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Old 02-14-2011, 01:31 AM   #101
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Default Re: The Official Lucas Till/Havok Thread

Alex Summers and Scott Summers do not have the same powers. Their powers are different and they are not similar. The thing they have in common is that they are brothers, And energy wielding mutants. Havoc absorbs solar and cosmic radiation, or rays and release it in the form of high energy plasma. Scott fires concussive beams of force from his eyes.

Why Fox and the rest of them idiots deemed it ok to make Alex Scott's father is beyond me. I just despise the direction these fools have taken the Xmen. I know nothing has been confirmed but truthfully this is the route that expect will be taken. All Fox says is ignore the fans and they won't have a choice but to accept it. They gonna complain and moan no matter what. They really don't get it. The sad thing is their isn't enough of us to make Fox take notice in terms of box office power cause despite our complaining majority of us go and pay and see it anyway. This is what Fox counts on and it's why they ignore us. I've said before that i will not pay to see this movie. I'll buy a ticket to another film and go into Xmen.

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Old 02-14-2011, 01:42 AM   #102
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Default Re: The Official Lucas Till/Havok Thread

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At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if Havok is Cyclops' father.
And you won't be, cause it's pretty much a given that will be the case. After that comment from Singer saying it wouldn't fit in the time period having Alex be Scott's brother, but he don't wanna give anything away. If that doesn't tell you that Havoc is the father then I don't know what will. Who do they think want that and why not give it away? It's not some clever twist that is gonna please the fans.


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Old 02-14-2011, 04:04 AM   #103
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When you think about it how can they be brothers in the movie universe cyclops in x men 1 looked about 25(just checked and Marsden was indeed 25 during Filming of X1) so he would of been born in 1975 which is a good 10+ years after First Class takes place.Lucas till who plays Havoc is currently 20 in the 1962 era in which X men First class Takes place in.

So lets put this in perspective Lucas till in the movie universe would have to of been born between 1942-1945 to match his age in the movie since he looks about 18-20.Which would have him be born a good 30 years before Cyclops in the movie universe so i think it likely makes more sense for him to be his father rather than his brother who would be 30 years apart from each other.

would it make more sense for them to be father and son or be brothers 30 years apart?
It is possible if they want the two to be brothers. Their father could have Havok when he was 18 and have Scott when he is 48. Guys can have kids at older age you know.

While if Havok is in fact his father, then it is even greater for the stories in the movie verse. Charles might not be able to save Havok, so he treated Scott like a son.

By the way, who could be their mother, Destiny perhaps ?

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Old 02-14-2011, 04:30 AM   #104
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Default Re: The Official Lucas Till/Havok Thread

^ exactly

yeah sure people can have kids later in life around 48-50 but it is unlikely

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Old 02-14-2011, 09:56 AM   #105
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I think it's just great that we're at the very least getting a Summers in First Class and that we'll actually get to see a take on Alex in a movie (something I'd hope they would have done previously). However, beam color aside, I'm cautiously optimistic.

I keep thinking though what role he could serve on the team aside from "Ranged DPS". Singer did mention that he's a danger to everyone around him (a nice nod) but will it be a point that's covered once (or very briefly) and then dismissed/resolved? I just wonder if maybe there's one too many mutants on the squad (what with Charles, Erik, Hank, Raven, Angel, Alex, and Sean), so that each person's role is ultimately diminished or even passed over especially with Charles and Erik leading the charge.

Nevertheless if Alex does turn out to be Scott's progenitor rather than a sibling, it won't really bother me because it's already been painfully obvious that this franchise does whatever it wants with the characters regardless of their comic counterparts. I'm just thankful that we're not getting another Wolverine and His Magical Powered Friends: The Prequel™.

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Old 02-14-2011, 09:57 AM   #106
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Default Re: The Official Lucas Till/Havok Thread

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It is possible if they want the two to be brothers. Their father could have Havok when he was 18 and have Scott when he is 48. Guys can have kids at older age you know.

While if Havok is in fact his father, then it is even greater for the stories in the movie verse. Charles might not be able to save Havok, so he treated Scott like a son.

By the way, who could be their mother, Destiny perhaps ?

I'm dying to see Destiny in an X-Film but not as Cyke's or Havok's brother...

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Old 02-14-2011, 10:52 AM   #107
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Default Re: The Official Lucas Till/Havok Thread

I'm just upset that this decision essentially throws out Cyclops' relationship with Havok. It feels like they just don't care about the Summers family or the relationships contained within it. They just stick them in for the sake of having them in to appeal to that portion of the fanbase and act like that should be good enough. This really hampered my anticipation for this film because even if it's good I don't think Havok is going to make it to the next film (unless they throw out the entire orphan aspect of the character to even further display how little they care about the backstory) and the way they're handling this and the way they already handled Cyclops doesn't offer me bright prospects for the Summers family in general. Havok will probably be dead and I doubt Singer will magically start treating Cyclops right.

