Discusin' the Villians

[Hunter Rider]

what does everyone think of the choice of mephisto as the lead villian for the movie i'm not sure it could end up being a crappy CGI creation like at the end of hellboy.I would have preferd Blackout or deathwatch.I guess there saving Vengeance for the sequel

[BIGGUN]

Mephisto HAS to be the main villain....he has been since day one of the original series and even the 90s series(or at least he was called Satan back then).
to not include him in the movie would be a big mistake.
now the only thing is i do not want to see him fight GR....Mephisto never engaged in hand to hand combat w/ lesser beings. he was always the dude who controlled things ....had other creatures do his dirty work for him.
if its true on what MSJ told me about Blackheart being in the movie he would be the one who would fight GR. that i can see happening.
really dont want Blackout as the main villain....he wouldnt last more than 3 minutes in a fight w/ GR. unless, of course they give him more powers which would not make him "Blackout" anymore. he would make a good lesser secondary villain though....something like a henchman type of role.
Vengeance might work....but use him for later sequels (if any)

[Hunter Rider]

Originally Posted by BIGGUN

Mephisto HAS to be the main villain....he has been since day one of the original series and even the 90s series(or at least he was called Satan back then).
to not include him in the movie would be a big mistake.
now the only thing is i do not want to see him fight GR....Mephisto never engaged in hand to hand combat w/ lesser beings. he was always the dude who controlled things ....had other creatures do his dirty work for him.
if its true on what MSJ told me about Blackheart being in the movie he would be the one who would fight GR. that i can see happening.
really dont want Blackout as the main villain....he wouldnt last more than 3 minutes in a fight w/ GR. unless, of course they give him more powers which would not make him "Blackout" anymore. he would make a good lesser secondary villain though....something like a henchman type of role.
Vengeance might work....but use him for later sequels (if any)

i am just getting into GR at the moment as its hard to get books so i take your more informed point about mephisto who by the way is blackheart.
do you know the budget for GR or if anyone will be cast as mephisto or will he be CGI(hope not)
i wondwer if it is only moderately succesfull like punisher if they might put the 2 together like AVP

[BIGGUN]

the budget of 70mil has been talked about for a long time but then i heard it was 40 mil. maybe 70mil is the total amount after marketing costs...we will see
since Cage is attached as Blaze and that Sony wants this to be a Summer blockbuster type of film im sure they want this to do better than say Hellboy...maybe they want it to get about 100 mil at least.
im not worried too much about the cgi...from the looks of things the producers want this film to do well. it would be a great embarrassment if they used crappy cgi effects for a film that stars someone like Nic Cage. just wouldnt look good on Marvel's part.
no one has been cast as Mephisto yet....but who knows they may make an announcement this Wed at the Q&A session in Melbourne.
i do hope they dont show Mephisto's true form too much....it always seemed creepier to me when they just hinted at Satan's true form.

[Hunter Rider]

$70M dosent sound bad but ithink that $100M shouldve been given to MSJ

there will be a lot of visual effects and there is nothing worse than bad CGI to bring you out of a good movie.
Do you think he will get the kind of leway LOTR got with violence?

[CaptainStacy]

They should go with Lilith as the main villain. That way her Lilin (demonic offspring) can be used as serious challenges to GR....plus, think of all the cool action figures!!!

[BIGGUN]

Originally Posted by hunter rider

Do you think he will get the kind of leway LOTR got with violence?

i think they can....simply make quick cuts right as you see something get killed. and if you noticed in the LOTR films most or all of the dismemberments were orcs and goblins. i think they can get away w/ the gore since the beings that were being killed were not human and did not have normal colored blood.


Lilith would be cool....but again i would save her for if/when Ketch becomes the new GR. you could really make several films around Lilith if need be.
Blackheart can still use underlings....after all he is the son of Mephisto and would be entitled to using cronies like his dad. added to the fact that BH and Mephisto want to kill each other it would add some cool background for BH. he could even be a slightly sympathetic villain if need be.
BH in his own warped view of reality feels that he would be a better ruler of Hell than his father and that mankind would be better off if Mephisto is gone.
sadly he feels that "the ends justify the means" and uses tactics just as bad as his father's to reach his goal. maybe where thousands of innocent people would be killed as a result of BH attempting to destroy Mephisto.

