Sabretooth Wolverine's half brother?

[cerealkiller182]

Originally Posted by Infinity9999x

I don't see why either of the options are bad ones, other then the fact that they support a theory you don't like. I think both ideas open up interesting possibilities for the Wolverine/Creed relationship. If you could give me a reason why you think it's a bad idea, other than saying you think it is, then I think I'd understand better.

Fine:

For one, it allows us to look at all Sabertooth's reasons for going after Wolverine in a whole new light. Wolverine was the "special" brother. He got everything Sabertooth wanted as a child. He had the father who cared about him, the nice house, warm food, and Rose. And then, Wolverine takes the one thing he had, his father. So now Sabertooth is out to take everything away from Wolverine in revenge.

This is all useless garbage. Sabertooth is an animal, he works on instinct. Blind hatred is so much more interesting and feral for Sabertooth's motivation. He is like rabid dog and Wolvie is the trusty guard dog.

Or, on a deeper level, Sabertooth may actually care for Logan. But Sabertooth is really screwed up. All he's known his whole life is basically pain and abuse, he really doesn't know how to show anyone affection. So the way he "helps out" Wolverine is by making his life hell, to make him tougher, so Wolverine will always be able to make it in the world. His actions could be a twisted version of brotherly love.

Sabes isnt suppose to care, he is feral. He is more animal than human. It is the basis of his existence and why he foils with Wolverine.

On top of which both are incredibly soap operaish. BTW, that guy Wolverine has rivaled with all these times, he's his half brother. How's it gonna end? It was all a dream.

Now, I have no idea why you think Wolverine feels responsible for Sabertooth, that doesn't make any sense at all.

Whenever Sabertooth came around, Wolverine would say something to the effect, "It's not your fight" or "I'm doing this alone." All the times he left the X-Mansion on his birthday so that Sabertooth wouldnt go there. The fact that when Sabertooth went full feral Wolverine felt it was his responsibility to take him out for good. Wolverine definitely feels responsible for Sabertooth. Not in the way that he has to follow him around, but when their paths cross, Wolvie goes in alone no matter who is willing to help.

However, there relationship has been one of "dark vs. light" Sabes is what Wolverine could become if he ever chose to stop fighting his dark side. However, writers now a days have all but abandoned that plot of Wolverine fighting against his dark side, showing him being quite content with killing, which makes Sabertooth's character somewhat unneeded.

Killing for necessity. Killing like a soldier would kill. Not killing like a mass murderer like Sabertooth. Wolverine isnt just feral, he is a trained killer. Army, Samurai, Mercenary, what have you. He directs it and meditates (Japanese influence) to control, Sabes runs free.

Making Sabertooth Wolverine's brother would add some more layers to him. We now have a reason that Sabertooth has all this fueled hatred against Wolverine. We also could have alterior motives for Sabertooth's continued obsession with him. Not only that, but the standing theme, of Wolverine somewhat accomplishing to shed his dark side, would add onto the other layers I've discussed. Sabertooth already has that hatred of being the "second hand" brother. Wolverine always got everything he wanted, and now Wolverine looks like he's achieved what Sabertooth thought that both of them wouldn't, shedding his animalistic side.

Unnecessary. Thats all already there except the brother stuff. The brother stuff is just extra baggage that is completely overkill.

Because Jean and Rose, while similar, were still different. Jean didn't go out of her way to protect and be a big sister figure to Wolverine. Dog on the other hand, acted exactly the way Sabertooth was, looked like Sabertooth, has an abusive father like Sabertooth, and had a history that would fit into Sabertooth's backstory perfectly.

I havent really read a lot of the classic X-Men books, but Jean and Wolverine always had a connection. But Wolverine was older, wiser, trained, and regretful, and did his best to protect her instead as a way to make up for it. Dog was not a vicious killer. The only person he ever attacked was Wolvie plus Wolvies dog. He didnt want to take the guns into the house in Origin, and ended with the old man at the end. He didnt rape and kill Rose and left her for Wolverine to find. He made a B-line for Wolverine, no one else.

And I also admitted that yes, Sabes fits, but that doesnt make it good.

