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Old 04-16-2006, 05:46 PM   #26
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by Super_Ludacris
I never got a chance to see the leak script. I havent really been here but I'm assuming it was ok?
It wasn't bad at all, it just had a couple isolated parts that caused much contriversey.

The 2 biggest were the demolecularization of Cyclops, and the sexual relationship between Wolverine and Storm.

Other than that, it was a pretty good premise.

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Old 04-16-2006, 05:47 PM   #27
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by Nell2ThaIzzay
It's a conflict, not a war...

And there are many occurances in the comics when the X-Men fought in these "wars" and nobody died. Nobody complained about the "ridiculousness" of nobody dying in war then. So why now?
because some of the things in the comics are stupid?

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Originally Posted by zryson
Is it real? Or a wig? Maybe he wears a wig in the movie cause he is bald and then at the end of the movie he rips off the wig and throws it at Superman.
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Old 04-16-2006, 05:48 PM   #28
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nell2ThaIzzay
It wasn't bad at all, it just had a couple isolated parts that caused much contriversey.

The 2 biggest were the demolecularization of Cyclops, and the sexual relationship between Wolverine and Storm.

Other than that, it was a pretty good premise.
And other than the fact that it got a terrible review. It wasn't the finished version though, so I'm not very worried about it.

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Old 04-16-2006, 05:50 PM   #29
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nell2ThaIzzay
It wasn't bad at all, it just had a couple isolated parts that caused much contriversey.

The 2 biggest were the demolecularization of Cyclops, and the sexual relationship between Wolverine and Storm.
Other than that, it was a pretty good premise.
Oh......that ever happend in the comics? I havent read X-Men in 10 years, trying to get back into it

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Old 04-16-2006, 05:51 PM   #30
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by Super_Ludacris
Oh......that ever happend in the comics? I havent read X-Men in 10 years, trying to get back into it
I believe it has, but I don't know for sure, because most of my X-Men comics are older ones.

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Old 04-16-2006, 05:52 PM   #31
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by lordofthenerds
And other than the fact that it got a terrible review. It wasn't the finished version though, so I'm not very worried about it.
Just because it got a terrible review doesn't mean it was bad...

Harry has been bashing X-Men 3 since day one, and from what I've seen, he hasn't let up yet, despite the good things that have come from this film, in the form of pictures, trailers, and T.V. spots.

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Old 04-16-2006, 05:52 PM   #32
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Super_Ludacris
I never got a chance to see the leak script. I havent really been here but I'm assuming it was ok?
It was a downer because they killed off Cyclops and Xavier in the first half of the movie, and the trailers make it seem like they didn't change that.

But I think they changed one at least.

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Old 04-16-2006, 05:53 PM   #33
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by Maze
because some of the things in the comics are stupid?
Okay, I agree with that, but that still doesn't mean that people have to die in this movie.

This is a comic book movie, not Saving Private Ryan... the whole "war" aspect is really being over-stated and taken too seriously.

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Old 04-16-2006, 05:53 PM   #34
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nell2ThaIzzay
Just because it got a terrible review doesn't mean it was bad...

Harry has been bashing X-Men 3 since day one, and from what I've seen, he hasn't let up yet, despite the good things that have come from this film, in the form of pictures, trailers, and T.V. spots.
True. I bet that man would give X3 a bad review even if he liked it.

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Old 04-16-2006, 05:54 PM   #35
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

See, I dont mind them doing little bold moves like that, in the end if the product is good its fine but I could see how that upsets people.

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Old 04-16-2006, 05:56 PM   #36
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

Quote:
Originally Posted by PikaZeroX
It was a downer because they killed off Cyclops and Xavier in the first half of the movie, and the trailers make it seem like they didn't change that.

But I think they changed one at least.
I'm 100% certain in my own mind that the Cyclops death has been changed, and was only added in the first place as a way to work around Marsden's limited availability, should he not be able to shoot for a full role.

But the filming of X-Men 3 got pushed back, and didn't conflict with the shooting of Superman Returns as badly as it was originally going to, so Marsden was more available that he as originally going to be.

