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View Poll Results: AMH (as Mike Engel)...
Is (or will become) the Riddler. 33 27.97%
Is simply a reporter. 85 72.03%
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Old 08-02-2007, 08:42 PM   #2576
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

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Originally Posted by StorminNorman View Post
To compare Crispin Glover with Paul Bettany shows your stupidity.

Crispin Glover's largest problem is not his acting ability, its the fact hes an ass hat. Since Paul Bettany does not suffer that problem, your opinion is in valid.

While yes, Gangster No. 1 made a strong case for Bettany as the Joker - it was by far means not the only reason he made for a great Joker. Bettany naturally has the suave, the class that the Joker needs. He also can play damn creepy pretty well - as shown in Firewall, Da Vinci Code and Gangster No 1. He also had a very Joker look, given his long lanky body and a face that had that Joker twist.



Also Bettany is absolutely hilarious, which though not a requirement for the Joker - is not a bad thing. His talk show interviews show him to be a fun, hilarious guy - again, making the Crispin Glover comparison head scratching.

Bettany is one of the most talented young actor and England and his performance as the Joker would of been incredible.

Actually it's ****ed up to call someone stupid when you think I was comparing them to each other. I was clearly just giving reasons of their own why I felt they were overated back before we knew who was going to be cast. I would never compare the two ever. I was simply stating why I felt so many fanboys wanted them for the role, which to me was looks over substance. I don't see why you have to go out of your way to call someone stupid for their opinion, to me being that defensive for an actor you don't know personally, gives me the idea that you are a little too obsessed over them.

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Old 08-02-2007, 08:50 PM   #2577
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

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Holiday only works as a character if there is a mystery. Since TLH is a widely beloved Batman comic - the mystery is gone and would need to be rewritten to work on screen.
Which it obviously would be, seeing as we haven't had even semi-legitimate Mad Hatter, Catwoman, or Penguin casting rumors. And you're wrong if you think that even a fifth of the people that will watch this movie will be people that have read The Long Halloween.

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Old 08-02-2007, 09:03 PM   #2578
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

Ugh. I feel like I know who AMH is. I just can't place it. It's like there's one little hint out there that would make it all come together. I'm pretty sure he has to do with The Joker, but he's not him. Like... I don't know.

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Old 08-02-2007, 09:05 PM   #2579
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

I'm telling you. He's Egghead.

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Old 08-02-2007, 09:08 PM   #2580
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

He's gotta be Edward Nygma.

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Old 08-02-2007, 09:09 PM   #2581
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

Or Firefly.

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Old 08-02-2007, 09:15 PM   #2582
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I think the secrecy of the role leads to Anthony Michael Hall playing a known Bat Villain. Again, if he is playing John Due X: Batman Wannabe - the secrecy is unnecessary.
that really seems like a flip of the coin decision. i don't see how the secrecy leans more towards villain than good guy. what we know is that he said his character affects the story. if he were to reveal his character, it would take away the suspense of the story. that doesn't really indicate good or bad.

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I then have to Batman villains. The lack of Guy Lewis and Thomas Roach takes away the possibility of Black Mask. You need to establish the long standing relationship between the Waynes and these characters to really give them depth - and with Nolan, he would want to cram as much depth to these characters as possible.
Nolan gave Scarecrow little to no depth in BB. a brief gloss-over monologue to Rachel provided us with the character's motivation. not really depth filled.

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Harvey Dent's corrupt aid, Vernon, would seem to be a possible contender - and I initially thought this would be Anthony Michael Hall's role. However Aaron Eckhart as filmed many scenes in Chicago, as well as all the court scenes, and Hall was not on-set. Anthony Michel Hall is not Vernon.
as has been pointed out, if AMH is VF, there is ample opportunity for both of them to be in scenes together. there will be sound stage filming as well. i think it's too soon to rule out this possibility. now it may be way down on the list and the odds may not be as great as other roles, but it's still a possibility.

