How To Correct a Misconception Made by Superman Returns

[SuperMike335!!]

Originally Posted by afan

While I understand where this is coming from, Clint Walker is at 6'6", just too big.

His build on a 6'3" frame would be ideal tho.

6'6" is the top end of my range for Superman. Its about as tall as you could get away with but it would still have worked.

By wearing flat sole shoes, and slouching as Clark he would seem no taller than 6'3".

In some ways Walkers 6'6" would have been an Asset, because by hiding a few inches as Clark (slouching, and flat sole shoes) there would seem to be a bigger contrast with the size of Clark and Superman, than if both were 6'3".

Sourcebook stats are rarely used by comic book artists anyway. They mostly just draw Superman they way they feel he should look. Alex Ross draws Superman looking easily 6'6".

In most videos from Cheyenne Walker does not tower over everyone else that much either. The camera angle can easily conceal or add to height.

Regardless, its just number, when you view old Cheyenne Clips on youtube you will find he does not look freakishly tall.

[Webhead2006]

Originally Posted by GreenKToo

My preference would be for them to get an actor that has some real experience so he can carry himself well.
One that maybe has been in a few films already as a minor character, and one that has acted on TV a good bit. known, just not WELL known if that makes sense.

IMVHO I dont think they'll be looking for a reeve or routh clone the next time around,
so at this point I don't think you can rule anyone in or out as long as they are the right height and build.

This is how i would like for it to go to next go around.

[Fresh Prince]

Originally Posted by GreenKToo

My preference would be for them to get an actor that has some real experience so he can carry himself well.
One that maybe has been in a few films already as a minor character, and one that has acted on TV a good bit. known, just not WELL known if that makes sense.

IMVHO I dont think they'll be looking for a reeve or routh clone the next time around,
so at this point I don't think you can rule anyone in or out as long as they are the right height and build.

How known you want them to be only reconized in US and Canada?

[SuperMike335!!]

Originally Posted by Fresh Prince

How known you want them to be only reconized in US and Canada?

What am you saying?

[Webhead2006]

well they should have some tv work, maybe done a series of indie films, or a few bigger films but hasnt hit it big yet. Like a chris pine for example. he has done alot of films, but Trek was his huge breakout film. Someone along that lines of semi known is good for me i think.

[Fresh Prince]

Originally Posted by SuperMike335!!

What am you saying?

Do you want them to be known like only in the US...Thats what I'm saying....Cause you said you want known actors not well known ones.

[DavidTyler]

I HAVE BEEN SAYING THIS ALL ALONG

Superman needs to have 'feet of clay'. Clark needs to be more than just a mask for Superman. He needs to be a fully realized human being so that Superman can be a fully realized human being.

[I SEE SPIDEY]

Unless they make a relentlessly dumb fun movie with lots of action that clicks with audiences, (AKA, Transformers) they can't afford to make Superman/Clark Kent a cypher again.

The next actor needs to have more raw charisma than Routh if they are going to portray the character so...er unearthly. I perfer they get away from that though.

And yes, I'm well aware that this is all my opinion!

[GreenKToo]

FNJ disagrees with this, and he prolly has good reason, but since we really don't know whats going on all we can do is speculate. I think at this point they should prolly get a known actor. Not a superstar mind you, but certainly someone that has acted in more projects than just ''soaps'' or commericials. He'll need to be able to carry himself and make us believe he is clark/superman.

I think it needs to be an actor that has already been in a few films and maybe in a few TV series....say someone like a kiefer sutherland, and before some of you start screaming ''NOOOO!!'' he's just an example, so breath. ( I do think he'd make a helluva Metallo though)

[DavidTyler]

Originally Posted by GreenKToo

FNJ disagrees with this, and he prolly has good reason, but since we really don't know whats going on all we can do is speculate. I think at this point they should prolly get a known actor. Not a superstar mind you, but certainly someone that has acted in more projects than just ''soaps'' or commericials. He'll need to be able to carry himself and make us believe he is clark/superman.

I think it needs to be an actor that has already been in a few films and maybe in a few TV series....say someone like a kiefer sutherland, and before some of you start screaming ''NOOOO!!'' he's just an example, so breath. ( I do think he'd make a helluva Metallo though)

Not to digress and make this into another 'Casting Superman' thread, I have to say I disagree.

It doesn't matter where the actor got their start, they need to have chops and I'd prefer not to see someone in the role that makes me forget I'm watching Superman and not Keifer Sutherland's latest movie.

