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Old 01-27-2010, 05:08 PM   #26
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Lightbulb Re: The Clinton Thread

SECRETARY CLINTON TO REMAIN IN LONDON; WILL MISS 'SOTU'
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...-union-speech/

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Old 02-11-2010, 03:39 PM   #27
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Default Re: The Future of the DEMOCRATIC Party

BREAKING NEWS:

Former President Clinton has been hospitalized.

No details have been given yet.

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Old 02-11-2010, 03:43 PM   #28
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Default Re: The Political Lounge: Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Lounginess

Bill Clinton is hospitalized

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Old 02-11-2010, 03:49 PM   #29
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Default Re: The Future of the DEMOCRATIC Party

A few more details...

He is hospitalized in Manhattan, and early reports say that it is something with his heart once again, that goes along with his heart bypass in 2004.

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Old 02-11-2010, 04:00 PM   #30
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Lightbulb Re: The Clinton Thread

Edit: Kel beat me to it.

I hope he's ok...


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Old 02-11-2010, 04:06 PM   #31
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Default Re: The Political Lounge: Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Lounginess

They say it looks like he needs a stint and Hillary does not appear to be concerned. Of course the latter may not be an indicator........

If it's a stint that's a fairly common procedure and he'll feel better VERY quickly (both parents had them - well I guess both still do but only Mom is using her's now).

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Old 02-11-2010, 04:09 PM   #32
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Default Re: The Clinton Thread

Aren't stints a temporary fix?

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Old 02-11-2010, 04:43 PM   #33
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Default Re: The Clinton Thread

Yes, unless you can stay chilled, and eat right....and many times they work for long periods of time.

1. He is eating better...
2. He has not chilled or slowed down, I don't think he has the ability to do that. He was sick while he was in Haiti, so that along with the stress of the trip could have caused the extra work on the heart, which causes the heart pain.

They say he will be in the hospital anywhere from 1 to 3 days, and Secretary Clinton has not changed her plans as of yet to fly to I believe Asia, tomorrow.

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Old 02-11-2010, 04:45 PM   #34
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Default Re: The Clinton Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marx View Post
Aren't stints a temporary fix?
Not always, no. Often they can be used in place of bypass. They DO have a "shelf life" and may need to be replaced - if you live long enough - but they aren't generally used as a hold over until a more permanent solution avails itself.

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Old 02-11-2010, 05:03 PM   #35
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Default Re: The Clinton Thread

Bill Clinton hospitalized for chest pains

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35355089/ns/politics
Quote:
"Today President Bill Clinton was admitted to the Columbia Campus of New York Presbyterian Hospital after feeling discomfort in his chest," adviser Doug Band said in a statement. "Following a visit to his cardiologist, he underwent a procedure to place two stents in one of his coronary arteries."

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Old 02-11-2010, 10:16 PM   #36
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Default Re: The Clinton Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kel View Post
Yes, unless you can stay chilled, and eat right....and many times they work for long periods of time.

1. He is eating better...
2. He has not chilled or slowed down, I don't think he has the ability to do that. He was sick while he was in Haiti, so that along with the stress of the trip could have caused the extra work on the heart, which causes the heart pain.

They say he will be in the hospital anywhere from 1 to 3 days, and Secretary Clinton has not changed her plans as of yet to fly to I believe Asia, tomorrow.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VampElvis View Post
Not always, no. Often they can be used in place of bypass. They DO have a "shelf life" and may need to be replaced - if you live long enough - but they aren't generally used as a hold over until a more permanent solution avails itself.
I just know that a co-worker's husband hasn't had an easy time with them. He's had to have them replaced more than once.

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Old 02-11-2010, 10:27 PM   #37
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Lightbulb Re: The Clinton Thread

DOCTOR: CLINTON'S PROGNOSIS IS 'EXCELLENT'
http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/02/...ex.html?hpt=T1

Great news!

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Old 02-12-2010, 11:51 AM   #38
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Lightbulb Re: The Clinton Thread

CLINTON RELEASED FROM HOSPITAL
http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/02/...ex.html?hpt=T2

Great news!

