Beginning of a new era; how The Dark Knight changed saved summer blockbusters

[thedarks0ldier]

Summer blockbusters have traditionally been mindless action movies that sacrifice depth for cheap thrills and sophistication for special fx.

I believe that the Dark Knight has just showed every studio that you can make a smart action film that with a dark ending, deficate over what traditional market research shows (in terms of what "sells" in Hollywood), and make an astronomical amount of money.

For the past decade we have seen CGI misused to the point that it tires the audience and our favorite characters slaughtered because studio exectutives thought that "they" knew how to make the character more appealing to children or interesting.

Not since Terminator 2 have we been able to get a successful big budget action film that delivers in every level.

I want you guys to list examples of how studios or just cliches that most summer blockbusters have and discuss how the Dark Knight has potentially broken that mold for the summer blockbuster film.

Hopefully this will make the real artist in Hollywood stand out and weed out all the "Rob Cohens","Brett Ratners", and "Mike Steven Johnson."

Here's hoping we get better quality films from these studios from now on.

[TheDarkKnight08]

Originally Posted by thedarks0ldier

Summer blockbusters have traditionally been mindless action movies that sacrifice depth for cheap thrills and sophistication for special fx.

I believe that the Dark Knight has just showed every studio that you can make a smart action film that with a dark ending, deficate over what traditional market research shows (in terms of what "sells" in Hollywood), and make an astronomical amount of money.

For the past decade we have seen CGI misused to the point that it tires the audience and our favorite characters slaughtered because studio exectutives thought that "they" knew how to make the character more appealing to children or interesting.

Not since Terminator 2 have we been able to get a successful big budget action film that delivers in every level.

I want you guys to list examples of how studios or just cliches that most summer blockbusters have and discuss how the Dark Knight has potentially broken that mold for the summer blockbuster film.

Hopefully this will make the real artist in Hollywood stand out and weed out all the "Rob Cohens","Brett Ratners", and "Mike Steven Johnson."

Here's hoping we get better quality films from these studios from now on.

I totally agree on every level. I was having a talk with a friend of mine about this, and it's true. Nolan changed things, forever.

[Luchastyle]

Originally Posted by TheDarkKnight08

I totally agree on every level. I was having a talk with a friend of mine about this, and it's true. Nolan changed things, forever.

indeed. in fact, you might say, there's no goin back

[jmc]

Great topic, one that should be discussed.

I’ve long had a beef with Hollywood over the past 15 or so years, the advent of CGI has been both a blessing and a curse, effectively giving directors and writers a way of producing even the most outrageous of concepts to the screen, with the only thing stopping them is imagination. Having said that CGI has also become a thorn in the side of film. For the first half a dozen or so years CGI was a real wow factor , the imagery sold itself whilst holes in the plot and poor acting were generally ignored, however overtime it has become extensively used to the point where it’s lost its novelty and can no longer carry the film alone. Despite how bad these movies have become this hasn’t stopped studios from continuing to make these type of films. It’s what I like to call Junk Food Cinema, the film equivalent of McDonalds, bad plot, cheesy lines, weak acting, one-dimensional characters all covered in a deliciously tasty yet ultimately under welming Special FX sauce. These films make money but they have no legs afterwards, they’re never going to win awards and most wont be remembered with only the occasional film standing out.

Suddenly in 2005 Chris Nolan comes out with one of the best films of the year in Batman Begins, a serious Summer Blockbuster, one that at first struggles to appeal due to its predecessor of the same character being part of aforementioned group of bad films, but overtime grows to a be appreciated as one of the best films of its kind ever. Fast forward 3 years to now, since Batman Begins Hollywood doesn’t learn anything, pumping out the same blockbuster drivel with the exception of one or two films. Then it hits like a car crash, The Dark Knight lands and changes everything. It’s smart, it’s complex, it’s dark, it’s terrifying, its cast is awesome, it’s more in line with an Scorsese crime epic, it throws out the rule book, it’s everything a Summer Blockbuster shouldn’t be, and yet 3 weeks after release there are still theatres selling out sessions, becoming not only one of the biggest films ever, but one of most critically acclaimed mainstream movies in years. Not only that, it's bringing in audiences who normally don't see these type of movies. What’s happened? This shouldn’t be right, how can a film that isn't marketed to kids and teens be making so much money? How can a superhero film be generating Oscar buzz? I tell you what’s happened, Chris Nolan has decided it's time for the Summer Blockbuster to grow up. Now the studios will go into their offices totally confused and have to re-evaluate what a Summer Blockbuster is because it’s forever been redefined.

I’m especially hopeful WB learns from this, for it’s remaining franchises (WW, GL, FL) deserve to be made with the same effort and quality as what Nolan and Co. has done. The Dark Knight marks the turning point, the Summer blockbuster has changed forever, and it will be for the better.

