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Old 09-11-2010, 04:00 AM   #26
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

Its not even out yet am Im already declaring it the best show ever...which means it will get snubbed at the emmys.

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Old 09-11-2010, 01:13 PM   #27
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

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Its not even out yet am Im already declaring it the best show ever...which means it will get snubbed at the emmys.
What are you talking about, Mad Men was won three times in a row and likely one more next year.

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Old 09-11-2010, 01:21 PM   #28
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

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I never said Nolan wasn't also to blame. But the bad writing came from Goyer. That much was clear when reading the script. It was Nolan's fault for keeping so much of it, but that doesn't mean Goyer is any less a terrible writer for coming up with it in the first place. I've just never seen ANYTHING that Goyer himself wrote that was any good. Period. In fact, I pretty much find most of it to be godawful. I'm a do-the-math kind of girl - when a guy like Goyer makes a career worth of crap, then suddenly finds his name attached to a couple of gems, and those gems just happen to be creative collaborations with guys who've alternatively proven to be gem-factories, then yeah, I draw what is in my mind the only logical conclusion and assign credit where I believe it belongs: to the other guys. Because based on their prior work, Goyer is obviously the weak link, imo. Not to mention he and Nolan have very different writing styles, so it's pretty easy to tell whose writing we're witnessing. And just like you hate when people blame BB's flaws on Goyer, I hate it when he gets credited for TDK's success. So we're kind of on opposite sides of the same coin, lol. And I'm not gonna be flipping sides any time soon - I've seen more of Goyer's work than I ever cared to (or cared to admit), and I feel like I have more than enough evidence to support my case.

Honestly, he is quite possibly my very least-favorite "major" writer in all of Hollywood. He's one of the few Hollywood writers that I genuinely believe I could write better than. And I would never presume to call myself a writer. Not by a long shot. That's just how terrible I find his writing to be.

But this thread is supposed to be a celebration. Nolan and Abrams! What's not to love? And on the network discussion, let's not forget that Abrams also has a burgeoning relationship with NBC now (with the Undercovers show), so I think they are also a strong possibility. And I don't think I even need to start describing how much they need a hit, lol.
Fair enough. It's just the Goyer provided the basis of the BB script where Nolan added to. The themes, the story, it was still all there. I give them both credit. Not just to Nolan. Because without Goyer, I'm sure they would have been fine, but I think Goyer does deserve to get credit with BB, even if you dislike him. If Nolan and Goyer share the credit for its mistakes, then they share the same credit for how good it is. It wasn't one or the other, it was both of them for everything. Yes, and even the great parts. Collaboration between the two.

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Old 09-11-2010, 02:19 PM   #29
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

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Fair enough. It's just the Goyer provided the basis of the BB script where Nolan added to. The themes, the story, it was still all there. I give them both credit. Not just to Nolan. Because without Goyer, I'm sure they would have been fine, but I think Goyer does deserve to get credit with BB, even if you dislike him. If Nolan and Goyer share the credit for its mistakes, then they share the same credit for how good it is. It wasn't one or the other, it was both of them for everything. Yes, and even the great parts. Collaboration between the two.
I see what you're saying, but I completely disagree. As someone who has been a part of and witnessed some similar creative collaborations in film school, it really frustrates me to see someone getting credit for someone else's good work - regardless of whether they were both given equal credit via the WGA or not - when, as I feel is truly the case here, not everyone pulls the same creative weight. The WGA system is notoriously tricky, political and deceptive when it comes to that kind of stuff, so I generally don't refer to the "official" credits at all. I look at what I know: I read Goyer's solo draft, and I didn't like it. I STILL don't care much for the finished draft, but I felt the changes Nolan made did improve it significantly. And thanks to his directing, the actors, the music, etc, I ended up enjoying the film despite a weak script. But I'm not gonna be giving David Goyer any credit for that enjoyment anytime soon, other than for bringing is knowledge of the characters from the comics to the table.

Do I think he deserves his official credit for BB? Of course. As you said, he wrote the foundations of it, and it would be wrong not to have his name there. So professionally, I agree they should share credit. But personally, I'm not about to credit him for most of the stuff I liked about the film, as it seems obvious to me that almost none of that was his doing.

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Old 09-11-2010, 02:41 PM   #30
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

So what do you think of BB in general?