Besides that, Wolverine would have to meet Sabertooth within the next few years after running off into the wilderness, since they both have memories of eachother many years before their Weapon X days. (We could debate on weather or not these memories are fabricated, but that wouldn't get us anywhere since the writers keep saying they did and didn't happen as of late.) But what are the odds that Logan escapes Dog, then a year or two later runs into someone who
*looks Just like him,
*acts just like him
*and is obsessed with Wolverine, Just like dog!

Well theres still many years before Wolvie made it to the Weapon X program. He fought in most of the big historical wars. Its not out of the realm of possibility that he met Sabertooth later on. Sabertooth who has just as much in common with Wolverine as he does Dog and Wild Child and Wolvies other brother from The End. Both the Romulus (or whatever his name) arc of Wolvies solo and the Earth X series and Weapon X Days of Future Now (the newer story) all made implications that Wolverine is part of a much larger group of mutants who all have very similar powers.

That's completely different. Batman and Joker have been in culture for years yes, but in terms of comic time they've known eachother for 10, maybe 15 years max. Wolverine and Sabertooth have a history going back decades, over half a century even, depending on the writer. Since Origins gave us a character who looks like Sabertooth, acts like Sabertooth, and (if revealed to be Sabertooth) explains why Sabertooth is the way he is today, I see no reason why Dog being Sabertooth is a bad idea.

History does not equal relationship. I am not arguing that Sabes doesnt fit. I said Sabes fits. I said its a stupid idea. Why does he have to Wolvies brother? "Cause then we know his motivation" SABES IS FERAL AND RABID. He is above justification. He found a kindred spirit, a mutant hiding an animal inside, but wasnt accepted by him and has lashed out at him for years.

[sniktsnakt]

However, writers now a days have all but abandoned that plot of Wolverine fighting against his dark side, showing him being quite content with killing, which makes Sabertooth's character somewhat unneeded.

Yeah, darn writers. Is it sad that I miss the old Madripoor and Japan arcs so much?

But I suppose that's one reason they justified getting rid of Sabertooth in WV 55. That and the sudden appearance of Wolvie's magically-appearing son.

I hope the movie leans more towards the Wolvie we knew in the 80's/90's, and not so much towards Ultimate Wolverine.

[Infinity9999x]

Originally Posted by cerealkiller182

Fine:


This is all useless garbage. Sabertooth is an animal, he works on instinct. Blind hatred is so much more interesting and feral for Sabertooth's motivation. He is like rabid dog and Wolvie is the trusty guard dog.

Sabes isnt suppose to care, he is feral. He is more animal than human. It is the basis of his existence and why he foils with Wolverine.

I don't think Sabertooth is all animal, or else he wouldn't be that great at talking, and he wouldn't focus all his actions on one single person, or go out of his way to track him down across the country every day of the year. He obviously still has some semblance of human nature, he just likes to give in to his feral side, so much so that he actually enjoys loosing control and killing.

Also, the comics originally gave us some reasons why Sabertooth is the way he is. His father was horribly abusive to him. Of course we don't know if those memories were true or not, due to weapon X, but we have seen that many memories Wolverine and Sabertooth have usually stem from something that actually happened.

On top of which both are incredibly soap operaish. BTW, that guy Wolverine has rivaled with all these times, he's his half brother. How's it gonna end? It was all a dream.

I don't think it's quite that soap opera ish. It's more like, the guy Wolverine has rivaled for over 50 years, has the same powers as him, looks similar to him, and has the same affinity for an animalistic nature as him, and they both can't remember when they met but it seems like they've been fighting for ever...he's his half-brother. To which I would say...oh, makes sense.

Whenever Sabertooth came around, Wolverine would say something to the effect, "It's not your fight" or "I'm doing this alone." All the times he left the X-Mansion on his birthday so that Sabertooth wouldnt go there. The fact that when Sabertooth went full feral Wolverine felt it was his responsibility to take him out for good. Wolverine definitely feels responsible for Sabertooth. Not in the way that he has to follow him around, but when their paths cross, Wolvie goes in alone no matter who is willing to help.

Ohh, the way you worded it I thought you meant Wolverine felt responsible for Sabertooth being feral and not mastering his animal side, not Sabertooth's actions.

