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Old 06-20-2008, 11:41 PM   #51
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Scarcely any blue.

No blue.

No effing blue.
So I'm obviously not alone in my thinking.

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Old 06-20-2008, 11:46 PM   #52
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And look at these.

Now here, WITH DIFFERENT LIGHTING,

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Old 06-21-2008, 12:17 AM   #53
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

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One-again, I never said "No blue, ever." In fact, I have even posted examples in which a healthy use of blue didn't harm the image.
And ok-there are some blue highlights on that car. But you know what? A car is not a garment. The principle is not the same, not at all. And note-in broad daylight, this cherry-clean, shiny car comes off predominantly black. And I see some grey tones in there as well. So in helping your case, you have also helped mine.
it doesn't matter whether it's a car or a garment. all that matters is that it has sheen and the color of the light hitting it will be reflected.

The car isn't prominently black. the surface that's in shadow is black, and the surface that's being hit by the most light in this case is blue. The gray tone you see is the white lines of the parking lot reflected in the black.

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Old 06-21-2008, 01:28 AM   #54
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My last post got messed up. I've done a little more research in light of this new evidence, & here's what I've found.
We do get a bit of a blue sheen here, in this light.

And here.

But not here.

Nor here.




Black more commonly reflects white & grey than blue.

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Old 06-21-2008, 01:43 AM   #55
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Another shining example. The blue is a rare occurance, not the norm. And it never overpowers the black, like we've seen in the illos I've shown.

I also found these.


And the grey looks just fine. Much better than this.

Or this.

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Last edited by Chris Wallace; 06-21-2008 at 01:57 AM.
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Old 06-21-2008, 01:47 AM   #56
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Black doesn't more commonly reflect anything. It's entirely Dependant on the light source hitting it and the consistency/texture of the object. You're right, in saying there are instances where artists have been wrong in their portrayal. but it's completely reliant on the atmosphere of the scene in question. There is no right or wrong. It's all circumstantial.

It is ironic, though. That every example you posted in that last post, was highlighted with blue. even the panther. Take it into photoshop, and select a pixel from a highlight. It's a tint of blue. Some are ranging with low saturations. but every one is more blue than any other color.

Edit: this was referring to the post before the one above mine.

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Old 06-21-2008, 02:05 AM   #57
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

Black doesn't reflect anything...it is the absorption of all light spectrums. You are quite keen on better art though and make good points.

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Old 06-21-2008, 02:21 AM   #58
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Perhaps my point got lost along the way-the problem I refer to is oversaturation of the black. This is why I prefer to highlight & break up in grey. That way, the surface still looks black when you're done, like in that first Venom illo. And you don't end up with the kind of image where the uninitiated viewer has to ask, "Is this blue or black"?

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Old 06-21-2008, 01:05 PM   #59
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

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Nope. Never. Not once. Which I've already stated. And since opening this thread & reading your posts, I've been paying especially close attention, looking for even one valid example.
maybe you should get out more then? it's fairly common. Go buy Blue/black hair dye... probably will be easier then finding a car with the paint job... and theres also iridescent paints that are black, that shine blue.

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Old 06-21-2008, 06:02 PM   #60
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

Have you read my subsequent posts?

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Old 06-22-2008, 04:01 PM   #61
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yes...

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Old 06-23-2008, 11:25 AM   #62
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

Then you know I have flexed but still maintain my position, yes?

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Old 06-23-2008, 06:07 PM   #63
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

si !

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Old 06-23-2008, 06:23 PM   #64
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

We are not as far apart on this as you may have thought; but then, we're not as far apart as I may have thought.

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Old 06-23-2008, 06:40 PM   #65
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

btw, i was watching ironman last night for my 2nd time, and at the Disney concert hall, he wears an EXTREMELY dark blue tux... that is soooo dark it's black. but when lighting hits it, it reflected blue... first time i've really seen fabric do that

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Old 06-23-2008, 06:43 PM   #66
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

Look at the Spider-Man films; in several shots the blue of the suit looks black. The instance that most immediately comes to mind is when he's crawling around on the train, looking for Ock.

