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Old 03-01-2012, 05:34 PM   #76
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Default Re: A fan's rage

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How can you seriously hate something that's not even out yet? So many people did the same thing with Nolan's batman movies when the first pics of the tumbler arose on the internet... and pics of heath ledger as the joker. Hell, the casting announcement ALONE of Heath Ledger cause huge fan rage that was out of nothing... and look at the movies now, ranked up there as one of the best comic book movies.

And compared to Raimi's version, this new reboot maintains the humor without the cheesiness. It has great actors... great story... a great director... and it's as faithful if not more faithful to the Spider-Man comics as Raimi's versions.

What's your argument for disliking the reboot?
Bad costume desing, Garfield doesn't sell the character for me, I don't like the Lizard's look, don't see a need to retell his origin or bring his parents into it, how is it THE UNTOLD STORY if we know his origin & they're just changing it, Captain Stacy acting like Jameson...
I haven't seen anything to like, really.

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Old 03-01-2012, 06:10 PM   #77
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Default Re: A fan's rage

Will you still give it a chance?

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Old 03-01-2012, 07:32 PM   #78
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Default Re: A fan's rage

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Bad costume desing, Garfield doesn't sell the character for me, I don't like the Lizard's look, don't see a need to retell his origin or bring his parents into it, how is it THE UNTOLD STORY if we know his origin & they're just changing it, Captain Stacy acting like Jameson...
I haven't seen anything to like, really.
The costume, I cannot argue. It's bad specially when compared to Raimi's (although I admit it looked good enough in the trailer, but then again it's just a trailer). But hey, see the movie and then compare Garfield to Maguire. And Lizard doesn't look worse than Raimi's Green Goblin. The need of re-telling is the whole purpose of a reboot. And his parents are part of Peter's story that was omitted by Raimi (not saying it's a bad thing but it is certainly not bad to consider it). And correct me if I'm wrong but Raimi did change Spider-man's story (organic webshooters, non-radioactive spider, no Gwen Stacy dying, Marko killed Uncle Ben... accidentally - and btw, how is Webb changing Spider-man's story? I actually don't know).

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Old 03-02-2012, 08:23 AM   #79
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Default Re: A fan's rage

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Bad costume desing
The suit looks bad in braod daylight pics, but it looks OK in the trailers, and it makes him look alien like and scary, something that would scare ordinary thugs.
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Garfield doesn't sell the character for me
I thought that his acting was OK, at least he does not look like a mild mannered loser like Tobey did.


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I don't like the Lizard's look
It is closer to Steve Dikto's Lizard, and they will have the Lizard say some lines for that he cannot have a long snout.

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don't see a need to retell his origin or bring his parents into it
Reboot means telling the Origin story again, but from a new perspective,.

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how is it THE UNTOLD STORY
It includes the back story about Peter's parents, something that was excluded in Raimi's movies.

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if we know his origin & they're just changing it
Not really.

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Captain Stacy acting like Jameson...
You have not seen the movie yet to claim that.

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I haven't seen anything to like, really.
O.K.

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Old 03-03-2012, 10:05 AM   #80
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Default Re: A fan's rage

Garfield is like 80 billion times better than Maguire.

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Old 03-03-2012, 07:42 PM   #81
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Default Re: A fan's rage

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Garfield is like 80 billion times better than Maguire.
If he has a better crying face - and every human being but Maguire does - then he wins. LOL.

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Old 03-03-2012, 11:18 PM   #82
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Default Re: A fan's rage

I'm going to go as far as saying I don't know how real tried and true Spider-Man fans could have been at all pleased with Maguire.

He never matured past the uber-geeky 15yo Peter Parker only existed for about 25 issues of the comics.

Once he moved to New York in Spider-Man 1, and certainly in all of Spider-Man 2, his characterization should've matched the much more confident and comedic Peter Parker of ASM #60+.