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Old 02-12-2010, 12:57 PM   #39
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Default Re: The Clinton Thread

It is. I would hate to be forced to hear a week talking about the "great" Bill Clinton while people forget the fact he was a disgusting sexual predator.

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Old 02-12-2010, 01:13 PM   #40
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Default Re: The Clinton Thread

Come on man, you are overblowing it a bit. His offense was infidelity and lying. If he got his BJs without being married, no one would care.

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Old 02-12-2010, 03:49 PM   #41
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Default Re: The Clinton Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by StorminNorman View Post
It is. I would hate to be forced to hear a week talking about the "great" Bill Clinton while people forget the fact he was a disgusting sexual predator.
Clinton was an amazing president...and he has done incredible work post-presidency. The Lewinsky scandal does not change that. At all.

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Old 02-13-2010, 01:07 PM   #42
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Default Re: The Clinton Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by StorminNorman View Post
It is. I would hate to be forced to hear a week talking about the "great" Bill Clinton while people forget the fact he was a disgusting sexual predator.

Whoa whoa, sexual predator?

I don't recall him diddling any kids, breaking into people's homes and raping women or men or anything.

Pretty sure the guy cheated on his wife. And while a terrible, disgusting thing, sexual predator is a little heavy handed there. Nor does it turn away from what he did in office.

Hate the guy all you want, but don't go about putting labels reserved for people who have to put signs in their front yards on Halloween which tell children to stay away, and likewise aren't allowed in public libraries.

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Old 02-14-2010, 05:46 PM   #43
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Lightbulb Re: The Clinton Thread

BILL CLINTON: 'I HAVE TO KEEP WORKING'
http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/02/...art/index.html

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Old 02-14-2010, 11:19 PM   #44
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Default Re: The Clinton Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paradoxium View Post
Come on man, you are overblowing it a bit. His offense was infidelity and lying. If he got his BJs without being married, no one would care.
While it is true, people would have cared far less if he wasn't, women have claimed he has been guilty of much more than infidelity and lying. Further more Lewinski has alleged that Clinton was receiving her services while on the phone with a member of Congress - an act demonstrating a distressing lack of regard for the office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marx View Post
Clinton was an amazing president...and he has done incredible work post-presidency. The Lewinsky scandal does not change that. At all.
He was not an amazing President and people need to get over Lewinksy. Clinton's misbehavior went beyond Lewinsky. The man is a lying scumbag and the sort of individual that no respectable individual would want to stay

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Originally Posted by Mistress Gluon View Post
Whoa whoa, sexual predator?

I don't recall him diddling any kids, breaking into people's homes and raping women or men or anything.

Pretty sure the guy cheated on his wife. And while a terrible, disgusting thing, sexual predator is a little heavy handed there. Nor does it turn away from what he did in office.

Hate the guy all you want, but don't go about putting labels reserved for people who have to put signs in their front yards on Halloween which tell children to stay away, and likewise aren't allowed in public libraries.
Google Juanita Broaddrick.

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Old 02-14-2010, 11:46 PM   #45
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Oh yeah. The lady who filed charges against Clinton which never revealed anything, nor was she ever called during his impeachment process because there was nothing to support her case?

I wasn't aware flaky, unsupported allegations of rape with zero evidence (aside from them being in the same town on the same day), with claims of mafia like strong-arming were the only professional pieces needed to call someone a sexual predator. o.o

Dude, you need to let the irrational hate go.

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Old 02-15-2010, 01:09 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistress Gluon View Post
Oh yeah. The lady who filed charges against Clinton which never revealed anything, nor was she ever called during his impeachment process because there was nothing to support her case?

I wasn't aware flaky, unsupported allegations of rape with zero evidence (aside from them being in the same town on the same day), with claims of mafia like strong-arming were the only professional pieces needed to call someone a sexual predator. o.o

Dude, you need to let the irrational hate go.
The only difference between Juanita Brodrick and Monica Lewinsky is that Monica had the smarts to keep the blue dress. The only difference between Junaita Brodrick and Gennifer Flowers is that Gennifer had the smarts to record phone calls. In all the cases the women, at first, denied (sometimes under oath) their relationships with Bubba.