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Old 02-14-2011, 11:07 AM   #108
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as i said in another thread you guys should view the films as just another "alternate universe," another off shoot of the main, canon universe, 616. It's no different than the Ultimate Universe or the Marvel 2099 Universe. Just new interpretations and versions of familiar characters.

this is how you fans should approach the films

hell look at the retcons from the comics

http://marvel.wikia.com/X-Men_%28Earth-616%29/Retcons

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Old 02-14-2011, 11:19 AM   #109
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Default Re: The Official Lucas Till/Havok Thread

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I'm dying to see Destiny in an X-Film but not as Cyke's or Havok's brother...
mother...not brother...

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Old 02-14-2011, 03:05 PM   #110
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as i said in another thread you guys should view the films as just another "alternate universe," another off shoot of the main, canon universe, 616. It's no different than the Ultimate Universe or the Marvel 2099 Universe. Just new interpretations and versions of familiar characters.
I'm pretty sure almost every single interpretation of X-Men at least kept the Cyclops/Havok brother relationship alive. Even when they had them not knowing they were brothers or having one be evil and try to kill the other, they at least kept the basic foundation of their relationship alive. If it's something that consistent, obviously the writers and fans find it to be important to the characters.

This film's lack of interest in keeping that aspect of the characters alive just yells out a lack of interest in the characters in general. If this was just the first film I would buy the mentality that it can be improved in the sequel but we're on on film five already and all Singer and Fox have done is prove over and over again that they don't care about Cyclops in anyway except to show him in posters and trailers for films he barely appears in because he's a recognizable character. And the fact they gave Havok red beams and stuck him in a time period he doesn't belong just tells me that they couldn't use Cyclops but they could make some lazy attempt to reference him using Havok instead.

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Old 02-14-2011, 03:15 PM   #111
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Default Re: The Official Lucas Till/Havok Thread

so would you really prefer them be brothers 30 years apart?

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Old 02-14-2011, 05:58 PM   #112
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so would you really prefer them be brothers 30 years apart?
Good point. Them being brothers 30 years apart completely changes the dynamic of their relationship.

...as opposed to Havok being Cyclops' father completely destroying their relationship altogether. Unless Cyclops isn't raised an orphan in this series and Singer and company decide that having two red beam shooters isn't completely redundant.

This really isn't a hard choice.

And the best option of all would be to have the character be the right age in the first place instead of shoehorning him into a 60s plot he doesn't belong in just so you can use him as a reference to Cyclops.

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Old 02-14-2011, 05:59 PM   #113
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Default Re: The Official Lucas Till/Havok Thread

Double.

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Cyclops is the best superhero in the world. He is, as far as I'm concerned, the Batman. He's been in intensive training since his early teenage years to lead the first-ever mutant rescue and security team. This is a guy who gets up every morning asking himself how he can be better.

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Old 02-14-2011, 06:25 PM   #114
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Default Re: The Official Lucas Till/Havok Thread

Havok sounds like a terrible character to me, if being some guy's brother is so indespensible to his character.

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Old 02-14-2011, 07:06 PM   #115
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Havok sounds like a terrible character to me, if being some guy's brother is so indespensible to his character.
Good point. Why can not comic fanboys treat Havok better, he is not just Cyclop's litter brother. When I watched X men catoon, havok was alway saved by cyclop, and then later, havok would take cyclop's wife. That is really suck and indespensible.
I am glad X Men First class gives Havok a chance to be in the movie without obviously related to Cyclope, once being himself and a hero and badass.

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Old 02-14-2011, 07:40 PM   #116
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Except they're obviously sticking him in the shadow of Cyclops by giving him the red beams.

In that way, making them unrelated would have been a better choice. Instead of just "they're related so lets stick him in here despite the time period so we can have a nice reference and lets make his powers look similar too so as to really hammer the point in."

Edit: And no one is saying the relationship is all that matters. But it coupled with the red beams just screams to me of the same mentality that had Cyclops running around in the Wolverine film. Or had Emma be Silverfox's sister just so she would somehow fit into the plot. This series has already devolved into Mad Libs with fill in the random X-Character and Havok only seems to be in here as a reference to Cyclops. I won't be surprised if Azazel took the spot of more deserving X-Characters that are actual Hellfire Club members just for the reference to Nightcrawler.

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Old 02-14-2011, 08:08 PM   #117
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Damned if they do, damned if they don't. People complain Havok is in an origin movie, which potentially negates his proper comic book relationship with Cyclops, and then complain Azazel is in an origin movie, which potentially highlights his proper comic book relationship with Mystique and the subsequent origin of one of the most well-liked characters in the franchise, Nightcrawler.