Kinberg even said that draft was turned in just so Fox could get an idea of what their budget for the movie was going to need to be. And I think the Cyclops death was just there as an insurance policy.

I've never believed Cyclops' death to be true.

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Old 04-16-2006, 05:59 PM   #37
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by Nell2ThaIzzay
Okay, I agree with that, but that still doesn't mean that people have to die in this movie.

This is a comic book movie, not Saving Private Ryan... the whole "war" aspect is really being over-stated .and taken too seriously
Well imo , even if it not saving Private Ryan , even if yes it has not to be taken too seriously, to really involve the audience you have to have some sense of real danger..i mean you have already somebody that has ressurected , you have a "war" and nobody die?

Even more Nell , you are one of the people who don't wan't an X4.if in the Xmen everything is safe , there is not an "end" to things you can be sure that you will see not only sequels ( and if this movie is a succes they are inevitable imo) but sequel where for the screenwriters it will become harder and harder to write script who have some base of reality..

and that was the force of this franchise , you believed that it could happen.

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Is it real? Or a wig? Maybe he wears a wig in the movie cause he is bald and then at the end of the movie he rips off the wig and throws it at Superman.
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Old 04-16-2006, 06:03 PM   #38
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Well imo , even if it not saving Private Ryan , even if yes it has not to be taken too seriously, to really involve the audience you have to have some sense of real danger..i mean you have already somebody that has ressurected , you have a "war" and nobody die?

Even more Nell , you are one of the people who don't wan't an X4.if in the Xmen everything is safe , there is not an "end" to things you can be sure that you will see not only sequels ( and if this movie is a succes they are inevitable imo) but sequel where for the screenwriters it will become harder and harder to write script who have some base of reality..

and that was the force of this franchise , you believed that it could happen.
I disagree. I believe that you can bring closure to the franchise without killing everyone off. Check out the Sentinels thread, and read my "treatment" if you will, of the 3rd act.

And even more, if this franchise does continue, which you're right, I don't really want, but if it must, I want it done right. And that means keeping the core characters of Cyclops, Wolverine, Storm, Jean Grey, etc... not killing them off and replacing them with characters who shouldn't be the core of the X-Men in an adaptation, which is one of the reasons why I am against this franchise continuing.

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Old 04-16-2006, 06:08 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by Nell2ThaIzzay
I disagree. I believe that you can bring closure to the franchise without killing everyone off. Check out the Sentinels thread, and read my "treatment" if you will, of the 3rd act.

And even more, if this franchise does continue, which you're right, I don't really want, but if it must, I want it done right. And that means keeping the core characters of Cyclops, Wolverine, Storm, Jean Grey, etc... not killing them off and replacing them with characters who shouldn't be the core of the X-Men in an adaptation, which is one of the reasons why I am against this franchise continuing.
Well we will have to agree to disagree

Now from a screenwriting point of view i can tell you , that continuing in a safe way , not killing any character , resurecting them, will kill this serie.

Those are not comics , that is cinema.

ps: i read your treatement , nice,
but that doesn't change what i'm saying.

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Is it real? Or a wig? Maybe he wears a wig in the movie cause he is bald and then at the end of the movie he rips off the wig and throws it at Superman.

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Old 04-16-2006, 06:35 PM   #40
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Those are not comics , that is cinema.
Yes, you're right, it is cinema, not the comics. And if you know anything about me, it's that I understand that certain changes do have to be made to successfully translate the material to the big screen.

But at the same time, you still do have to remain faithful to the source material. And killing off a bunch of characters that don't die in the source material (and I don't count "deaths" in which the character has come back from, such as deaths faced by every character in comics ever in which they come back later down the road because of some crazy ass, totally unrealistic explaination, as dying)for "dramatic purpose" is not how you remain faithful.

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Old 04-16-2006, 06:49 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by Nell2ThaIzzay
Yes, you're right, it is cinema, not the comics. And if you know anything about me, it's that I understand that certain changes do have to be made to successfully translate the material to the big screen.

