Iron Man a SKRULL ???????

Alright, who just read the new Secret Invasion? It's been suspected for some time, could he really be a sleeper agent ? It sure would explain a lot. Civil War? Director of S.H.E.I.L.D ?? What do you guys think? The Skrull queen could be just yanking his chain but I dunno......:stark

[Iron_Stark]

Originally Posted by JBlinkinsop

Alright, who just read the new Secret Invasion? It's been suspected for some time, could he really be a sleeper agent ? It sure would explain a lot. Civil War? Director of S.H.E.I.L.D ?? What do you guys think? The Skrull queen could be just yanking his chain but I dunno......:stark

It'd be a cheap copout if he's a Skrull, plus it completely ruins Civil War.

No, I think Tony's the real deal and Skruller-Woman's just messing with him.

[Ironfan72]

I agree, I doubt he's a Skrull, it would be a major copout, much like Spider Man's current let's erase his history story brand new day.
Plus, there were to many Skrulls around Tony, Dum Dum Dugan & Jarvis both close to Tony and turning out to be Skrulls.
I wouldn't be happy if it turned out he was a Skrull as I have been very happy with how Stark has become a more complex character and fun to read.

[StreetWarrior]

If Iron man turns out to be a skrull, Marvel just ruined the last three years of stories and destroyed all of their credibility. I'm gonna be hella pissed if he is.

Yes, I don't see Bendis making that big of a cop out. NOW. I can see the Skrulls still being responsible for some of the ISH that has gone on in the Marvel Universe. Thor hasn't come into the mix yet and last time I checked he wasn't to happy with Tony Stark. I'm sure he'll be a big gun against the Skrulls. The Sentry is now The Void (Weird) What did he see in space?? Hulk is still not in the mix (He has his hands full with the red Hulk) I believe we are seeing Tony Starks fall from grace. I can't wait to see Are's son kick some ass.

[chiefchirpa]

I hope not.

Tony is gonna say "I am Iron Man" to convince himself he's not a Skrull said by Doppelganger Skrull Princess.

[CaptainStacy]

Originally Posted by Iron_Stark

It'd be a cheap copout if he's a Skrull, plus it completely ruins Civil War.

No, I think Tony's the real deal and Skruller-Woman's just messing with him.

Well, it isnt as if Marvel HASN'T copped out before...

Originally Posted by TheComicGeek

Well, it isnt as if Marvel HASN'T copped out before...

Yes, Marvel has Definatley copped out before. we'll see.....

[iamlegend]

Originally Posted by JBlinkinsop

Alright, who just read the new Secret Invasion? It's been suspected for some time, could he really be a sleeper agent ? It sure would explain a lot. Civil War? Director of S.H.E.I.L.D ?? What do you guys think? The Skrull queen could be just yanking his chain but I dunno......:stark

If he turns out to be a Skrull I'm done with any Iron Man/Avenger titles. It'd ruin the character, in my mind. Civil War was a fantastic bit of development for Tony, at least in my mind.

[Phatman]

If they make Tony a skrull it's to repackage the character for mainstream public. IM Iis red hot off the movie and Marvel wants to capitalize on that. The character as currently presented in the comics is a borderline bad guy; Development or not thats a hard sell when you're trying to promote a sequel and an action figure line for kids.

Then again I know how most people would feel about it. I was mad as hell when "The Crossing" came about. (the Jump the shark of the 616 MU) I stopped buying comics completely after that and haven't bought one since. maybe this can finally rectify the continuty holes of the crossing, onslsaught and heroes reborn, three of the worst IM storylines ever produced. The reconciliation of teen and regular tony never fit organically into tony's story.

[iamlegend]

Originally Posted by Phatman

If they make Tony a skrull it's to repackage the character for mainstream public. IM Iis red hot off the movie and Marvel wants to capitalize on that. The character as currently presented in the comics is a borderline bad guy; Development or not thats a hard sell when you're trying to promote a sequel and an action figure line for kids.