[[A]]

Originally Posted by Luchastyle

indeed. in fact, you might say, there's no goin back

See, to us.. he's not a freak





*I had to say it

[I-T-B]

I don't really think The Dark Knight's going make any sort of substantial change. If anything we're going to see a rash of TDK rip-offs in a couple years, the same crappy blockbusters that've been coming out for decades, just dressed up with "moodier" visuals, "rich" (cliche) characters, and "darker" storylines focusing on a tortured hero and/or a seedy underworld. Yes, TDK was a quality movie that was essentially the opposite of every other summer blockbuster released in the last few years, but it's not the overall level of quality the studio executives are going to glean from the film's success. They'll take whatever aspects they can get for the lowest amount of money, the visuals, the criminal element, the darker aspects of the story, and they'll rush out a series of poorly written, poorly acted, ill-conceived movies that contain all the superficial elements, but lack what made The Dark Knight great. So no, I'm not personally expecting any revelatory turnaround in the way summer flicks are made.

[Anita18]

Originally Posted by I-T-B

I don't really think The Dark Knight's going make any sort of substantial change. If anything we're going to see a rash of TDK rip-offs in a couple years, the same crappy blockbusters that've been coming out for decades, just dressed up with "moodier" visuals, "rich" (cliche) characters, and "darker" storylines focusing on a tortured hero and/or a seedy underworld. Yes, TDK was a quality movie that was essentially the opposite of every other summer blockbuster released in the last few years, but it's not the overall level of quality the studio executives are going to glean from the film's success. They'll take whatever aspects they can get for the lowest amount of money, the visuals, the criminal element, the darker aspects of the story, and they'll rush out a series of poorly written, poorly acted, ill-conceived movies that contain all the superficial elements, but lack what made The Dark Knight great. So no, I'm not personally expecting any revelatory turnaround in the way summer flicks are made.

Well, assuming that all summer blockbusters would be TDK-ified, which I don't think will happen. The summer is meant for big-budget, action tentpole movies that appeal to many. That's what it's always been traditionally. As we've seen this year, niche movies like X-Files or Prince Caspian didn't do well at all, and would have definitely performed better if they had been released in the fall or winter.

The big difference this year is that TDK and IM were big summer movies that were made money because they were GOOD, even though the tone between them couldn't be more different. The unexpected success of both films will hopefully force Hollywood to start making action films that are well-acted and well-directed, at the very least. As they found out this week, people will still go to see something as good as TDK even if it's 3 weeks old, ahead of a new, snazzy (yet very crappy) movie like The Mummy 3. IM also held up extremely well against Indiana Jones, which was expected to be a juggernaut.

I believe IM was a nudge in the right direction, and hopefully what all major Hollywood studios will realistically aim for in the future for their summer tentpoles.

TDK was an extreme of what is possible if the right team comes together at the right time. Hopefully it will make it possible for another director to be able to convince a large studio to finance a similar summer project, because if it happened with TDK, it can happen again.

But you're right, I don't think that Hollywood will catch lightning in a bottle like this for a long time coming. I expect they'll try though. Oh, they'll try.

[DaRkVeNgeanCe]

I agree that atleast it was a really good change of pace for summer films in general.

[Boom]

I honestly doubt anything will change. If anything, Marvel will retaliate by producing rushed films.

[Shane Diesel]

Originally Posted by Boom

I honestly doubt anything will change. If anything, Marvel will retaliate by producing rushed films.

I agree. A studio is going to interpret this to mean that comic book movies are continuing to make money. So they'll just rush every adaptation they can to the screen as a blitzing maneuver.

[The Chris]

The dark Knight is the defintely the one and only king out there right now. I've seen three films since I saw the Dark Knight (The X-Files 2, Step Brothers, and The Mummy 3) I was entertained, but none even come close to the the absolute wrecking ball that Nolan gave us. A prestige film that came out in July, that's what Dark Knight is.

[Mike53421]

To be honest, since the first trailer for TDK came out (not the teaser) I've been so distracted by it that I haven't been able to fully enjoy these summer blockbusters. I've cut down significantly on the crap that I've gone to see in theatres. Movies like The Mummy, Wanted, Hancock, hell even Indy 4, just looked so lame. Even with Iron Man, friends of mine were gushing at how cool it was to see him fly initially at his house... but it was just CGI! I can't get into movies like The Mummy or Wanted who use CGI at a stupid-level. I did enjoy Iron Man but some of the stuff was just too too fake, but in the context of the movie there was literally no other option.

This summer though I've seen:

Iron Man
The Incredible Hulk
Get Smart
Wanted
Hellboy 2 (hours before the TDK screening, almost a warm-up round)
The Dark Knight
The Dark Knight
The Dark Knight
The Dark Knight

Aside from Wanted, there are no movies so far this summer where I'm looking back on and regretting seeing like how it usually is. I'm actually excited for the two comedies coming out in the next 10 days (Pineapple Express, Tropic Thunder).

