I've been thinking about all the SM3 hate...

[Chris Wallace]

It seems to me that everything fans have been complaining about can all be tied to one element-an element which, ironically, fans had been clamoring for for years and one that Raimi didn't even want to incorporate in the first place: Venom.
Peter Parker is a genuinely good guy at heart. He's a man of compassion, integrity and morals. He doesn't drink, smoke, curse, cheat on his woman, or lie except to protect his identity. Now a man of such character really doesn't give a parasitic organism that feeds off of-and magnifies-one's dark emotions, much to work with. So several elements were introduced to bring Peter to this place of deadly sins.
First: Public embrace. We've all come to know & love Spidey as an unappreciated hero. He's villified in the press, held in question by police & generally distrusted by the public as a whole. Now truth be told, I think this concept is much easier to sell in a comic book, where there are plenty of other heroes whose good can outshine his. But in a world where he's the only one, how many lives can you really save before public perception of you starts to turn around. And it's somewhat understandable that this might go to your head, especailly after you'd been denied it for two years while puting your ass on the line every day. So enter first sin: Pride. Something he'd not been given to since the night his uncle died. This also contributed to the rift between him & MJ, as he was far too wrapped up in himself to provide the support she so desperately needed from him. Which brings me to the second element:
Sandman. Peter will never forget the death of his beloved Uncle Ben. Nor should he, as it was the catalyst of his entire crusade, it is arguably the most crucial aspect of his storyline. And yet, it was behind him. For two years he thought that chapter of his life closed. He'd even come clean to Aunt May about his own role in the tragedy. So he'd gotten closure. But then he learned that Marko, not Carradine, was the man who'd pulled the trigger. So in comes second deadly sin, wrath. Peter now struggles with feelings of discontent. Vengeful thoughts, which he also hadn't had since that night.
Next element: Gwen. When you've only had eyes for one female since birth, your attention is not easily swayed from her. But we're all human, all vulnerable. And not many men can turn a blind eye to a woman's attention and constant flirtation. So we get the next sin: Lust. Magnified by the fact that MJ was becoming more distant from him while drawing closer to Harry.
Which brings me to the love triangle. From this we get envy, or jealousy. MJ's betrayal was the final match to the powder keg that turned our friendly neighborhood Spider-Man into such a jerk. Someone who was willing to kill, didn't care about other people's wants, needs or feelings, and danced and pranced around because arrogance was so out of character for him, this was the only way he knew to express his newfound hubris. I can only wonder what the movie would have been like if the only focus had been on progressing the relationship between him & MJ, resolving the Goblin Saga and maybe bringing in Sandman, as just a petty crook that needed to be taken down.

[LightningFlash]

Venom, the symbiote(how we only got one good scene of black-suited Spidey and the way it affected Peter, too much on looks and not enough on anger and rage), Eddie's lack of time, Gwen's lack of time, Captain Stacy's lack of time(which I don't think he was even needed, more or less than even Gwen), Sandman killing Uncle Ben, the poor script.

[webhead731]

I personally loved the whole revenge/forgiveness story line. As far as I know, that hasn't been done in a comic book movie yet. I think it's really unique. I think most of the fans were all "omfg venim he l00kz cool and is lyke spidee its gunna bee good!!1! lulz" and they didn't seem to focus on the story, which is more important to me. The story centers at Spidey, as it should. It is SPIDER-MAN 3. All these things were known a year previous: strutting, Sandman-Uncle Ben tie in, "emo hair", Venom only in for the last 30 minutes.

What's funny is, no one cared. It was all okay. The expectations got at an unreasonable level, causing some disappointment, and some hate. Which I don't understand. Most of it wasn't even a surprise to alot of us. What were people thinking? I don't know. It amazes me how it's all okie-dokey, but some how when the movie comes out it's not okay. Expecting this movie to be extremely dark and serious was a dumb thing too, for the other movies were not like that. Sure, it was darker than the rest, but not as much as some people thought. Spider-Man always has comedy, what's the surprise? The strutting we saw a whole year before? Why was it "okay" or "funny" or "blah" back then, but when the movie comes out it's all "OMFG RAIMI U SUK I WUNT UH REEB00T LULZ"?