Killing for necessity. Killing like a soldier would kill. Not killing like a mass murderer like Sabertooth. Wolverine isnt just feral, he is a trained killer. Army, Samurai, Mercenary, what have you. He directs it and meditates (Japanese influence) to control, Sabes runs free.

Sometimes, but at some points the comics just show Wolverine going beserk when he's fighting a group of foes (granted they are attacking him) and then not giving a damn when he kills them all. Before, Wolverine would get angry at himself for losing control, now he doesn't.

Unnecessary. Thats all already there except the brother stuff. The brother stuff is just extra baggage that is completely overkill.

To you maybe. I don't see it as overkill. The I hate you just becuase I hate you angle gets old after a while to me. Now, I'm not saying we have to connect everything Sabertooth does to his life as Dog, it can just influence it. For example, the brotherly love angle. I think it would fit perfectly with Sabertooth to be torturing Logan the way he does out of love. He actually cares for Logan, but all he's known his whole life is violence and abuse, so that's all he knows to respond with. Also, Sabertooth probably cared for his father in a twisted way, while also hated him because he abused him, but his father was all he had, and Logan took his father away from in. Now Sabertooth wants to take everything away from Logan, forever. That's only one way to look at it.

I havent really read a lot of the classic X-Men books, but Jean and Wolverine always had a connection. But Wolverine was older, wiser, trained, and regretful, and did his best to protect her instead as a way to make up for it. Dog was not a vicious killer. The only person he ever attacked was Wolvie plus Wolvies dog. He didnt want to take the guns into the house in Origin, and ended with the old man at the end. He didnt rape and kill Rose and left her for Wolverine to find. He made a B-line for Wolverine, no one else.

They had a connection, but it was a completely different dynamic then the one between Logan and Rose.

You're wrong about Dog only attacking Wolverine.Dog, by the time he was a teen, had many of Sabertooth's charicteristics already. He cornered and tried to force himself on Rose, killed Wolverine's dog, would have shot Wolverine as a boy if Rose hadn't pushed him away, killed the tracker in the woods once he got information out of him, and then proceeded to try and kill Wolverine. When Rose saw them fighting he told her that he'd "catch up" with her later, and I don't think he meant a nice little chat either. He acted just as Sabertooth would have acted.

Well theres still many years before Wolvie made it to the Weapon X program. He fought in most of the big historical wars. Its not out of the realm of possibility that he met Sabertooth later on. Sabertooth who has just as much in common with Wolverine as he does Dog and Wild Child and Wolvies other brother from The End. Both the Romulus (or whatever his name) arc of Wolvies solo and the Earth X series and Weapon X Days of Future Now (the newer story) all made implications that Wolverine is part of a much larger group of mutants who all have very similar powers.

Origin ends sometime in the early 1900's, and Wolverine and Sabertooth were shown to have known eachother in the early 1900s as well (around the time he knew Silver Fox). So that doesn't leave much room, and as I've said, it's it a bit odd that Wolverine managed to find someone who acted, looked, and would have the same hated obsession with him as his half brother in the span of a few years.

History does not equal relationship. I am not arguing that Sabes doesnt fit. I said Sabes fits. I said its a stupid idea. Why does he have to Wolvies brother? "Cause then we know his motivation" SABES IS FERAL AND RABID. He is above justification. He found a kindred spirit, a mutant hiding an animal inside, but wasnt accepted by him and has lashed out at him for years.

And there's no reason that the idea you just said can't still be a part of his character, if anything, the brother idea adds more to it. Not only was Sabertooth rejected by a kindred spirit, one of the few people who was just like him, he was rejected by his half brother. The brother who had already had everything he had ever wanted in life, and then stolen the one thing Sabertooth had, his father. Not only that, when it seemed that Sabertooth would not be alone in being one of the few people to embrace his animal side fully, his brother turns around again and sheds that side, which would seem like Wolverine saying "I'm better then you" to Sabertooth. This would infuriate him, even more so because the brother who had everything already is now saying "I'm better then you," to him by trying to deny his true nature.

[Knightsaber Priss]

Ah yes, I remember the old Sabretooth is/is not Wolverine's brother debates from the 80's/90's. It was only a matter of time before it would be confirmed.

P.S. Why does Sabes have black hair and not blond hair? Does he dye it black or something?

[Brian Braddock]

I also remember similiar debates but about Sabretooth being Wolverine's dad.

