Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer?

SHF · 08-07-2006, 06:41 AM

Well I loved Batman Begins like all of us here but I found out that Goyer aint writing the sequel.

I know he left an outline for it but that could just be a page of writing. So it would still be the Nolan brothers behind it.

So I wondered if the Nolan brothers writing it together will make the DARK KNIGHT better than Batman Begins?

Is Jonahan better than Goyer?

If DK is as stylistic and clever as Memento then I think he might be.

E-Mack · 08-07-2006, 06:43 AM

Jonathan by far.

Goyer should stick around though, if only for his knowledge in the mythos.

Macphisto · 08-07-2006, 06:51 AM

We won't know if Jonathan is a good script writer until The Prestige, which is his first ever script. He is a great storyteller, though.

CConn · 08-07-2006, 07:02 AM

While, as Macphisto said, we'll have to wait until The Prestige comes out to know for sure, I'm betting Jonathan is quite a bit better.

Goyer's a very...obvious kind of writer. Look at BB, everything is very discriptive and to the point - in the lines, in the plot, there's very little complexity or subtility.

If Memento Mori is any indication, I bet Jonathan Nolan will have that complexity. At least more of it. And while I have nothing against Goyer, Jonathan will probably be quite welcomed. For me, at least.

Excel · 08-07-2006, 07:04 AM

well i liked goyers batman script MORE then the movie script; so.....

SHF · 08-07-2006, 07:19 AM

Edit

SHF · 08-07-2006, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excel

well i liked goyers batman script MORE then the movie script; so.....

So your trying to say you liked how it ended with Bruce willing to give up being Batman just to get with Rachael Dawes?

Batman would never do that!!!

So Goyer messed up there and Nolan came in to fix that.

Excel · 08-07-2006, 07:24 AM

a young batman would defiently go through thoughts like that. bruce has to LEARN hell never be able to love again; and someone needs to teach him that; hence why i think they should bring in a new loveinterst and have bruce fall in love n wanna give up batman all bruce in BATMAN FOREVER but then KILL her off in the film, and itll just add to his rage as well as forcing to realize hell never be able to actually love someone again.

SHF · 08-07-2006, 07:46 AM

yeh but that would just mess things up in Begins if Racheal agreed that he shud give up the cape for her.

Then there would be no Batman unless you pressumed she gets killed in the sequel and he dons the Cape again out for vengence.

But I really dont think Batman would ever give up at this age because he promised his parents to rid the city of crime not Ra's Al Ghul for a 1 time thing.

Im sure the only time he has given up being Batman was when he chose to retire at an old age or something in DKR!

Excel · 08-07-2006, 07:47 AM

but she says he needs to be batman for the city which adds depth to her while simultaneously teaches the lesson.

Cinemaman · 08-07-2006, 07:49 AM

Well, Goyer is comic reader, while Nolan is excellent screen writer.

I think Nolan is better, all his scripts have enough logical aspects and very intersting twists, but also they make sense.

E-Mack · 08-07-2006, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excel

but she says he needs to be batman for the city which adds depth to her while simultaneously teaches the lesson.

My only real problem is that Bruce actually had to be told that Batman is needed more. I'd have much preferred he come to that conclusion himself.

SHF · 08-07-2006, 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excel

but she says he needs to be batman for the city which adds depth to her while simultaneously teaches the lesson.

Yeh I suppose but that just means Bruce really doesnt have a mission planned out in his head, he can be compremised!

Which really doesnt say much for the whole movie where it was a one mans quest to become a vigilante in Gotham City.

He doesnt need her to tell him he cant be with her he should know on his own that being Batman is burden and that he wont be able to have a relationship with anyone.

I thought depth was added to Racheals character when she knew that bruce waynes persona was the mask.

SHF · 08-07-2006, 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E-Mack

My only real problem is that Bruce actually had to be told that Batman is needed more. I'd have much preferred he come to that conclusion himself.

agreed!

Eros · 08-07-2006, 12:58 PM

unlike the rest of yuo guys, im not gotta start trashing goyer, who has already written many successful and great movies and scripts. I never heard of Jonathan nolan before, and so i can say how he is. Hopefully Goyer story won't get changed to much, as Goyers Knowledge of everything Batman vastly exceeds the nolan brothers combined. I wonder what th hell Batman Begins would of turned out to be, if Goyer didn't hlep Nolan write it so it was faithful to the character.

MJZ · 08-07-2006, 01:04 PM

Jonathan wrote Memento, you dullards.

Mr. Vice · 08-07-2006, 01:05 PM

Jonathan gets my vote, but Goyer did a damn good job with Batman Begins.

