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Old 04-16-2006, 08:03 PM   #51
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by WorthyStevens4
Trailers are very misleading.
i thought the same thing also .. but i watched the x2 trailers again, trying to be objective. the main point they were getting across was the school being attacked.. but all in all the trailer held true to the actual movie, key things were missing ofcourse like jean at the end and little things n they did hint at xavier and cerebro.

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:03 PM   #52
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by cyke93
the studios pander to the crowd but they're not the french and wouldn't just bow out because people protest. (j'aime le français. je vais là- dans l'été. je ne peux pas attendre aller). though cyclops is a major character, he has certaintly not been portrayed as one, especially in x2. they could still easily toss him to the side.
Why do people keep saying this?

Have you not seen the ending to X2? It proved he's very much worth a damn.

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:04 PM   #53
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by cyke93
i wish i was more optimistic like you but from we've seen in the trailers to the photos out and knowing fox' history, im sorry to say that i still think he bites the big one and that he shows up in the end, only in jeans head.
if you are reffering to Alien3 and his deaths , that was hugely impopular and they were not characters that had 40 years of history.

So, don't fear Xmaniac is right.They will not risk alienating the core audience: even if Scott bite the dust ( and i doubt it) he will come back as a clone or something..

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:08 PM   #54
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by cyke93
the studios pander to the crowd but they're not the french and wouldn't just bow out because people protest. (j'aime le français. je vais là- dans l'été. je ne peux pas attendre aller). though cyclops is a major character, he has certaintly not been portrayed as one, especially in x2. they could still easily toss him to the side.
We are talking movies and trades, not politics.

ps: ok you like the France , but let's drop the political comments , and especially if they are scorning .You don't wan't us to talk about American politics, don't you?


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Old 04-16-2006, 08:11 PM   #55
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by WorthyStevens4
Trailers are very misleading.
Agreed

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:13 PM   #56
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by tonytr1687
People keep using this whole war idea as an excuse for the many deaths. But here's the thing...the rumored deaths for Xavier and Cyke aren't even a result of the war, they're merely casualties of Dark Phoenix's power.
yup you're right.Tony

but phoenix is not the one of the Aicn script.she is a skizo ..and at worst , i don't see her accidently killing Scott..but willingly .To realize, in her jean pesonna, with horror what she has done .

Even if i don't believe that scott will die (and even more that he will stay dead)even, if i'm a great fan of scott, even if that's departure from the original saga, i could accept that , and even like it..there Phoenix would be really scary imo.


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Old 04-16-2006, 08:22 PM   #57
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by WorthyStevens4
Why do people keep saying this?

Have you not seen the ending to X2? It proved he's very much worth a damn.
as a cyclops fan, of course i saw it.. to the reg average movie go'er .. not so much. wolverine is the main draw not cyclops. they've put more heat on logan and jean than cyclops and jean.. look at the 4 main x-men from x1. wolverine is obviously not going anywhere, storm is halle berry shes staying put, they made jean phoenix, she aint going newhere, where does that leave cyclops? exactly .. i have no doubt now that cyclops will come back at the end, simply to appease the outcry of fans but it'll be a daydream/flashback whatever ..

and i dont trust the promos, look at what they did to jean in x2.

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:24 PM   #58
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by Maze
yup you're right.Tony

but phoenix is not the one of the Aicn script.she is a skizo ..and at worst , i don't see her accidently killing Scott..but willingly .To realize, in her jean pesonna, with horror what she has done .

Even if i don't believe that scott will die (and even more that he will stay dead)even, if i'm a great fan of scott, even if that's departure from the original saga, i could accept that , and even like it..there Phoenix would be really scary imo.
Jean would never do that willingly, even if she was schizo. That would be worse than her killing him accidentally. Scott is supposed to be the only one who can break through to her and stop her from being evil. I should correct you and a lot of ppl here on one thing though, what Jean is supposed to have in X3 isn't schizophrenia, it's multiple personality disorder. For some reason ppl like to say schizophrenia when talking about someone with a split personality.

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:25 PM   #59
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by cyke93
as a cyclops fan, of course i saw it.. to the reg average movie go'er .. not so much. wolverine is the main draw not cyclops. they've put more heat on logan and jean than cyclops and jean.. look at the 4 main x-men from x1. wolverine is obviously not going anywhere, storm is halle berry shes staying put, they made jean phoenix, she aint going newhere, where does that leave cyclops? exactly .. i have no doubt now that cyclops will come back at the end, simply to appease the outcry of fans but it'll be a daydream/flashback whatever ..

and i dont trust the promos, look at what they did to jean in x2.
They were hiding something huge with the Phoenix at the end... they had reason to put that promo out.

With X3, not so much...

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:31 PM   #60
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by Maze
We are talking movies and trades, not politics.

ps: ok you like the France , but let's drop the political comments , and especially if they are scorning .You don't wan't us to talk about American politics, don't you?
oh i prolly agree with all the arugments about american politics hehehe lol



They were hiding something huge with the Phoenix at the end... they had reason to put that promo out.

With X3, not so much...



well i think now that cyclops is such a hot topic they will be smart and not release anything that confirms or denies it.. look at us right now, its working.

