Rob Zombie's Halloween and Halloween 2...reconsidered?

[Sarge 2.0]

I don't think this fits in either thread, because although it technically pertains to the movies, it's more about challenging conventional wisdom (in this case, "Zombie's Halloween movies are trash") through an experiment in critical thinking.

Former Premiere magazine film critic Glenn Kenny decides to watch both movies after considering the positive reviews given to them by semi-retired, ex-Village Voice critic Nathan Lee. Kenny often takes serious, serious issues with Lee and the way he writes and conducts himself, but notes that Lee is a sharp, real critic. Read, think, and enjoy:

http://somecamerunning.typepad.com/s...challenge.html

[Spider-ManHero12]

I can't tell if this guy is praising the films or not....

[Spider-ManHero12]

I want to add though, that people don't understand Rob's films. They consider his Halloween films "Trash" because of the stuff that's in them. Rob explained why he did whath e did in the films, but some people just don't get it. Believe it or not, and I've seen ALOT of horror films, Rob's visions on what he wants in horror films are some of th best I've heard in the past couple of years.

[Sarge 2.0]

Originally Posted by Spider-ManHero12

I can't tell if this guy is praising the films or not....

Did you read the article?

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Spider-ManHero12

I want to add though, that people don't understand Rob's films. They consider his Halloween films "Trash" because of the stuff that's in them. Rob explained why he did whath e did in the films, but some people just don't get it. Believe it or not, and I've seen ALOT of horror films, Rob's visions on what he wants in horror films are some of th best I've heard in the past couple of years.

Believe it or not, we're not the dumb rednecks of Zombie's films. People can
"get it," and still not like it.

[Spider-ManHero12]

^^ Yes. I don't know, I just can't tell. Let me read it again.

[Spider-ManHero12]

Originally Posted by Matt

Believe it or not, we're not the dumb rednecks of Zombie's films. People can
"get it," and still not like it.

You guys don't get it though. Listen to his commentary on Halloween II (2009).

[Matt]

I DO get it. I still think it is crappy film making.

[Matt]

That's such an immature stance. "I didn't like it." "No, you don't get it."

[Spider-ManHero12]

Originally Posted by Matt

That's such an immature stance. "I didn't like it." "No, you don't get it."

See, now you're just trying to make it look like I'm bashing you. I'm not, man, trust me.

my point is that alot of people don't get what Zombie does with his movies. I'm not saying you can't think they're crappy.

[Doctor Jones]

I get what Zombie does, but it isn't the best choices, which results in poor filmmaking.

The first movie sucked, The Devil's Rejects was alright, it had some good ideas, but I think he needs to look at the fact that not all disfunctional families are white trash who says "****" as every other word.

[Spider-ManHero12]

Originally Posted by Doctor Jones

The first movie sucked, The Devil's Rejects was alright, it had some good ideas, but I think he needs to look at the fact that not all disfunctional families are white trash who says "****" in every other word.

Although hearing f*** isn't great all the time, Rob likes to make things "real", which is why i think it works in his films.

[Doctor Jones]

Real can be good, but sometimes a filmmaker must know when enough is enough.

[Spider-ManHero12]

Originally Posted by Doctor Jones

Real can be good, but sometimes a filmmaker must know when enough is enough.

Not entirely. A filmmmaker may want a film of his to be completley real. I mean, we know how high school is in real life. Alot of swears. Just like with Laurie and Annie's talk after school in the Halloween remake.

[Doctor Jones]

Well, yes, people do curse alot, but on film it just comes across as repetitive and annoying. It's worse when the acting is bad.

[Spider-ManHero12]

Originally Posted by Doctor Jones

Well, yes, people do curse alot, but on film it just comes across as repetitive and annoying. It's worse when the acting is bad.

That's his directing style though. He's trying to make people feel uneasy when watching his horror films.

[Matt Mortem]

I love everything Zombie has ever done, I'm an uber fan. I will admit H2 was not that terrific, but after listening to the commentary I understand why. H1 wasn't as a good as his original flicks, but it was still decent. I think where Zombie went wrong was taking on an established franchise and rebooting it. He would be much better off sticking to original works.

[Doctor Jones]

What did he say in his commentaries?

[Sarge 2.0]

Originally Posted by Spider-ManHero12

^^ Yes. I don't know, I just can't tell. Let me read it again.

He was saying that he admired large parts of both films, especially from a visual perspective since Zombie is such a dutiful student of horror films, but feels that Zombie's weaknesses as a writer bog down the second movie.

[Matt Mortem]

Originally Posted by Doctor Jones

What did he say in his commentaries?

He pretty much said the production was rushed beyond reason and they just had problem after problem. For example that bit where the coroners are taking Michaels body and hit the cow had to be shot twice at the last minute because the original film got ruined in an airport x-ray machine.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Spider-ManHero12

Although hearing f*** isn't great all the time, Rob likes to make things "real", which is why i think it works in his films.

Originally Posted by Spider-ManHero12

Not entirely. A filmmmaker may want a film of his to be completley real. I mean, we know how high school is in real life. Alot of swears. Just like with Laurie and Annie's talk after school in the Halloween remake.

The thing is, constant swearing isn't "real." Same with his dialogue, the way Laurie and Annie talk, no one says things like "Starvin' like Marvin," or "Too coolio for schoolio." This kind of stuff is not real. Its just poor writing. Same with the ****s. Its not real as people do not generally use it as every other word in casual conversation (not even rednecks). It just comes off as lazy writing to compensate for the fact that he couldn't come up with relevant or meaningful dialogue so he throws a bunch of swears in there and says, "Thats how real people talk."

Originally Posted by Spider-ManHero12

That's his directing style though. He's trying to make people feel uneasy when watching his horror films.

But there is a difference between making people uneasy, and awkward. The constant ****s just make people feel awkward, not uneasy, uncomfortable, or tense as they should in a proper horror atmosphere. Using **** does not establish a scary atmosphere or take the audience out of their comfortzone.

[I SEE SPIDEY]

Originally Posted by matt

i do get it. I still think it is crappy film making.

qft.

[Spider-ManHero12]

Originally Posted by Matt

But there is a difference between making people uneasy, and awkward. The constant ****s just make people feel awkward, not uneasy, uncomfortable, or tense as they should in a proper horror atmosphere. Using **** does not establish a scary atmosphere or take the audience out of their comfortzone.

It still was rela. That's the way high school is these days. He also said that Annie being all bloody, but half nude was meant to be disturbing and not make gusy go "Yes, boobs!" YOu guys make Zombie out ot be a terrible director, when really, he makes alot of sense.

I mean, for gods sake, these films aren't supposed to be academy award winning films.

[Motown Marvel]

house of a 1000 corpses was solid. devils rejects was great. halloween was half good. halloween 2 was complete crap. i get what zombie is doing. he's the most genuine, well intended, and passionate horror film director in hollywood today, and for that i give him my complete support and respect, whether or not he delivers on the actual film itself.

[Dark Victory]

Originally Posted by Spider-ManHero12

It still was rela. That's the way high school is these days. He also said that Annie being all bloody, but half nude was meant to be disturbing and not make gusy go "Yes, boobs!" YOu guys make Zombie out ot be a terrible director, when really, he makes alot of sense.

I mean, for gods sake, these films aren't supposed to be academy award winning films.

I run into a fair share of idiots every day at school, but the characters Zombie created were laughably bad stereotypes that were dragged out to a gratuitous extent.