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View Poll Results: Rate X-Men Origins: Wolverine
10 - Excellent 24 5.08%
9 29 6.14%
8 74 15.68%
7 97 20.55%
6 70 14.83%
5 67 14.19%
4 37 7.84%
3 20 4.24%
2 9 1.91%
1 - Poor 45 9.53%
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Old 05-19-2009, 02:18 PM   #1301
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

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Originally Posted by chaseter View Post
To me, Stryker was lying to Logan to get him back on his side.
Yeah, and it was all an illusion from Psylocke

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Old 05-19-2009, 02:38 PM   #1302
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

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Yeah, and it was all an illusion from Psylocke
Totally

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Old 05-19-2009, 04:02 PM   #1303
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

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Perhaps so, that is true.



Yes, although that scene where Sabretooth hits him with a tree branch in X1 always seems inconsisent as it knocks him out for what must be a few hours (the flight from Canada to New York), when a bullet only knocks him out for a few minutes in X2. Of course, he remains unconscious in X1 in order to have the drama and mystery of him waking up in the mansion and not knowing where he is or who brought him there.


Okay....but does his physical strength alter when he has adamantium? Would having adamantium allow him to break through restraints that he couldn't before?




That sounds fine, if they were to have gone down the route of a forced procedure.



Mind control could be an option, if they had involved Kayla or Jason.

But, on the other hand, Wolverine's volunteering for the process does tie in with the direct dialogue in X2. Even if Stryker was lying, he did say Wolverine had volunteered and that's what people seeing that scene will register.
They have portrayed his powers fairly inconsistent. As you said about him staying unconscious. And I agree that it does tie into the dialog, I just never liked the idea of him agreeing to it. I always liked the theme of the ultimate violation, where he was not only abducted and experimented on, but also violated in terms of his mind.

They wouldn't have even had to have Kayla to alter his mind, in the comics they had machines that could do it. They could have incorporated that. But hey, opportunity lost.
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Originally Posted by The Ace of Knaves
What comic is that from? Where DP tranqs him?
It's one of the early Wolverine normal title issues, before they restarted it. Somewhere from the 115 to 130ish range I think.

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Old 05-19-2009, 08:33 PM   #1304
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

The thing is, what Stryker did was sleazy. Kayla had been working for him the whole time (although she wound up falling for him), they set up this fake death to trick Logan into coming out of retirement and undergoing this procedure - and his plan was to erase his memory and keep him for whatever he planned after it was done. He was never going to send Logan off to hunt down Victor like he promised. Those were all lies.

The problem was - Brian Cox was much better at playing Stryker as a lying evil sleaze than Danny Huston was, so it wasn't nearly as convincing. I wish they had gotten him back to play Stryker in this movie, because I think he would have played him much more like the sinister character we saw in X2.

I think they really had to stay with the whole 'volunteer' thing here. That was such a moment for the audience not familiar with the comics (including me, I had never read them until after X2) that I think it would have confused too many people and it would have cheapened his decision to leave Stryker to die in X2. As it was, Wolverine was tricked into doing it, which is pretty bad too.

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Old 05-19-2009, 11:25 PM   #1305
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Yea I think it works much better that Stryker duped him into it.

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Old 05-20-2009, 11:10 AM   #1306
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

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The thing is, what Stryker did was sleazy. Kayla had been working for him the whole time (although she wound up falling for him), they set up this fake death to trick Logan into coming out of retirement and undergoing this procedure - and his plan was to erase his memory and keep him for whatever he planned after it was done. He was never going to send Logan off to hunt down Victor like he promised. Those were all lies.

The problem was - Brian Cox was much better at playing Stryker as a lying evil sleaze than Danny Huston was, so it wasn't nearly as convincing. I wish they had gotten him back to play Stryker in this movie, because I think he would have played him much more like the sinister character we saw in X2.

I think they really had to stay with the whole 'volunteer' thing here. That was such a moment for the audience not familiar with the comics (including me, I had never read them until after X2) that I think it would have confused too many people and it would have cheapened his decision to leave Stryker to die in X2. As it was, Wolverine was tricked into doing it, which is pretty bad too.
So if Kayla worked for Stryker the whole time, does that mean she also knew about her sister, languishing in prison for those six years?

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Old 05-20-2009, 11:11 AM   #1307
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Yea she did, that is the whole reason she worked for Stryker. But how do you know Emma was held captive for 6 years? It never mentions that.

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Old 05-20-2009, 12:41 PM   #1308
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

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Yea she did, that is the whole reason she worked for Stryker. But how do you know Emma was held captive for 6 years? It never mentions that.
I still think that Kayla and Logan met under legitimate circumstances, and when Stryker came back into the picture, he behind the scenes blackmailed Kayla by informing her that he had kidnapped her sister, so she had to play along when Creed came a knocking.

I don't think that Kayla was going along with this the whole time.

Although even if she was, it still isn't necessary that she and Logan had been together for the entire 6 years. I doubt that Logan and Kayla met the moment he walked away from Team X.

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Old 05-20-2009, 12:54 PM   #1309
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

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So if Kayla worked for Stryker the whole time, does that mean she also knew about her sister, languishing in prison for those six years?
It was never stated in the movie that he had her sister for 6 years. For all we know, it had just happened and she found out about it when Victor showed up.

She didn't seem surprised at all to see him - and the blood they used when they faked her death was probably her own. She could have given it before she left to be with Logan so they'd have if they ever needed to fake her death. That way it's her own blood Logan smelled when he found her and it fooled him into thinking she was dead.

