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Old 08-25-2009, 01:40 AM   #1
JackMercy
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Default The Fortress of Solitude

OK folks...

The potential for a new Superman film in the...future.

A reinterpretation of the mythology on film by an as-yet-undetermined filmmaker and the studio.

The Fortress of Solitude -- the visual and narrative aesthetic.

How would you like to see it portrayed?

Do you like caves?

Do you like crystals?

Do you like the Arctic?

What about a...space pocket or...interspace, or...inner space?

What if there were no crystals whatsoever?

Should there be alien species contained within?

Should there be computers?

Eradicator? No?

How would you like to see the Fortress integrated narratively?

Give me your best thoughts! (real and fictional, historical and mythological, potential tie-in knowledge appreciated!)



(I've seen a little bit of this discussion going on in the "Source material" thread, but Show approved me starting a separate topic here.)

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Old 08-25-2009, 01:46 AM   #2
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

Nice idea for thread. For me i would like to keep in in the artic, it doesnt have to be crystal look like donner/some comics/smallville decided to go with. Only thing i would like to see still used is crystals being a storage unit for vast amounts of information. Then if he gets the fos in first film during second/third films fill it up with cool items and all that.

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Old 08-25-2009, 01:57 AM   #3
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

I don't want it to have anything to do with Krypton. I don't want it to build itself out of a crystal shard. I wouldn't even want it in the first movie. Superman can build it himself in the second one when he feels the need to get away for a while.

I am personally sick of the crystal fortress iconography. I want Superman to live in Metropolis. I would rather see his apartment or farmhouse ala Lois and Clark than have him run off to the arctic every 10 minutes.

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Old 08-25-2009, 02:00 AM   #4
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

No Crystals, etc.

I was thinking maybe what looks like just a huge cave in a glacier or what have you. Empty, until Superman enters. Then...if there's advanced technology to be incorporated, we see it as holographic panels/displays/etc. Maybe something akin to the virtual Zion control towers in Matrix but not all white and sterile. Colored panels and stuff, angled outwards and arranged in semi-circular layouts in front of him. Probably have to connect that with the technology on Krypton when you show that part of the story. I guess the FOS's technology will be determined by what the newer movie version of Krypton will be. I was hoping that Krypton would be a vibrant civilization that;s futuristic, but not as stoic and sterile as it was in Donner's movies. More majestic, with an emphasis on sculpture and more organic shapes/architecture. Whereas the technology takes up very little 'space', if you will. No physical supercomputers or big power generators, etc. It shows up as holographic interfaces when needed, then is out of the way when not. Just how it works isn't as important.

So maybe over time, the FOS can evolve into something that reflects that. What starts out as an ice cave or what have you will start to take on more of that majestic, sculpted look....maybe Supes carves out the space to look more like that. Be nice to have an entrance that only he can use, for once. Then perhaps a big sheet of transparent ice way up top that lets sunlight in.

As for narratively....I dunno. A place of meditation, of study, learning about his home planet's civilization. I'd like it to eventually be the key to Braniac's arrival on Earth, as if Braniac was an AI-based entity tied to Krypton somehow, then hitched a ride on Baby Kal-El's ship....incubating all those years until Clark discovered who/what he is and decided to build the FOS.

Something like that.

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)

Last edited by KalMart; 08-25-2009 at 02:04 AM.
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Old 08-25-2009, 02:22 AM   #5
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

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Originally Posted by KalMart View Post
A place of meditation, of study,
That's all I'd want it to be.

I am sick of the over reliance of Krypton in Superman's life. I would like to get back to the old school Fleischer concept: he's a guy with super powers who defends the city. Focus on that, and throw in a subplot with Clark and Lois as investigative reporters uncovering a mystery and BAM - there's your movie.

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Old 08-25-2009, 02:27 AM   #6
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

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Originally Posted by sithgoblin View Post
That's all I'd want it to be.