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Old 02-15-2011, 01:39 AM   #118
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Damned if they do, damned if they don't. People complain Havok is in an origin movie, which potentially negates his proper comic book relationship with Cyclops, and then complain Azazel is in an origin movie, which potentially highlights his proper comic book relationship with Mystique and the subsequent origin of one of the most well-liked characters in the franchise, Nightcrawler.
Well I'm gonna complain because there is no reason that I can think of that having Havoc as Cyke's father is making the translation from comic to film smoother. Why even use the character Havoc, if you gonna change everything about him. He's going from Brother to father and changing his powers to be like Scott's? WTF? Again I ask why use him? I would've been alright if they just made Scott's actual dad, Christopher Summers a mutant and gave him similar powers.

Ive got no problem with Azazel in the movie and as far as I'm concerned having a father of a future Xmen in the film is more then enough at 1.

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Old 02-15-2011, 02:45 AM   #119
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I understand the complaints about Havok potentially being Cyclops' father, but there's no way in Hell you're going to catch me complaining about his power display, as though it's the end of the world. After seeing that he actually emanates waves of circles from his chest, and reading that he's so powerful that he's a danger to himself, I'll live. I've seen the color of his powers fluctuate for years in the books and, from what I've seen, they're keeping the bright white base. That works for me.

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Old 02-15-2011, 09:34 AM   #120
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Except they're obviously sticking him in the shadow of Cyclops by giving him the red beams.

In that way, making them unrelated would have been a better choice. Instead of just "they're related so lets stick him in here despite the time period so we can have a nice reference and lets make his powers look similar too so as to really hammer the point in."

Edit: And no one is saying the relationship is all that matters. But it coupled with the red beams just screams to me of the same mentality that had Cyclops running around in the Wolverine film. Or had Emma be Silverfox's sister just so she would somehow fit into the plot. This series has already devolved into Mad Libs with fill in the random X-Character and Havok only seems to be in here as a reference to Cyclops. I won't be surprised if Azazel took the spot of more deserving X-Characters that are actual Hellfire Club members just for the reference to Nightcrawler.
I genuinely don't understand the upset about the colour change. How is it sticking Havok in Cyclops' shadow? It's just a nod to their comic book lineage. Fan's will know why, and general audience won't notice. It doesn't matter.

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Old 02-15-2011, 09:37 AM   #121
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I don't see how changing the color of his beams to red would be the same as giving him similar powers. In a way, they already have them. The color wasn't the only way to differentiate between them, but the basic premise of both Alex and Scott is that they are powerful energy projectile mutants who struggle to control their abilities and use some manner of device to help them contain that power. Scott with his ruby quartz glasses and Alex with his containment suit. True, the makeup of their power (solar concussive vs. cosmic radiation/heat) and how it's released is somewhat different (eyes vs. anywhere he wants really, but typically the arm), but the basic elements and how they effect them are the same.

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Old 02-15-2011, 09:51 AM   #122
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I genuinely don't understand the upset about the colour change. How is it sticking Havok in Cyclops' shadow? It's just a nod to their comic book lineage. Fan's will know why, and general audience won't notice. It doesn't matter.
I think it's simply the fact they chose red, and that's what Scott's beam looks like. Unlike Scott, Alex's powers have never been shown with consistent color. Most of the times it's either gold/yellow or blue. It's been shown as white and (apparently) red in some comics. Personally I'm a fan of the blue/white approach, because I think it's an aesthetic that plays well in defining him against Scott.

The more I think about it, it's likely that it's either a nod to being a Summers (and as such people could draw parallels between the two) or that they tested multiple colors and thought red looked the best. While it's not my ideal look, I'm still very glad we'll at least get some take on Alex (a character Singer seemed excited to include). Now, if he starts acting like Scott, then I'd have something to gripe about.

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Old 02-15-2011, 10:21 AM   #123
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Default Re: The Official Lucas Till/Havok Thread

a fight between Scott and Alex woud have looked really cool on the big screen.

Like the Iceman/Pyros one on X3, but between two brothers.

A wasted oportunity.

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Old 02-15-2011, 10:27 AM   #124
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a fight between Scott and Alex woud have looked really cool on the big screen.

Like the Iceman/Pyros one on X3, but between two brothers.

A wasted oportunity.
Except they are immune to each other's powers....

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Old 02-15-2011, 10:30 AM   #125
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are they inmune?

I didnt know that.

What I was meaning is that it would have been a nice watch. Maybe on the danger room as part of the training. something like that.

the two brothers learning together....

I should stop thinking about that, it makes me feel a bit bad about Cyclops and Havok and their fans.

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