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Old 10-13-2006, 11:37 PM   #226
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

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Originally Posted by StorminNorman
I think I may have. The idea of executing punishment without a trial goes against everything in the constitution. To be truthful I know very little about the Punisher - if this is what he does without exception, then yes - his means are unAmerican.
This is exactly why the Punisher is fun. He's a complete anti-hero. He does the wrong thing, but for the exact right reason, if that makes any sense.

Say, for example, a guy went around raping and mutilating women, and never got sent to jail because he was connected to the right people, or the police or DA bungled the case, or, you know, he just kept escaping.

Whatever the case, the Punisher would gather up all the information on this guy, track him down, and blow up his ****. Just because, it was time the dude was punished. Pure and simple.

Am I glad the Punisher did it? Absolutely.

Do I condone it? Officially, no.

But I'm still glad he did it.

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Old 10-13-2006, 11:37 PM   #227
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

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Originally Posted by StorminNorman
I think I may have. The idea of executing punishment without a trial goes against everything in the constitution. To be truthful I know very little about the Punisher - if this is what he does without exception, then yes - his means are unAmerican.
Frank Castle is the consummate American.

He's just bat**** insane.

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Old 10-13-2006, 11:40 PM   #228
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

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Originally Posted by CConn
Frank Castle is the consummate American.

He's just bat**** insane.
Dude, I just laughed so hard I started hacking and coughing.

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Old 10-13-2006, 11:40 PM   #229
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

Quote:
Originally Posted by CConn
Frank Castle is the consummate American.

He's just bat**** insane.
He should be in Washington

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Old 10-13-2006, 11:44 PM   #230
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

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Originally Posted by Keyser Sushi
Dude, I just laughed so hard I started hacking and coughing.
I didn't almost kill you, did I?

Good analysis of the Punisher, btw.
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Originally Posted by StorminNorman
He should be in Washington
He'd kill all of his co-workers.

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Old 10-14-2006, 12:42 AM   #231
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??



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Old 10-14-2006, 04:40 PM   #232
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

Cesar Romero is the best live-action Joker.


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Old 10-14-2006, 05:06 PM   #233
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

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Originally Posted by Kevin Roegele
Cesar Romero is the best live-action Joker.

Was always fun to rush home from school to watch the old batman TV show and a treat to see the Joker.

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Old 10-14-2006, 06:20 PM   #234
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

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That is after Trial and Jury though. Killing people with out such trials is an unAmerican and, yes, unheroic.
What about war though? Bombing people and such.

It's all about perspective. It's one of the reasons I like the Punisher so much. He truly brings justice to those who deserve it.

Quote:
I think I may have. The idea of executing punishment without a trial goes against everything in the constitution. To be truthful I know very little about the Punisher - if this is what he does without exception, then yes - his means are unAmerican.
Bull****. He learned to do what he does, and the reasons to do, from America.

Quote:
This is exactly why the Punisher is fun. He's a complete anti-hero. He does the wrong thing, but for the exact right reason, if that makes any sense.

Say, for example, a guy went around raping and mutilating women, and never got sent to jail because he was connected to the right people, or the police or DA bungled the case, or, you know, he just kept escaping.

Whatever the case, the Punisher would gather up all the information on this guy, track him down, and blow up his ****. Just because, it was time the dude was punished. Pure and simple.

Am I glad the Punisher did it? Absolutely.

Do I condone it? Officially, no.

But I'm still glad he did it.
****....I condone it. I mean, the guys had it coming. He deserved it, forget trial and jury.....

Quote:
Frank Castle is the consummate American.

He's just bat**** insane.
That's the thing. Castle is basically the ultimate American gone ****ing insane. He's got morals, he's got values.....he just kills alot of people who deserve to die.

I think he's very much American, in alot of way. Not exactly the poster boy....but more like the janitor who gets hated on b/c he cleans ****.

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Old 10-14-2006, 06:28 PM   #235
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

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Originally Posted by Kevin Roegele
Cesar Romero is the best live-action Joker.

If you read the comics from when that show was on. You'll see he was perfect.

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Old 10-14-2006, 06:36 PM   #236
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

He was a hoot, that's for sure. A hoot.

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Old 10-14-2006, 08:38 PM   #237
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

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Originally Posted by CConn
I didn't almost kill you, did I?
Not kill, exactly, but you did almost make me lose a lung. But, hell, if John Wayne can do it.

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Good analysis of the Punisher, btw.
Thanks. Big Pun is my homeboy.

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Old 10-15-2006, 02:06 AM   #238
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

Nicholson got "a Joker" right. What he did was take the "Batman Adam West" Joker and make him grim. The product was a cross between Cesar Romero and the Joker on the 1950s/1960s era. It was close, but the vision Nolan has attached sounds much closer.

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Old 10-15-2006, 02:08 AM   #239
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Roegele
Cesar Romero is the best live-action Joker.

People don't understand how comic accurate that show was. It may not have gotten any "story" out of the comics directly. But when Batman was reduced to camp on account of Wherthams claim that comics were indecent and seducing the youth, that was what Batman comics became like.

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Old 10-15-2006, 02:18 AM   #240
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisBaleBatman
What about war though? Bombing people and such.

It's all about perspective. It's one of the reasons I like the Punisher so much. He truly brings justice to those who deserve it.
War is a whole other ballgame. However even there, there are rules of engagement that must be followed - or face the consequences.

Do I have a problem with a vigilante taking down rapists, pediphiles, mureders - no. The problem is that who gets to decide if one is guilty or not with the benefits of the court.