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:32 PM   #61
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by tonytr1687
Jean would never do that willingly, even if she was schizo. That would be worse than her killing him accidentally. Scott is supposed to be the only one who can break through to her and stop her from being evil
Dark Phoenix would never do that?

Why?

Even,If let's say cyke defends what Xavier has done ?

we are talking about a Jean Grey there , who want to be free who want to have sex savagely with Wolverine ; who think that Xavier is messing with them..

Scott is the perfect incarnation of Xavier dream

She could want to at least fight that.(and for other reasons she did it in a what if)

Quote:
Scott is supposed to be the only one who can break through to her and stop her from being evil
Why? because they are in love? (good reason) because that's the way it is written in the comics (bad reason imo)

i'm a fan since 25 years Tony ,and i'm a lover of the phoenix saga.but i can accept other takes on the saga.Great tragedy have where somebody kill his/her lover..

Quote:
what Jean is supposed to have in X3 isn't schizophrenia, it's multiple personality disorder. For some reason ppl like to say schizophrenia when talking about someone with a split personality
thanks for the correction.
but my point still stand imo.


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Old 04-16-2006, 08:33 PM   #62
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by Maze
she would never do that?

Why?

Even,If let's say cyke defends what Xavier has done ?

we are talking about a Jean Grey there , who want to be free who want to have sex savagely with Wolverine ; who think that Xavier is messing with them..

Scott is the perfect incarnation of Xavier dream

She could want to destroy that.(and for other reasons she did it in a what if)


Where? in the comics yep.

i'm a fan since 25 years Tony ,and i'm a lover of the phoenix saga.but i can accept other takes on the saga.
remember in the comic books, jean returns back to her home and thats when the x-men confront her and try to use that brain scrambler device, it doesnt work and cyclops manages to distract her long enough for xavier to attack her mind.

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:35 PM   #63
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by cyke93
as a cyclops fan, of course i saw it.. to the reg average movie go'er .. not so much. wolverine is the main draw not cyclops. they've put more heat on logan and jean than cyclops and jean.. look at the 4 main x-men from x1. wolverine is obviously not going anywhere, storm is halle berry shes staying put, they made jean phoenix, she aint going newhere, where does that leave cyclops? exactly .. i have no doubt now that cyclops will come back at the end, simply to appease the outcry of fans but it'll be a daydream/flashback whatever ..

and i dont trust the promos, look at what they did to jean in x2.
Why would Cyclops be wearing his X uniform for a daydream sequence cyke93? The X-Men generally only suit up for action scenes. You also say to the casual moviegoer Wolverine is the main draw but look at the trouble they went to in disguising what happens to Jean in X2, Wolverine was still a big part of the film but instead of making it all about him they chose to incorporate the Phoenix story into X2. Why couldn't it be the same for Cyclops? - afterall the Phoenix story revolves around Cyclop's lover returning and reaking havoc, now anyone who has seen X2 will know that at the end of X2 Jean chose + truly loves Cyclops, so his importance has already been deliberately established for the casual viewer.

Sure something might happen Cyclops to show how demented Phoenix is, but again the importance of Cyclop's character will probably be further highlighted before whatever happens to him - we're gonna see him grieving and sharing an emotional reunion with Jean, before Phoenix takes over; I think it'll be made clear in these sequences that Cyclops will ultimately be the only one who can save her and that he is a very important character in the Phoenix storyline!

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:36 PM   #64
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Originally Posted by cyke93
remember in the comic books, jean returns back to her home and thats when the x-men confront her and try to use that brain scrambler device, it doesnt work and cyclops manages to distract her long enough for xavier to attack her mind.
ok,

but remember that the comics books is not exactly what we are going to see onscreen.

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:45 PM   #65
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Good analysis Xmaniac , and I understand all that: you are right obviously, there will not be real death.

Now,to make really powerful story, answering to the publics demand everytime restrain the artistic side of things (and , curiously when you give the public what they wan't, when you don't surprise them , you don't win them everytime..the paradox...)

But again, you're right , for all those reasons,there will not be real death.

I would prefer that to be a true artistic decision ..we are not living in such a world i agree.
Yes, there is the paradox. To make a good movie that stands on its own as a good movie, or to make a movie that pleases the core fans and doesn't take big risks.

If the deaths are meaningless, and people come popping back up at the end, the critics may tear it to pieces; they will say the viewers are being cheated.

This isn't a soap opera or one issue of a comic, with many episodes/issues to follow after. It's one movie, and one with a fairly final tone to it. Very difficult to write a script that's going to please everyone. The general public will have no real affinity or emotional connection with Cyclops because he was walked over by Wolverine in X1 and a background character for most of X2. So, to them, a death will be much more acceptable because Cyclops hasn't been built into this powerful commanding hero in the two previous movies.

We could go round in circles on this forever, but we will know the answers in a few weeks...

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:48 PM   #66
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Why would Cyclops be wearing his X uniform for a daydream sequence cyke93? The X-Men generally only suit up for action scenes.

