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View Poll Results: Superman as a Christ Figure?
Yes 13 28.89%
No 32 71.11%
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Old 07-06-2009, 02:59 PM   #26
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

To an extent the Christ/savior parallels are inevitable. I would rather the movie be subtle about it and let the audience make the connection for themselves.

I do like the idea of people trying to worship Superman when they first see him. A religion based around this all-powerful alien probably would spring up in real life.

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Old 07-06-2009, 03:17 PM   #27
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

I don't mind the Christ parallels as long as its more like Willem Dafoe Christ.

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Old 07-06-2009, 03:31 PM   #28
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

Always find it funny how supes is seen as a christ fig when he was created by a jewish person and jesus is seen as a christian even when he was jewish.

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Old 07-06-2009, 03:37 PM   #29
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

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Originally Posted by Doomed_hero View Post
jesus is seen as a christian even when he was jewish.
This statement completely perplexes me.

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Old 07-06-2009, 05:04 PM   #30
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

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Originally Posted by Lighthouse View Post
I don't mind the Christ parallels as long as its more like Willem Dafoe Christ.
Tell me your kidding right?

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Old 07-06-2009, 05:06 PM   #31
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

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Originally Posted by RachelDawes View Post
To an extent the Christ/savior parallels are inevitable. I would rather the movie be subtle about it and let the audience make the connection for themselves.

I do like the idea of people trying to worship Superman when they first see him. A religion based around this all-powerful alien probably would spring up in real life.
It would **** you see a guy like Superman in reall ife you start to question is he Jesus or the second coming a new messiah. But do not go Superman Returns route with him being Christ like. But it be cool and good.

Have Superman deal with being a Christ like symbol to the human race.

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Old 07-06-2009, 05:36 PM   #32
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

Every time this comes up, people assume that "Christ Figure" means that the character IS Christ. I have no idea where that comes from. It's just a literary paralell, like the "Alice in Wonderland" elements in THE MATRIX.

If you want to portray Superman faithfully, then he is a Christ Figure any way you slice it. The paralells are inherent in his character. Especially if you want to portray the mythology faithfully, where he dies and comes back to life.

People, there's just no way to get beyond the "God"/savior idea if you're doing Superman properly. Even if he doesn't want to be, he is a savior. The idea that he could be, but doesn't want to be for a multiple of reasons, mankind's savior is compelling, and should be explored.

Now, he need not be a blatant Christ Figure, as he was in SUPERMAN RETURNS (although a lot of people didn't even get the connection until it was pointed out to them).

I actually thought Singer handled it pretty well, in a traditional fashion.

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Old 07-06-2009, 07:14 PM   #33
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

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Originally Posted by The Guard View Post
People, there's just no way to get beyond the "God"/savior idea if you're doing Superman properly. Even if he doesn't want to be, he is a savior. The idea that he could be, but doesn't want to be for a multiple of reasons, mankind's savior is compelling, and should be explored.
That's why I said I wouldn't mind if it was Dafoe's Christ. Last Temptation explores a similar theme.

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Old 07-06-2009, 07:24 PM   #34
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

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Originally Posted by The Guard View Post
Every time this comes up, people assume that "Christ Figure" means that the character IS Christ. I have no idea where that comes from. It's just a literary paralell, like the "Alice in Wonderland" elements in THE MATRIX.

If you want to portray Superman faithfully, then he is a Christ Figure any way you slice it. The paralells are inherent in his character. Especially if you want to portray the mythology faithfully, where he dies and comes back to life.

People, there's just no way to get beyond the "God"/savior idea if you're doing Superman properly. Even if he doesn't want to be, he is a savior. The idea that he could be, but doesn't want to be for a multiple of reasons, mankind's savior is compelling, and should be explored.

Now, he need not be a blatant Christ Figure, as he was in SUPERMAN RETURNS (although a lot of people didn't even get the connection until it was pointed out to them).

I actually thought Singer handled it pretty well, in a traditional fashion.
I think you nailed this one (no pun intended)

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Old 07-07-2009, 07:48 AM   #35
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

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Originally Posted by The Guard View Post
Every time this comes up, people assume that "Christ Figure" means that the character IS Christ. I have no idea where that comes from. It's just a literary paralell, like the "Alice in Wonderland" elements in THE MATRIX.

If you want to portray Superman faithfully, then he is a Christ Figure any way you slice it. The paralells are inherent in his character. Especially if you want to portray the mythology faithfully, where he dies and comes back to life.