I'm sorry, but my hate isn't "irrational". The only reason why Democrats hold him in such a high light is that they have to - the party hasn't had a likable President since Kennedy. They ignore the fact that Clinton's Presidency was in shambles before Gingrich came to town and Clinton had to play under his rules.

Clinton's foreign policy was laughable: he allowed Jimmy Carter to negotiate a deal with North Korea, he gutted the CIA, the sold secrets to China, and he took no real action against Al Qaeda in the face of several attacks against American interests.

You can point to Clinton for one of the main reasons of the 2008 economic collapse with his work with the Community Reinvestment Act.

He also left Bush with a recession.

Oh yea, and we could then consider the impeachment, the selling out of the Lincoln Bedroom, Travelgate, the SELLING OF PRESIDENTIAL PARDONS FOR PERSONAL BRIBES, the stealing of White House furniture, etc.

There is no defense for Bill Clinton as an "amazing President". If he didn't have the benefit of being before Bush and being one of the most charismatic politicians America has ever seen, he would be regarded as one of the most disgusting leaders in American history.

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Old 02-15-2010, 02:27 AM   #47
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Ah, yes. The alleged bribes where Hillary's brother apparently accepted money, and then told the President how to do his job. However, selling presidential pardons? Big time no no. Clinton would be serving time right now in found guilty of that. As would Hillary's brother. A loooong time.

Or selling history for other people to share and enjoy. Truly an evil man. =l (To be absolutely fair, I find it a little disrespectful. But sharing a nations history isn't exactly a bad thing)

Allowing former presidents to help with negotiations is nothing new for any president, and is usually a sign of respect for former presidents who wish to use their influence to help American interests abroad and at home. Absolutely insidious.

As for gutting the CIA, he asked them to reduce spending where? It's not just, "Yeah, everything you're doing. 40% of that needs to go." Budget cuts, ESPECIALLY in DoD areas, are always targeted of purpose, like the Cold War funding budget cuts and reallocation. However, his counter-terrorism had not suffered nearly as much, especially by the idea he gave authorization to the euthanasia of Bin Laden. The big thing about CIA budget is, we're not allowed to know it. So when and if it finds itself getting "gutted" it's either at the admission of the CIA director, the President, or someone who has some form of control over that, like Congress. It's easy for some field workers to say, "Yeah, we got budget cuts, so we can't perform our job as well," or "Since there was a reallocation of resources, it prevented us from performing as well as we have," or "Yeah, Clinton's budget-cuts in no way show the leaks America has always suffered since the days of WW2, where American's have constantly pointed the finger at other countries who developed technologies fairly similar to American technologies." This leads to -

The truth of the matter with "selling secrets" is 1) The most likely case is, Clinton is trying to show good faith towards a country you've ALWAYS had a problem with, and they're sort of your friend for now. Remember, even back then, China was an emerging economic power. Not making friends with people who you sort of want to make money off of is not very smart. 2) China is not constructed of idiots. Eventually they WILL figure out rocket technology. With 1 billion people there, it's not hard to believe a group of them might eventually figure out how to put a cylinder into space. Iran can do it, and I'm fairly sure they don't need Clinton selling our government secrets for that. 3) Companies share and sell information all the time. It's a cornerstone of business industry. "You scratch my back by doing my work for cheaper, I'll scratch your back by sharing some information. We all win." America definitely should not take one out of Russia's book, and just go into supreme isolation, rather than try to build bridges with the world's largest populated country. It worked out great for Russia being isolated, after all. Pretty sure that Soviet Union is just chugging along well without any allies to speak of. But the real thing of this is, nobody really KNOWS if Clinton did it. Especially as it was all allegedly tied to illegal funding. As it's highly f'ing illegal to do so, Clinton (if caught doing it) would be serving quite a long sentence in prison right now.