But at the same time, you still do have to remain faithful to the source material. And killing off a bunch of characters that don't die in the source material (and I don't count "deaths" in which the character has come back from, such as deaths faced by every character in comics ever in which they come back later down the road because of some crazy ass, totally unrealistic explaination, as dying)for "dramatic purpose" is not how you remain faithful.
Yes Nell i know that you are a believer that some things have to change and i agree obviously.

but why do you believe that some things like the fact that the core character do not die must not change? You say ,because that doesn't happen in the comics?ok.

But, why do they never ever really die? because that is too risky ,because one must sell month after month .if not Jean grey/phoenix would have stayed dead .

What would you have done ?you would have not killed jean grey at all?

Well , ok , but the saga would have lost a lot of his weight.Like it did when she came back.(and we are in agreement that is it a lame , it seem)

So do you think ,Nell ,that the commercial side is a good reason to not kill any major character?(and i'm sure that you don't)

I don't think so.

The characters, and especially because they are outrageous can't really live a breath, and really grow if you don't have some sense of reality in it.

And because the producer of X3 are also salesman, i fear that you are right and that no core characters will really die (forgetting maybe the"vilains" )

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Is it real? Or a wig? Maybe he wears a wig in the movie cause he is bald and then at the end of the movie he rips off the wig and throws it at Superman.

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Old 04-16-2006, 06:55 PM   #42
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

I'd have to say that, yes it is a war.

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Old 04-16-2006, 07:19 PM   #43
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edit :We can continue to argue but anyways,there will be death.that's a shame that there are little chances that they'll stay dead..

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*Of course it’s not necessary. There are plenty of dramatic movies (and books and plays) that have no prominent deaths. Our particular story demanded some death – I can’t think of a war movie that didn’t have some death in it.

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Is it real? Or a wig? Maybe he wears a wig in the movie cause he is bald and then at the end of the movie he rips off the wig and throws it at Superman.

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Old 04-16-2006, 07:29 PM   #44
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Yes Nell i know that you are a believer that some things have to change and i agree obviously.

but why do you believe that some things like the fact that the core character do not die must not change? You say ,because that doesn't happen in the comics?ok.

But, why do they never ever really die? because that is too risky ,because one must sell month after month .if not Jean grey/phoenix would have stayed dead .

What would you have done ?you would have not killed jean grey at all?

Well , ok , but the saga would have lost a lot of his weight.Like it did when she came back.(and we are in agreement that is it a lame , it seem)

So do you think ,Nell ,that the commercial side is a good reason to not kill any major character?(and i'm sure that you don't)

I don't think so.

The characters, and especially because they are outrageous can't really live a breath, and really grow if you don't have some sense of reality in it.

And because the producer of X3 are also salesman, i fear that you are right and that no core characters will really die (forgetting maybe the"vilains" )

Reasons to be careful of movie deaths:

1) Studio demand/public demand - It's a franchise, Maze... there may be future movies, like X4. It's dangerous to kill off characters if there is demand for their return.

2) Alienating the fanbase - these are the people (us) who see the movie several times, rave on about it on forums for months and years before and after, who go on about it to colleagues (and i know i've converted almost every person i know to being a superhero fan!), who are first in line to buy the DVD, who buy all the special editions of the DVD. Movies that stray too far from the source material in their content (Fantastic Four, Catwoman) or their style (Hulk, Elektra) always seem to end up being blasted to pieces by critics even if they don't do that badly (usually they recoup cash at DVD sales level).. it's dangerous to change things too much from the source. The X-Men have been going for 40 years....so many fans of so many different characters.. Do you want to risk switching off a whole group of fans who follow a certain character if you kill that character off?

3) When we have had deaths in comicbook movies it's almost always been the villains (Joker, Penguin, TwoFace, Green Goblin, Ra's Al Ghul, Doctor Octopus, Sabretooth, Toad, Deathstryke, Stryker) because of a basic need for justice, for good to win in the end... basic storytelling... When good people die (Lois Lane in Superman 1, Lana Lang in Smallville, Elektra in Daredevil), they usually come back! (not always, but usually!).

