Just Imagine Joss Whedon's Spider-Man

[Fox]

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

Of course. With Whedon, we would not be seeing Batman, I mean Spider-Man Begins.

I'm not going to bother trying to convince you that TASM is good. You've clearly established you don't like it. But to imply that TASM is somehow a knock off of Batman Begins is nothing short of a stretch. The only similarities I can think of are that both films are reboots of franchises, which centre around Comic Book protagonists, and tell the origins of each respective hero. Beyond that and the standard 'heroes journey' themes that you'll find in many CB movies, they really have very little in common.

[Anno_Domini]

The fact that TAS-M is inspired by Batman Begins, but only goes FARTHER than being inspired by having some "gritty" feel to it makes me believe that TAS-M is Spider-Man Begins.

Inspiration is fine, but when you can't have your own identity...makes it obvious.

Originally Posted by Picard Sisko

Oh lord...

You say something that you disagreed about and I say something in disagreement with you and this is your reply.

Mine shall be..."oh my goodness" then.

[Fox]

Never mind that the two films are completely different (and I wouldn't call TASM gritty), where did you get that TASM is inspired by BB? Was this in one of the interviews?

[Vid Electricz]

It's in the interviews as far as Marc Webb and Garfield talking about how "grounded" the new series was going to be.

The studios got it in their heads, after the success of Batman Begins and especially the Dark Knight, that audiences responded well (with their wallets) to the more "grounded", "modern" take on superheroes. It's no coincidence that the studio should mandate one of it's most popular franchises to follow suit thinking they'll rake in more coin that way. If you pay attention and watch for trends in films, it's almost completely transparent. And yes, like anything else, movies do go through trends. Just look at the gritty, stripped down reboots we've gotten lately: Casino Royale, TASM, Man of Steel- and I'm sure there will be more. Nothing is created in a vacuum.

[Fox]

Right. And I'm not questioning that. But to call TASM 'Spider-man' begins is like calling Casino Royale 'James Bond Begins'. Yes it may have a more 'gritty' or 'grounded' (choose your adjective) filmic style indicative of the present trend, but the actual films, in terms story and plot, are quite different.

As far as 'inspiration' goes, that's a rather vague term. Many artists are inspired by the things around them, including other pieces of art. That doesn't mean they are copying or stealing for those other artists. So the people behind TASM see the trends and felt/feel that they can apply a similar tone to their character (yes, because the studios want to make more money.)

Now, obviously many people here felt that the end result was not successful. And that's fair. My point is, I don't See how TASM is a copy of Batman Begins any more than James Bond is, other than the fact that Spidey and Bats are both masked comic book characters.

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by Fox

Never mind that the two films are completely different (and I wouldn't call TASM gritty), where did you get that TASM is inspired by BB? Was this in one of the interviews?

Yes, it's been said that TAS-M is inspired by BB and just the overall tone feels like it's trying to copy BB's tone without making its own. Its own tone, its own atmosphere, its own identity...I didn't feel like as Raimi's film had one very much different than any other CBM. TAS-M? No, tbh.

[Fox]

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

Yes, it's been said that TAS-M is inspired by BB and just the overall tone feels like it's trying to copy BB's tone without making its own.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one I guess. I feel the two films are quite distinct.

Its own tone, its own atmosphere, its own identity...I didn't feel like as Raimi's film had one very much different than any other CBM. TAS-M? No, tbh.

I promise I'm not trying to come off as a grammar-nazi, but I'm having a bit of a hard time understanding this sentence. However, I'm gathering the gist is that you feel Raimi's films to be more unique (re: better), as apposed to Webb's film, which you believe to be derivative and uninventive. (Please correct me if I've misread you)

Once again, we'll have to agree to disagree.

[Anno_Domini]

Its own tone, its own atmosphere, its own identity...it didn't feel like it did as Raimi's film had one very much different than any other CBM. TAS-M? No, tbh.

Fixed. I was in a rush.

Other than the mistakes I made, I don't see what issues you have with my sentence, haha.

[Oscorp]

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

The fact that TAS-M is inspired by Batman Begins, but only goes FARTHER than being inspired by having some "gritty" feel to it makes me believe that TAS-M is Spider-Man Begins.

Inspiration is fine, but when you can't have your own identity...makes it obvious.