[Hunter Rider]

could someone please post pics of lilith and Blackheart as i am not familiar with them

[BIGGUN]

Blackheart.....imagine seeing this on the big screen....




will see if i can find any of Lilith...

[Hunter Rider]

Originally Posted by BIGGUN

Blackheart.....imagine seeing this on the big screen....




will see if i can find any of Lilith...

Thanks i think he would look great on the big screen especially if done with prosthetics and just topped up with CGI.

[BIGGUN]

No prob..
here is one of Lilith...think they would have to change some things on her though..

[Hunter Rider]

Originally Posted by BIGGUN

No prob..
here is one of Lilith...think they would have to change some things on her though..

Yes definately some changes needed but not the usual leather outfit like every other female comic character put on screen.
Any Suggestions?
Sorry to be a pain but got any vengeance or V vs GR pics you could post i want to get more informed on GR's enemies

[Hunter Rider]

Just read MSJ's melbourne comments.
The abandoned railway chopper Chase sequence sounds potentially awesome but budget stretching.
I hope it dosen't replace the scene where Gr rides up the side of a skyscraper and jumps through a chopper that avi arad mentioned in empire.

[FlameHead]

I can't believe it's taken me so long to post to this thread. I've been passing it by lately as I've only been on these boards at work and I just didn't have the time necessary to make a good post. Now I do. So... here I am, now that the conversation has dried up. Better late, than never I guess.

Mephisto
I'm happy that Mephisto is the baddie, like most other people. After all, without him Johnny Blaze would never have become Ghost Rider. If this is an Origin story (and I suspect it is) then they're gonna need the guy (and I use that term loosely) that created him.
I agree with BIGGUN on him not being shown in true for at this time as well. The longer we think the guy is human, the better. Having said that, I think there should come a time where we do see his true form. Perhaps in a sequal. Why? Because there are some really great panels that I would love to see in motion.
I wonder who's gonna be casted now....

Blackheart
If he is used, he should be a henchmen and probably will be. Mephisto will probably rise him from the pits of hell and send him loose. Ghost Rider will make way with him and move on. I wonder what he'll look like if he is used. Will he be in his true form or be hiding like Mephisto likely will?
BIGGUN, I took some pics of him from the HOD book. I'll post them here when I get a chance to photoshop and upload them.

Blackout
Hunter, you mentioned Blackout in your first post and didn't really talk about him much after that. I think it's because BlackHeart started being discussed. Anyway, I think he'd make a good villian as well but probably can be saved for the Lilith Storyline that I hope happens someday. He is a Grandson of hers...

Lilith
As much as I love her as a villian and as much as I love her entire family I think it's too big, too soon. I mean, the story in the comics span over 5 or 6 titles involving tonnes of issues. I know this can be condensed but it'll still take a lot of time to develope. I picture her story as a trilogy alone... and we'll probably never see that happen.

Vengence
I don't know about having Vengence on screen with Ghost Rider. I think it would be too confusing and would in turn take away from seeing Ghost Rider on screen. Two flaming heads aren't necessarily better. It's sorta like the whole Blade and Hannibal King thing. Having two vampires fighting side by side would take away from Blade being a vampy and fighting other vampies... so they made Hannibal king an ex vampy.
PLUS, Vengence becomes a good guy after a short peried of time and ends up discovering that he has part of the Medallion of Power. He is a Midnight Son. This means, he's not really an enemy.

This is him......

[FlameHead]

Here are those BlackHeart pics I mentioned....

[Master Kenobi]

CONFIRMED:

Blackheart & Mephistopholes

will be the villians in the Ghost Rider Movie!

Confirmed by Mark Steven Johnson and producers.

[Metamorpho1977]

Is John Voigt still attached to play a villain?

John Voigt as Mephisto should be cool.

