The Avengers roster for 2012

[iamlegend]

Originally Posted by Matt Mortem

I think that's the best logic I've ever heard on this board. That literally shuts down any argument against bringing a character in based on how well people already know the character. Not many people knew who Blade was, but that film turned out to be a success

No, no it doesn't. Not at all.

When Blade was introduced, he was the titular character in a movie about himself.

When Star Wars was introduced, there WAS no precedent, because it was the first in its line, and there was no other media that preceded it (comic books, tv, etc.)

When The Avengers comes out, there will be precedents: there will be characters that have already had solo movies and video games and cartoon shows and God knows what else... characters that the mainstream audience is secure with, happy with and generally expects to see on screen.

Then you throw the Pyms out there and people have no idea what they're seeing. Do you spend time giving them a backstory? Maybe, but that would steal screen time from the established superheroes that people already like AND cut into potential fight scene time, which nobody wants. You don't spend a bagillion dollars on an Avengers movie and then have the characters stand around and talk about their past.

For that matter, why waste the money on the CGI it'd take for Giant Man/Wasp/whatever incarnation of the Pyms you want, when you can spend that on other things? They're not necessary, and no one would have a clue who they were -- as opposed to the rest of the cast. There's just too much going on in an Avengers movie to spend time updating the audience on characters that aren't needed.

[protocida]

I give up.

[catintheengine]

Originally Posted by iamlegend

No, no it doesn't. Not at all.

When Blade was introduced, he was the titular character in a movie about himself.

When Star Wars was introduced, there WAS no precedent, because it was the first in its line, and there was no other media that preceded it (comic books, tv, etc.)

When The Avengers comes out, there will be precedents: there will be characters that have already had solo movies and video games and cartoon shows and God knows what else... characters that the mainstream audience is secure with, happy with and generally expects to see on screen.

Then you throw the Pyms out there and people have no idea what they're seeing. Do you spend time giving them a backstory? Maybe, but that would steal screen time from the established superheroes that people already like AND cut into potential fight scene time, which nobody wants. You don't spend a bagillion dollars on an Avengers movie and then have the characters stand around and talk about their past.

For that matter, why waste the money on the CGI it'd take for Giant Man/Wasp/whatever incarnation of the Pyms you want, when you can spend that on other things? They're not necessary, and no one would have a clue who they were -- as opposed to the rest of the cast. There's just too much going on in an Avengers movie to spend time updating the audience on characters that aren't needed.

I half-way agree with you. I think we, as Marvel fans, might just be able to have our cake and eat it too. It just may not be the cake we thought we were getting.

I think that it would be a nice nod to the fandom to have the Pyms appear but in a primarily non-combatant role. Bring them in as scientists working for S.H.I.E.L.D. Just use them in a supporting role and not as primary characters (at least not in the first Avengers, assuming there may be a second) that maybe reveal a bit of exposition or something.

I for one don't want more than four or five major heroes, otherwise we end up with a cluttered screen and a cluttered film. I agree that we can't just be throwing brand new characters in and saying "These are main characters" to the audience. Film doesn't work like that. At least, not effectively.

I want to see the Pyms, and Barton. However, I only want to see them in supporting roles.



On the other hand, I don't want them to get two seconds of screen time and then disappear, either. They aren't Sideswipe in Transformers 2. I have faith that if those characters WERE to appear in the Avengers movie, that Marvel would have the ability/good sense to do them justice, without overflowing the film. I hope they can find a happy medium.

Just my opinion, though.

[GoldGoblin]

Are these characters gonna be in the movie?
-Tigra?
-Scarlet Witch?
-Giant Man?
-Hawkeye?
-Luke Cage?

[iamlegend]

Originally Posted by GoldGoblin

Are these characters gonna be in the movie?
-Tigra?
-Scarlet Witch?
-Giant Man?
-Hawkeye?
-Luke Cage?

Scarlet Witch remains tied to the X-Men franchise, I believe, which would make her Fox's domain for now. So no.

Luke Cage isn't really an old-school Avenger, and they're working on a solo film for him anyway. So no.

Giant Man and Hawkeye have legitimate shots, though nothing is even close to being confirmed.

As for Tigra... I'd severely doubt it, just because the character's not nearly popular enough or well known.

[GoldGoblin]

That sucks,there cool characters.

[Matt Mortem]

The only way I'd like Tigra is if after introducing Hawkeye and War Machine they could do a Moon Knight movie and make a west coast avengers film.

