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Old 11-27-2006, 08:52 PM   #1
NotFadeAway
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Default Downplaying The Romance In Superman

...because Superman Returns featured the most emotionless emotion Ive ever seen. And I hope the dialouge has more wit and emotion to it, the dialouge was dry and lacked any feeling in Returns, with the best lines being ripped off from Superman: The Movie.

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Old 11-27-2006, 09:19 PM   #2
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

I agree. For all the heart and supposed character development people say this movie had, I had barely any connection to this Superman because I didn't know him at all.

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Old 11-28-2006, 01:12 AM   #3
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Count me in, too. WHo was that jerk anyway?

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Old 11-28-2006, 11:56 AM   #4
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

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Originally Posted by mego joe
Count me in, too. WHo was that jerk anyway?

Some Christopher Reeve knockoff.

That Superman's story was done and should be done even now. I want to see the storyof a different Superman, one that connects with the audience through his own story, not through distant memories of a great hero who is no longer with us.

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Old 11-28-2006, 12:19 PM   #5
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Quote:
Originally Posted by venom420
Some Christopher Reeve knockoff.

That Superman's story was done and should be done even now. I want to see the storyof a different Superman, one that connects with the audience through his own story, not through distant memories of a great hero who is no longer with us.
I had no problem with Brandon Roth. I think most ppl knew they were gonna find someone similar to Christopher reeves. If they would of casted someone totally different than CR ppl would of complained that he dont follow the part..Most or all ppl associate superman w/christopher reeves,so hes better than the rumor of nicolous cage...

Far as the story,ya its just the first superman movie just redone in another way with a few twists added. They spent most of movie on character devolopment,which is good but most ppl want a little more action wth this type of movie..
Me personally I wanted more info on his journey,what he was looking for what he found etc...Little more interaction w/lex. Spent alot of movie developing that relationship with lois,which is big part of supermans life..

Far as sequal...This is gonna be a situation..Do they continue development of Superman or start focousing on his 'son' which is a can of worms they opened up..Maybe if they follow the spider-man formula I think they can pull it off.
Now far as future enemies..This can be done now with him going to krypton and looking for evidence of life..They can explain away any enemies they want as they can say' On superman's journies to krypton he encountered (insert enemie of choosing),and they had a brief encounter,and now they want revenge for whatever reason..blah blah blah

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Old 11-28-2006, 12:21 PM   #6
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Yep, you guys have hit the nail on the head. I couldn't care less about Superman when Lex was stabbing him with the kryptonite weapon - now there has to be something wrong with that. I should have been on the edge of my seat.

Flat, bland, unengaging performances from Routh and Bosworth. Spacey was OK I guess, but he kind of went through the motions I thought. No real emotional hook to grab you and keep you there - it's never a good sign when you're sitting wondering how much more of this you have to sit through, it's Superman, you know? So disappointing....

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Old 11-28-2006, 12:33 PM   #7
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

though i loved the movie and i actually felt a connection with Clark/Supes, i agree that there needs to be more dramatic/emotional scenes. after watching Casino Royale and hearing the witty, charming dialogue coming from Daniel Craig...i want Supes to say some cool things too.

i don't feel it's Routh's fault...it's the writers'.

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Old 11-28-2006, 12:44 PM   #8
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Quote:
Originally Posted by DorkyFresh

i don't feel it's Routh's fault...it's the writers'.
True. It's sad because I thought Routh actually was a suitable replacement for Reeve. He had some moments of actually being Superman. It's too bad that no real solid connection was made with the audience. No empathy and no emotion. That blame lies with the writers and Singer and not Routh. They just assumed we'd care because he's a character we all know, love and respect.

Obviously that worked with some people. Some people could overlook it simply because he was Superman and wore the suit. To me, they never gave me a reason to care about anything.

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Old 11-28-2006, 04:13 PM   #9
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

i disagree, if anything, there was too much emotion and not enough story. The story wasn't very good, they kinda just threw a monkey wrench in the plot and see how peopel react to it. So if anything, the emotion was fine, if not too much, but without a good story, it just looks like a bunch of people crying.

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Old 11-28-2006, 05:09 PM   #10
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Superman Returns definently had enough emotion imo. I actually felt kind of bad for Superman when he he was flying up in space after hearing that Lois didn't love him and when he was in the hospital. If anything was lacking it was the action which I hear will be put in the sequal.