Then again I know how most people would feel about it. I was mad as hell when "The Crossing" came about. (the Jump the shark of the 616 MU) I stopped buying comics completely after that and haven't bought one since. maybe this can finally rectify the continuty holes of the crossing, onslsaught and heroes reborn, three of the worst IM storylines ever produced. The reconciliation of teen and regular tony never fit organically into tony's story.

He's not a borderline bad guy. He's a hero, through and through. Just a hero with a different perspective than some of the other mainstreamers.

[Phatman]

Originally Posted by iamlegend

He's not a borderline bad guy. He's a hero, through and through. Just a hero with a different perspective than some of the other mainstreamers.

We comic fans may understand that, but tell that to the moviegoers and their kids who bought all those toys. Marvel wants to appeal to the broadest audience as possible and having an ethically challenged superhero who makes deals with bad guys like Doom and turns on legends like Captain America and Spider-Man in a newly minted "A" list title is a hard sell. They're probably going to use this as a springboard to retool the character or it may mean nothing at all. Counts on how Marvel wants to play it. Iron Man is red hot right now and the movie version is the one everyone likes. Marvel wouldn't be smart to make the comics to fit Movie Tony's persona.

[Arach Knight]

No...Tony is pretty much a heel. He just happens to be a heel that everyone likes (okay that Ironman fans like). He is basing himself too much on ethics rather than on morals. So while he is ethically correct, he has been morally wrong for some time. He cloned a god that was his friend, is detaining people in inhuman conditions (such as the constant submersion of people with fire powers) and is arresting people that continue to fight crime, while employing known murderers because they are registered.

Nothing about that is heroic. It's logic over emotion and ethics over morals. I don't see making him a Skrull as a copout. It would make far more sense than Tony's sudden change of heart. Tony struggled to become a true hero (remember when he was a drunk and paralyzed?). Some how all of that development and experince went out the window so that Tony could become this dick to everybody he knows.

From what we know about Secret Invasion, the Skrulls have been dipping their fingers into every piece of pie. We already know (from SI) that there is at least one Skrull on each of the inititative teams. We know that Tony orchestrated the Initiative. If that doesn't sound like a Skrull double agent, I don't know what does. He also took a vote on getting rid of the Hulk (who was a wild card as far as the agenda of Civil War went). Making Tony a Skrull is the easy way out...but not a copout.

[Phatman]

Originally Posted by Arach Knight

No...Tony is pretty much a heel. He just happens to be a heel that everyone likes (okay that Ironman fans like). He is basing himself too much on ethics rather than on morals. So while he is ethically correct, he has been morally wrong for some time. He cloned a god that was his friend, is detaining people in inhuman conditions (such as the constant submersion of people with fire powers) and is arresting people that continue to fight crime, while employing known murderers because they are registered.

Nothing about that is heroic. It's logic over emotion and ethics over morals. I don't see making him a Skrull as a copout. It would make far more sense than Tony's sudden change of heart. Tony struggled to become a true hero (remember when he was a drunk and paralyzed?). Some how all of that development and experince went out the window so that Tony could become this dick to everybody he knows.

From what we know about Secret Invasion, the Skrulls have been dipping their fingers into every piece of pie. We already know (from SI) that there is at least one Skrull on each of the inititative teams. We know that Tony orchestrated the Initiative. If that doesn't sound like a Skrull double agent, I don't know what does. He also took a vote on getting rid of the Hulk (who was a wild card as far as the agenda of Civil War went). Making Tony a Skrull is the easy way out...but not a copout.

Have to agree with you on that Arachknight. making Tony a skrull wouldn't be a cop-out, but a way to get the character back on track. Civil War/Initiative Tony isn't going to go over well with new readers or moviegoers. This way the character can be retooled no harm, no foul. Marvel produces a book and character in line with the movies

Besides They were able to retcon that horrible Alicia masters/johhnny Storm marriage this way; it would work way better than killing Old tony and replacing him with a teenaged version from an alternate universe or makiing a deal with mephisto to wipe out 15 years of continuity. I want Tony to go back to being a Moral, ethical hero, not Doom Lite.