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Old 03-04-2012, 12:04 PM   #83
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Default Re: A fan's rage

Define "real tried and true," Spider-Man fans. Is there a test? Or do you do you alone have the rules that govern this?

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Old 03-04-2012, 12:20 PM   #84
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Default Re: A fan's rage

I mean people with a thorough knowledge of Spider-Man comics.

As said, if you analyze his characterization throughout the early run of ASM (from about #1-150, let's say), you'll see that Maguire's characterization doesn't match what Peter's personality was for the majority of those comics.

Like I said, Maguire's characterization was early Peter Parker (issues #1-30 or so, maybe). Which was fine for the first 30-45 minutes of the first movie, but once he moved into the city, his characterization should've progressed to his characterization in the later issues of ASM.

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Old 03-04-2012, 12:36 PM   #85
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Default Re: A fan's rage

You said he should have been more confident. What scenes show Peter has a lack of confidence?

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Old 03-04-2012, 12:38 PM   #86
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Default Re: A fan's rage

Every scene with Mary Jane.

Most scenes with Aunt May.

Every scene with Norman.

Etc. al.

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Old 03-04-2012, 02:04 PM   #87
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Default Re: A fan's rage

Right.

Try this, give a specific example and then explain how that proves your point.

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Old 03-06-2012, 04:26 PM   #88
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Default Re: A fan's rage

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Every scene with Mary Jane.

Most scenes with Aunt May.

Every scene with Norman.

Etc. al.
VIDEO-CLick to Watch!:

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Old 03-06-2012, 04:29 PM   #89
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Default Re: A fan's rage

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You said he should have been more confident. What scenes show Peter has a lack of confidence?
VIDEO-CLick to Watch!:

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Old 03-06-2012, 06:18 PM   #90
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Default Re: A fan's rage

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Right.

Try this, give a specific example and then explain how that proves your point.
I'm sorry, I didn't realize you were looking for such specificity.

I'll have to pull up the script or rewatch a couple scenes. I wouldn't want to misquote Tobey.

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Old 03-06-2012, 06:25 PM   #91
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Default Re: A fan's rage

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He sounds exactly like my ex-girlfriend.

Who now takes Prozac.

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Old 03-07-2012, 09:24 AM   #92
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The woman he loved broke up with him just as he was going to propose and he cried.


How did he show a lack of confidence? What would have confident person have done different?

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Old 03-07-2012, 09:26 AM   #93
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I'm sorry, I didn't realize you were looking for such specificity.

I'll have to pull up the script or rewatch a couple scenes. I wouldn't want to misquote Tobey.
Look, no need to apologize. Just admit you can't think of one and we'll move one.

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Old 03-07-2012, 04:18 PM   #94
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Default Re: A fan's rage

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The woman he loved broke up with him just as he was going to propose and he cried.


How did he show a lack of confidence? What would have confident person have done different?
Not cry?

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Old 03-08-2012, 04:34 PM   #95
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Where does it say a reboot requires a whole new origin? Of the 3 Marvel reboots that have come out thus far, (Hulk, Ghost Rider, Punisher) not ONE has redone the origin. They did a quick recap and moved on.

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Old 03-08-2012, 05:02 PM   #96
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Where does it say a reboot requires a whole new origin? Of the 3 Marvel reboots that have come out thus far, (Hulk, Ghost Rider, Punisher) not ONE has redone the origin. They did a quick recap and moved on.
I do agree that the origin didn't need to be retold. However, with ASM, it at least seems to tie into the overall plot of the film rather closely.

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Old 03-08-2012, 05:05 PM   #97
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Look, no need to apologize. Just admit you can't think of one and we'll move one.
That's it. Once I'm done watching Star Wars, I'm popping in my Spider-Man Blu-ray and tearing you a new one.

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Old 03-08-2012, 08:02 PM   #98
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Okay...