Quote:
****....I condone it. I mean, the guys had it coming. He deserved it, forget trial and jury.....
In a perfect world where the guilty and innocent are clearly distinguishable - I would be behind such a vigilante 100%. Of course if this was the case then the court system would never get it wrong and the criminals would always be punished - taking away the need for such a person.



Quote:
That's the thing. Castle is basically the ultimate American gone ****ing insane. He's got morals, he's got values.....he just kills alot of people who deserve to die.

I think he's very much American, in alot of way. Not exactly the poster boy....but more like the janitor who gets hated on b/c he cleans ****.
Exactly, he is insane. He takes the law into his own hands. You can't do that in this country. Taking the life of another in cold blood because of a crime they may or may not of committed is wrong.

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Old 10-15-2006, 02:26 AM   #241
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

Just wanted to point out, that vigilantes have been around for the entire length of the US's existance. It's as much American as apple pie, it's just not the aspect that you'd want people to know about.

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Old 10-15-2006, 02:27 AM   #242
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

Jack got it perfectly, the jokes mixed with the dark side and insanity.

Even Bob Kane wanted Jack.

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Old 10-15-2006, 04:42 PM   #243
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

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War is a whole other ballgame. However even there, there are rules of engagement that must be followed - or face the consequences.

Do I have a problem with a vigilante taking down rapists, pediphiles, mureders - no. The problem is that who gets to decide if one is guilty or not with the benefits of the court.
But, to me.....there's no point in a trial when we all know, and acknowledge, that the bastard is guilty. If the vigilante, ie: Castle, knows for a fact....then do the job. I think it's what they deserve.

Sigh....I guess in this case, I'm Magneto and your Professor X.......

Quote:
In a perfect world where the guilty and innocent are clearly distinguishable - I would be behind such a vigilante 100%. Of course if this was the case then the court system would never get it wrong and the criminals would always be punished - taking away the need for such a person.
Well, I do hear you on this one.

But, maybe they should abolish the death penality all together. I mean, they do kill innocent men after all. So, I dunno.....

Quote:
Exactly, he is insane. He takes the law into his own hands. You can't do that in this country. Taking the life of another in cold blood because of a crime they may or may not of committed is wrong.
But, when the law is powerless and bent.....in the case that the bad guy cannot get caught b/c he has weight in the system.....then something's wrong, isn't it?

"Those who do not punish evil, commands it to be done"
- Leonardo da Vinci

Castle does not kill those who "he's not sure of". From everything I've read, seen, and know of Castle.....he always gets the ones that truly deserve it.


Quote:
Jack got it perfectly, the jokes mixed with the dark side and insanity.
I think he nailed certain aspects of the Joker. He was good. But, I would have loved to have seen him go darker. The black comedy was there, for sure, but it could have been darker. But...maybe that's not Jack's fault at all. Could be the fillmakers.
Quote:

Even Bob Kane wanted Jack.
Doesn't matter.

I mean......Kane gave his approval on everyone. I heard he wanted Kilmer for Batman. Then wanted Clooney for Batman. So......Kane wanting anyone, doesn't really hold much weight....lol.....

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Old 01-11-2007, 03:03 AM   #244
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

No you are not alone here. I too feel that Jack was not the be all end all Joker. I'll put money on the notion that Nolan's "Ledger Joker' will topp Jack's performance. Don't get me wrong . . .Jack add'libbed that entire role. . . . but I found it lacking. I think Mark Hamill would have gotten the Joker down. He already owns Jack's Joker as a cartoon.

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Old 01-11-2007, 03:23 AM   #245
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

I like when Jack shoots Bob.

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Old 01-11-2007, 05:25 AM   #246
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

Jack Nicholson's Joker is the gretest cinematic villain of all time IMO.

Bob is the greatest henchman ever, not IMO. Fact!

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Old 01-11-2007, 08:16 AM   #247
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

I am a Nicholson fan, but the Joker isn't among my top-favorites. I just can't wait to see what Ledger has in store for us!

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Old 01-11-2007, 01:28 PM   #248
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

Jack nicholson WAS the joker of the mainstream comics in Batman 89 all these haters only dont appreciate him for one thing his physical weight problem he had in the movie ill admit he was carrying a few pounds but his performance completely overshadowed it. I firmly beleive Nolans take with Ledger will be the joker seen in the dark knight returns graphic novel a none laughing dark suited killer a bit like hannibull leckter (i.e boring and seen a million times in a million movies) not the flambouyantly dressed laughing CLOWN prince that is the character thats why i personally am more looking foward to Dennts appearance in tdk.

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Old 01-11-2007, 01:32 PM   #249
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

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Jack Nicholson's Joker is the gretest cinematic villain of all time IMO.

Bob is the greatest henchman ever, not IMO. Fact!
Damn right! Ledger wont come close no one has the indivisual charm Nicholson has period those slanting eyebrows and natural drawling voice where perfect for the CLOWN PRINCE of crime.

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Old 01-11-2007, 08:45 PM   #250
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Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

Agreed on Jacks greatness, but I'm certainly keeping an open mind on Ledger. By all means I hope he outdoes Jack. It's obvious the two will be different. I hope they keep Joker's face hidden in all forms of teaser/advertising. He definatley wont be as fun as Jack, whether that's a good thing or a bad thing, I'm still not sure (Despite the fact I'll probably be treated like I've got some sort of contagious disease for still liking Nicholson come 2008).

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