You say something that you disagreed about and I say something in disagreement with you and this is your reply.

Mine shall be..."oh my goodness" then.

Inspired, yes. But it doesn't really have anything in common when it comes to the tone IMO. So...just because it's not all light and fluff like in Raimi's films, it's a Nolan wannabe?

Why am I even asking, I'm not surprised you think that way.

[Bruce Malone]

I honestly think whedon would have been a better fit for spider-man than he was for the avengers.

Peter Parker was made to spout whedon dialogue.

[Oscorp]

Yeah I think Whedon would have made the perfect Spidey film.

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by Oscorp

Inspired, yes. But it doesn't really have anything in common when it comes to the tone IMO. So...just because it's not all light and fluff like in Raimi's films, it's a Nolan wannabe?

Why am I even asking, I'm not surprised you think that way.

Funny, because I'm not surprised a fan of TAS-M is disagreeing.

[Oscorp]

I'm not surprised you still have your head up your......

[Anno_Domini]

Your effort made me laugh, so good one.

[Oscorp]

I am however surprised that you can type...

[Anno_Domini]

Once again, nice.

Although...you have never taken a typing class? I don't need to look at a keyboard to type.

Oh, and before you ask...no, I don't need my eyes to look at what anyone says...I usually have an idea of what someone is going to say. I'm that good.

[Vid Electricz]

Originally Posted by Oscorp

Inspired, yes. But it doesn't really have anything in common when it comes to the tone IMO. So...just because it's not all light and fluff like in Raimi's films, it's a Nolan wannabe?

Why am I even asking, I'm not surprised you think that way.

The Raimi films were no more "light and fluffy" than TASM. TASM adopted a "darker" tone and atmosphere, which superficially makes them seem different, but storywise, the content was basically the same.

The Raimi films had a very prominent "self aware" sense of humor about themselves and TASM didn't- it was more straight forward and "serious".

It's the difference between a confident adult who is comfortable just being themself (the Raimi films) and a confused adolescent who wants to seem more mature than they really are so they try to act more adult-like (TASM). In the end, the whole act is a facade that anyone can see through.

[Leenie]

Hm, I still wish that Whedon could make a Spider-Man musical web series, much like the format of Dr. Horrible.

Might not be a popular opinion, but damn, I would love to see that.

[Picard Sisko]

Originally Posted by Fox

I'm not going to bother trying to convince you that TASM is good. You've clearly established you don't like it. But to imply that TASM is somehow a knock off of Batman Begins is nothing short of a stretch. The only similarities I can think of are that both films are reboots of franchises, which centre around Comic Book protagonists, and tell the origins of each respective hero. Beyond that and the standard 'heroes journey' themes that you'll find in many CB movies, they really have very little in common.

Yeah, I don't see how TASM was a knock-off of BB. Inspired perhaps.

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

The fact that TAS-M is inspired by Batman Begins, but only goes FARTHER than being inspired by having some "gritty" feel to it makes me believe that TAS-M is Spider-Man Begins.

Inspiration is fine, but when you can't have your own identity...makes it obvious.

TASM does have its own identity. Doesn't feel like any other comic book film I've ever seen IMO. Are we to say that Nolan wasn't inspired by any other movies out there, and hasn't borrowed elements from other films he has seen? Nothing today is truly 100% "original."

I guess Skyfall didn't have its own identity because it was just like the dark knight rises.

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

You say something that you disagreed about and I say something in disagreement with you and this is your reply.

Mine shall be..."oh my goodness" then.

Are you serious?

Originally Posted by Vid Electricz

It's in the interviews as far as Marc Webb and Garfield talking about how "grounded" the new series was going to be.

The studios got it in their heads, after the success of Batman Begins and especially the Dark Knight, that audiences responded well (with their wallets) to the more "grounded", "modern" take on superheroes. It's no coincidence that the studio should mandate one of it's most popular franchises to follow suit thinking they'll rake in more coin that way. If you pay attention and watch for trends in films, it's almost completely transparent. And yes, like anything else, movies do go through trends. Just look at the gritty, stripped down reboots we've gotten lately: Casino Royale, TASM, Man of Steel- and I'm sure there will be more. Nothing is created in a vacuum.

Yes, I'm sure Batman Begins served as an inspiration for the TASM. Same with other films that you have mentioned. Doesn't mean that they are going to be bad, or unoriginal.