People, there's just no way to get beyond the "God"/savior idea if you're doing Superman properly. Even if he doesn't want to be, he is a savior. The idea that he could be, but doesn't want to be for a multiple of reasons, mankind's savior is compelling, and should be explored.

Now, he need not be a blatant Christ Figure, as he was in SUPERMAN RETURNS (although a lot of people didn't even get the connection until it was pointed out to them).

I actually thought Singer handled it pretty well, in a traditional fashion.
Matter of opinion and I completely disagree.
I am an advocate of the portrayal of Superman in the 50's TV series, for myself that "did" Superman properly, and there is absolutely no way Superman is a Christ Figure in that run.

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Old 07-07-2009, 08:24 AM   #36
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

Like I said, some nutt jobs would worship him regardless of what he does, but I would prefer it not be in your face like it was with SR. I think we get the comparisons without them having to be shown, no need to beat us over the head with it.

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Old 07-07-2009, 09:04 AM   #37
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

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Now can someone please explain how this is rife with comparisons to the life of Jesus Christ.
He was designed by two Jewish creators as a Messiah-like figure. Superhuman, benevolent, child of a "heavenly" father, absolutely beyond reproach, designed with the same prophecies in mind.

It has nothing to do with his methodology or the events of his life, it has to do with his premise and mission, which has always been messianic. There are a lot of characters who take up christ-like themes, it is, as someone pointed out, the ultimate story, but Superman is designed around it.

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Old 07-07-2009, 09:51 AM   #38
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

On a side note they're rebooting Blade, BLADE for goodness sakes, a 3rd tier character.

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Old 07-07-2009, 10:18 AM   #39
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

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Originally Posted by GL1 View Post
He was designed by two Jewish creators as a Messiah-like figure. Superhuman, benevolent, child of a "heavenly" father, absolutely beyond reproach, designed with the same prophecies in mind.

It has nothing to do with his methodology or the events of his life, it has to do with his premise and mission, which has always been messianic. There are a lot of characters who take up christ-like themes, it is, as someone pointed out, the ultimate story, but Superman is designed around it.
Have you actually read the Siegel, Shuster strips? Exactly why is that incarnation a messiah!!?? He is super-human to be sure but he is anything but benevolent. Child of a "heavenly" father is a fanciful stretch at best.

Sorry, still waiting..........

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Old 07-07-2009, 10:40 AM   #40
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

Some of you have got to get over this "Siegel and Shuster created him as this or that" crutch. Superman couldn't fly when he was first created. Clark Kent was JUST a disguise, not much was known about the Kents or Krypton, and Lois, Jimmy and Perry were 2 dimensional characters at best. The mythos has grown far, far beyond this. Superman is no longer just a Moses allegory, he is both a Moses allegory and a Christ Figure. He's become much, much more than he started out as, and a film adaption should respect that.

I don't think he's a messiah by definition, because he's usually not prophecied. I would, however, like to see the idea that some of Earth THINK he is a messiah explored. But he IS a savior on a grand scale.

"a person who rescues you from harm or danger"

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Old 07-07-2009, 12:48 PM   #41
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

I am not hung up on Siegel and Shuster's original vision. I was responding to a post that stated they designed a messiah-like character.

By definition a firefighter may be a savior; does that then also qualify them as "Christ Figures". You need more than rescues to make the connection.

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Old 07-07-2009, 02:38 PM   #42
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

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I am not hung up on Siegel and Shuster's original vision. I was responding to a post that stated they designed a messiah-like character.

By definition a firefighter may be a savior; does that then also qualify them as "Christ Figures". You need more than rescues to make the connection.
I speak from experience on this, I AM a firefighter, and the answer is no.

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Old 07-07-2009, 02:41 PM   #43
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

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This statement completely perplexes me.
Why, Jesus didn't think of himself as a christian. He saw himself as Jewish. It was a mission to reform judism for him, not start a whole new reilgion

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Old 07-07-2009, 03:46 PM   #44
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

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Have you actually read the Siegel, Shuster strips? Exactly why is that incarnation a messiah!!?? He is super-human to be sure but he is anything but benevolent. Child of a "heavenly" father is a fanciful stretch at best.

Sorry, still waiting..........
Benevolent was my insertion, scratch that.

Regardless, I'm just pointing out the similarities in theme and origin. If you demand explicit proof of subtext, then clearly you are at an advantage.