I do agree that a huge part of the problem is the disconnected way Routh played (either thru his own initiative or Singer's direction) Superman. Clark Kent was not raised as an alien. He was raised human and all of the foibles of being human should be evident in the character. He was not raised as Superman ... in fact it wasn't even a daydream when he was growing up. He was raised as a confused young human who had to hide the unusual things he could do. - but still - the operative word there is 'human'. He had the best upbringing but that doesn't mean he doesn't have all the same emotions and ability to makes mistakes that we all share.

Here I go pontificating again.

[GreenKToo]

That's my whole point though. HOW is the guy gonna have the chops unless he has substantial experience? Sure, they could get lucky and hire an unknown that gives an oscar caliber performance. I could also win the lottery tomorrow.

[Webhead2006]

i agree greenktoo it shouldnt be someone huge Alist type like a brad pitt/matt damon/etc.... actor. It should be someone who hasnt hit the big time yet. Done various tv show roles, some indie films, maybe been minor/supporting role in some big films. So we know he has alot of range and what not in his acting.

[SuperMike335!!]

　
I think he means that skill and experience are not always one and the same.

They could get someone fresh out of acting school, who just has great talent.

Even someone who has done stage and theatre acting, or even small parts as character roles on TV shows. Hugh Jackman was a virtual unknown until he got the part for Wolverine, next thing you know he is a star. I think they got him doing song and dance at some stage theatre Australia.

On top of that, they may be perfect for Clark and Superman both, but no good at any other type of character.

I say they look far and wide, and just have the right criteria for casting.
Experience is not so relevant as is talent.

Heck there are some very bad actors, who have charisma, and lots of experience, but could not blend into a role to save their life.

So what we really need is talent, and the right kind of talent for the role.

[Webhead2006]

i agree there a bit they should look at their acting talent. Probably looking at theatre people would be a good step. But i too hope they have a big/wide testing for clark/superman and have a clear cut list on what they want in looks and skills.

[Webhead2006]

i agree there a bit they should look at their acting talent. Probably looking at theatre people would be a good step. But i too hope they have a big/wide testing for clark/superman and have a clear cut list on what they want in looks and skills.

[KalMart]

Originally Posted by markaudette

I'm watching Superman Returns as I write this. And there's something about the movie that has botrhered me since the movie was released. A misconception that I desperately hope the next writers do not repeat in the forthcoming movie ...if there ever is going to be one.

Do NOT write Superman like he's some kind of trophy collecting dust on a mantlepiece. That is to say, do not make the mistake of writing Superman only as some disembodied demi-god. Do not make the mistake that Superman Returns made - the entire movie danced around Superman without spending much effort on Kal-el himself. Just as if Superman was everyone's prized posession that sat stale underneath a glass dome in the middle of the room. As everyone danced and fluttered around him, all eyes fixed on Superman. But not really interacting with him. As if the movie was more interested in dealing with the CONCEPT of Superman's world rather than the man himself.

The reason I chose to post this here is that I desperately hope someone reads this and takes away my one true hope in the next Superman movie - please, please write Superman's character as if he's a real breathing person. Of all the characters in Superman Returns, Brandon Routh had just about the least amount of lines in the entire movie. Do not be afraid to let Clark speak! Do not be afraid to let Superman's humanity show through his superpowers. There's a scene in Superman II that perfectly sums up what I want every writer to recapture in Superman - the scene where the bus full of commuters is thrown at Superman. You could see for one terrible moment the very human-like panic in Christopher Reeve's performance.

...okay, okay. Maybe it was the weakness in Brandon Routh's acting. Maybe it was a weakness in the script and screenplay. Maybe it was a weakness in the directing. There's no way I can say whose fault it was since I'm just a lowly fanboy sitting here at 4 in the morning watching movies.

Clark may be a Kryptonian. But he's a man who wears many hats. At the core of who he is, is a son to two families, a small town farm boy at heart. And he's a stern demi-god saviour of us all, a stone hearted Kryptonian, a lover and a goofy reporter. All at once. It should be fun watching him attempt to be all these things at once . As if you're watching him choose these proverbial "hats" like he's trying to use a slide rule to to solve a math problem.

In short, don't be afraid to give him lines. Real meat-and-bones dialog.

Show him mad.

Show him happy.

Show fear in him.

Show desire, lust in him. Don't be afraid to show Clark as a hunk.

Show his emotional weaknesses.

Show his strength.

Show his courage.

Show him as a man.

Yes, As a Demi-God.