I'm not against deaths, but they have to be carefully considered. Like Nell said, I'm sure the initial script draft was created when it seemed James Marsden was unlikely to be available.

I've no idea if Cyclops lives or dies in X3. It's a massive risk and a big departure to kill him off, and yet I can see how it fits the story structure if his apparent death is there to make Jean go crazy, side with Magneto and attack Xavier. Whether they have scripted Cyclops to make a return at the end and talk Jean down from a destructive rampage, I have no idea. I have no idea if she redeems herself. I can't imagine she happily swishes back into the mansion as if nothing has happened.

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Old 04-16-2006, 07:37 PM   #45
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And because the producer of X3 are also salesman, i fear that you are right and that no core characters will really die (forgetting maybe the"vilains" )


Quote:
Reasons to be careful of movie deaths:

1) Studio demand/public demand - It's a franchise, Maze... there may be future movies, like X4. It's dangerous to kill off characters if there is demand for their return.
Good analysis Xmaniac , and I understand all that: you are right obviously, there will not be real death.

Now,to make really powerful story, answering to the publics demand everytime restrain the artistic side of things (and , curiously when you give the public what they wan't, when you don't surprise them , you don't win them everytime..the paradox...)

But again, you're right , for all those reasons,there will not be real death.

I would prefer that to be a true artistic decision ..we are not living in such a world i agree.

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Is it real? Or a wig? Maybe he wears a wig in the movie cause he is bald and then at the end of the movie he rips off the wig and throws it at Superman.

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Old 04-16-2006, 07:40 PM   #46
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

This movie is gonna blow us away.
I bet they aren't showing anything thats spoilerish.
They don't want to ruin the movie for us die-hard fans.

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Old 04-16-2006, 07:55 PM   #47
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by Nell2ThaIzzay
I'm 100% certain in my own mind that the Cyclops death has been changed, and was only added in the first place as a way to work around Marsden's limited availability, should he not be able to shoot for a full role.

But the filming of X-Men 3 got pushed back, and didn't conflict with the shooting of Superman Returns as badly as it was originally going to, so Marsden was more available that he as originally going to be.

Kinberg even said that draft was turned in just so Fox could get an idea of what their budget for the movie was going to need to be. And I think the Cyclops death was just there as an insurance policy.

I've never believed Cyclops' death to be true.
i wish i was more optimistic like you but from we've seen in the trailers to the photos out and knowing fox' history, im sorry to say that i still think he bites the big one and that he shows up in the end, only in jeans head.

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Old 04-16-2006, 07:56 PM   #48
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i wish i was more optimistic like you but from we've seen in the trailers to the photos out and knowing fox' history, im sorry to say that i still think he bites the big one and that he shows up in the end, only in jeans head.
Trailers are very misleading.

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:00 PM   #49
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Good analysis Xmaniac , and I understand all that: you are right obviously, there will not be real death.

Now,to make really powerful story, answering to the publics demand everytime restrain the artistic side of things (and , curiously when you give the public what they wan't, when you don't surprise them , you don't win them everytime..the paradox...)

But again, you're right , for all those reasons,there will not be real death.

I would prefer that to be a true artistic decision ..we are not living in such a world i agree.
the studios pander to the crowd but they're not the french and wouldn't just bow out because people protest. (j'aime le français. je vais là- dans l'été. je ne peux pas attendre aller). though cyclops is a major character, he has certaintly not been portrayed as one, especially in x2. they could still easily toss him to the side.

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:01 PM   #50
tonytr1687
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Join Date: Sep 2005
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avalanche
In a war?

Doesn't seem that ridiculous to me that two people could die in a brewing war.

It's pretty much widely known that the script isn't the same as it was for the AICN draft. Things will have changed. The basic premise of the draft remains however.
People keep using this whole war idea as an excuse for the many deaths. But here's the thing...the rumored deaths for Xavier and Cyke aren't even a result of the war, they're merely casualties of Dark Phoenix's power.

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