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Old 07-08-2009, 02:07 PM   #45
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Superman is neither Moses or Jesus and should not be that way. People should look at Superman as a symbol of hope and peace. Not a messiah or a second coming or Jesus or Moses. But as a symbol of hope and peace.

Besides Superman not even a religious person so how can he qualify of all that stuff anyways. Jesus and Moses were religious people. Superman not. He does not talk in religious nature like Jesus and Moses did.

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Old 07-08-2009, 04:54 PM   #46
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

I can't help but throw my hand in here... I've beaten this horse to a pulp over the years, but whatever, here's my conclusion, take it for what its two cents worth:

Superman certainly wasn't created to be analogous to the story of Jesus. He is though, inevitably a generic messianic figure. But he is also Moses... he's Hercules... he's Flash Gordon... he's just one more rather generic mythological god in the historical pantheon of fantasy characters. The only times issues arise though, are when those parallels become overt and blatant. Jesus himself is a figure not without controversy, especially to observant Jews. When you see Superman dying then coming back to life, or assuming crucifixion poses after sacrificing himself for humanity, then you're well on your way to turning Superman into something which should otherwise remain as secular and universally appealing as possible. There are plenty of ways to make Superman interesting, heroic, and contemporary without turning him into a figure that quite frankly not everyone is inspired by.

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Old 07-08-2009, 06:41 PM   #47
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I can't help but throw my hand in here... I've beaten this horse to a pulp over the years, but whatever, here's my conclusion, take it for what its two cents worth:

Superman certainly wasn't created to be analogous to the story of Jesus. He is though, inevitably a generic messianic figure. But he is also Moses... he's Hercules... he's Flash Gordon... he's just one more rather generic mythological god in the historical pantheon of fantasy characters. The only times issues arise though, are when those parallels become overt and blatant. Jesus himself is a figure not without controversy, especially to observant Jews. When you see Superman dying then coming back to life, or assuming crucifixion poses after sacrificing himself for humanity, then you're well on your way to turning Superman into something which should otherwise remain as secular and universally appealing as possible. There are plenty of ways to make Superman interesting, heroic, and contemporary without turning him into a figure that quite frankly not everyone is inspired by.
You can be inspired by Jesus but its hard especially since the man perfect. Not even Superman perfect he makesm istakes. But lol how is Superman Flash Gordon? And why people keep saying Moses how was he a messiah? He was a follower of Jesus i know but how was he a messiah?

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Old 07-08-2009, 06:54 PM   #48
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Read up on Moses. A simple 5 minute search should be all you need.

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Old 07-08-2009, 07:49 PM   #49
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

Quote:
I can't help but throw my hand in here... I've beaten this horse to a pulp over the years, but whatever, here's my conclusion, take it for what its two cents worth:

Superman certainly wasn't created to be analogous to the story of Jesus. He is though, inevitably a generic messianic figure. But he is also Moses... he's Hercules... he's Flash Gordon... he's just one more rather generic mythological god in the historical pantheon of fantasy characters. The only times issues arise though, are when those parallels become overt and blatant. Jesus himself is a figure not without controversy, especially to observant Jews. When you see Superman dying then coming back to life, or assuming crucifixion poses after sacrificing himself for humanity, then you're well on your way to turning Superman into something which should otherwise remain as secular and universally appealing as possible. There are plenty of ways to make Superman interesting, heroic, and contemporary without turning him into a figure that quite frankly not everyone is inspired by.
Sure, Superman has a lot of inspirations. That's a good point, and one is arguing that.

No one said he was only a Christ Figure. But he is a Christ Figure. By literary standards, there's just no way around it.

I think when you say "Well on your way to turning Superman into something which should otherwise remain as secular and universally appealing as possible", that's a bit much. How does dying and coming back to life make him less secular or universally appealing? How does assuming a relatively subtle pose that has come to mean sacrifice suddenly make him less secular, or into a Christian teaching tool, or any of that?

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Old 07-09-2009, 02:42 AM   #50
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Default Re: Superman as a Christ figure?

I don't mind Superman being a Christ-figure, but only as long as they don't get too heavy handed with it. He does have some intrinsically Christ-like qualities, however he's still a man, and I personally think Superman is at his best when we get to see how he is grounded by human nature in addition to having great powers. He's not perfect, but he's still trying his darnedest to give the people something good to look up to.

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