[Raiden]

I don't think it's possible or even feasible to make all the superhero movies like TDK (ie dark and without CGI). IM, for instance, cannot do with CGI since without it we won't be treated to scenes where IM fly or walk around with that bulky armor. But IM shows that with good director, script, and talented actors, they can make a good movie great. I just hope that with TDK's success, Marvel will make more movies like IM, SM2, X2 and less movies like GR, DD, and FF.

[Spider-Vader]

Originally Posted by Anita18

IM also held up extremely well against Indiana Jones, which was expected to be a juggernaut.

Well wasn't it? It's one of only 3 movies to pass the 300 mil mark domestically, IM barely held Indy off by like it's pinky toe. Plus it made 700 mil + WW, while the only other movies likely to do that this year are TDK & HP.

[DaRkVeNgeanCe]

Originally Posted by Boom

I honestly doubt anything will change. If anything, Marvel will retaliate by producing rushed films.

It's not like that would surprise me. lol

[thedarks0ldier]

Originally Posted by Boom

I honestly doubt anything will change. If anything, Marvel will retaliate by producing rushed films.

I don't think thats Marvel's fault, but more so 20th Century Fox. They seem to be ran by monkeys who think they are making good executive decisions. I cannot stand them, I hope they go under, along with News Corp.

[TLH]

The Dark Knight has not changed the summer blockbuster. All it has done is proven that a dark, intelligent film can be a winner at the box office.

It's not going to inspire copy-cats; we aren't going to see a sudden surge of dark, intelligent blockbusters. Everybody knows that the man behind the film (Christopher Nolan) is what made the film work; he can control and balance intelligence and darkness with entertainment, character development, intense action, cool gadgets, and suspense -- and do it all with barely any CGI. Let's not forget that Batman is pretty much the only character who can apply to all of these.

So many elements were in the right place for TDK that few will ever try to "cash-in" on what made TDK so successful. Too many things could go wrong. Unless they had Christopher Nolan.

[Anita18]

Originally Posted by Spider-Vader

Well wasn't it? It's one of only 3 movies to pass the 300 mil mark domestically, IM barely held Indy off by like it's pinky toe. Plus it made 700 mil + WW, while the only other movies likely to do that this year are TDK & HP.

Right, but Indy4 was expected to bulldoze absolutely everything in its way like TDK is currently doing, but IM survived intact and kicking.

[thedarks0ldier]

Originally Posted by Anita18

Right, but Indy4 was expected to bulldoze absolutely everything in its way like TDK is currently doing, but IM survived intact and kicking.

I am glad this is happening

I am glad TDK has devoured Pirates of the Caribbean's records, especially after Disney encroached on Superman Returns. And I am glad Indy 4 didn't take out Iron Man, and that TDK is kicking it's arse (INDY's). After all, a lackluster Episode 3 out did a spectacular Batman Begins, and it's about time for Nolan and Co. to release a film that "skeets" over one by Lucus and Co.

[thedarks0ldier]

Originally Posted by I-T-B

I don't really think The Dark Knight's going make any sort of substantial change. If anything we're going to see a rash of TDK rip-offs in a couple years, the same crappy blockbusters that've been coming out for decades, just dressed up with "moodier" visuals, "rich" (cliche) characters, and "darker" storylines focusing on a tortured hero and/or a seedy underworld. Yes, TDK was a quality movie that was essentially the opposite of every other summer blockbuster released in the last few years, but it's not the overall level of quality the studio executives are going to glean from the film's success. They'll take whatever aspects they can get for the lowest amount of money, the visuals, the criminal element, the darker aspects of the story, and they'll rush out a series of poorly written, poorly acted, ill-conceived movies that contain all the superficial elements, but lack what made The Dark Knight great. So no, I'm not personally expecting any revelatory turnaround in the way summer flicks are made.

Originally Posted by Anita18

Well, assuming that all summer blockbusters would be TDK-ified, which I don't think will happen. The summer is meant for big-budget, action tentpole movies that appeal to many. That's what it's always been traditionally. As we've seen this year, niche movies like X-Files or Prince Caspian didn't do well at all, and would have definitely performed better if they had been released in the fall or winter.

The big difference this year is that TDK and IM were big summer movies that were made money because they were GOOD, even though the tone between them couldn't be more different. The unexpected success of both films will hopefully force Hollywood to start making action films that are well-acted and well-directed, at the very least. As they found out this week, people will still go to see something as good as TDK even if it's 3 weeks old, ahead of a new, snazzy (yet very crappy) movie like The Mummy 3. IM also held up extremely well against Indiana Jones, which was expected to be a juggernaut.