I just don't understand honestly. The hate isn't everywhere, as there are many who were fine with the movie and I enjoy discussing it. I like discussing 3 more than the other two, because of the deeper story line. Say what you want, just because there is some typical Spidey cheese doesn't mean you should ignore the story.

That's just my opinion though.

[LightningFlash]

Originally Posted by webhead731

All these things were known a year previous: strutting, Sandman-Uncle Ben tie in, "emo hair", Venom only in for the last 30 minutes.

I don't recall any of us knowing about the "emo hair" before it came to theatres.

And we did know that Marko would kill Uncle Ben, and there was STILL some hate over it before the movie came out.

And we thought Venom would be in the last 30-20 minutes, yes, but we all thought he would've been given more time as we all knew he would be in only the final battle. We all thought longer than five minutes.

And one can appreciate the main storyline/arc, yes...forgiveness, revenge and all of that has never really been used for a comic-book adaptation, BUT...with the mis-usage of villains and the overkill of the kids, and the reporter, and Mary Jane's complaining...it made the movie seem like an overkill itself.

And also, the pic of Venom in your avatar, or whatever it's called, that is what Venom should look like, yes...but the film itself, his symbol didn't look that white, and the night made him look smaller. But that is also my opinion though.

[SuperFerret]

Originally Posted by LightningFlash

I don't recall any of us knowing about the "emo hair" before it came to theatres.

And we did know that Marko would kill Uncle Ben, and there was STILL some hate over it before the movie came out.

And we thought Venom would be in the last 30-20 minutes, yes, but we all thought he would've been given more time as we all knew he would be in only the final battle. We all thought longer than five minutes.

And one can appreciate the main storyline/arc, yes...forgiveness, revenge and all of that has never really been used for a comic-book adaptation, BUT...with the mis-usage of villains and the overkill of the kids, and the reporter, and Mary Jane's complaining...it made the movie seem like an overkill itself.

The only thing that was "overkill" about them is the complaining of the fans who can't seem to just brush off a momentary bit part as what it is.

[LightningFlash]

For kids to call a giant sand creature explode "wicked cool" is just unnecessary and weird.

Why should kids enjoy such a sight at such a young age?

[SuperFerret]

Originally Posted by LightningFlash

For kids to call a giant sand creature explode "wicked cool" is just unnecessary and weird.

Why should kids enjoy such a sight at such a young age?

Have you EVER been a kid?

Sure, I would've pissed my pants at that age if I saw a giant sand-monster explode, but at least half of that piss would be from the excitement of seeing something so "wicked cool".

As "unnecessary" as it may be, that doesn't make it bad, or a valid reason not to like the entire movie. It's a neutral moment, and doesn't add or subtract anything to or from the movie.

[LightningFlash]

Originally Posted by SuperFerret

Have you EVER been a kid?

Sure, I would've pissed my pants at that age if I saw a giant sand-monster explode, but at least half of that piss would be from the excitement of seeing something so "wicked cool".

As "unnecessary" as it may be, that doesn't make it bad, or a valid reason not to like the entire movie. It's a neutral moment, and doesn't add or subtract anything to or from the movie.

Yes I was a kid...but, then again, a giant sandman would've most likely made me **** my pants...so instead of watching it, I think I would get a change of underwear, lol.

And I said it was unnecessary because it took away from the final fight, such as JJJ's skit with the little girl.

Both took away from the final fight only to try to make it "lighter".

[SuperFerret]

I don't think it took anything away from the fight, but that's just me.

[NewYorkSpider]

The reporter should've been axed.

[webhead731]

Originally Posted by LightningFlash

I don't recall any of us knowing about the "emo hair" before it came to theatres.

Sucks. It was shown in the teaser trailer in June 2006, plus the Comic-Con trailer that summer, which leaked online in November. Plus, we had this set pic:
http://indieharbor.com/img/parker.jpg

This poster from Comic-Con:
http://tatumweb.com/blog/pix/spider-3-tobey-big.jpg

And this from the official website:
http://www.cinematicwallpaper.com/mo...ter_Parker.jpg

Sure we had more too.