And about the hair colour - siblings dont necessarily have to share the same hair colour. I've got a coupla cousins who are brothers; ones got brown hair and the others got blonde.

It can happen.

[Knightsaber Priss]

Originally Posted by SUPERBENITEZ

I also remember similiar debates but about Sabretooth being Wolverine's dad.

Yep, I remember that too, but I always thought it better they were siblings of some sort.

Originally Posted by SUPERBENITEZ

And about the hair colour - siblings dont necessarily have to share the same hair colour. I've got a coupla cousins who are brothers; ones got brown hair and the others got blonde.

It can happen.

No, no, I meant that the Sabes I know from the comics I read and the one Tyler Mane portrayed in X-Men was a natural blond. The one in Origins has black hair which has me a little puzzled.

[Brian Braddock]

Ah, gotcha.

In that case - I got nuthin'.

You may be right about the hair dye then.

[Knightsaber Priss]

Originally Posted by SUPERBENITEZ

Ah, gotcha.

In that case - I got nuthin'.

You may be right about the hair dye then.

Let's face it, Sabretooth is an Emo Goth. That would explain his hatred for all living things on Earth as well as dying his blond hair black.

[Brian Braddock]

And having longer than normal fingernails.

[[A]]

Originally Posted by Godzilla2000

Let's face it, Sabretooth is an Emo Goth. That would explain his hatred for all living things on Earth as well as dying his blond hair black.

The horror! Does he like Twilight too?

[ironwez20]

Originally Posted by Peter McCabe

Its not a false rumor.

Sabretooth is his brother.

The Dog Logan character and Victor Creed are one in the same in the film.

Logan and Creed are both the sons of Thomas Logan who is the guy getting stabbed by young Logan in the Trailer.

Thomas Logan like Logan and Creed has mutton chops and claws.

I like that.

omg i wanted this to be taken after the book origin and now that i know this sabertooth now has responsibility for killing logan's foster dad

[November Rain]

this films has a lot of opportunities for real depth, i hope they don't **** it up...

[Knightsaber Priss]

Originally Posted by Aeghast

The horror! Does he like Twilight too?

He probably owns all of the books in the series and Wolverine found out. That's why he's so pissed off at him all the time.

[[A]]

So he deserves to die

[Knightsaber Priss]

Originally Posted by Aeghast

So he deserves to die

Well I wouldn't go that far. Perhaps introduce Sabes to the wonderful world of V.C. Andrews.

[Peter McCabe]

Something fun to look at...

[TNC9852002]

hehehehe...

-TNC

[Bloodwynd]

I actually like the idea of them being brothers, it makes it that much more interesting for me. Btw, is Wolverine (as a child) killing his father in the trailer? I really need verification on that.

[the a1ant]

It looked like actor Aaron Jeffery that was getting stabbed in the trailer. On IMDB he's listed as Wolverine's half brother.

[Peter McCabe]

Originally Posted by the a1ant

It looked like actor Aaron Jeffery that was getting stabbed in the trailer. On IMDB he's listed as Wolverine's half brother.

IMDB is wrong.

As usual.

[Bloodwynd]

Completely wrong...IMDB is never, ever a reliable source for anything.

[Peter McCabe]

Originally Posted by Bloodwynd

Completely wrong...IMDB is never, ever a reliable source for anything.

At one point they had Keanu listed as Wolverine.

Yeah, I know.

Anyway I'm glad they got another Australian in there to play Thomas Logan, this movie smells like this generation's Mad Max.

[Bloodwynd]

In terms of quality, it may even give TDK a run for it's money.

[TheVileOne]

Just saying, it's not really canon unless Marvel says it is.

But again just saying, if Wolverine and Sabretooth were half-brothers, why would that be so bad? I mean that's what I took coming out of Origins without it being explicitly stated, but if this is true, why is this so bad? The idea itself makes sense, it fits, and suddenly the whole Wolverine/Sabretooth relationship ties together and makes a lot more sense.

Sabretooth also isn't an animal. Sabretooth is worse. And so is Wolverine.

[Bloodwynd]

Agreed, it's not a bad idea at all. I always thought they looked similar enough to be brothers, so why not finally go for that angle on film? Awesome change in my book.