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Old 05-30-2017, 12:29 PM   #301
CaptainWagner
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

It's hilarious watching people on Breitbart freak out over Chris Evans criticizing Trump. It's like the perfect "life imitates art" moment, they're literally pulling word for word from the "Take Back the Shield" rhetoric from the comics.

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Old 05-30-2017, 12:39 PM   #302
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

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Originally Posted by Docker2.0 View Post
I can also see the point of people saying Marvel isn't creating new characters but instead are making alternative versions of legends.
Well, they're making new characters as well. It's just that those don't get their own titles, don't lead team books, don't get a marketing push, etc. because no matter how good their book is, it will almost definitely not outsell a title called "Spider-Man" or "X-Men". Unfortunately books like Mosaic don't sell well and are cancelled soon, so Marvel doesn't try very often. If they wanted more diverse characters, they could have made more original characters, or out of the original characters they created this decade alone, they could have pushed characters like:

-Hazmat
-Mettle
-Striker
-Hummingbird
-Triage
-Morph
-Shark-Girl
-Goldballs
-Pod/Enigma
-Cullen Bloodstone
-Sun Girl
-Nature Girl
-Inferno
-Iso
-Flint
-Radiance
-Blindspot
-Sera
-Synapse
-Grid
-White Fox
-Kid Kaiju
-Mosaic
-Good Boy
-Captain Swain
-Panacea
-Glorianna

and more.

But you probably don't recognize over half of these because most were just supporting characters or teammembers limited to just one book or so.

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Old 05-30-2017, 02:00 PM   #303
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

Even established heroes War Machine and Storm couldn't maintain solo titles in recent years. I don't a book like Runaways would survive in todays market unless it had Avengers on the title or a Wolverine or Spider-Man among the line up.

Original non- legacy characters are mostly DOA thanks to comics high pricing and fans lack of willingness to buy anything outside of established franchises.

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Old 06-17-2017, 07:47 AM   #304
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Original non- legacy characters are mostly DOA thanks to comics high pricing and fans lack of willingness to buy anything outside of established franchises.
Unfortunately it is not even directly because of the fans. With the current system the comicbook stores have to decide upfront how many issues to buy, with no possibility for returning, so they won't take the risk of overstocking with new/unknown books and people who don't really follow new releases or preorder/pull will not even have the chance to buy it if it sells relatively well.

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Old 06-26-2017, 12:52 AM   #305
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

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The Atlantic has written the best unbiased article on Marvel's comic publishing problems I've seen recently
https://www.theatlantic.com/entertai...s-woes/527127/
It's not unbiased at all.

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Old 07-04-2017, 09:13 AM   #306
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

Marvel is getting killed because they are putting out terrible comics. As far as their writers being "too liberal", I don't think it's as much a matter of that as it is they have forgotten the Golden Rule of story-telling -- show, don't tell.

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Old 07-13-2017, 01:40 AM   #307
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

I'm sure there are a few people who don't read marvel anymore because the tolerance and respect for all people is at odds with their political stance. As for me. I have been brought back in by wonderful new series like Ms. Marvel, Moon Girl and Devil Dino, and the Champions!

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Old 07-13-2017, 02:26 AM   #308
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

Obviously, it's not fair for me to generalize based on a couple panels, but Stark and Strange were unironically exchanging vapid frat lingo as an obvious pander towards millennials.
If that's by "liberal writers", that's certainly cause for concern.

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Old 07-14-2017, 03:03 AM   #309
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

The idea that progressive/liberal storytelling is somehow "killing Marvel," is a myth perpetuated by those that dread the impending paradigm shift toward a more inclusive, diverse society. Marvel has never shied away from political commentary that was germane to the time. In fact, the medium as a whole has proven to be a vehicle for voicing progressive and political issues, but that is a matter for a separate discussion. Your interpretation of Marvel as only recently affecting a shift toward "liberal" (read: progressive and inclusive) and political storytelling is ahistorical.







The only difference between then and now is that marginalized groups have found platforms that allow their voices to be heard, and thus it seems that some dramatic change has taken place, but in truth, Marvel has long been a force for positive change when it comes to matters of diversity, progressive/liberal politics, and inclusion.

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Old 07-19-2017, 01:32 AM   #310
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

Call it progressive. Call it forward thinking. Call it whatever you want.

When I can't read comics about heroic Steve Rogers, Sam Wilson as the Falcon, Bruce Banner, Mjolnir weilding Thor, Wolverine, Tony Stark, the X-Men I watched cartoons about for years... whatever is causing that? That's killing Marvel, for me. And with respect to whatever intent there may be, I don't think I'm in a small pool of fans, or people.