And we did know that Marko would kill Uncle Ben, and there was STILL some hate over it before the movie came out.

I recall it calming down after it was learned that Dennis startled Flint, causing him to shoot. I know I was worried that it tampered with the origin until we learned that.

And we thought Venom would be in the last 30-20 minutes, yes, but we all thought he would've been given more time as we all knew he would be in only the final battle. We all thought longer than five minutes.

I recall someone saying 10 minutes of just Venom himself in the final act. Whether it was Raimi or one of those Q&A's, I don't remember. But I knew about it, so surely others did.
Don't get me wrong, I wasn't HAPPY, but it all depended on how the character was, whom I did like. I knew he was going to die and that pissed me off.

And one can appreciate the main storyline/arc, yes...forgiveness, revenge and all of that has never really been used for a comic-book adaptation, BUT...with the mis-usage of villains and the overkill of the kids, and the reporter, and Mary Jane's complaining...it made the movie seem like an overkill itself.

How did like 4 seconds of kids in the final battle kill the ENTIRE movie? Mary Jane didn't complain THAT much either. If I let petty stuff like that ruin a movie for me, I'd hate about everything, because I always find something to roll my eyes at.

And also, the pic of Venom in your avatar, or whatever it's called, that is what Venom should look like, yes...but the film itself, his symbol didn't look that white, and the night made him look smaller. But that is also my opinion though.

Well, this is a screen cap taken directly from the film (after Harry throws razor-bats at him), and it's used on the back of the DVD. They brightened it up and made the spider more white.
Sure, I can agree that it should have been white. But I'm happy they had it at all and it looked so damn good.

Originally Posted by SuperFerret

Have you EVER been a kid?

Sure, I would've pissed my pants at that age if I saw a giant sand-monster explode, but at least half of that piss would be from the excitement of seeing something so "wicked cool".

I would have too. I was always in to monsters. I loved Predator, Aliens, Terminator (the skeletons), Jurassic Park, Gremlins and all sorts of stuff. I still do! I don't know why they never scared me.

Originally Posted by NewYorkSpider

The reporter should've been axed.

Agreed. If not cut, no accent please.

[Chris Wallace]

Originally Posted by LightningFlash

For kids to call a giant sand creature explode "wicked cool" is just unnecessary and weird.

Why should kids enjoy such a sight at such a young age?

Why wouldn't they? One minute the city's protector is getting his ass kicked, the next we see his backup arrive & bring fireworks with him.

[LightningFlash]

Ehh...

kinda pontless on my behalf to say my opinions and thoughts with people who wish they were related to Sam Raimi.

[Chris Wallace]

Okay-can you not do that? You came to this thread just to start some negativity. People like what they like. It doesn't make them sheep or whatever the hell you're trying to make Spidey fans out to be. You don't like to be accused of sucking up to Nolan, we don't like being accused of sucking up to Raimi.

[LightningFlash]

Lol.

[Chris Wallace]

And you've already gotten one warning on the other thread. Don't bring that bull**** over here.

[SP1D3RxV3N0M]

Originally Posted by SuperFerret

I don't think it took anything away from the fight, but that's just me.

It destroyed the fight's momentum IMO.

[SP1D3RxV3N0M]

Originally Posted by NewYorkSpider

The reporter should've been axed.

She should have been killed by Venom, symbiotes are very sensible to sounds...

[Jick09]

High frequency, actually.

[LightningFlash]

Originally Posted by Chris Wallace

And you've already gotten one warning on the other thread. Don't bring that bull**** over here.

It's not BS actually.

[SP1D3RxV3N0M]

Originally Posted by Jick09

High frequency, actually.

so?

[Jick09]

Originally Posted by SP1D3RxV3N0M

so?

It's different.
A high phone ring wouldn't hurt the symbiote or Eddie, nor would the noise the train does on the subway, for example.
But frequency waves, caused by the bell of the church or those poles hitting each other on the construction site actually hurt the symbiote. Know what I'm saying?

[Chris Wallace]

As evidenced by the fight between SPidey & Sandman in the subway.

[Jick09]

Exactly. It's is a perfect example.

[Papa Burgundy]

i hate this movie. underground fight rocks though.