just amazing to look at? I haven't seen either of them so I can't say that much about them. I know I've seen poorly written scenes that have impressed me with their cinematography, but I can't say that I've ever felt that it was dramatically powerful. But we're moved by different things, and for me, good writing is the most important thing.

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Old 01-18-2018, 11:39 PM   #566
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

MCU's cinematography almost always makes it clear what is happening with the story, characters and action. I agree that the movies could be a lot prettier, but at least they are perfectly functional. Could be worse.


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Old 01-19-2018, 02:32 AM   #567
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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MCU's cinematography always makes it clear what is happening with the story, characters and action. I agree that the movies could be a lot prettier, but at least they are perfectly functional. Could be worse.
Save for a few scenes shot with hand-helds (namely in the last two Cap films), most shots allow the viewer to clearly see what's going on and not feel lost. Some movies you can tell the directors are designing shots to hide certain things and it can add a bit of confusion if it's done too often or at the wrong moments.

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Old 01-19-2018, 03:53 AM   #568
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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MCU's cinematography almost always makes it clear what is happening with the story, characters and action. I agree that the movies could be a lot prettier, but at least they are perfectly functional. Could be worse.
Why settle for mediocrity when it could be improved?


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Old 01-19-2018, 04:48 AM   #569
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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Why settle for mediocrity when it could be improved?
Well, for my part, I don't think about cinematography. When it's exceptionally great, I notice it. But most of the time it would never occur to me to demand for better. I'm content little sheep, lol.

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Old 01-19-2018, 05:23 AM   #570
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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Well, for my part, I don't think about cinematography. When it's exceptionally great, I notice it. But most of the time it would never occur to me to demand for better.
That's the position I stand in.

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Old 01-19-2018, 06:49 AM   #571
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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Well, for my part, I don't think about cinematography. When it's exceptionally great, I notice it. But most of the time it would never occur to me to demand for better. I'm content little sheep, lol.
That's understandable. It's something that i definitely look at but not in the same way as a lot of folks it seems. All it needs to do is serve the story and tone that the film is exploring. I feel like the MCU films do that, just like i feel Blade Runner 2049 does or Mad Max: Fury Road for example. That's the number 1 goal. I mean look at some best picture winners. Was Spotlight the best looking film of 2015? Not even close but the look served the story. Or even this year with Three Billboards and Lady Bird. I think the simple and natural approach served those films really well, but i don't expect to see them in the cinematography race.

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Old 01-19-2018, 07:01 AM   #572
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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Why settle for mediocrity when it could be improved?
You should never settle, but a large proportion of other franchise films are setting on more important filmmaking aspects. Of course ideally you want a film to be great in all aspects.

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Old 01-19-2018, 07:25 AM   #573
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

The cinematography in the MCU is good enough. It’s rarely impressive, but it’s not what I’d call bad or ugly either. And, honestly, I think that’s what they’re going for.

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Old 01-19-2018, 08:55 AM   #574
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

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I don't hate the MCU cinematography at all, but I can't agree on this point. Film is a visual storytelling medium, so visuals are hugely important. If you just want storytelling, that's what books are for.
Agreed. I don't think any of the MCU films look bad. They look fine. But, do I notice things like Asgard is a series of 5 rooms in the 1st Thor? Yes I do. I notice issues like that, but the MCU films I think have been getting far more visually impressive since their 2014 releases. Each year they have been getting more dynamic and impressive (I think GotG2 is their most visually impressive film to date). But, like you said, film is a visual medium. Yes, you need good story, characters, etc. But at the end of the day, you're WATCHING a film. If it looks unprofessional, you notice.

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Old 01-19-2018, 09:05 AM   #575
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Default Re: Superhero Cinematic Civil War - - - Part 43

The most visually-impressive MCU film is The Avengers, imo. 1.78:1 AR, bright and clear image, colorful costumes, amazing FX and action.

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