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Old 11-28-2006, 06:27 PM   #11
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Quote:
Originally Posted by DorkyFresh

i don't feel it's Routh's fault...it's the writers'.
I know I bash the hell outta Superman Returns, but I agree with this statement....Routh was only reading the lines he was given. Now, could he give an engaging performance with better material, I don't know, but Im willing to give him a chance. I still feel Henry Cavill was the better choice, but that is a pointless arguement now.

Kate Bosworth on the other hand.....lets just say Im all for a re-cast. Bryan Singer decided to defy my genius cast of Henry Cavill(Supes), Rachel McAdams(Lois), and Jaquin Phoenix(Lex) and go with his own ideas.

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Old 11-28-2006, 10:49 PM   #12
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

I've never thought it was Routh's fault either. People always ask me if I thought he was a good Superman in the movie, and I always tell them "I don't know. He barely said a word." He could be a great Superman if he's actually given some dialogue. I recently just got done watching the Donner cut, and the scenes between Reeve and Jor-El have more emotion, and more heart than anything I saw in SR.

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Old 11-29-2006, 10:26 AM   #13
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Like I said before, this movie just goes over some peoples heads...

Sorry if Superman didn't say "I'M SAD" or "I'M HAPPY" to express his emotions. There is this thing called subtlety.

And the thematic similarities to S:tM were to connect the origin and the return. Again, this is too subtle for some to comprehend.

And this thread is useless, it is basically another chance to bash the movie and complain about things already complained about. You don't see me making another suit thread do you?

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Old 11-29-2006, 10:33 AM   #14
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

So agree with the thread's creator. Film is chalked full of awkwardness, fake emotion, bland / stiff acting. Very little felt believable in this film.

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Old 11-29-2006, 10:50 AM   #15
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Perception , perception..

i feel the contrary of the thread creator.

i was very moved by the movie and i hope that i will be as moved with the sequel.

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Old 11-29-2006, 10:55 AM   #16
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayKay
Like I said before, this movie just goes over some peoples heads...

Funniest quote ever.

So that's why we didn't like it. It went over our heads. It wasn't the bland and unimaginative story, the melodramatic themes, the lack of action, the lack of good direction, no chemistry between Lois and Supes, Spacey sleepwalking through the movie, a super kid, and a complete missed opportunity for a grand film.

...It was the fact it went over our heads. Thank you for clearing that up.

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Old 11-29-2006, 10:59 AM   #17
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Quote:
Originally Posted by matthooper
Funniest quote ever.

So that's why we didn't like it. It went over our heads. It wasn't the bland and unimaginative story, the melodramatic themes, the lack of action, the lack of good direction, no chemistry between Lois and Supes, Spacey sleepwalking through the movie, a super kid, and a complete missed opportunity for a grand film.

...It was the fact it went over our heads. Thank you for clearing that up.
Yes yes ,in fact Matt people can like SR but they should admit that's it's a mediocre film anyway ,i know.

it makes me laugh too you know ,sometimes .. at other time i find that downright insulting ..Yes, what makes you think you know more about cinema than some?

maybe , just maybe i know a lot more about it than you , you know ..

Maybe you just couldn't "understand" the movie .

You see ,it's pointless.

let's agree to disagree, it's better

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Old 11-29-2006, 12:25 PM   #18
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

well,i'm just glad it wasnt some cartoony film,like alot are these days...I am the first to admit it wasnt perfect,but i'll take it over ALOT of other recent C.B. films.

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Old 11-29-2006, 12:34 PM   #19
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maze
Yes yes ,in fact Matt people can like SR but it's a mediocre film anyway ,i know.

it makes me laugh too you know ,sometimes .. at other time i find that downright insulting ..Yes, what makes you think you know more about cinema than some?

maybe , just maybe i know a lot more about it than you , you know ..

Maybe you just couldn't "understand" the movie .

You see ,it's pointless.

let's agree to disagree, it's better
You can't argue about other people's perceptions. It's a black and white issue. Either you like it or you don't. It's just a movie. It's not a college thesis. There's no hidden agenda to understand or not understand. I understand your sarcasm, but where there is smoke there is usually fire, and you and the like actually believe that we just don't get it, and that's the reason we don't like it.

It's achems razor. The simplest explanation is usually the answer. We don't like it simply because we don't feel it's good.

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Old 11-29-2006, 12:38 PM   #20
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Quote:
Originally Posted by matthooper
You can't argue about other people's perceptions.
Exactly , that was the point of my message .