The problem is, Marvel's reaching a catch 22. They cancel comics quick, and so people don't trust their new characters, or pushed diverse characters, to stay afloat. Like Fox TV, I don't get into new Marvel because it just gets cancelled. New Warriors, Angela, Silk, Red Wolf, Guardians 3000, Avengers Academy, Young Avengers, all cancelled. Guessing my America will fall, before too long, too.

So. If we can't trust new comics, or Marvel can't push them (for whatever reason), and they remove/sideline/corrupt/change the characters that brought them to the table, then it'll be a downward spiral until all they are is a movie studio.

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Old 07-19-2017, 01:42 AM   #311
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

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I'm sure there are a few people who don't read marvel anymore because the tolerance and respect for all people is at odds with their political stance. As for me. I have been brought back in by wonderful new series like Ms. Marvel, Moon Girl and Devil Dino, and the Champions!
I'll read any comic about characters I like. Most, get cancelled anymore (see my post above). Nova, comes to mind.

When it comes down to it, Marvel just ain't the company I loved. Not in quality, not without the characters I love, not with disregard of canon, not with a lack of good, consistent stories.

My pull list from Marvel is down to Iron Fist, Defenders, Renew Your Vows and America. And to be honest, America is going to get dropped, soon, because she doesn't even feel like the flirty bad ass girl I loved; she feels like a Tumblr caricature. That may not mean anything to you, but before the severe decline over the last few years... man, my pull list.

Cap, Winter Soldier, Black Widow, Avengers, Uncanny Avengers, Young Avengers, Guardians 3000, GotG, Iron Fist, Thunderbolts, Avengers Academy, Spiderman, Thor, Cable, Deadpool, Daredevil, Red Wolf, America, so many comics.

Sadly, with everything, I'm just falling to DC. It's weird. DC doesn't feel like 'home,' but it at least feels right. Epic, yet familiar.

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Old 08-08-2017, 06:51 PM   #312
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

I find everything with Marvel completely off. Captain marvel will now be "off the Charts" powered according to Feige and there are 3 Thors. It's all part of depowering and diminishing legacy characters that started all of this and catering to the new crowd of know it all bratts. They will not get my families hard earned money. Will not go see Ms marvell, just because this is ridiculous. And if it affects Infi. Wars... then i'll look for a way to see it without spending. ive had it NO MORE PC crap.

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Old 09-07-2017, 01:56 PM   #313
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

http://www.screengeek.net/2017/09/02...be-in-trouble/

"Marvel Comics Rumored To Be In Some Serious Trouble"

Quote:
It’s time for that rumor mill to start spinning and it might be a big one. Word around the comic book campfire is that Marvel’s lines of comic books are a disaster behind the scenes and big changes are coming our way.
Can't believe I'm saying this but I hope this is true. I'd rather see Marvel Publishing fold then continue on disgracing their history with this SJW nonsense. Mass firings or stop the presses. Either way, end this madness. No sane true old school fans are still reading any of this nonsense and the numbers are backing that up.

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Old 09-07-2017, 01:59 PM   #314
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

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You’re going to have to take this with a huge grain of salt but the news is showing up on message boards across 4chan on their diverse replacement characters
Yup, really reliable
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Originally Posted by Marvel View Post
Can't believe I'm saying this but I hope this is true. I'd rather see Marvel Publishing fold then continue on disgracing their history with this SJW nonsense. Mass firings or stop the presses. Either way, end this madness. No sane true old school fans are still reading any of this nonsense and the numbers are backing that up.
Keep dreaming and maybe post on 4chan instead.

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Old 09-08-2017, 08:50 PM   #315
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The comic book industry must be saved from itself and these SJW agendas.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_c1Bq2_4Mc

"Clean sweep at Marvel" has to happen at this point. Fire everyone at the top.

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Old 09-09-2017, 12:35 PM   #316
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That Youtube Channel is a joke and a troll. The paranoid conspiracy theories coming from the ramblings of that narrow minded wackjob are deranged and a giant waste of time.

He starts that video by "calling a war room". How could anyone take that seriously? He just spews ridiculous crap for views because he knows there's an angry entitled audience for his opinions.

I watched his Iceman review video a bit ago. More bigoted bs, where he speaks for all gay people despite being straight, and then physically rips the book in half. That guy has serious psychological issues and its baffling that people watch his videos and soak up his nonsense.

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Old 09-09-2017, 02:05 PM   #317
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

^Agreed, except for the baffling part. There's never been a shortage of idiots to support other idiots.

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Old 09-09-2017, 04:30 PM   #318
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

Honestly, the only Marvel comic I've come across to be completely 100% SJW driven is America.