Sharkboy · 08-07-2006, 01:09 PM

While im sure all aspects of the script will be worked over by the nolan brothers and goyer himself. Im pretty confident than johnathan is up to the task. Have you read memento mori?

http://www.impulsenine.com/homepage/...mento_mori.htm

here it is, if this can give you any idea of how he writes, you will realise that the script is in excellent hands, especially with goyers knowledge of the mythos, and nolans directing skill.

Im not going to bash goyer, but he is a decent writer at best, the reason batman begins was such a good script was because hes a bat-fan boy just like us. he had such a knowledge and passion for the mythos that it came easily to him.

Goyer -story
john nolan - script
chris nolan - directing

thats the holy trinity right there!

Cinemaman · 08-07-2006, 01:21 PM

And also there is The Prestige (new movie of Nolan bros) script review, which was very very positive

El Payaso · 08-07-2006, 01:21 PM

Sure he is. Goyer's one-liners, 'wise' dialogues and repetitiveness were awful. But I must admit the BB structure was very good so I'm glad he's contributing with the plotlione but not the dialogues.

The Kid · 08-07-2006, 01:42 PM

Thank god goyer's not the main writer on this.

Cinemaman · 08-07-2006, 02:21 PM

I thought his dialogues were ok. The best part was with training of Bruce, Ducard had not bad monologue I think.

Mr. Vice · 08-07-2006, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cinemaman

And also there is The Prestige (new movie of Nolan bros) script review, which was very very positive

I can't wait to see that.

theShape · 08-07-2006, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El Payaso

Sure he is. Goyer's one-liners, 'wise' dialogues and repetitiveness were awful. But I must admit the BB structure was very good so I'm glad he's contributing with the plotlione but not the dialogues.

I agree.

theShape · 08-07-2006, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Vice

I can't wait to see that.

Me niether. It should be amazing.

08-07-2006, 06:41 AM	#1
SHF On a Rise Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 167	Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? Well I loved Batman Begins like all of us here but I found out that Goyer aint writing the sequel. I know he left an outline for it but that could just be a page of writing. So it would still be the Nolan brothers behind it. So I wondered if the Nolan brothers writing it together will make the DARK KNIGHT better than Batman Begins? Is Jonahan better than Goyer? If DK is as stylistic and clever as Memento then I think he might be. __________________ لا إله إلا الله محمد رسول ال Last edited by SHF; 08-07-2006 at 06:49 AM.

08-07-2006, 06:43 AM	#2
E-Mack Banned User Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 1,128	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? Jonathan by far. Goyer should stick around though, if only for his knowledge in the mythos.

08-07-2006, 06:51 AM	#3
Macphisto Side-Kick Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 299	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? We won't know if Jonathan is a good script writer until The Prestige, which is his first ever script. He is a great storyteller, though. __________________ Closer than ever to everybody's wife

08-07-2006, 07:02 AM	#4
CConn Probably racist Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Peter North's Southern Headquarters Posts: 46,828	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? While, as Macphisto said, we'll have to wait until The Prestige comes out to know for sure, I'm betting Jonathan is quite a bit better. Goyer's a very...obvious kind of writer. Look at BB, everything is very discriptive and to the point - in the lines, in the plot, there's very little complexity or subtility. If Memento Mori is any indication, I bet Jonathan Nolan will have that complexity. At least more of it. And while I have nothing against Goyer, Jonathan will probably be quite welcomed. For me, at least. __________________ Okay, some bastard thinks Batman won't punch blind people, but I've got news: Batman loves punching blind people!

08-07-2006, 07:04 AM	#5
Excel O-bama-ama-ama-ay-ay Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Places Posts: 16,659	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? well i liked goyers batman script MORE then the movie script; so..... __________________ If You Wanna Make The World A Better Place, Take A Look At Yourself, And Then Make A Change R.I.P. Heath

08-07-2006, 07:19 AM	#6
SHF On a Rise Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 167	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? Edit __________________ لا إله إلا الله محمد رسول ال

08-07-2006, 07:24 AM	#8
Excel O-bama-ama-ama-ay-ay Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Places Posts: 16,659	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? a young batman would defiently go through thoughts like that. bruce has to LEARN hell never be able to love again; and someone needs to teach him that; hence why i think they should bring in a new loveinterst and have bruce fall in love n wanna give up batman all bruce in BATMAN FOREVER but then KILL her off in the film, and itll just add to his rage as well as forcing to realize hell never be able to actually love someone again. __________________ If You Wanna Make The World A Better Place, Take A Look At Yourself, And Then Make A Change R.I.P. Heath