[iamlegend]

Originally Posted by Phatman

We comic fans may understand that, but tell that to the moviegoers and their kids who bought all those toys. Marvel wants to appeal to the broadest audience as possible and having an ethically challenged superhero who makes deals with bad guys like Doom and turns on legends like Captain America and Spider-Man in a newly minted "A" list title is a hard sell. They're probably going to use this as a springboard to retool the character or it may mean nothing at all. Counts on how Marvel wants to play it. Iron Man is red hot right now and the movie version is the one everyone likes. Marvel wouldn't be smart to make the comics to fit Movie Tony's persona.

Marvel made their fortune selling "real" superheroes.

Right now, Tony Stark is the most realistic and human character they've got. His deals with folks like Doom, and his decisions concerning Civil War were beautifully portrayed in his own book, where you saw how conflicted he was, but how he did what he thought was right.

We don't need any more cardboard cutout superheroes. Leave that to DC.

[Arach Knight]

I don't know about real in such a definitive sense, but I would agree that the reactions to Civil War (save for Spidey's recent retcon) have progressed in a natural fashion. However, somem of this progression has called for uncharacteristic behavior. Tony used to have drinking problems that stemmed from the preassures of being Iron Man and Tony Stark. For a brief while he balanced that problem with temporary paralysis (believed to be permanent back when that obstacle was being written). He always over came adversity to do two things....

1) Cover his own interests from technology thieves

2) Do the right thing and save lives.

All we've seen of Tony lately, is his ability to alienate long time friends and manipulate both sides of an issue. He has more or less been a coward. He hired Titanium Man to attack U.S. Senators, while lobbying against Super Hero Registration. I find it difficult to believe that a person that devoted to super heroics and that body of people, would just give up in two shakes of a lambs tail, just because it looked like the losing legal side. The only flip flops worse than that, were Spidey's willingness to suddeny unmask publicly, and Captain America's rather rapid capitulation to Tony Stark at the end of Civil War. Natural progression...but not a realistic response based on long established character norms.

[3dman27]

Originally Posted by Phatman

Have to agree with you on that Arachknight. making Tony a skrull wouldn't be a cop-out, but a way to get the character back on track. Civil War/Initiative Tony isn't going to go over well with new readers or moviegoers. This way the character can be retooled no harm, no foul. Marvel produces a book and character in line with the movies

Besides They were able to retcon that horrible Alicia masters/johhnny Storm marriage this way; it would work way better than killing Old tony and replacing him with a teenaged version from an alternate universe or makiing a deal with mephisto to wipe out 15 years of continuity. I want Tony to go back to being a Moral, ethical hero, not Doom Lite.

yes i agree 100%

Originally Posted by Phatman

Have to agree with you on that Arachknight. making Tony a skrull wouldn't be a cop-out, but a way to get the character back on track. Civil War/Initiative Tony isn't going to go over well with new readers or moviegoers. This way the character can be retooled no harm, no foul.

I agree in terms of this not being a cop out. Iron Man needs to be reset so he can be redeemed. But no harm no foul? Cap has been helping to carry Marvel since before they were even Marvel, when they were Timely and the only one to really rival him in sales was the old-school Namor. And now one of my all-time favorites, and I'm sure a hell of a lot of other peoples' all time favorites, is dead. Yet Tony is still there, pulse going strong. That pisses me off. So many people love Captain America, and to see him lose to this pampered (if it's really him) arrogant (if it's really....actually no, the Skrulls are arrogant too) s.o.b is almost enough to drive me to heavy drinking, enough so that I can forget any of this ever happened. What's more is how they keep writing it so Iron Man wins. What the hell? Captain America, Hulk. What's next? "This month in Marvel....Iron Man punches out Galactus!!" Don't get me wrong, I have always had some form of liking or respect for the character until Civil War. I loved the movie; that's the Iron Man I want to see brought back. But this is just too much. The sad thing is I keep buying and reading the books cause I'm an idiot and I always set myself up for disappointment lol. Although I gotta say with a hell of a lot of honesty that I can a certain satisfaction and a big smile on my face after reading "Avengers: Invaders", seeing the old-school Captain America completely pwning Iron Man. This has been my very long winded two cents