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Old 11-29-2006, 02:14 PM   #21
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Quote:
Originally Posted by DorkyFresh
i don't feel it's Routh's fault...it's the writers'.
C'mon now. I know you're going to stick up for your guy and all, but that just isn't necessarily true. Yes, the writers were bad. But there is a reason many of Routh's scenes were cut. He couldn't carry the scenes. And the ones he was in, were extremely dry, with little emotion or resonance. Did you see the scene where he describes what he saw on Krypton to his mother? Horrible. It was like a cardboard cut out, or plastic toy reading memorized lines. There is a big reason why Routh was an unkown, and why he was kicked off soap operas of all things. He isn't a very good actor. He was just eye candy, that luckily somewhat looked like Christopher Reeve. Beyond that, kid wasn't that great. Mediocre AT BEST. Not all the writers' fault. I'm sure they couldn't write or include some scenes, or dialogue, because they knew how bad of an actor Routh is. The strength of the movie didn't lie with Routh. But to be honest, I don't know what the strength of the movie was. I don't think it really had any, or even one. Spacey mailed in a performance. Nothing reached out and grabbed you. Bosworth was horrible. The character of Richard was "meh" at best. Nothing stood out. The film was an extremely average film. Not good, not bad, but just an empty shell of a film. Dissapointing.

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Old 11-29-2006, 02:24 PM   #22
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkest Knight
C'mon now. I know you're going to stick up for your guy and all, but that just isn't necessarily true. Yes, the writers were bad. But there is a reason many of Routh's scenes were cut. He couldn't carry the scenes. And the ones he was in, were extremely dry, with little emotion or resonance. Did you see the scene where he describes what he saw on Krypton to his mother? Horrible. It was like a cardboard cut out, or plastic toy reading memorized lines. There is a big reason why Routh was an unkown, and why he was kicked off soap operas of all things. He isn't a very good actor. He was just eye candy, that luckily somewhat looked like Christopher Reeve. Beyond that, kid wasn't that great. Mediocre AT BEST. Not all the writers' fault. I'm sure they couldn't write or include some scenes, or dialogue, because they knew how bad of an actor Routh is. The strength of the movie didn't lie with Routh. But to be honest, I don't know what the strength of the movie was. I don't think it really had any, or even one. Spacey mailed in a performance. Nothing reached out and grabbed you. Bosworth was horrible. The character of Richard was "meh" at best. Nothing stood out. The film was an extremely average film. Not good, not bad, but just an empty shell of a film. Dissapointing.

Havn't you heard? Me, and those of us who didn't like the film just didn't understand it, or so I'm told by many of the defenders. So all your accurate points are lost since we didn't actually think the film was mediocre at best because we didn't like it, but rather because it went over our heads.

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Old 11-29-2006, 02:44 PM   #23
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayKay
Like I said before, this movie just goes over some peoples heads...

Sorry if Superman didn't say "I'M SAD" or "I'M HAPPY" to express his emotions. There is this thing called subtlety.

And the thematic similarities to S:tM were to connect the origin and the return. Again, this is too subtle for some to comprehend.

And this thread is useless, it is basically another chance to bash the movie and complain about things already complained about. You don't see me making another suit thread do you?
You see, this film was not anywhere near "over my head", it was actaully beneath me as a writer, a movie-goer, and general Superman fan. I GOT the film, and it still sucked. The subtelty was atroscious, and I say this with authority as I myself am a very subtle person, face to face anyway. That personality trait of mine actually contributes to me hating the film.

I also understood the thematic similarity to S:TM, but that doesn't mean I have to like it. Again, I feel that Superman's story was done, Singer should have created his own Superman story, although I don't know how well that would have turned out considering Singer can't even copy and paste well.

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Old 11-29-2006, 03:41 PM   #24
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Brandon confirmed that Singer is doing is own story for the sequel. My only concern is fans will now complain that it will be too far of a departure from Donner.

And then people will complain there was too much action, not enough story (since the reps said this sequel will have more action than any DC film ever made).

Blah. Most of the complainers are douchebags anyway.


But at the very least, if Singer does in fact make these improvements to the sequel, I would commend him for listening to critisism and adjusting accordingly.

95% of directors wouldnt do that. It's fortunate Singer and Brandon are such major fans of Superman.

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Old 11-29-2006, 03:45 PM   #25
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Default Re: Hopefully there is some real emotion in this film...

Singer is a fan of Richard Donner. Nothing more, nothing less. He handed in a rip off, re-telling of a story that came out in 1978. They needed an imaginative re-invention, and re-integration of the character and mythos ala Batman Begins. Batman Begins is a restart and the last movie came out in 1997. It has been even longer since a Superman movie came out, let alone a Richard Donner one, and Singer wanted to make a sequel to that. Does that make any sense, what so ever?

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