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Of course you frequently point out that AMH will probably be playing a Batman wannabe. While again, I believe the secrecy of the role takes away that as an option, there has also been several films shot with Batman wannabe's present - again, Anthony Michael Hall was a no go.
the reason i point out that AMH MAY be playing a wannabe is based on two things: 1) we know that wannabes are a part of the movie, and 2) he has said he's playing a good guy. for the sake of argument i'll concede that there have been takes shot with wannabes present. why assume that all the wannabes would be together? why assume that just because one or two wannabe scenes have been filmed without AMH that more can't be done with him?

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This ambiguity makes the Riddler fit even the AMH made of the View: which though seems to be pretty cut and dry, IMO has to be regarded with suspicion. If we are not suppose to see Riddler as exactly a villain, and even a good guy in parts of the film - then his declaration is a perfect, and plays brilliantly with the tight lip policy about his role.
that may be. right now, until i see something that suggests otherwise, i'm going to take his words at face value. since he's said that if we knew who or what his character is that it would ruin the suspense built up in the story, i don't see any reason to not believe him. it doesn't sound like he's trying to throw people off the scent - especially with Eckhart going around saying "Harvey Two-Face."

Quote:
Of course I am further backed up when I consider the accounts from BOF's source. We know Jett has a friend who has read the script. While not in any way how I came to my opinion - it does reassure me of my claim.
a couple of things regarding BOF: 1) the original report that AMH is Riddler started out on this board as speculation and was picked up by filmick. filmick then reported that AMH is Riddler. this is a fact. the operator of filmick has admitted this on this forum. filmick's report was then picked up by other sites. by the time it got to jett, it had the appearance of coming from many sources. 2) the guy who read the script said nothing about AMH or the Riddler. all he said, or all that jett printed, was "the movie is great!!!!"


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Old 08-02-2007, 09:15 PM   #2583
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

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Actually it's ****ed up to call someone stupid when you think I was comparing them to each other. I was clearly just giving reasons of their own why I felt they were overated back before we knew who was going to be cast. I would never compare the two ever. I was simply stating why I felt so many fanboys wanted them for the role, which to me was looks over substance. I don't see why you have to go out of your way to call someone stupid for their opinion, to me being that defensive for an actor you don't know personally, gives me the idea that you are a little too obsessed over them.
Of course calling someone stupid for having differing opinions is overreacting. However considering you are not new to these forums, I figured you knew that was my style.

However for you to care if someone on a message board called your opinion stupid is equally ridiculous as the act of calling your opinion stupid. Grow a pair

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Old 08-02-2007, 09:19 PM   #2584
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

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And you're wrong if you think that even a fifth of the people that will watch this movie will be people that have read The Long Halloween.
you can count me among those who haven't.

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Old 08-02-2007, 09:19 PM   #2585
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

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Which it obviously would be, seeing as we haven't had even semi-legitimate Mad Hatter, Catwoman, or Penguin casting rumors. And you're wrong if you think that even a fifth of the people that will watch this movie will be people that have read The Long Halloween.
99% of every person that read the Long Halloween will see this movie in theaters. That is a large chunk. Regardless the mystery is dead, so the character is dead.

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Old 08-02-2007, 09:21 PM   #2586
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

Okay. I know who he is. . .

He's. . .

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:
METALHEAD!

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Old 08-02-2007, 09:25 PM   #2587
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

Any truth to the Phillip Seymor Hoffman/Penguin rumors? God, it would be awesome to see the Penguin and the Riddler!

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Old 08-02-2007, 09:27 PM   #2588
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I dont think so,

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Old 08-02-2007, 09:44 PM   #2589
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that really seems like a flip of the coin decision. i don't see how the secrecy leans more towards villain than good guy. what we know is that he said his character affects the story. if he were to reveal his character, it would take away the suspense of the story. that doesn't really indicate good or bad.
The reason I feel the secrecy leans towards a villain is that I believe the secrecy leads to a known Batman character - which at this point and time, would most likely be a villain.

Quote:
Nolan gave Scarecrow little to no depth in BB. a brief gloss-over monologue to Rachel provided us with the character's motivation. not really depth filled.
Honestly, you bring up a good point. So I counter by re-stating my argument. I see no place in the current story line for Black Mask. Black Mask would have to be a leader of a mob-like gang, which unless the Czechs have Black Mask as their leader, all the other top spots are taken. I also don't think Nolan would use Black Mask in the same movie where Two face is scarred personally.