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Old 09-09-2017, 05:18 PM   #319
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

Champions is 100% SJW. I think a lot of other books dabble in it though. X-Men Gold comes to mind and maybe Iceman (though I'm not sure I'd consider it SJW as much as it just covers a topic typically more linked to SJWs).

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Old 09-09-2017, 06:02 PM   #320
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

Marvel Publishing is in the toilet right now and it's undeniable.

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Old 09-10-2017, 06:34 PM   #321
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

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Champions is 100% SJW. I think a lot of other books dabble in it though. X-Men Gold comes to mind and maybe Iceman (though I'm not sure I'd consider it SJW as much as it just covers a topic typically more linked to SJWs).
Doesn't seem to hurt the Champions' sales, much...

As usual, this thread and everything "Marvel" posts is pure hogwash. Unfortuantely, the line's REAL problems make it way too easy for certain crowds to justify their own hating agendas.

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Old 09-11-2017, 12:09 PM   #322
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

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Doesn't seem to hurt the Champions' sales, much...

As usual, this thread and everything "Marvel" posts is pure hogwash. Unfortuantely, the line's REAL problems make it way too easy for certain crowds to justify their own hating agendas.
I don't really pay attention to sales so I have no idea if the Champions' book being targeted for SJWs hurts sales or not. I was just mentioning that it was definitely in that avenue.

As I said when I started it, I just thought the article's talking points could start up some interesting conversation. And as I've said before, I don't think it's the main reason why the company is having some issues. But it's definitely a turn off for a lot of fans which could result in being a small PART of the problem.

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Old 09-11-2017, 02:44 PM   #323
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

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No sane true old school fans are still reading any of this nonsense and the numbers are backing that up.
50% of comic book readers are women. Another percentage are minorities. And 40% are between the ages of 18-25. So if your plan is to rely on "true old school fans" to sustain Marvel, then you are dooming them to bankruptcy. Diversity isn't Marvel's problem. People who rely on such an explanation for Marvel's woes are just using it as a cheap and easy excuse to justify their racism by neglecting women and people of color from having representation in a genre which they've previously been neglected.

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Old 09-11-2017, 04:05 PM   #324
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People who rely on such an explanation for Marvel's woes are just using it as a cheap and easy excuse to justify their racism by neglecting women and people of color from having representation in a genre which they've previously been neglected.
No this is just nonsense imo.

Here's the thing.. Marvel's only ever had a "big two". Spiderman and Hulk. A lot of the other guys have got more prominence very recently because of the movies, but everybody's forgetting that before the MCU, the Avengers were second fiddle in the Marvel universe to the X-Men.

The X-Men have been MASSIVE for decades and have always been hugely diverse with very strong female leads (maybe TOO strong, Claremont!). Strong, POPULAR, fan favourite diverse and female characters.

Marvel complained that fans were driven away by "Diversity", forgetting that one of their biggest and most popular characters for 40 years has been an African woman. Storm's consistently been shown as one of the most powerful and competent heroes in the MU, as well as a great leader.

I find it hilarious that when Marvel shows off their new-diverse characters, there's normally Black Panther in there too. He's been a fan favourite since the 60s ffs Now they're pretending his popularity is some radical shift towards diversity in the industry.

Black Panther, The Falcon, Storm, Luke Cage, Mar Machine, Blade, Bishop, Black Goliath, Doctor Voodoo, Deathlok and others have all had their own titles at one time or another (albeit some as mini-series), and they've all had a huge number of fans. The difference is that they ALL had to sell a title based on their characters and the quality of the story. None just relied on "LOOK WE HAVE A BLACK CHARACTER!!" headlines like Riri does (because, that's the only thing that she has going for her - such a terrible character).

So this is my issue with the "diverse" streak in Marvel recently. It's all just a shallow sales gimmick. They're shamelessly using race, gender and sexuality to grab headlines - as if it was all just another "event" and they're putting just as much care in the quality of the titles as they do their usual events (ie a couple of great titles, and a whole heap of crappy ones)


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Old 09-11-2017, 04:06 PM   #325
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Default Re: Liberal Writers Killing Marvel Comics?

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50% of comic book readers are women. Another percentage are minorities. And 40% are between the ages of 18-25. So if your plan is to rely on "true old school fans" to sustain Marvel, then you are dooming them to bankruptcy. Diversity isn't Marvel's problem. People who rely on such an explanation for Marvel's woes are just using it as a cheap and easy excuse to justify their racism by neglecting women and people of color from having representation in a genre which they've previously been neglected.
That's quite an assumption you're throwing out there. It's a shallow and lazy thought process that jumps from nostalgia to racism/sexism/etc. Believe it or not, people tend to have more depth than that. I'm curious when people will learn that lesson after liberals helped get Donald Trump elected with such hollow rhetoric.

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