I see what you're saying now. If you didn't like the final script for BB that much then that's fine. But his knowledge of the character did help Nolan for the screenplay. Without it, hell, Nolan wouldn't have put a bag on Crane's head. The source material is just as important as the film is. Both go hand in hand for a comic book film. I just don't give Nolan the only credit. I think it's wrong for him to just get credit in both ways. After all, Goyer pitched Nolan the Superman reboot idea and Nolan loved it. Despite what someone thinks of the film, I give credit to both of them. About 90% of what Goyer wrote remains in BB. The WGA only gives certain credit. Nolan did rewrite and redo some things, but not enough to recieve credit. I see it as Goyer writing the screenplay with Nolan mixing his ideas into it. Both of their ideas led to the final outcome in the end.

Oh, I forgot to say, I do agree with you. Nolan did improve upon things from Goyer's draft, but personally, I loved the film, and realy liked the screenplay, especially the dialogue.

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Old 09-11-2010, 07:30 PM   #31
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

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So what do you think of BB in general?

I see what you're saying now. If you didn't like the final script for BB that much then that's fine. But his knowledge of the character did help Nolan for the screenplay. Without it, hell, Nolan wouldn't have put a bag on Crane's head. The source material is just as important as the film is. Both go hand in hand for a comic book film. I just don't give Nolan the only credit. I think it's wrong for him to just get credit in both ways. After all, Goyer pitched Nolan the Superman reboot idea and Nolan loved it. Despite what someone thinks of the film, I give credit to both of them. About 90% of what Goyer wrote remains in BB. The WGA only gives certain credit. Nolan did rewrite and redo some things, but not enough to recieve credit. I see it as Goyer writing the screenplay with Nolan mixing his ideas into it. Both of their ideas led to the final outcome in the end.

Oh, I forgot to say, I do agree with you. Nolan did improve upon things from Goyer's draft, but personally, I loved the film, and realy liked the screenplay, especially the dialogue.
Yeah, I don't really love BB as a whole. I'd say it's probably my least-favorite Nolan film. BUT everything Nolan added, not just in the writing, but the atmosphere, visuals, casting/acting, music...still managed to make it quite an enjoyable experience for me. And I love Batman as a character, so the fact that it was the long-awaited return of a serious Batman after the camp of the Schumacher days definitely added a rosy tint to my viewing glasses. So I do enjoy it, but I don't unabashedly love it like I do his other films. And I also feel that its biggest weakness is easily the screenplay - especially the dialogue. So on that point, we definitely disagree.

But I do agree with you on one point - that the knowledge of the comics that Goyer provides is absolutely essential to the franchise, and I do give him credit for that. It's just that...I'm not sure he brought anything to the table that many of the die hard geeks here couldn't have done. I feel the same way toward Superman - Goyer's knowledge of the comics will give Jonathan Nolan some good stories to write from (and therefore earning him another "story" credit), but I've got my fingers crossed that Goyer doesn't touch the actual screenplay. And I think the heart of our disagreement lies in the fact that I don't believe these "story" credits earn him such a lofty title as "co-writer," as he keeps getting called in the media with TDK. But mileage varies there, obviously.

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Old 09-15-2010, 11:23 PM   #32
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

J.J. Abrams' Alcatraz has been picked up by Fox.
So I would cross off Fox for the destination of the Nolan/Abrams show.

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Old 09-15-2010, 11:26 PM   #33
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

Eh. Who knows, they could be planning a JJ Abrams night of Fringe/Alcatraz/Abrams-Nolan Show..... probably not, but that would still be pretty amazing.

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Old 09-15-2010, 11:39 PM   #34
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

If I'm Bad Robot I wouldn't want two high profile projects competing for possibly one timeslot on Fox but you never know. It would be great if Fox picked them both up and then have one air in the fall and then one air in spring, each having 12-15 episode seasons uninterrupted like on cable.

There is the chance that Fringe is canceled in favour of Alcatraz or Tera Nova.

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Old 09-15-2010, 11:47 PM   #35
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

I pray that's not the case...

I'm looking forward to both, but not at the cost of Fringe.

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Old 09-15-2010, 11:53 PM   #36
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

I'm with you there but all you need is a bunch of execs looking at Fringe's ratings and thinking a new show can do better. Like most shows canceled by Fox. Rarely turns out that way.

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Old 09-15-2010, 11:58 PM   #37
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

I just hope Abrams' name alone is enough to convince them to keep it around. Get rid of one of the new series that will inevitably fail in ratings.

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Old 09-16-2010, 02:34 AM   #38
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

is this new series Undercovers? Because that looks so ****ing stupid.

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Old 09-16-2010, 10:53 AM   #39
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

No U.