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as has been pointed out, if AMH is VF, there is ample opportunity for both of them to be in scenes together. there will be sound stage filming as well. i think it's too soon to rule out this possibility. now it may be way down on the list and the odds may not be as great as other roles, but it's still a possibility.
Vernon would be in court with Eckhart, as well as the fact that Vernon wouldn't have any shared scenes with Morgan Freeman.

Quote:
the reason i point out that AMH MAY be playing a wannabe is based on two things: 1) we know that wannabes are a part of the movie, and 2) he has said he's playing a good guy. for the sake of argument i'll concede that there have been takes shot with wannabes present. why assume that all the wannabes would be together? why assume that just because one or two wannabe scenes have been filmed without AMH that more can't be done with him?
The fact that we know the Bat wannabes are apart of the film is the strongest piece of evidence supporting this theory - though again, I question the reason for the secrecy. I mean the Bat Wannabes are clearly not a "hush-hush" sub plot, since they were made available online.

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that may be. right now, until i see something that suggests otherwise, i'm going to take his words at face value. since he's said that if we knew who or what his character is that it would ruin the suspense built up in the story, i don't see any reason to not believe him. it doesn't sound like he's trying to throw people off the scent - especially with Eckhart going around saying "Harvey Two-Face."
Everyone knew that Harvey Dent was Eckhart's character. Most everyone knows that Harvey = Two Face. Him throwing that around isn't much of a surprise.

Since there has been no hint of Riddler being in the film, then the secrecy in this case is justified.

Quote:
a couple of things regarding BOF: 1) the original report that AMH is Riddler started out on this board as speculation and was picked up by filmick. filmick then reported that AMH is Riddler. this is a fact. the operator of filmick has admitted this on this forum. filmick's report was then picked up by other sites. by the time it got to jett, it had the appearance of coming from many sources. 2) the guy who read the script said nothing about AMH or the Riddler. all he said, or all that jett printed, was "the movie is great!!!!"
The fact that the original rumor came from filmick, which was completely baseless, is completely irrelevant I think. The point is Jett has a friend - apparently and long time friend - who has read the script, and yet has not told Jett that his information on that page is wrong. While it is not enough to base an opinion on alone - it is not moot point.

BTW - I quite enjoy this debate. It is a nice change from the idiotic, off topic comments I make

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Old 08-02-2007, 10:15 PM   #2590
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

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Either way you're thinking about the Calendar Man. That would be cool if AMH was the Calendar Man but I wonder how they would put him into the movie considering The Dark Knight is partially based on TLH. Not completley based on TLH.
by having him give advice on another villain who kills on a holiday ("see you in december")

of course, that only works if you completely disregard his scenes with lucius fox

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Old 08-02-2007, 10:19 PM   #2591
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

Yup. He's Metalhead.

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Old 08-02-2007, 10:20 PM   #2592
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AMH is soloman grundy

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Old 08-02-2007, 10:21 PM   #2593
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Metalhead.

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Old 08-02-2007, 10:22 PM   #2594
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If Hall's real role was "The Joker", I would crack the hell up. That'd be the best joke pulled on anybody.

That's why I voted "the real joker".

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Old 08-02-2007, 10:24 PM   #2595
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yeah I guess it'll be pretty funny when they reverse what is by all accounts a character-redefining performance, by replacing him with the guy from the dead zone

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Old 08-02-2007, 10:27 PM   #2596
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I think it would be cool if they re-worked the character of Hush a bit and made AMH Dr. Thomas Elliot. Or Roman Sionis and Black Mask comes in, in the 3rd to try to take over the mafia.

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Old 08-02-2007, 10:28 PM   #2597
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if he turns out to be the Joker there will be many deaths throughout theaters within the United States

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Old 08-03-2007, 08:16 AM   #2598
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BTW - I quite enjoy this debate. It is a nice change from the idiotic, off topic comments I make
so do i. i think this is, right now, the most interesting thing going and it's the big missing piece. it's fun to figure out and speculate, and talk through people's thought processes - how they got from A to B.