Cyclops will ultimately be the only one who can save her and that he is a very important character in the Phoenix storyline!
he is an important part of the phoenix saga and they know that, but look at what they did in the first draft, kill him off! granted there is a chance he doesn't get killed but the fact that they would kill him off so early on indicated their faith in his character, heck after singer's departure and x2 this was shocking to hear but i was actually not surprised they would do this

and as far as cyclops suiting up, yes he may show up in the final battle but for all we know, the opening sequence is in the danger room showing cyclops blow off steam.

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:55 PM   #67
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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he is an important part of the phoenix saga and they know that, but look at what they did in the first draft, kill him off! granted there is a chance he doesn't get killed but the fact that they would kill him off so early on indicated their faith in his character, heck after singer's departure and x2 this was shocking to hear but i was actually not surprised they would do this

and as far as cyclops suiting up, yes he may show up in the final battle but for all we know, the opening sequence is in the danger room showing cyclops blow off steam.
True but we also never saw the final act of that AICN draft! They may have used Cyclops as a way of demonstrating Phoenix's menace but it will probably also have been established that Cyclops has a connection with Jean and he can save her.
Who knows though - we may see Cyke in his uniform in the DR but I doubt it, I'd say that'd take away from the build up to the DR - they're gonna want to really show it off which is why they're sending Storm and co. in for that big action sequence.

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Old 04-16-2006, 08:56 PM   #68
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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We could go round in circles on this forever, but we will know the answers in a few weeks...
hehe exactly, i would like to says, yes cyclops lives, but after coming out of x2 disappointed about cyclops.. id rather go with the glass half empty approach so that anything more will be a bonus and it doesnt completely ruin the movie for me.

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Old 04-16-2006, 09:06 PM   #69
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

Well I'm gonna be going in like that also and Cyclops dying certainly won't ruin the movie for me but I am feeling pretty optimistic about Cyclops.

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Old 04-16-2006, 09:08 PM   #70
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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True but we also never saw the final act of that AICN draft! They may have used Cyclops as a way of demonstrating Phoenix's menace but it will probably also have been established that Cyclops has a connection with Jean and he can save her.
i think its clear to anyone that the original idea of killing cyclops in the AICN script was to make give spotlight to storm to be the leader and have logan be more of a more emotional connection with jean. which is why i think that they will use logan as the vessel in which to connect to jean .. and logal will say something bout "cyclops" and use that to get to jean. .. heck mentioning cyclops name to her would have an effect on jean shows how much cyclops is important to her..

but you're right the final act was never disclosed and was the last thing filmed. but i still think we'll just see a daydream type sequence of him sometime in the 3rd act.

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Old 04-16-2006, 09:10 PM   #71
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

well we'll agree to disagree cyke, meet ya back here May 26th!

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Old 04-16-2006, 09:12 PM   #72
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Well I'm gonna be going in like that also and Cyclops dying certainly won't ruin the movie for me but I am feeling pretty optimistic about Cyclops.
if i came in and saw cyclops die with out no prior knowledge, i would flip out and that would consume me the whole movie and i would not enjoy it as much. that's what happened in x2, the whole time until cyclops reappeared on screen, i was like "where was he" and when he came back, i was just like .. oh just like that he's a zombie...

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Old 04-16-2006, 09:47 PM   #73
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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Why would Cyclops be wearing his X uniform for a daydream sequence cyke93? The X-Men generally only suit up for action scenes. You also say to the casual moviegoer Wolverine is the main draw but look at the trouble they went to in disguising what happens to Jean in X2, Wolverine was still a big part of the film but instead of making it all about him they chose to incorporate the Phoenix story into X2. Why couldn't it be the same for Cyclops? - afterall the Phoenix story revolves around Cyclop's lover returning and reaking havoc, now anyone who has seen X2 will know that at the end of X2 Jean chose + truly loves Cyclops, so his importance has already been deliberately established for the casual viewer.

Sure something might happen Cyclops to show how demented Phoenix is, but again the importance of Cyclop's character will probably be further highlighted before whatever happens to him - we're gonna see him grieving and sharing an emotional reunion with Jean, before Phoenix takes over; I think it'll be made clear in these sequences that Cyclops will ultimately be the only one who can save her and that he is a very important character in the Phoenix storyline!
If they're gonna stay true to the original Phoenix story, then Cyclops can't save Jean. That was the whole point of the suicide, that no one but Jean could ever stop the Phoenix. Sure, Scott came close but in the bitter end he couldn't do a damn thing.

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Old 04-16-2006, 11:26 PM   #74
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

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If they're gonna stay true to the original Phoenix story, then Cyclops can't save Jean. That was the whole point of the suicide, that no one but Jean could ever stop the Phoenix. Sure, Scott came close but in the bitter end he couldn't do a damn thing.
well he gave her the strengh that she needed to carry it out. it was her and scott that was left against the imperial gaurd. once cyclops was struck down, she broke down and became phoenix again. the "what if x-men" issue #60 confirms this. dark phoennix took over jean but because of their love, she managed to hold off dark phoenix just long enough to kill herself.

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Old 04-17-2006, 12:12 AM   #75
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Default Re: Still hoping changes were made to the leaked script? This might help

I think that we all agree that this movie is just plain gonna rock.

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