Originally Posted by Fox

Right. And I'm not questioning that. But to call TASM 'Spider-man' begins is like calling Casino Royale 'James Bond Begins'. Yes it may have a more 'gritty' or 'grounded' (choose your adjective) filmic style indicative of the present trend, but the actual films, in terms story and plot, are quite different.

As far as 'inspiration' goes, that's a rather vague term. Many artists are inspired by the things around them, including other pieces of art. That doesn't mean they are copying or stealing for those other artists. So the people behind TASM see the trends and felt/feel that they can apply a similar tone to their character (yes, because the studios want to make more money.)

Now, obviously many people here felt that the end result was not successful. And that's fair. My point is, I don't See how TASM is a copy of Batman Begins any more than James Bond is, other than the fact that Spidey and Bats are both masked comic book characters.

This can be said about almost any artwork/film.

Originally Posted by Oscorp

Inspired, yes. But it doesn't really have anything in common when it comes to the tone IMO. So...just because it's not all light and fluff like in Raimi's films, it's a Nolan wannabe?

Why am I even asking, I'm not surprised you think that way.

Sometimes I just wonder why we even bother with him.

Originally Posted by Bruce Malone

I honestly think whedon would have been a better fit for spider-man than he was for the avengers.

Peter Parker was made to spout whedon dialogue.

Well he certainly was a HUGE fan of the first two Raimi films.

Originally Posted by Anno_Domini

Once again, nice.

Although...you have never taken a typing class? I don't need to look at a keyboard to type.

Oh, and before you ask...no, I don't need my eyes to look at what anyone says...I usually have an idea of what someone is going to say. I'm that good.

Funny how you need to "prove" something to other members here. I mean... seriously?

[Anno_Domini]

Originally Posted by Picard Sisko

Yeah, I don't see how TASM was a knock-off of BB. Inspired perhaps.

Let's see how many diehard TAS-M fans say this

TASM does have its own identity. Doesn't feel like any other comic book film I've ever seen IMO. Are we to say that Nolan wasn't inspired by any other movies out there, and hasn't borrowed elements from other films he has seen? Nothing today is truly 100% "original."

I don't see an identity. I see a film trying to bring in the light-heartedness of Raimi's trilogy while having a darker tone that Nolan brought for his Batman trilogy. Maybe, just maybe, we will see one in a sequel, but that's all the hope I can give on TAS-M's identity.

And you misunderstand me again. I never said Nolan wasn't inspired by other CBMs(mostly and mainly, Superman: The Movie for Batman Begins) as well as other films for his trilogy(Blade Runner and Heat for example), but this is just a situation where I feel that a CBM is heavily relying on a tone of another CBM.

I guess Skyfall didn't have its own identity because it was just like the dark knight rises.

Sorry if you think that when it's not. It was inspired by The Dark Knight anyhow, BUT...I am referring to CBMs feeling the same as other CBMs.

Are you serious?

So you can reply in a childish manner over giving my opinion, but I can't reply to you in a same way?

""

Sometimes I just wonder why we even bother with him.

Sometimes I wonder why you try as well, but it's fun when you do TRY regardless.

Funny how you need to "prove" something to other members here. I mean... seriously?

I can say the same with you replying to most of all of my posts in the last couple of pages.

[Picard Sisko]

Oh Anno...

[Anno_Domini]

[Fox]

Well... so anyways;

I think Joss's stylings and penchant for serialized storytelling would have been intriguing to see, but at the same time I'm happy with what we have.

Hopefully the sequel will satisfy more as-yet-unconvinced viewers and we can all rejoice in another solid Spidey flick.

[Anno_Domini]

I don't think Whedon's version would be as serialized as Webb's Spidey became, though. That idea only work's with Whedon's TV shows. Avengers was a film that felt like a solo film.

[Fox]

That is true. But I got the impression that it was 'laying the groundwork' for phase two. But you're right, it was more of a standalone film in terms of what we've been talking. Then again, Joss is also somewhat restricted in how serialized he can go with The Avengers since each character has their own franchise to return to.

If anything I think Joss would have given us something between what Raimi and Webb delivered. His Spidey might have been more of a solo film, but I also think Joss has a better sense of 'leaving the audience wanting more' than Raimi does.

I suppose the future Avengers sequels will be the true test of that.