Also, carpet bombing several thought of al-Quaeda facilities. Not a real reaction at all. It's not like Clinton got some form of backfire for destroying any Sudanese pharmaceutical plants in the crossfire or anything like that.

I forgot about the evil CRA revision. Clinton's plan to refine examinations along more consistent qualities, reduce paperwork needed, extend credit to everybody, and to reduce costs was part of his evil, overarching plan to cripple the country itself. Evil indeed. Dr. Doom would learn well from Clinton. Because, it is well known in no way could the situation be taken advantage of in unforeseen ways like many laws and technologies do by industry leaders and individuals themselves.

Clinton didn't like, "Yeah, I'm gonna totally jump start a recession," and then dump it on the next president. Recessions and growths are common. During the 90's growth, which would be the longest growth America had ever seen economically under Clinton's watch, America had achieved an economic surplus it had never seen before. Unfortunately, it would be things like the dotcom bubble burst, terrorist attacks, and other factors which led to an extremely minor recession. This recession would only last for a single year in 2001, and would not see another recession for another six years in 2007. In 2002, America was believed to be in a non progressing, yet non recessing economy. Many people believe the terrorist attacks were what put the nail in the coffin for the recession at all, and could have possibly been avoided.

As for Travelgate, what I remember about it was: Clinton fired his Travel Dept because the FBI had told him they were embezzling money, and would in turn hire another firm he knew (which wasn't necessarily as devious as it sounds, as it was a travel firm they used back in Arkansas regularly). The courts stepped in, told him to give them jobs elsewhere, and replace the firm. Some people were charged with embezzlement, but were never convicted as guilty ultimately. Apparently, the Travel Office had an "off the books" ledger, with over a dozen thousand dollars unaccounted for, and is most likely assumed to have been used for personal reasons, or to accommodate the press which regularly visited. This was not helped by the idea one of the staffers held highly messed up paperwork. In the end, the President was not found guilty of any wrongdoing, or conspiracy to serve his own agenda.

In all honesty, if those are the WORST things a president of the United States ever has to come against, allegations of wrongdoing, with the only charge sticking is his adultery with Monica and Gennifer, and the rest having no evidence for, then he actually was a pretty good president. Hardly anything here holds any weight other than allegations without substantial evidence to back them. Most of the charges of adultery fall apart when under scrutiny, and the rest of it just personal hatred for whatever reason.

I mean, was the guy the all time best president America ever had? No. But he didn't dress up in a cape, wring his hands menacingly, cackle at night by lightning storms, have horses jump and run at the sound of his name, or scheme world domination plans as the leader of the Bilderberg Group in their Fortress of Evil. It's not ignorant to call your hatred irrational, when really, the guy is being accused of unfair things.

It's one thing to hate a man on principle for cheating on his wife. Fully understood, and fully sympathized. It's another to hear about something he might have done, grip it as the absolute fact of existence, and launch cannons at the guy with no evidence for it.

Now, if you -have- evidence for it, I'd love to see it. I'm always willing to review evidence I'm not aware of previously (especially in politics, since information is always on an emerging scale). But if not, cool off, take a few breaths, and relax.

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Old 02-15-2010, 11:22 AM   #48
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I don't expect much from politicians in terms of personal morality. Wouldn't excuse his infidelity, but I would place it fairly low on a list of complaints. However his behavior always did seem to have a lascivious stench to accompany. I would place the Ricky Ray Rector debacle in a decently high spot along with some other things that have already been mentioned. The Hitchens book No One Left To Lie To is a pretty good read, though there is an obvious bias.

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Old 02-15-2010, 11:41 AM   #49
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He was not an amazing President and people need to get over Lewinksy. Clinton's misbehavior went beyond Lewinsky. The man is a lying scumbag and the sort of individual that no respectable individual would want to stay.
Well...you are certainly entitled to your own opinion.

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Old 02-15-2010, 12:14 PM   #50
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Default Re: The Clinton Thread

A woman wanting to preform sexual acts on a man makes the man a sexual predator?

A wah?

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