[Hunter Rider]

Originally Posted by FlameHead

Vengence
I don't know about having Vengence on screen with Ghost Rider. I think it would be too confusing and would in turn take away from seeing Ghost Rider on screen. Two flaming heads aren't necessarily better. It's sorta like the whole Blade and Hannibal King thing. Having two vampires fighting side by side would take away from Blade being a vampy and fighting other vampies... so they made Hannibal king an ex vampy.
PLUS, Vengence becomes a good guy after a short peried of time and ends up discovering that he has part of the Medallion of Power. He is a Midnight Son. This means, he's not really an enemy.

First of Great to see GR with his own forum.
Secondly thanks for the cool vengeance pic and all the info.

Read the MSJ Q&A report not a lot of info though,why havent they confirmed Cage is there a problem?
still i liked the modern western analogy.
ive mentioned this before but does anyone know if this qoute from avi arad is about a definate scene in the movie,"when you see Gr ride his flaming motorcycle up a skyscraper and then jump through a helicopter you will beleive" ?
as for story do you think MSJ wiil make it work i have been reading up and its pretty heavy stuff ?
I take your point about Vengeance.
Do you think they will have an ongoing storyline for the whole run(hopefully 3 at least) or a different villian story for each ?
if they go different i would like to see Centurious with Steel Wind And Steel Vengeance as his henchladies(i want some bike on bike action!) this would mean you could still keep mephisto involved beacause of his link to centurious.
I hope i got that last bit right.
Does anybody agree Gr will be the most Visually amazing hero ever put on screen ?
Anyway i am just glad its finally getting made.

[The Flash]

Originally Posted by BIGGUN

Blackheart.....imagine seeing this on the big screen....




will see if i can find any of Lilith...

That's one of the coolest shots I've seen of Blackheart so far. Thanks for posting it BIGGUN.

Has there been any mention of Memphisto as being the main villain yet?

[Hunter Rider]

Originally Posted by The Flash

That's one of the coolest shots I've seen of Blackheart so far. Thanks for posting it BIGGUN.

Has there been any mention of Memphisto as being the main villain yet?

Yes he is the main villian check the SHH report

[zer00]

Originally Posted by FlameHead

Here are those BlackHeart pics I mentioned....

After seeing these..looks like I'm going to go read 'hearts of darkness' again.

[The Flash]

Originally Posted by hunter rider

Yes he is the main villian check the SHH report

Thanks. I didn't know for sure. Some say he wasn't going to be, and some say he is. So you can see how I get confused.

[FlameHead]

Originally Posted by hunter rider

First of Great to see GR with his own forum.
Secondly thanks for the cool vengeance pic and all the info.

Read the MSJ Q&A report not a lot of info though,why havent they confirmed Cage is there a problem?
still i liked the modern western analogy.
ive mentioned this before but does anyone know if this qoute from avi arad is about a definate scene in the movie,"when you see Gr ride his flaming motorcycle up a skyscraper and then jump through a helicopter you will beleive" ?
as for story do you think MSJ wiil make it work i have been reading up and its pretty heavy stuff ?
I take your point about Vengeance.
Do you think they will have an ongoing storyline for the whole run(hopefully 3 at least) or a different villian story for each ?
if they go different i would like to see Centurious with Steel Wind And Steel Vengeance as his henchladies(i want some bike on bike action!) this would mean you could still keep mephisto involved beacause of his link to centurious.
I hope i got that last bit right.
Does anybody agree Gr will be the most Visually amazing hero ever put on screen ?
Anyway i am just glad its finally getting made.

If the movie is successful then, it'll get three. I think it will be successfull. If it is, I'd love to see a Lilith story line come into play. I do agree that a Steel sister battle would be awesome... and most likely the way they would go with a sequal.

[Hunter Rider]

Originally Posted by The Flash

Thanks. I didn't know for sure. Some say he wasn't going to be, and some say he is. So you can see how I get confused.

No problem and i know its easy to get confused as there is so many rumors particualy on the net.

[FlameHead]

We'll likely here a dozen more rumors yet. The net created a world of lies mixed with half truths. You just have to sift through the bull**** to find the truth... and not crap on anybody along the way.