08-07-2006, 07:46 AM	#9
SHF On a Rise Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 167	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? yeh but that would just mess things up in Begins if Racheal agreed that he shud give up the cape for her. Then there would be no Batman unless you pressumed she gets killed in the sequel and he dons the Cape again out for vengence. But I really dont think Batman would ever give up at this age because he promised his parents to rid the city of crime not Ra's Al Ghul for a 1 time thing. Im sure the only time he has given up being Batman was when he chose to retire at an old age or something in DKR! __________________ لا إله إلا الله محمد رسول ال

08-07-2006, 07:47 AM	#10
Excel O-bama-ama-ama-ay-ay Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Places Posts: 16,659	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? but she says he needs to be batman for the city which adds depth to her while simultaneously teaches the lesson. __________________ If You Wanna Make The World A Better Place, Take A Look At Yourself, And Then Make A Change R.I.P. Heath

08-07-2006, 07:49 AM	#11
Cinemaman The Man Without The World Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Hype! Posts: 14,855	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? Well, Goyer is comic reader, while Nolan is excellent screen writer. I think Nolan is better, all his scripts have enough logical aspects and very intersting twists, but also they make sense. __________________ Here, if you have a milkshake, and I have a milkshake, and I have a straw. And my straw reaches acroooss the room, and starts to drink your milkshake. I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE! I drink it up! Hunter Rider is the Best Avvy-Maker... Ever!

08-07-2006, 12:58 PM	#15
Eros Side-Kick Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 6,582	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? unlike the rest of yuo guys, im not gotta start trashing goyer, who has already written many successful and great movies and scripts. I never heard of Jonathan nolan before, and so i can say how he is. Hopefully Goyer story won't get changed to much, as Goyers Knowledge of everything Batman vastly exceeds the nolan brothers combined. I wonder what th hell Batman Begins would of turned out to be, if Goyer didn't hlep Nolan write it so it was faithful to the character.

08-07-2006, 01:04 PM	#16
MJZ Side-Kick Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Trapped in the Speed Force Posts: 6,738	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? Jonathan wrote Memento, you dullards. __________________ Teh Planet.

08-07-2006, 01:05 PM	#17
Mr. Vice Side-Kick Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: CALIFORNIA Posts: 2,040	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? Jonathan gets my vote, but Goyer did a damn good job with Batman Begins. __________________ "How about a game of pool? You'll be the cue ball. I'll break." -Rorschach

08-07-2006, 01:09 PM	#18
Sharkboy Side-Kick Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 580	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? While im sure all aspects of the script will be worked over by the nolan brothers and goyer himself. Im pretty confident than johnathan is up to the task. Have you read memento mori? http://www.impulsenine.com/homepage/...mento_mori.htm here it is, if this can give you any idea of how he writes, you will realise that the script is in excellent hands, especially with goyers knowledge of the mythos, and nolans directing skill. Im not going to bash goyer, but he is a decent writer at best, the reason batman begins was such a good script was because hes a bat-fan boy just like us. he had such a knowledge and passion for the mythos that it came easily to him. Goyer -story john nolan - script chris nolan - directing thats the holy trinity right there!

08-07-2006, 01:21 PM	#19
Cinemaman The Man Without The World Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Hype! Posts: 14,855	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? And also there is The Prestige (new movie of Nolan bros) script review, which was very very positive __________________ Here, if you have a milkshake, and I have a milkshake, and I have a straw. And my straw reaches acroooss the room, and starts to drink your milkshake. I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE! I drink it up! Hunter Rider is the Best Avvy-Maker... Ever!

08-07-2006, 01:21 PM	#20
El Payaso rubbing your rhubarb Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: LEAVE BRITNEY ALONE!!! Posts: 9,413	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? Sure he is. Goyer's one-liners, 'wise' dialogues and repetitiveness were awful. But I must admit the BB structure was very good so I'm glad he's contributing with the plotlione but not the dialogues. __________________ "Do I really look like a guy with an argument? I just... post things." :joker: "The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it.." (G.B.S.) *** Avatar comes from:DialBforBlog.com

08-07-2006, 01:42 PM	#21
The Kid AMERICA FTW Join Date: May 2005 Location: Bronx Posts: 12,800	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? Thank god goyer's not the main writer on this. __________________ Superman Returns is better than the Dark Knight

08-07-2006, 02:21 PM	#22
Cinemaman The Man Without The World Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Hype! Posts: 14,855	Re: Who's a better writer Jonathan Nolan or David Goyer? I thought his dialogues were ok. The best part was with training of Bruce, Ducard had not bad monologue I think. __________________ Here, if you have a milkshake, and I have a milkshake, and I have a straw. And my straw reaches acroooss the room, and starts to drink your milkshake. I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE! I drink it up! Hunter Rider is the Best Avvy-Maker... Ever!

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