[Spider-Vader]

I wouldn't be surprised if Cage is in the Avengers movies after his solo movie... Which Marvel better be working on!

[iamlegend]

Originally Posted by Spider-Vader

I wouldn't be surprised if Cage is in the Avengers movies after his solo movie... Which Marvel better be working on!

Well, seeing as how the development for a Luke Cage flick is essentially at Stage 0 right now, it'll be awhile.

At the very least we can count him out of the first one.

[KangConquers]

Captain America
Iron Man
Thor
Wasp
Giant Man


Nick Fury as their boss at SHIELD.
Black Widow as sort of a liason between the Avengers and SHIELD.
Hulk as the villain turned brief member turned running off on his own.
Loki as the mastermind villain.

[Spider-Vader]

I like that.

I really think Antman & Wasp should be in, their origin isn't that complicated. Scientist who discover a technology on how to change the size of themselves & use it to be super heroes.

[iamlegend]

Originally Posted by KangConquers

Captain America
Iron Man
Thor
Wasp
Giant Man


Nick Fury as their boss at SHIELD.
Black Widow as sort of a liason between the Avengers and SHIELD.
Hulk as the villain turned brief member turned running off on his own.
Loki as the mastermind villain.

IDK... You've got to think Loki's going to be the villain in Thor's solo, right?

While he could certainly play some sort of role, I doubt they'd re-use him as the lead villain, comic history be damned.

[chris moore]

Judging by the movies thus far, Fury seems to be going round to people as they emerge as superheroes/develop powers to recruit them for the Avenger's initiative. Most likely (given Nick's words to Tony about him thinking he's the only superhero on the planet), Fury has already recruited one or two superpowered people. The best bet there are Hank and Jan, for simplicities sake of not needing to do their movie before the Avengers.

Simple non-flashback anecdote by Hank Pym to whoever is the 'fresh eyes' in the movie should cover his and Jan's origin. Hank applied to the government for funding for his research into something biochemical or robotics (not particle physics, dimension theory or anything - lets not do to Hank's expertise of robotics and biochem what Raimi did to Parker's expertise in Chemistry). His research inadvertently taps into a stream of particles that envelope his body and saturate every cell in him. Because it was government funded, Fury reads about it. Not military funded though - we don't need SHIELD claiming Pym himself is property of the US army like Ross and the Hulk; make it NIH funding. Still government, but less ownership issues of intellectual property rights etc.

Hawkeye is the one recruit who is already on board and isnt superpowered. He's just so good that he is beyond any black ops, special forces unit. With the creation of the Avengers, the opportunity presents itself for Hawkeye to be part of a unit that operates at a skill/ability level above anything else in the military. Hawkeye could be the one who is on a mission at the start of the movie and sees the beginnings of the threat the team must come together to fight. Barely escaping, he gets back to Fury and informs him his whole unit (at this time he's not an Avenger, but he is the best operator in any unit in service) died and its gonna take more than throwing missiles and soldiers to defeat this. Because of his skill and invaluable intel, Hawkeye is added to the roster when he thought all he was doing was briefing the assembled Avengers. A nice surprise moment in the briefing room when Fury tells him this.

This can be worked around Cap either already being present (if his movie woke him in modern times before the end) or just prior to the Avengers finding him. In the former, when Hawkeye questions his suitability because the team already has Captain frickin' America Cap tells Hawkeye he needs a military man to help him adjust to both modern military protocols as well as to modern civilian life. In the latter, maybe Cap's revival could be part of the evil plot; recovery of Captain America's body and extraction of the Supersoldier serum as the first part of the boss of the Masters of Evil's plan of giving his ordinary henchmen superpowers. One of his enforcers is the Abomination, who though possessing superpowers due to the inaccurate attempt at the SSS, is not exactly the perfect result.

So there you go: Cap, Thor, Iron Man, Black Widow, Hank (with Jan as assistant/fiance who has not yet needed to be subjected to Hank's particles - an accident/rescue/hostage situation in the third act can deal with this kind of like the foreshadowing of the leader in Hulk) and Hawkeye.

Hulk as we know will be in it - but maybe only in half as someone Cap and someone else track down to ask for help because they're going to need his raw power to deal with a particular bad guy/weapon.