I believe IM was a nudge in the right direction, and hopefully what all major Hollywood studios will realistically aim for in the future for their summer tentpoles.

TDK was an extreme of what is possible if the right team comes together at the right time. Hopefully it will make it possible for another director to be able to convince a large studio to finance a similar summer project, because if it happened with TDK, it can happen again.

But you're right, I don't think that Hollywood will catch lightning in a bottle like this for a long time coming. I expect they'll try though. Oh, they'll try.

Originally Posted by Raiden

I don't think it's possible or even feasible to make all the superhero movies like TDK (ie dark and without CGI). IM, for instance, cannot do with CGI since without it we won't be treated to scenes where IM fly or walk around with that bulky armor. But IM shows that with good director, script, and talented actors, they can make a good movie great. I just hope that with TDK's success, Marvel will make more movies like IM, SM2, X2 and less movies like GR, DD, and FF.

Originally Posted by Trunks

The Dark Knight has not changed the summer blockbuster. All it has done is proven that a dark, intelligent film can be a winner at the box office.

It's not going to inspire copy-cats; we aren't going to see a sudden surge of dark, intelligent blockbusters. Everybody knows that the man behind the film (Christopher Nolan) is what made the film work; he can control and balance intelligence and darkness with entertainment, character development, intense action, cool gadgets, and suspense -- and do it all with barely any CGI. Let's not forget that Batman is pretty much the only character who can apply to all of these.

So many elements were in the right place for TDK that few will ever try to "cash-in" on what made TDK so successful. Too many things could go wrong. Unless they had Christopher Nolan.

You guys are all right, but what I am hope happens is that I hope that entertainers (Michael Bay, Dean Devlin, Roland Emmerich, Tim Story, Paul W.S. Anderson, Doug Limen (although he get respect for Bourne Identity), Steven Soderbergh, and the three I listed earlier (Cohen, Ratner, Steven Jonson) stop getting work, or only do horror movies while the real artist in Hollywood begin getting the respect and recognition they deserve.

And I hope that directors in future projects don't see blockbusters as just cash cows, but rather as a way to really put everything into a movie. Action films can be masterpieces, it's just idiots usually direct them.

[xwhysoseriousx]

Great topic! I was actually discussing this with a friend who is also a big movie buff. We don't fall for crap like The Mummy 3 or Journey to the Center of the Earth or any crap like that.

CGI. Three little letters. At first, it seemed like CGI could only make a movie more grand and inspiring (see: Jurassic Park, T2, or any other early usage of computer special f/x). Now it seems, CGI makes for lazy film-making and even lazier story-telling. Too many directors (I'm looking at you Michael Bay) rely on f/x to tell the story for them. Its so sad that 95% of the heavy CGI movies are CRAP! Just complete utter horsepoo thrown on the general public because the Hollywood douchebags KNOW that we'll eat it right up (myself excluded).

That was proven this weekend with The Mummy coming in right on TDK's tail. Every review I've read has said its simply a cash-in move, and that's probably exactly what it is. I haven't seen it and I don't plan on seeing it, and my life is probably better off for avoiding it.

I really hope that Chris Nolan has set a precedent for the rest of Hollywood to follow. Don't rely on CGI to carry a film when the rest of it was written and directed by a 4th grader. We're not stupid, but Hollywood sure treats us like we are.

[Mike53421]

So as far as the CGI debate goes, what are people's feelings on movies like 300 or Sin City that are CGI-heavy but have a certain style about them?

Transformers was CGI-heavy, as was Sin City, but in a different way is what I mean.

[xwhysoseriousx]

Originally Posted by Mike53421

So as far as the CGI debate goes, what are people's feelings on movies like 300 or Sin City that are CGI-heavy but have a certain style about them?

Transformers was CGI-heavy, as was Sin City, but in a different way is what I mean.

The difference is simple: 300 and Sin City are good movies. Pirates 2 and 3 and Transformers are not. CGI should enhance a movie, not make it. That's my opinion anyway.

[Heretic]

Do any of us actually belive that Paul W. S. Anderson and Uwe Boll are now hard at work at their masterpieces filled with in depth characters and engaging storylines?

No, movie makers, as with any medium, will pick up a couple of vary surface elements and rip them off in their own movies. Look at comics, for instance. Did Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns inspire a heihtened quality in comics, or did the publishers just go with very bad grim and gritty heroes THINKING that they were delivering quality? It wont be any difference here. You'll have really bad summer blockbusters who try to disgiuse themselves as thought provoking, in depth films.

[jmc]

Originally Posted by xwhysoseriousx

The difference is simple: 300 and Sin City are good movies. Pirates 2 and 3 and Transformers are not. CGI should enhance a movie, not make it. That's my opinion anyway.

That's 100% correct. The smart film makers are the ones who use CGI as a tool not as a plot device, in fact the best films are the ones where you don't even notice the CGI.