Dragonball HQ

[SymbioticToxin]

Buu wasn't entirely bad, I just didn't care for the length and the fact that only the saiyans could do anything. Everyone else took a backseat to death.

[gkokujin]

okay i had only seen PARTS of DBGT, and i loved what i had seen.

now that they are airing the series, i TOTALLY understand why people hated this.
its non stop cornball/silly stuff.

I'll tune back in when they get to the end when goku fights the dragons.

[Liam_H]

Originally Posted by SymbioticToxin

Buu wasn't entirely bad, I just didn't care for the length and the fact that only the saiyans could do anything. Everyone else took a backseat to death.

That's a product of making the Saiyans too powerful. Everyone else would have been pointless to be fighting unless some other plot device was introduced.

[craigdbfan]

The entire Super Saiyan aspect is to blame for that. Sure it's awesome but it rendered every character that wasn't a Saiyan or Saiyan/Human hybrid useless.

Piccolo became a freaking comic relief babysitter by the Buu saga...

[Mr. Wooden Alligator]

They could've done an arc where characters like Yamcha (desert bandit king was much more intriguing than what he was turned into in DBZ) and Tien are given the option of training to gain a power up to near SSJ levels so that they could have an active role. The catch could be that the training could cost them some of their humanity or a big sacrifice on their part.

[Liam_H]

Dragonball Z had some great visuals in regards to Saiyans but this is why Dragonball has always been superior overall.

It certainly could've been analogous to some type of Kaio-Ken where too much use will kill them.

[Mr. Wooden Alligator]

No...the problem there is that it is temporary. I was thinking something more in line with Elric and Stormbringer. Elric is a weak, deficient individual on his own. Stormbringer grants him a high of sorts and empowers him. The cost? Whoever Elric kills with Stormbringer isn't just used as a sort of power-boost for Elric. Their soul is condemed to Hell as a plaything for the Dukes of Hell and the Chaos Lords. Plus using the blade gave the Dukes of Hell a stronger grip on the mortal plane, eventually leading to an end-of-the-world scenario.

Now, I'm not saying they need something like that...but something with the same heavy and possibly unfortunate implications that provides a permanent power-up that would let all the Z-Fighters stay near on-par with the Super Saiyans.

I think Dead Zone is my favorite of the movies for a couple of reasons. One, I remember that blue minion pulling those swords out of his flesh and that was awesome. Two, Garlic Jr. was the only villain to actually attain immortality.

World's Strongest should've been the first of the DBZ movies, I think. It feels a bit more like Dragonball than does Dead Zone and would be a better transition into the DBZ tone.

[Parker Wayne]

Originally Posted by Lord

While DBZ is cooler i must say that most of the times Dragon Ball has more story, i think that while i enjoy Cell and Buu's arcs after Freeza they already did it all.
Goku had become stronger and by dragon ball z his fight with freeza even destroyed a planet, i think that could have actually been a great finale

Originally Posted by Soapy

To me the Frieza saga feels like the natural end point of the series. Having said that, I can "accept" the Cell saga because so much of it is so awesome (logical inconsistencies aside), but the Buu saga is just...ugh. No thank you.

Freiza was the original finale of DBZ. Goku was supposed to turn SSJ (and be the only one who could do that) and die on Namek, leaving the earth in the other's hands.

But the series was so popular in Japan that Toriyama continued with it.

[SymbioticToxin]

Wasn't he forced to do it? I think I heard he was supposed to, for both the manga and animes sake.

[craigdbfan]

Yeah, Toei/Shueisha forced him to keep going because the demand and financial returns were just far too high for them to stop. Apparently the editor was really strict at times with him while other reports say he wasn't.

While the intended ending is still debated to this day there's a really in depth article about it over at daziex. It's a pretty good read if you're interested in this. Intended ending?

[Alchemyst]

Originally Posted by craigdbfan

Yeah, Toei/Shueisha forced him to keep going because the demand and financial returns were just far too high for them to stop. Apparently the editor was really strict at times with him while other reports say he wasn't.

While the intended ending is still debated to this day there's a really in depth article about it over at daziex. It's a pretty good read if you're interested in this. Intended ending?

that was an interesting read, especially the part about the Saiyan saga and how Toriyama did not think of Freeza until later on, causing a few inconsistencies in character back stories. Crazy

[craigdbfan]

Yeah a lot of it was on the fly it would seem. I think only Oda and Kishimoto in recent years have had a rough outline of what they wanted since the beginning. Tite Kubo on the other hand has followed the path/groundwork that Toriyama left and that is basically writing these stories as they go.

I know for a fact Toei created Bardock to add some padding and explaining and Toriyama liked it so much that he made him canon and gave him 2 or 3 panels in the manga.

Really interesting stuff indeed.

[SpideyForPrez]

My apologies if this is a question that gets asked a lot, but what's the deal with these new DBZ movies?

I know there were rumors of something called Dragonball Hoshi that turned out to be fake but I just came across "Yo! Son Goku and his Friends Return" and this new Bardock movie on Youtube.

Are these new movies any good? It's been years since I watched any Dragonball and if the movies/specials are any good I'll take some time to watch them. But if they're anything like GT then I probably won't be interested.

Thanks.

[craigdbfan]

They're different. Hard to explain but the nonsensical aspect is pretty damn high for "Yo!" especially.

If you have some time to kill I'd say go for it.

[SpideyForPrez]

Thanks. I figured I'd watch them no matter what but was just curious about what I might be in for. Expectations will be kept to a minimum.

[Oberon sexton]

Ok so I was just thinking about a totally random moment from DBZ history: when Videl "appeared" to have killed Spopovich.......was there going to be any legal action ? Haha I mean she did just kill a man on national television, you'd think that they'd be hauling her away haha

[Liam_H]

Are you referring to during the tournament? Because I believe killing is allowed unless they had changed the rules.

[Oberon sexton]

never realized that ! Haha what a bloodsport

[craigdbfan]

Killing isn't allowed in the Tenkaichi Budokai you're immediately disqualified. The only tournament where killing was perfectly fine was the Cell Games.

[Oberon sexton]

Best damn event in this dimension

[craigdbfan]

Agreed.

[SymbioticToxin]

Originally Posted by craigdbfan

Killing isn't allowed in the Tenkaichi Budokai you're immediately disqualified. The only tournament where killing was perfectly fine was the Cell Games.

Well to be fair, the people who did kill weren't disqualified sometimes, namely Piccolo. Understandable, since they're so frickin' scary.

[MarvelKnight]

I would have been happy with the series ending after Frieza, but I was happy with the Cell saga.

After Cell Games, it was good, but just wasn't as good as Frieza or Cell. Frieza/Goku and Cell/Gohan were some of the best fights in animation ever.

[Oberon sexton]

So yeah after much debate and soul searching I've come to the conclusion that Perfect Cell is the greatest of DBZ villains, and possibly one of the greatest Anime villains of all time.

[craigdbfan]

You know upon reevaluating and watching some of the Cell saga again I agree. Cell made for the most physically and mentally difficult enemy to face. The culmination seemed perfect and fitting.

Gohan's hidden potential seen from the first episodes of DBZ were finally put to the test and facing Cell who was basically every formidable fighter the Z warriors have either befriended or destroyed in the past made it that much more difficult.

This scene still stands as one of the most memorable and just awe inspiring moments from the Cell saga. The scream he does which also combines the Oozaru scream shows that he's finally reached a form that takes on the most inner rage and power from a Saiyan but is still balanced out by his kind and humble human upbringing.

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