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Old 09-16-2010, 12:44 PM   #40
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

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I just hope Abrams' name alone is enough to convince them to keep it around. Get rid of one of the new series that will inevitably fail in ratings.
There is Ride Along, Lie to Me, their hour of live action comedies, Hell's Kitchen, Fringe, Human Target and The Good Guys as potentially not coming back next season. Maybe Lone Star.

Warner Bros. is the production company behind Fringe/Human Target while Fox TV is behind Lie to Me/The Good Guys/Lone Star/Ride Along.

Not always the case but networks tend to favour shows that they own. So if those six shows are on the cancellation docket, Fox may favour shows that will make the company money with a syndication package. There is no real incentive to order another season of Fringe so it can get a decent 80+ episode syndication deal for Warner Bros. TV.

NBC aired Scrubs and My Name Is Earl but they didn't own it like they do 30 Rock, The Office, Parks & Rec. ABC picked up Touchtone's (now ABC Studios) Scrubs to fill a timeslot and to potentially increase the show total so they can make money, no matter how little it may be, its extra money they can earn from around the world. Fox thought of picking up My Name is Earl but couldn't work a deal. NBC canceled Medium but CBS's TV production company owned it so now the show is on CBS.

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Old 09-16-2010, 01:40 PM   #41
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

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There is the chance that Fringe is canceled in favour of Alcatraz or Tera Nova.
Nah, I seriously doubt that.

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Old 09-16-2010, 02:13 PM   #42
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

Ratings weren't great for the second season, there has to be someone looking at ratings that thinks that another show could do better in the demo and overall viewers. See what the first few weeks bring.

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Old 09-18-2010, 12:33 AM   #43
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

I saw that this may end up on CBS, which I'm a little meh about, but hey, if this, as well as Hawaii Five-0, can bring the network back to being respectable, then I'm all for it.

Just get some talented comedic writers in there.

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Old 09-18-2010, 02:23 AM   #44
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

Where are they going to put this besides Friday? Maybe Wednesday, they'll figure it out. Its going to pilot so we will see a cast for this, has to be a frontrunner at CBS which has a only a few shows they could cancel.

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J.J. Abrams and Jonah Nolan's TV Pilot, Person of Interest, Goes to CBS

It may be time to stop with the CBS-isn't-cool jokes: Vulture has learned that the Eye has all but closed a deal for the rights to Person of Interest, the new hour-long drama being developed by J.J. Abrams and Dark Knight/The Prestige co-writer Jonah Nolan (brother of Christopher, and often credited as "Jonathan"). Nolan is penning the pilot for the crime thriller, which first hit the network market earlier this month via Abrams and partner Bryan Burk's Bad Robot (based at Warner Bros. TV). It attracted strong interest from multiple networks, but CBS stepped up with a pilot commitment and won out, according to insiders.

If Person makes it to series, it will be the first time Abrams will produce a project for CBS; he's previously had shows at ABC (Lost, What About Brian), Fox (Fringe and a just-sold Alcatraz drama), NBC (Undercovers), and CW predecessor the WB (Felicity). While we're still trying to dig up details on Person, Nolan's work (he also wrote the short story that Memento was based on) makes a twisty ride likely. In addition, since Nolan is a TV newbie — and Abrams is a very, very busy man these days — it wouldn't be surprising if another seasoned producer ends up joining Abrams, Nolan, and Burk as an executive producer on the project. CBS and Warner Bros. declined comment.

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Old 09-18-2010, 06:50 PM   #45
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

I need to know more...

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Old 09-18-2010, 06:54 PM   #46
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We need to go deeper.

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Old 01-12-2011, 03:33 PM   #47
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

title Person of Interest

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Old 02-10-2011, 11:44 AM   #48
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CBS Picks Up Abrams and Nolan's Person of Interest

Source: Variety
February 10, 2011


Variety says that CBS has picked up J.J.Abrams pilot "Person of Interest," a crime drama written by The Dark Knight screenwriter Jonathan Nolan.

The project, from Bad Robot and WarnerBros. TV, centers on a CIA paramilitary officer, presumed dead, who is recruited to work on a secret project for a reclusive billionaire.

Nolan, Abrams and Bad Robot's Bryan Burk are executive producers.





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Old 02-10-2011, 11:53 AM   #49
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Default Re: New series from J.J Abrams and Joanthan Nolan

CBS, it's not bad, that tv network does draw a lot of viewers. I'm intrigued by the small description of the plot.

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Old 02-10-2011, 11:54 AM   #50
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Sign me up!

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