I am sick of the over reliance of Krypton in Superman's life. I would like to get back to the old school Fleischer concept: he's a guy with super powers who defends the city. Focus on that, and throw in a subplot with Clark and Lois as investigative reporters uncovering a mystery and BAM - there's your movie.
Yeah that's why'd I'd want to keep Krypton to one storyline...preferably a second film paralleled with the current storyline just to broaden the scope of something like Braniac. No 'weekly talks with dad', etc. We only see Jor-El on Krypton, not a constant presence. His ship may have carried some things over, but Superman finds things out on his own and realizes what he should become on his own, whereas his parents just hoped he'd at least survive.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt
Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)

Last edited by KalMart; 08-25-2009 at 02:54 AM.
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Old 08-25-2009, 02:39 AM   #7
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

That could work, and say if brainiac is tied to krypton and other worlds when he is destroyed superman takes some information/knowledge of the universe from him to keep stored at the fos and this could lead to run ins with maxima/lobo/mongul/darkseid/etc...... in the future.

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Old 08-25-2009, 03:02 AM   #8
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

The FOS should be where Supes keeps the bottled city of Kandor......on a shelf....next to a vase and some books.


He feeds'em fish food once a day.....and taps on the glass if they start to get raucous. He also keeps a little net handy for when one of them dies....floating belly-up, high in the bottled airspace.

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 08-25-2009, 03:19 AM   #9
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

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Yeah that's why'd I'd want to keep Krypton to one storyline...preferably a second film paralleled with the current storyline just to broaden the scope of something like Braniac. No 'weekly talks with dad', etc. We only see Jor-El on Krypton, not a constant presence. His ship may have carried some things over, but Superman finds things out on his own and realizes what he should become on his own, whereas his parents just hoped he'd at least survive.
We're on the same wavelength. I hate the idea that Jor-El planned for Clark to become Superman and instructed him on what to do with his life. I thought Birthright was hit and miss, but I loved how it showed Clark exploring the world and deciding for himself that it needed his help.

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Old 08-25-2009, 04:29 AM   #10
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

IMO the crystal-based Fortress of Solitude should be one thing that's carried over from the past. I Loved how it looked in SR. I think that sequence was one of the more successful moments in that movie. Not to be contrary to this thread's current pattern, but I really do just like how it looks in the most recent film and it makes sense to me given that it's set in the Arctic.

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Old 08-25-2009, 07:47 AM   #11
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

I agree with you I hate this too. But that was the idea in J.Byrne serie too, wasn't it ?

I like pretty much the crystal fortress, cold and beautiful, I like this idea but I would like the interior more like in the Donner-verse, with several rooms with different things in there. I'm mot pro-crystals but I'm not against it either. what bother me it that, for now all we got was crystals for information. there could be a phantom zone projector and work with a crystal for example, this kind of things. I do not care very much about the inside as long as it is quiet and silenced. A place to think. For the exterior design, I like the crystal exterior.

I want to add that if Superman franchise was like James Bond franchise, a continuing saga instead of reboots, the fortress could contain several objects, slowly, instead of having everything in one movie or one trilogy.
Good thread JackMercy.

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Old 08-25-2009, 09:02 AM   #12
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

We don't need the fortress in the first film, but I would like to see it hinted at.
What I mean is it would start out as a place in the Arctic (either an existing hole inside a glacier or something he creates) where he hides something. Perhaps he needs to move the ship so no one finds it or something.

Then I would do something similar to the Byrne era where some Kryptonian artifact creates "a fortress." It doesn't have to be the Eradicator, but something similar. Perhaps Jor-El and Lara included a way for Kal-El to create a shelter if he needed it, but it was damaged in the landing and all of a sudden malfunctions and goes off in the Arctic or something. Anyway, Clark needs to hide this giant building and buries it under the ice, as in the Byrne era. From the outside, you'd basically have the ice cliff from the Silver Age, and inside you'd have the Byrne Fortress. I'd use crystals as part of Kryptonian tech, because I like the idea, and as a nod to the previous films/current comics. As time goes on, Clark fills it with various artifacts and "souvenirs" from his adventures. No "all knowing" Jor-El involved, but I think he would have some knowledge of Krypton via the Fortress and perhaps other artifacts his parents sent with him to teach him a bit about his homeworld.

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Old 08-25-2009, 09:07 AM   #13
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

No crystals this time. I'd still like him to build it in the artic tho. Have him build a HUGE cave in the side of a mountain, then make it look all high tech on the inside.