I think she was working for Stryker the whole time. Logan was too valuable for Stryker to just let walk away, especially once he'd discovered the adamantium, so he sent Kayla as a sort of spy so he'd always know where to find him. He also knew what 'killing' her would do to Logan, so that fit into his plan too. She just wound up falling for him, which was not in the plan.

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Old 05-20-2009, 02:26 PM   #1310
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

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It was never stated in the movie that he had her sister for 6 years. For all we know, it had just happened and she found out about it when Victor showed up.

She didn't seem surprised at all to see him - and the blood they used when they faked her death was probably her own. She could have given it before she left to be with Logan so they'd have if they ever needed to fake her death. That way it's her own blood Logan smelled when he found her and it fooled him into thinking she was dead.

I think she was working for Stryker the whole time. Logan was too valuable for Stryker to just let walk away, especially once he'd discovered the adamantium, so he sent Kayla as a sort of spy so he'd always know where to find him. He also knew what 'killing' her would do to Logan, so that fit into his plan too. She just wound up falling for him, which was not in the plan.
This is what I got out of the movie as well.

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Old 05-20-2009, 06:47 PM   #1311
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

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Yea I think it works much better that Stryker duped him into it.
Ehh, it only really works better continuity wise.

Most of the general audience won't remember the specifics of X2, it came out 6 years ago.

And I think it's a much stronger, and more potent theme of violation to have Logan be captured and forcefully experimented on. It makes it all the more horrendous to see that not only is he tortured physically and mentally. They try to break him down, take away all his humanity, and turn him into a mindless killer. Essentially, exactly what he's afraid of becoming. An animalistic killer.

It ties in with the theme of "animal vs. man" better as well. And I think it would have made it all the more interesting if you found out that Victor was helping Weapon X with the torture, since all he really wants is for Wolverine to become like him. Overall, I think it would have been a much stronger narrative.

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Old 05-20-2009, 10:09 PM   #1312
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

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Ehh, it only really works better continuity wise.

Most of the general audience won't remember the specifics of X2, it came out 6 years ago.
i don't think the average fan is that slow. + they could just re-watch x2 and than they would realize something was wrong.

it's really not that hard to believe that the average movie goer remembers what happened in previes chapters in a movie series. I think it's only a few that know allmost nothing about these movies, and would be easily confused.

like there was this 1 guy who thought that deadpool and night crawler was the same guy, because they could both teleport.:facepalm
i doubt any1 else made that mistake.

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Old 05-21-2009, 07:13 AM   #1313
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

Finally saw it 6/10, pretty damn average considering they had a great story to work from, another let down.

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Old 05-21-2009, 07:25 AM   #1314
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

I have a friend who I consider quite intelligent, and has a wonderful passion for movies. As far as I know, she haven't read an X-Men comic ever. She used the word "violation" when describing the Weapon X procedure in the movie...

I thought it was an interesting choice of word, since many here felt it needed more violation


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Old 05-21-2009, 09:26 AM   #1315
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

When I saw it opening night, it seemed like half our audience was turning away just at the sight of the needles coming down. I still think it should have been matched up the X2 flashbacks a little more, but I think it was definitely effective for plenty of people just as it was.

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Old 05-21-2009, 09:32 AM   #1316
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

Having needles pouring hot metal inside your bones IS ghastly, but the scene bothered me not just because of it's inconsistency with established canon, but because it was badly written and badly directed.

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Old 05-21-2009, 09:33 AM   #1317
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Why would people turn away from something so squeaky clean?

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Old 05-21-2009, 09:38 AM   #1318
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Why would people turn away from something so squeaky clean?
I can watch the most ghastly eye-gouging scenes of any italian zombie horror movie, but I ALWAYS cringe during any needle-in-the-arm scene from any drug-related or medical movie.

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Old 05-21-2009, 09:46 AM   #1319
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I get horny!

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Old 05-21-2009, 10:13 AM   #1320
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

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I can watch the most ghastly eye-gouging scenes of any italian zombie horror movie, but I ALWAYS cringe during any needle-in-the-arm scene from any drug-related or medical movie.
Show them a bunch of needles, it will get most of the audience most of the time.

One of my friends wants to see the movie this weekend, I know she's going to be practically hiding under the chair for that scene.

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Old 05-21-2009, 11:17 AM   #1321
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Huh....see me? I would've made that scene disturbing as hell. Blood, screams, close ups. Hell, maybe even a in body shot. Just to get the whole idea of this guy getting pumped with hot metal.

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Old 05-21-2009, 01:04 PM   #1322
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

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I can watch the most ghastly eye-gouging scenes of any italian zombie horror movie, but I ALWAYS cringe during any needle-in-the-arm scene from any drug-related or medical movie.
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I get horny!
You guys're funny.

I am going with my friend tonight to see this for the third time. It' sher first time seeing it and she doesn't know a lot about the X-men beyond having seen all the movies so I am curious what she will think of it. She wants to see Gambit.

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Old 05-21-2009, 01:08 PM   #1323
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

My dad took one of his friends to see it last night (he saw it with me on opening night). His friend loved it - he especially liked Gambit. They stayed through the credits and saw the Deadpool ending, which my dad hadn't seen the first time. He told me the guy cleaning up the theater told him that scene freaks him out every time he sees it.

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Old 05-21-2009, 01:16 PM   #1324
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

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He told me the guy cleaning up the theater told him that scene freaks him out every time he sees it.
lol, that's funny!

I haven't seen that on the big screen yet

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Old 05-21-2009, 01:17 PM   #1325
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Default Re: Rate and Review X-Men Origins: Wolverine!

Your dad must be awesome. My dad hates going to movies.

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