Show him as your uncle. Your brother. Your Dad. Your teacher.

Show him growing as a person.

Show his wisdom.

But dog gone-it, make Superman chew some dialog for once.

And if they can get around to it....show him as a Supehero doing Superhero stuff. If SR had more of that, I doubt the rest of what it didn't do would have been as much of an issue.

[Fresh Prince]

Originally Posted by SuperMike335!!

　
I think he means that skill and experience are not always one and the same.

They could get someone fresh out of acting school, who just has great talent.

Even someone who has done stage and theatre acting, or even small parts as character roles on TV shows. Hugh Jackman was a virtual unknown until he got the part for Wolverine, next thing you know he is a star. I think they got him doing song and dance at some stage theatre Australia.

On top of that, they may be perfect for Clark and Superman both, but no good at any other type of character.

I say they look far and wide, and just have the right criteria for casting.
Experience is not so relevant as is talent.

Heck there are some very bad actors, who have charisma, and lots of experience, but could not blend into a role to save their life.

So what we really need is talent, and the right kind of talent for the role.

You think they take a chance on soemone coming out of acting school? Who had no expierence of acting but training in school? I mean if the person has great acting skills go for it but doubt Hollywood take chances....They afraid too these days.....And Superman should not be a dumb fun movie like Transformers.

[Ita-KalEl]

IMO a Superman cameo in a successful Green Lantern movie would be a good restart for the franchise.

[RachelDawes]

Originally Posted by KalMart

And if they can get around to it....show him as a Supehero doing Superhero stuff. If SR had more of that, I doubt the rest of what it didn't do would have been as much of an issue.

Obviously we want to see Superman do superheroic things, but if the characterization isn't there then it might as well be about some other hero. We're Superman fans so we want to see the character done justice along with the action.

Originally Posted by Fresh Prince

You think they take a chance on soemone coming out of acting school? Who had no expierence of acting but training in school? I mean if the person has great acting skills go for it but doubt Hollywood take chances....They afraid too these days.....And Superman should not be a dumb fun movie like Transformers.

They've already cast inexperienced actors twice as Superman. They could do it again.

[Webhead2006]

i still say the clark kent cameo is likely not going to make it into the shooting script or in the film. We still dont know whats up with all the legal stuff, and even if that wasnt a problem. There is still the issue they have no writers/directors/producers lined up or have picked a clear cut direction they want to go in.

[SuperMike335!!]

Originally Posted by Fresh Prince

You think they take a chance on soemone coming out of acting school? Who had no expierence of acting but training in school? I mean if the person has great acting skills go for it but doubt Hollywood take chances....They afraid too these days.....And Superman should not be a dumb fun movie like Transformers.

If the guys gives an audition and floors them with a Prefect Clark and Superman, and just happens to have a lot of talent, they might.

Offhand, I'd also like the guy to have some experience too, but not be such a known face that when we see him we are just seeing "so and so's newest role".

As has been noted by Rachel, has been done twice in the past.

[Fresh Prince]

What someone said earlier in Superman making a camoe appearance in a GL film can be a way to jump start all of this...Also him making a camoe appearance in other DC hero movies like Flash if they ever make one, Wonder Women, Martian Manhunter, Lobo.

[I SEE SPIDEY]

Originally Posted by Fresh Prince

You think they take a chance on soemone coming out of acting school? Who had no expierence of acting but training in school? I mean if the person has great acting skills go for it but doubt Hollywood take chances....They afraid too these days.....And Superman should not be a dumb fun movie like Transformers.

Clearfully read my post before you respond.

[KalMart]

Originally Posted by RachelDawes

Obviously we want to see Superman do superheroic things, but if the characterization isn't there then it might as well be about some other hero. We're Superman fans so we want to see the character done justice along with the action.

He's not exactly a Dostoevsky character. But the more exciting and engaging they make the big stuff, the more interesting the little stuff he does and says will be.

[markaudette]

Superman may not exactly a Dostoevsky character, but a Superman movie should, in part should always be about morality.

Jor-el: "You must not interfere with human history."

or

Clark: "All those powers, all those things I can do and I couldn't even save him."

Superman may not be a very complex person but the universe has become extroidnarily complex because of his existance on Earth.

And, as a side note, because DC formed their own movie studio like Marvel Entertainment, so help me God there is no reason whatsoever why Superman can't make an appearance in other DC movies. Like it or not we DO have a Superman for right now. Personally, I think we're lucky to have a Superman actor primed and ready ready to don the cape again if need be.