How Iron Man 3 can set up for Phase 2

[AvengeME]

Ant-Man won't be three movies. We don't even know if Hulk will get a sequel at this point. Eventually, yes. GotG may end up barely above Green Lantern in terms of financial and critical success. It is a complete unknown.

I think Thor/Cap will get six movies, be it a third installment or a fourth Avengers movie. We'll see.

I want Avengers to be a four part series and not the basic trilogy. Each movie should be a self contained story and none of the movies should directly tie into one another. Just tell us three, hopefully four great Avenger stories.

Thanos should be like Mandarin, who barely shows up or referenced in IM 1/2. He will even be in the background for much of IM 3. That's how I would handle Thanos. Masters of Evil would be kinda lame, but a lineup featuring the likes of Mandarin, The Leader, Skull/Zemo is almost too good to pass.

[TheVileOne]

Hopefully they won't spend $300 million on Guardians like Green Lantern.

[Joe]

Originally Posted by AvengeME

Ant-Man won't be three movies. We don't even know if Hulk will get a sequel at this point.

Which is why I said "potentially" for each. You don't know that it won't be a success.

[AvengeME]

If Green Lantern won't get a sequel (it might with a new Lantern if we do get another) then I wouldn't hold out on Ant-Man being this dark horse property. Anything is possible. I've always felt IM would get three movies before 2008. IM1/2 plus Avengers or just a trilogy. After its success in 2008, I felt Cap/Thor could also be 3-6 movie characters. Now, outside of the Hulk, Marvel doesn't have a potentially sustaining franchise that I would bet a penny on. I'm a bit concerned as to the plan outside the Avengers. GotG, while promising, isn't the direction I would have gone personally. Especially with so many FF characters tied up at Fox.

[catintheengine]

I get what you're saying AvengeME, which is why I fully expect GotG to be sort of an "experiment" for Marvel - a test to see if a non-Avengers property can stand on its own.

I'm sure we may very well get a reference to Thanos, but I expect that will be the extent of it. I doubt we will even hear the word "Avengers".

[Ash Talon]

Well, Phase 1 wasn't much of a plan other than finally making the Avengers. I think using individual film characters in a team-up movie was obviously unique and worked well. But the threads building to Avengers weren't particularly well thought out. Some post-credits scenes. And shoe-horned cameos.

I'd like to see Phase 2 be a little more thought out. It doesn't have to be hammered home, but I'd prefer to see more threadlines buried in the films. Thematically and factually. Hopefully the theme of Avengers 2 plays off where they leave the characters after their sequel films. I'd like also like to see smaller, world-building threads established in the individual sequels. Stuff like AIM. While we don't know exactly how much of a role it'll play in IM3, I think it should be referenced in other films even if only in news clips.

I'd like to see the build to the villain of Avengers 2 woven into the tapestry of the Phase 2 films yet not be overbearing in those films. For instance, if it's Ultron, introduce the Ultron computer system in IM3 somehow. Some earthbound scene in Thor 2 (Jane Foster working with SHIELD scene) shows us how Ultron has integrated into their systems (AI help). Cap 2 has a scene where Ultron suggests that some agents are expendable to meet final goal which alludes to Ultron's turning on mankind. Avengers 2, Ultron becomes fully independent and attacks mankind.

I would suggest that Phase 2 would be about expanding the roster of characters, but we're only getting 1 film (maybe 2 if Ant-Man happens) with original characters (other than supporting & villains). While Phase 2 could build to Thanos, we just had a cosmic threat in Avengers 1. I'd love to see Thanos on film, but I'm leaning toward wanting him in Avengers 3, so we can have a large roster of characters face him. I'd rather have Phase 2 build to an earth-based threat to the team. I'm hoping Phase 3 expands the number of franchises and starts to explore more fringes to the MCU, like mysticism with Dr. Strange and strange lands with Black Panther and Namor. Which then ends with all these diverse heroes coming together to stop Thanos.

[cherokeesam]

Originally Posted by catintheengine

I get what you're saying AvengeME, which is why I fully expect GotG to be sort of an "experiment" for Marvel - a test to see if a non-Avengers property can stand on its own.

I'm sure we may very well get a reference to Thanos, but I expect that will be the extent of it. I doubt we will even hear the word "Avengers".