CAPTAIN AMERICA AND HULK PWN LIFE!!!!

[iamlegend]

Originally Posted by capsavenger

I agree in terms of this not being a cop out. Iron Man needs to be reset so he can be redeemed. But no harm no foul? Cap has been helping to carry Marvel since before they were even Marvel, when they were Timely and the only one to really rival him in sales was the old-school Namor. And now one of my all-time favorites, and I'm sure a hell of a lot of other peoples' all time favorites, is dead. Yet Tony is still there, pulse going strong. That pisses me off. So many people love Captain America, and to see him lose to this pampered (if it's really him) arrogant (if it's really....actually no, the Skrulls are arrogant too) s.o.b is almost enough to drive me to heavy drinking, enough so that I can forget any of this ever happened. What's more is how they keep writing it so Iron Man wins. What the hell? Captain America, Hulk. What's next? "This month in Marvel....Iron Man punches out Galactus!!" Don't get me wrong, I have always had some form of liking or respect for the character until Civil War. I loved the movie; that's the Iron Man I want to see brought back. But this is just too much. The sad thing is I keep buying and reading the books cause I'm an idiot and I always set myself up for disappointment lol. Although I gotta say with a hell of a lot of honesty that I can a certain satisfaction and a big smile on my face after reading "Avengers: Invaders", seeing the old-school Captain America completely pwning Iron Man. This has been my very long winded two cents



CAPTAIN AMERICA AND HULK PWN LIFE!!!!

Iron Man didn't "beat" Cap or the Hulk. Hell, Cap conceding in Civil War was some trumped up political statement by Marvel, and they weren't actually going to have the Hulk destroy the Marvel Universe.

Iron Man doesn't need to be redeemed, because something like this was a long time coming in Marvel comics. A character that wasn't some ridiculous vigilante that figured they knew better than everyone else. At least Iron Man places himself firmly on one side of the coin, rather than jumping the fence with every new villain or issue.

Movie Iron Man is actually written quite like current comic Iron Man, btw. He's made his public identity known, and he's actively working with SHIELD. So they're kind of associating the two media forms of the character. Sorry.

[Kanon]

I don't think he is a Skrull (but I was wishing he and Reed Richards were). So far, the writers are trying to surprise us with the reveals... Iron Man, Captain America and Spidey would have been obvious and easy choices... I don't think any of those is a Skrull

Originally Posted by iamlegend

Iron Man didn't "beat" Cap or the Hulk. Hell, Cap conceding in Civil War was some trumped up political statement by Marvel, and they weren't actually going to have the Hulk destroy the Marvel Universe.

Iron Man doesn't need to be redeemed, because something like this was a long time coming in Marvel comics. A character that wasn't some ridiculous vigilante that figured they knew better than everyone else. At least Iron Man places himself firmly on one side of the coin, rather than jumping the fence with every new villain or issue.

Movie Iron Man is actually written quite like current comic Iron Man, btw. He's made his public identity known, and he's actively working with SHIELD. So they're kind of associating the two media forms of the character. Sorry.

OK. First of all, when I said Iron Man beat them, I meant he won. Secondly, Hulk wouldn't have destroyed the universe; he'd have destroyed Earth. Reed Richards has come closer to destroying the Marvel Universe when he threatened Galactus with the Ultimate Nullifier. Third, mixing two characters together doesn't make them one and the same. The Superman clone from the Superman: Doomsday movie should have taught you that.