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The reason I feel the secrecy leans towards a villain is that I believe the secrecy leads to a known Batman character - which at this point and time, would most likely be a villain.
the assumption here, of course, is that he's playing a known Batman character, but we have to have a starting point somewhere so this one is as good as any. assuming villains outnumber known good guys, then odds are in favor of villain. but i still go back to his "i play a good guy."


Quote:
Honestly, you bring up a good point. So I counter by re-stating my argument. I see no place in the current story line for Black Mask. Black Mask would have to be a leader of a mob-like gang, which unless the Czechs have Black Mask as their leader, all the other top spots are taken. I also don't think Nolan would use Black Mask in the same movie where Two face is scarred personally.
forget Black Mask. the point here is that we have an example of Nolan not giving as much depth as possible to a villain: Scarecrow. therefore the statement "with Nolan, he would want to cram as much depth to these characters as possible" is not true.


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Vernon would be in court with Eckhart, as well as the fact that Vernon wouldn't have any shared scenes with Morgan Freeman.
that can't be called a fact since Lucius Fox is a character created for the movies. no previous comic book relationship between the two characters exists because one of the characters doesn't exist in the comic world. it isn't necessary for Vernon's character to be in court with Eckhart for every single case - if at all. we also can't assume that all courtroom shots have been filmed. they may have filmed establishing shots - crowds in the galley, etc., but other shots from a studio set may be upcoming. according to TLH, Harvey is scarred in court. assuming that this scene will be loyal to the comics, they haven't filmed this yet and there are still opportunities to do so. again, the biggest piece of evidence against VF is "i play a good guy."

Quote:
The fact that we know the Bat wannabes are apart of the film is the strongest piece of evidence supporting this theory - though again, I question the reason for the secrecy. I mean the Bat Wannabes are clearly not a "hush-hush" sub plot, since they were made available online.
the audition parts were never labeled as "batman wannabes." they were given the name VIGILANTE. Batman was given the name AVENGER. it was being kept secret.

Quote:
Everyone knew that Harvey Dent was Eckhart's character. Most everyone knows that Harvey = Two Face. Him throwing that around isn't much of a surprise.
yes, everyone knows Harvey Dent becomes Two Face, but it hasn't been officially revealed that Two Face is in the movie. we only know for certain that he is due to spy pics. if the part of the story AMH is trying to protect is Two Face, then there isn't really the need for secrecy since Eckhart has referred to himself as "Harvey Two Face" in public. so again, i have to take "i play a good guy," at face value.

Quote:
Since there has been no hint of Riddler being in the film, then the secrecy in this case is justified.
again, AMH clearly states that his part affects the story. saying, "i play Riddler/Enigma" in no way gives up the story. just as announcing Ledger as Joker doesn't give away the story or the story's suspense.

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Old 08-03-2007, 08:36 AM   #2599
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

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Originally Posted by StorminNorman View Post
To compare Crispin Glover with Paul Bettany shows your stupidity.

Crispin Glover's largest problem is not his acting ability, its the fact hes an ass hat. Since Paul Bettany does not suffer that problem, your opinion is in valid.

While yes, Gangster No. 1 made a strong case for Bettany as the Joker - it was by far means not the only reason he made for a great Joker. Bettany naturally has the suave, the class that the Joker needs. He also can play damn creepy pretty well - as shown in Firewall, Da Vinci Code and Gangster No 1. He also had a very Joker look, given his long lanky body and a face that had that Joker twist.



Also Bettany is absolutely hilarious, which though not a requirement for the Joker - is not a bad thing. His talk show interviews show him to be a fun, hilarious guy - again, making the Crispin Glover comparison head scratching.

Bettany is one of the most talented young actor and England and his performance as the Joker would of been incredible.
And this is probably why he wasn't cast as The Joker. Nolan likes treading new ground in his casting, I doubt he wanted one of the current go-to-guys for villainy to be cast.

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Old 08-03-2007, 08:47 AM   #2600
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Default Re: Anthony Michael Hall's Secret Role in the Dark Knight?

And back on topic, I can't say there's enough concrete evidence to make me THINK Anthony Michael Hall is playing The Riddler. But I certainly HOPE he's playing The Riddler.

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