I don't think Marvel Studios is going to "experiment" or "test to see" if a franchise unrelated to the Avengers is going to work out; they've made absolutely clear that they're counting on non-Avenger films. GOTG, Luke Cage, Iron Fist, Dr. Strange, The Inhumans, Runaways, Cloak & Dagger....all of these titles remain in *some* level of development hell at Marvel Studios, and NONE of them are likely to tie in to future Avenger sequels. In fact, they could go all canon and **** and even unceremoniously dump Hulk after Avengers 1 and leave him to fend for himself as a solo act (which is the way God and Stan Lee always intended it).

[chronos]

Here's a thought- if they ever do lead up to a Masters of Evil storyline, with the archrivals coming back for vengeance, who will be IM's opponent? If they introduce Zemo in CA2 and Skurge & Amora in Thor2, and have Chen Lu in Antman, that's really stick close to th books. They could even bring back Blonsky for good measure. But I don't really see a foe for Tony. Vanko would have worked, but he blowed himself all up. I don't really see Mandarin joining a league of evil arches. But this is all just speculation as most of those characters aren't even confirmed.

[cherokeesam]

Originally Posted by chronos

Here's a thought- if they ever do lead up to a Masters of Evil storyline, with the archrivals coming back for vengeance, who will be IM's opponent? If they introduce Zemo in CA2 and Skurge & Amora in Thor2, and have Chen Lu in Antman, that's really stick close to th books. They could even bring back Blonsky for good measure. But I don't really see a foe for Tony. Vanko would have worked, but he blowed himself all up. I don't really see Mandarin joining a league of evil arches. But this is all just speculation as most of those characters aren't even confirmed.

Ideally, Crimson Dynamo. He hasn't officially appeared in the MCU yet, but an incarnation of the MOE would be a great place for a debut. He could even be named Anton Vanko, Jr. (or whatever nomenclature Russians use to indicate he's the son of Anton, and brother of dearly departed Ivan), who develops the armor to avenge the "murders" of his dad and bro at the hands of Iron Man.

Or, better yet, bring back Justin Hammer, and have Hammer create his own superhenchy, like Beetle; then all the fanboys will be fangasming over how close to canon this roster appears.

[AvengeME]

Masters of Evil needs A-list Marvel villains. Going to the comic book rosters wouldn't work in a feature film, or at least most of iterations of the MoE roster. Leader and Mandarin are A-list but you already featured or will feature them in the solo acts. Plus it may be kinda cheesy for all those guys to team up at once. Depending on where IM3 leaves us, we may see the return of Mandarin although I doubt it. Red Skull is another possibility. Baron Zemo could be featured in both CA2 and Avengers 2. So we would already get a rehash in a sense. I don't think the recipe is there yet. We just haven't had an A-list calibur Marvel villain in this MCU. Not someone on that Magneto, Goblin, Doc Ock level. Until these solo MCU villains reach that iconic status in a featured film, I don't think bringing them all together will carry much weight.

I would go Ultron before MoE. Then after Hulk 3 and IM3 and CA 2/3, you could feature Skull/Zemo, Mandarin, and Leader in Avengers 3. Save Thanos for another time/trilogy.

[cherokeesam]

Originally Posted by AvengeME

Masters of Evil needs A-list Marvel villains. Going to the comic book rosters wouldn't work in a feature film, or at least most of iterations of the MoE roster. Leader and Mandarin are A-list but you already featured or will feature them in the solo acts. Plus it may be kinda cheesy for all those guys to team up at once. Depending on where IM3 leaves us, we may see the return of Mandarin although I doubt it. Red Skull is another possibility. Baron Zemo could be featured in both CA2 and Avengers 2. So we would already get a rehash in a sense. I don't think the recipe is there yet. We just haven't had an A-list calibur Marvel villain in this MCU. Not someone on that Magneto, Goblin, Doc Ock level. Until these solo MCU villains reach that iconic status in a featured film, I don't think bringing them all together will carry much weight.

I would go Ultron before MoE. Then after Hulk 3 and IM3 and CA 2/3, you could feature Skull/Zemo, Mandarin, and Leader in Avengers 3. Save Thanos for another time/trilogy.

Yeah, I'd definitely put MoE low on the movie Avengers' fight card. Way below Ultron, Kang, Thanos, Kree-Skrull, Zodiac, AIM and HYDRA. While rematches with old foes is popular in the comics, movie audiences are not nearly as interested in seeing the same old-same old when it comes to villains.

[chromehorn]

Originally Posted by cherokeesam

Yeah, I'd definitely put MoE low on the movie Avengers' fight card. Way below Ultron, Kang, Thanos, Kree-Skrull, Zodiac, AIM and HYDRA. While rematches with old foes is popular in the comics, movie audiences are not nearly as interested in seeing the same old-same old when it comes to villains.