Black Widow - could be asked to join because she has intel on terrorists/mafia figures etc from all over the world as well as contacts everywhere. But we'll have to see how they end her story in IM2

[Spider-Vader]

If Hawkeye is in, I'll be so happy. He must wear purple though!

[Blackman]

I would be fine with the lineup of Cap, IM, Thor, Hank, Wasp and Hulk as a villain and a hero, but I wish they would take this chance to introduce new characters like Hawkeye, Black Panther, Agent 13 (Sharon Carter), Falcon (towards the end) who could potentially have spin offs. The downside is it could be too many heroes. I think it all depends on who the villain is.
IMO with signing Tim Roth (Abomination) and Tom Hiddleston (Loki) for multiple pictures deals it seems like they will be doing a Masters of Evil sort of thing maybe and for that then I would say keep it to the lineup I mentioned at the beginning
But if the Avengers are gonna be fighting an organization like Hyrda where there would be henchmen along with the supervillains then I would say add the others.

[Superhero 101]

I think that the Masters Of Evil would make a awesome film i mean Loki vs Thor Hulk vs. Abomination Iron Man vs Whiplash(depends if he lives)

[chris moore]

The beauty of solo film preceeding the collective movie is that the addition of as so far unseen heroes (Hank, Jan, Clint) won't necessarily crowd the cast or ensure a Colossus treatment of these new additions. Because of course we will have had plenty of character exploration and establishment of roles and personality types of Cap, Thor and Tony

[Spider-Vader]

Yeah, that's what Avengers has over X-Men. You already know who most of the characters are because of their own movies, while none of the X-Men (except Wolverine) have solo movies or books. Most solo X-Men books don't last that long, if one is lucky enough to get a spin-off. Cable being an exception.

[topdog1]

Originally Posted by Spider-Vader

If Hawkeye is in, I'll be so happy. He must wear purple though!

Has this link been posted anywhere?

http://io9.com/5342925/marvel-prez-l...-movie-details

"Given that Iron Man 2 is also introducing well-known Avengers character Hawkeye"

Where did that come from?

[Spider-Vader]

I think one of the earlier drafts of IM2 has Hawkeye in it. I don't know if he's still in, but I really hope he is.

[iamlegend]

Originally Posted by Spider-Vader

I think one of the earlier drafts of IM2 has Hawkeye in it. I don't know if he's still in, but I really hope he is.

As quite the Hawkeye fan, I do as well.

However, as we've heard absolutely NOTHING about the character, any casting, etc., I'd doubt he shows up as anything more than an extremely minor cameo, or maybe even just as a throwaway reference in dialogue.

While I'm sure they considered it (what with his ties to Black Widow, among other things) there's really just too much going on in the movie to wedge him in there. You've already got a bunch of new characters to introduce (Widow, Whiplash, Hammer, etc.), plus the War Machine storyline and presumably an increased SHIELD presence.

[Noona]

Hawkeye Became part of The Avengers at the same time as Quicksilver and The Scarlet Witch , So if they end up putting Hawkeye in the Avengers movies ...It wouldn't be right or Fair not to have the twins in the movie as well ...
Hawkeye is going to be introducted in the iron man movie to make non-comic book audiences get used to the character for the upcoming avengers movie ...

[Noona]

[chris moore]

While Pietro and Wanda were part of Cap's 'Kooky Quartet' and joined the team at the same time as Clint, I have no problem them not being in any version of the movie line up. They have stronger ties (historically) to mutantdom really. You can be fairly certain that they can and might well show up in any further installments of the current X-Men movie franchise (or maybe, if we're lucky, in a relaunch with Marvel studios). If we didnt have Hawkeye, Hank or Jan in the Avengers - where are we gonna get them? None of them carries enough solo comicbook weight for a successful solo movie as their first appearance, only as potential spin offs.

[iamlegend]

Originally Posted by Noona

Hawkeye Became part of The Avengers at the same time as Quicksilver and The Scarlet Witch , So if they end up putting Hawkeye in the Avengers movies ...It wouldn't be right or Fair not to have the twins in the movie as well ...
Hawkeye is going to be introducted in the iron man movie to make non-comic book audiences get used to the character for the upcoming avengers movie ...

Of course it'd be fair.

Why? Because the twins are mutants, and belong more to the X-Franchise nowadays anyway, and thus likely fall under FOX's ownership.

Hence, no chance at the twins until Marvel gets the X-Franchise rights back. Which probably ain't happening, since FOX continue to rake in money, low quality productions be damned.