Should Superman be dark?

[Mr. Earle]

Originally Posted by Timstuff

My reaction exactly when i read that. Like... what the hell?

Should Superman be dark?

The themes and villains can be, but the tone of the movie and Superman himself have to be bright. The only two things i liked in Superman Returns, and i really mean the only two, were the tone of the film and the camera tint that i could say played a role in the tone.

Superman should have about the same tone as the Ironman movie. It must not be darker, it must not be lighter.

[Webhead2006]

Doesnt superman try to see the best in everyone?

[Mr. Earle]

Yes he does.

[afan]

Originally Posted by Webhead2006

Doesnt superman try to see the best in everyone?

No.

There are evil people in the world and Superman recognizes them as such. He is a positive thinker, but that's not the same as saying he believes there is any good whatsoever in them.. Lex Luthor.. for instance.

[SuperMike335!!]

I think he meant that more in general, as in he sees the goodness in humanity, and does not judge all of humanity for its capacity for evil.

Sure he will meet some people he knows are corrupt to the core.

[afan]

Originally Posted by SuperMike335!!

I think he meant that more in general, as in he sees the goodness in humanity, and does not judge all of humanity for its capacity for evil.

Sure he will meet some people he knows are corrupt to the core.

Could be, but that's putting words in his post.
Bottom line he sees the best in those that deserve it, and recognizes those that do not.

[Webhead2006]

yea i meant in general.

[afan]

Originally Posted by Webhead2006

yea i meant in general.

Then I stand corrected, Webhead.

[Webhead2006]

no problem guys, i guess i should have made my original post a little more clear.

[NeoRanger]

Originally Posted by afan

Bottom line he sees the best in those that deserve it, and recognizes those that do not.

I'm afraid I can't quite agree. He's not stupid as to not be cautious with those that have proved dangerous, but if he can't recognize any good in them, rehabilitation is a moot point. Even Batman believes that.

Unless I misread your point.

[afan]

Originally Posted by NeoRanger

I'm afraid I can't quite agree. He's not stupid as to not be cautious with those that have proved dangerous, but if he can't recognize any good in them, rehabilitation is a moot point. Even Batman believes that.

Unless I misread your point.

Superman would never decide what to do with dangerous individuals or those that break the laws. That responsibilty, whether it be a jail sentance intended to either punish or rehab or the finality of capital punishment, Superman would leave to society.

What I am saying is that there are truly evil people in his world, and Superman would recognize them as such, saving his empathy for those deserving, just as Batman recognizes true evil in the Joker.

[sithlord]

no!!!!

[wattabrownsound]

aren't there ways of working around the idea of a dark superman without giving us a superman that is dark by choice. you could see how far you could push him. you could also have parasite shapeshift into superman and abuse his powers.

even though you might not want superman to be dark wouldn't it be interesting to see superman explore the ramifications of going dark at least once like when he killed those phantom zone criminals with the green kryptonite in the comics?

it feels there are doors being closed story-wise if the idea of a dark Superman in some shape or form is rejected.

[Anubis]

No.

[RachelDawes]

Originally Posted by wattabrownsound

aren't there ways of working around the idea of a dark superman without giving us a superman that is dark by choice. you could see how far you could push him. you could also have parasite shapeshift into superman and abuse his powers.

even though you might not want superman to be dark wouldn't it be interesting to see superman explore the ramifications of going dark at least once like when he killed those phantom zone criminals with the green kryptonite in the comics?

it feels there are doors being closed story-wise if the idea of a dark Superman in some shape or form is rejected.

A Superman who isn't dark by choice sounds interesting. How would you manage this?

[Mr. Earle]

Originally Posted by wattabrownsound

aren't there ways of working around the idea of a dark superman without giving us a superman that is dark by choice. you could see how far you could push him. you could also have parasite shapeshift into superman and abuse his powers.

even though you might not want superman to be dark wouldn't it be interesting to see superman explore the ramifications of going dark at least once like when he killed those phantom zone criminals with the green kryptonite in the comics?

it feels there are doors being closed story-wise if the idea of a dark Superman in some shape or form is rejected.

That sounds like Smallville. I think he is going dark this season. I dont watch it though so i am not sure.
\

[Fresh Prince]

Originally Posted by Anubis

No.

Agreed.

[wattabrownsound]

here are some examples of showing a dark superman in some shape or form without it being superman who has decided to be dark.

-you could brainwash superman like Granny Goodness did in STAS where he would join darkseid and do dark things.
-you could use people like Maxwell Lord, Grodd or Manchester Black to also brainwash superman.
-you could have manchester black see how far you can push superman to be dark.
-you could have imposters like the Parasite shapeshift and behave like a dark superman.
-you could have superman contemplate what it would be like if he didn't use his powers for good or someone else contemplate the same thing.
-you could show what if? scenario's if superman went dark when bad guys ask superman to join them.

[Webhead2006]

all could work.

[Anubis]

Not for the first film in a reboot.

[RachelDawes]

Originally Posted by wattabrownsound

here are some examples of showing a dark superman in some shape or form without it being superman who has decided to be dark.

-you could brainwash superman like Granny Goodness did in STAS where he would join darkseid and do dark things.
-you could use people like Maxwell Lord, Grodd or Manchester Black to also brainwash superman.
-you could have manchester black see how far you can push superman to be dark.
-you could have imposters like the Parasite shapeshift and behave like a dark superman.
-you could have superman contemplate what it would be like if he didn't use his powers for good or someone else contemplate the same thing.
-you could show what if? scenario's if superman went dark when bad guys ask superman to join them.

Originally Posted by Anubis

Not for the first film in a reboot.

I like the bolded ideas. The others are too far out there for me, and if Parasite were to do terrible things it wouldn't really be Superman being dark.

[RachelDawes]

Originally Posted by Anubis

Not for the first film in a reboot.

But in a sequel to a reboot it would be a good way to up the action and the stakes.

[wattabrownsound]

even though superman wouldn't go dark you can have imposters make it look like he has and really tarnish his reputation. with this way you can keep the fans happy that say superman would and should never go dark but are still able to explore the dark superman idea all because the true superman isn't dark but an imposter.

[Webhead2006]

totally would be something to wait for sequel on. and we are all not saying we want superman to be dark. alot of us i believe agree superman need to be bright bold, and a symbol for hope and peace and all that. But there is no reason why the city cant be dark, and he faces dark threats and the villains themselfs are dark people.

[afan]

Smallville has created a dark Superman by choice, and alienated an audience.

Superman III already used the beyond his control dark Superman device.