I agree. Since most of my exposure is from various cartoons I would love to see Kang or Ultron as the main villian.

[Spuzz]

Ultron. Thanos. Kang. These guys should be priority before any other villain in the main Avengers films.

[LegendAssemble]

Originally Posted by cherokeesam

Ideally, Crimson Dynamo. He hasn't officially appeared in the MCU yet, but an incarnation of the MOE would be a great place for a debut. He could even be named Anton Vanko, Jr. (or whatever nomenclature Russians use to indicate he's the son of Anton, and brother of dearly departed Ivan), who develops the armor to avenge the "murders" of his dad and bro at the hands of Iron Man.

Or, better yet, bring back Justin Hammer, and have Hammer create his own superhenchy, like Beetle; then all the fanboys will be fangasming over how close to canon this roster appears.

I've always thought a Thunderbolts movie could be good.

[Spider-Vader]

I don't see how Iron Man 3 can tie into Thanos, UNLESS Mandarin stumbles upon one of the Infinity Gems in this movie. But I don't see that happening.

There's the rumors that the after-credits scene will tie into Ant-Man. I'm also hoping we can get a tease for Black Panther in this movie, I still have hope that he can get into Phase II.

A Carol Danvers cameo would give me the biggest geekgasm as well.

[ericadawn16]

When Jessica Chastain was originally named as part of the cast, I was really hoping she'd be Carol but now that her character's played by Rebecca Hall, I don't know...

[spideymouse]

Yeah, there have been no indications of Carol appearing in Phase II at all so far.

[Rock Sexton]

Originally Posted by Ash Talon

Well, Phase 1 wasn't much of a plan other than finally making the Avengers. I think using individual film characters in a team-up movie was obviously unique and worked well. But the threads building to Avengers weren't particularly well thought out. Some post-credits scenes. And shoe-horned cameos.

I'd like to see Phase 2 be a little more thought out. It doesn't have to be hammered home, but I'd prefer to see more threadlines buried in the films. Thematically and factually. Hopefully the theme of Avengers 2 plays off where they leave the characters after their sequel films. I'd like also like to see smaller, world-building threads established in the individual sequels. Stuff like AIM. While we don't know exactly how much of a role it'll play in IM3, I think it should be referenced in other films even if only in news clips.

I'd like to see the build to the villain of Avengers 2 woven into the tapestry of the Phase 2 films yet not be overbearing in those films. For instance, if it's Ultron, introduce the Ultron computer system in IM3 somehow. Some earthbound scene in Thor 2 (Jane Foster working with SHIELD scene) shows us how Ultron has integrated into their systems (AI help). Cap 2 has a scene where Ultron suggests that some agents are expendable to meet final goal which alludes to Ultron's turning on mankind. Avengers 2, Ultron becomes fully independent and attacks mankind.

I would suggest that Phase 2 would be about expanding the roster of characters, but we're only getting 1 film (maybe 2 if Ant-Man happens) with original characters (other than supporting & villains). While Phase 2 could build to Thanos, we just had a cosmic threat in Avengers 1. I'd love to see Thanos on film, but I'm leaning toward wanting him in Avengers 3, so we can have a large roster of characters face him. I'd rather have Phase 2 build to an earth-based threat to the team. I'm hoping Phase 3 expands the number of franchises and starts to explore more fringes to the MCU, like mysticism with Dr. Strange and strange lands with Black Panther and Namor. Which then ends with all these diverse heroes coming together to stop Thanos.

Actually Phase 1 was entirely thought out. They said as much. After Fury made his cameo in IM1 it got the ball rolling in a big way.

[herolee10]

A part of me thinks that with descriptions out there saying on how Mandarin was shown to have mentioned something about how he doesn't believe that there are real heroes in the world, along with his attack on Tony in the Comic Con Footage, that the upcoming MCU Solo films will perhaps reflect on how the villains present in the world (and even in the universe) have taken notice of how dangerous the Avengers can be if allowed to band together again (which was ironically something that Fury said that he wanted to point out to everyone at the end of TA), which will probably compel some interested parties in attacking everyone while they're all spread out.

[fireflyhatter]

If they do end up doing Civil War for Phase 3, I don't see them being able to do the story justice without somehow getting the rights to Spider-Man back or making some sort of deal with Sony, because Peter Parker's part in the whole Civil War plot is kind of essential, especially the relationship between Tony and Peter.

[metaphysician]

Which is yet another reason to hope they *don't do Civil War.* There is little they could do that would drive away the GA faster.