When he's talking to Mary Jane outside of the diner:
The awkward way he just stares crestfallen when MJ tells him she's going out with Harry, the way he can't barely muster up a reply when she reveals her embarrassment about big a waitress. It all belies a lack of confidence and immaturity. Honestly, his performance at times strikes me as if he's a child watching the world happen before him without totally understanding how to interpret or respond to it. It's always stuttering and nervous smiles. Uncomfortable glances and a lack for words.

The scene with Betty Brant also displays that same dopey nature: "I'm Peter Parker. I'm a photographer." You really can't get more awkward than that line and delivery.

During the Thanksgiving Dinner:
The entire scene characterizes Peter as unaware, stuttering adolescent. Not only does he project a dopey demeanor to his family with his excuses fto cover up being Spider-Man (which isn't too bad in and of itself), but he also displays a lack of confidence and downright intelligence by being unable to act nonchalant when attention is drawn to his injury, and by his inaction while Harry and Norman are being *******s to the love of his life.

When Mary Jane visits Aunt May in the hospital:
It doesn't start off too bad, asking MJ how she's feeling after the previous day is the right thing to do, but once MJ starts talking about how she feels about Spider-Man, and Peter starts going into his fake conversation with Spider-Man, again, he just seems like someone who has absolutely no clue what he's doing. It's obvious he's making the speech up as he goes long, which isn't too bad, but what really clinches it is that he can't just be upfront and honest about his feelings, rather he has to hide behind his other persona.

I will admit, a lot of it does simply come Maguire himself; his whole demeanor screams nervousness, awkwardness, and and insecurity. The way his voice If another actor had played the role, possibly they could have interjected more maturity and chrisma into the role.

Unfortunately, it didn't happen. More unfortunate, I'm quite sure Maguire played the character exactly the way Raimi intended it. Which while isn't bad for the movie (I do enjoy the movie, don't get me wrong), it just doesn't really match up with who Peter was in the comics at that time.

Even, if you aren't well versed in the originals, just go take a look at Spider-Man: Blue. The Peter Parker in that, to me at least, seems very much the polar opposite of the Peter Parker in the movies. He's juggling women and friends. Despite his constant bad luck, always seems to stay one step ahead due to his intellect and powers. That's the Peter Parker I'll always prefer.

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Old 03-09-2012, 07:32 PM   #99
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I'm going to go as far as saying I don't know how real tried and true Spider-Man fans could have been at all pleased with Maguire.
and this is where I stopped listening...sorry but this sounds a bit elitist...."only true spider-man fans would have hated the movie"
are the true fans the ones who read Amazing Fantasy 15 or Spider-man #1???
Do we not count fans who got into Spider-man thru Spiderman and his amazing friends??
or the animated series???
or the 70s Series???
or the movies??
or are they only fans of the comics???

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Old 03-10-2012, 02:17 AM   #100
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Um, I didn't say anyone should hate the movie. I quite like both Spider-Man movies.

My point is simply that Maguire did not play the character accurately to the comics. That's what I mean by "tried and true". Not to be demeaning to anyone who became a fan from some other medium (my first exposure to Spider-Man was TAS), just that judging by comic faithfulness, it was not a strong performance.

I would liken it to Michael Keaton's Bruce Wayne; I love Keaton, but there were many aspects of the character that Burton and Keaton completely ignored (that said, I'd say Keaton's performances were 80 times better than Maguire's, but that's another story altogether. ).

In any case, my general point is; Maguire played the 15yo version of Peter Parker for 3 movies - by the end of which he had to at least be 21-24 (in movie time, at least). That fact alone (no matter how good or bad his actual performance was) should make it pretty obvious that another, different, interpretation of Spider-Man is needed to really properly represent the character.

And I'm sorry if it sounds elitist, but that era of Spider-Man comics - late 60s, early 70s - were absolute pinnacle of the character. I've heard numerous people - of all ages - state that. It's not to be offensive to any other time or adaptation, it's just that those comics were that good. Probably one of the best comic runs of all time.

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