As for any speculation on Cap being a Skrull, can I please just say to everyone who thinks so, "Wake your asses up." He didn't turn into a Skrull upon death. Kind of a big effin' clue if you ask me.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by capsavenger

As for any speculation on Cap being a Skrull, can I please just say to everyone who thinks so, "Wake your asses up." He didn't turn into a Skrull upon death. Kind of a big effin' clue if you ask me.

The corpse could have been replaced, blah, blah... there are ways to undo everything in comics...

Anyway, I don't think he was a skrull in a millon years...

[iamlegend]

Originally Posted by capsavenger

OK. First of all, when I said Iron Man beat them, I meant he won. Secondly, Hulk wouldn't have destroyed the universe; he'd have destroyed Earth. Reed Richards has come closer to destroying the Marvel Universe when he threatened Galactus with the Ultimate Nullifier. Third, mixing two characters together doesn't make them one and the same. The Superman clone from the Superman: Doomsday movie should have taught you that.

Did you actually think Cap was going to defeat the American government? Civil War was over before it began.

I still don't get the grip about the Hulk. Again, the character was in a no win situation. They weren't letting him kill all of the Illuminati and take out the planet.

I'm not quite sure what point you were trying to make with the Superman bit. I was simply pointing out that movie-IM was given a few of the qualities of current comic-IM, which suggests to me that they might be keeping Tony this way for a long while.

Originally Posted by iamlegend

Did you actually think Cap was going to defeat the American government? Civil War was over before it began.

I still don't get the grip about the Hulk. Again, the character was in a no win situation. They weren't letting him kill all of the Illuminati and take out the planet.

I'm not quite sure what point you were trying to make with the Superman bit. I was simply pointing out that movie-IM was given a few of the qualities of current comic-IM, which suggests to me that they might be keeping Tony this way for a long while.

Yes I do actually believe Cap should have defeated the government. He's done it with other countries and he's also taken down a good portion of corruption in the American government also. So did I believe Cap was going to win? Yes. Did I believe it when they announced the Iron Man movie? No, though I admit I always had some hope that they'd come to their senses and write the book for the book, and not let Iron Man win it just because he had a movie coming out and they wanted to spark the public's interest. It's all the same bs with them, doing it their way instead of for the fans. Did you guys know Quesada never liked the marriage of Spider-Man and MJ? That's why he allowed all the Mephisto garbage. Now that he's in charge he's ruining everything. Stan Lee should come back and beat a little sense into him. AND HE SHOULD DO IT WITH A REPLICA OF CAPTAIN AMERICA'S SHIELD.

[iamlegend]

Originally Posted by capsavenger

Yes I do actually believe Cap should have defeated the government. He's done it with other countries and he's also taken down a good portion of corruption in the American government also. So did I believe Cap was going to win? Yes. Did I believe it when they announced the Iron Man movie? No, though I admit I always had some hope that they'd come to their senses and write the book for the book, and not let Iron Man win it just because he had a movie coming out and they wanted to spark the public's interest. It's all the same bs with them, doing it their way instead of for the fans. Did you guys know Quesada never liked the marriage of Spider-Man and MJ? That's why he allowed all the Mephisto garbage. Now that he's in charge he's ruining everything. Stan Lee should come back and beat a little sense into him. AND HE SHOULD DO IT WITH A REPLICA OF CAPTAIN AMERICA'S SHIELD.

Have you even followed Iron Man since Civil War? He's not up on some mountain, laughing and talking about how amazing he is.

And what the government was trying to do in CW was not a corrupt decision. They went about it a poor way, but the registration of heroes was a natural move in the Marvel U, and it's a realistic topic.

I know all about the Spider-Man thing, but I gave up Spidey a long time ago.

In a few years they'll release the Cap movie, he'll have a completely ridiculous resurrection, and they'll set the universe back to it's boring status quo. Then you can be happy again, I guess...