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Old 06-23-2008, 07:04 PM   #67
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

blue can easily look black, its black that usually doesnt look blue (fabric wise) thats the point i was trying to make, not the other way around

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Old 08-21-2008, 12:56 AM   #68
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

I got into a pretty heated debate on a Black Panther thread, w/a guy who thought the actual color of the costume is blue. This sort of misconception is what I've been worried about, & why I started the thread.

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Old 08-21-2008, 09:08 AM   #69
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

I would have to agree that blue is over-used when it comes to the Black Panther.

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Old 08-21-2008, 09:41 AM   #70
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

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The main reason that there is blue used on a lot of these images is because of reflective light. The shiny black material is reflecting the environmental light (in most of the cases the sky). It's all about creating a mood and a feeling from your colouring.


Does spiderman here feel like he is swinging around on a summers day as much as the blue does? Not really- it feels cooler.
(If we ignore that spideys suit is blue and red)

The main way for your black leather have grey as a highlight would be to have a white light as the light source. It's quite rare to have white light in nature, normally it give off a shade of something.
I can't believe there is 3 pages on this topic but it is a problem.

Cybermonketron I love this recolor would you mind if I use it for my Avvy?

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Old 08-21-2008, 11:59 AM   #71
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

If you agree it's a problem, then why is it hard to believe?

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Old 01-26-2009, 11:45 AM   #72
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

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I would have to agree that blue is over-used when it comes to the Black Panther.

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Old 01-26-2009, 12:11 PM   #73
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

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I think the problem is less about using blue, and more about people overusing highlights and blacks. Take this Spider-man picture. It has an insane amount of unrealistic highlights, especially in the part of Spider-man facing the building and on the hand, how is light getting in there? This shows an artist who isn't confident in his use of blacks, so he makes sure to outline everything, on both sides, with a highlight. It's unrealistic.

Then colorists get these drawings with an absurd amount of highlights, and pick a color that goes with the scene, but due to the amount of color they need to put on the suits, in the highlights, it becomes confusing what color is what.



The only "highlights" here are on Spider-man's left- back, thigh/leg, and arm. The only black areas are on his left and right inner thighs and where his left shoulder overlaps his neck, Those are all the highlights and blacks one would draw when drawing that picture. The rest is normal shading of the black costume.

So, I don't think it has anything to do with what color they pick, but more about artists who don't realize where to correctly put a highlight and a black.


Or that if you look at the two Spiderman pics you posted as well, you can see different shades and even texture detail. Just because the person who drew this spiderman outlined most everything with what seemed like highlights DOESN'T mean they are highlights. Most of those could easily be realistically filled in with a middle to dark value but not black. You can see a dark gray on the underside of Spidey's thigh in that last picture, but no technical highlight. But if this was drawn in normal comic book style, it would be left wide open (unless you're one of those artists that inkwashes other values in).

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Old 01-26-2009, 02:42 PM   #74
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Default Re: My thoughts on a topic that affects ALL aspiring comic artists.

Quote:
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Scarcely any blue.

No blue.

No effing blue.
So I'm obviously not alone in my thinking.
In these two there is definitely blue used. But it's the right way of doing. It helps create depth without over powering the impression of grey or black.

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While I believe blue is a good way to create a sense of contour and depth in shading, just using grey tends to flatten an image out, the above is overboard. In this Panther is most definitely wearing a blue costume. A use of grey in the middle tones and darks with only highlights of blues would have been more effective.

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Old 01-26-2009, 05:46 PM   #75
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In these two there is definitely blue used. But it's the right way of doing. It helps create depth without over powering the impression of grey or black.



While I believe blue is a good way to create a sense of contour and depth in shading, just using grey tends to flatten an image out, the above is overboard. In this Panther is most definitely wearing a blue costume. A use of grey in the middle tones and darks with only highlights of blues would have been more effective.

"You...innocent."
I can see the blue in the Batman images now. But you clearly see my point. It's overused, often to detrimental effect.

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