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Old 08-25-2009, 09:21 AM   #14
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

I don't want to see it til the end of the movie, or the begining of the sequel to this movie.

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Old 08-25-2009, 09:24 AM   #15
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

I'd probably take a lot of influence from the "Superman: Doomsday" version of the Fortress:




Complete with the interplanetary zoo a la S:TAS...


A few other things:
* The door and key from "All-Star Superman".
* Only one robot - Kelex. Maybe with a metallized on his chest.

* Phantom Zone projector? Maybe. But again, I wouldn't want any Kryptonians in there unless they're from a parallel universe or something and Kal-El puts them in there (since in the comics of the '50s it was suggested that Kryptonian criminals were usually put into suspended animation and launched into space in capsules, I'd probably say that the capsules were usually kept in orbit, and every last one was annihilated in Krypton's explosion).

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Old 08-25-2009, 07:32 PM   #16
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

I think the FOS should be completely eradicted from the Superman mythos, especially in a more realistic, darker tone re-boot that the new movie will most likely take, ala Batman Begins. Any Superman comic I liked, had nothing to do with the FOS. In this day in age, there would be no way in hell that the FOS would not be detected, even if it was in the deep arctic. Idk it's just my opinion but everytime he goes into the FOS it just gets a little more lame.

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Old 08-25-2009, 07:54 PM   #17
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

Easy to detect.....like the Batcave, which is maybe a ten minute drive out of Gotham?

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 08-25-2009, 11:32 PM   #18
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

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I think the FOS should be completely eradicted from the Superman mythos, especially in a more realistic, darker tone re-boot that the new movie will most likely take, ala Batman Begins. Any Superman comic I liked, had nothing to do with the FOS. In this day in age, there would be no way in hell that the FOS would not be detected, even if it was in the deep arctic. Idk it's just my opinion but everytime he goes into the FOS it just gets a little more lame.
You think that the total accumulation of all literature and scientific fact from dozens of other worlds, spanning the 28 known galaxies cannot hide the Fortress?

Now to you Mr. Donner, Mr. Mankeweicz, Mr. Puzo and Mr. & Mrs. Newman, do you really think that the total accumulation of all literature and scientific fact from dozens of other worlds, spanning the 28 known galaxies cannot create a door that would prevent Lex from getting in??!!!!

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Old 08-25-2009, 11:40 PM   #19
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

Totally the next fos should only be accessible only to kryptonians and if kalel brings someone in with him like lois or some other character.

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Old 08-25-2009, 11:43 PM   #20
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

Agreed. That has always been my main problem with the film (and Smallville) versions of the Fortress. Also what is with SR and Smallville making the damn thing all open so that the snow, etc can get in. In the first film it is completely solid, and apparently heated, either intentionally or because the crystals are warm by nature/function.

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Old 08-25-2009, 11:45 PM   #21
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

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Originally Posted by Kal-El Fan View Post
You think that the total accumulation of all literature and scientific fact from dozens of other worlds, spanning the 28 known galaxies cannot hide the Fortress?

Now to you Mr. Donner, Mr. Mankeweicz, Mr. Puzo and Mr. & Mrs. Newman, do you really think that the total accumulation of all literature and scientific fact from dozens of other worlds, spanning the 28 known galaxies cannot create a door that would prevent Lex from getting in??!!!!
Or how about just having the exterior of the structure blend in with the rest of the surroundings...instead of having a glowing lattice-network design that one can pick out from miles away?

It's a movie, yo?

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 08-25-2009, 11:47 PM   #22
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

well actually in smallville it looks like it did have some defenses like when chloe first entered it was going to kill her and then the others who have been their either was taken in their by clark or was able to break in when it was damaged or lex via that stupid orb thing.

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Old 08-25-2009, 11:52 PM   #23
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

So if the defenses actually worked....then Superman would have to discreetly dispose of a body?


I mean, I'll lock my door and all, but I won't rig a hanging piano over it.

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Originally Posted by Matt
Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 08-25-2009, 11:54 PM   #24
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

I guess so then.

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Old 08-25-2009, 11:56 PM   #25
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Default Re: The Fortress of Solitude

What if someone from the Canadian authorities happened to find it and got zapped to death while knocking on the door?

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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