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Old 05-16-2011, 12:24 AM   #76
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

What did you think about The Dark Knight?

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Old 05-16-2011, 12:44 AM   #77
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

People seriously need to get over the whole no Jean, Ice Man or Cyclops in First Class. The movie series has been different from the comic since the first movie, it's kinda dumb to get all worked up about it. It's just a movie, the comics will always exist.

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Old 05-16-2011, 12:58 AM   #78
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

The Dark Knight was great, they didnt mess with the Origin or anything, its based off the Year One series which is alot darker and like gritty but the movie incorporated alot of stuff but it did not mess with his origin or powers or change who batman/Bruce Wayne is.

im not opposed to like seperate story lines and exploring characters in new ways as long as that doesnt involve changing who the core character is.

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Old 05-16-2011, 03:20 AM   #79
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

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Originally Posted by Zelkar View Post
You cannot take something like the origin… and just make it how you want, you cant write in your own characters or change the ones that are there...
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Originally Posted by Zelkar View Post
The Dark Knight was great, they didnt mess with the Origin or anything, its based off the Year One series which is alot darker and like gritty but the movie incorporated alot of stuff but it did not mess with his origin or powers or change who batman/Bruce Wayne is.

im not opposed to like seperate story lines and exploring characters in new ways as long as that doesnt involve changing who the core character is.
You mean Batman Begins? And Begins is a combination of a lot more than just Year One. It combines and omits numerous characters and storylines and even goes so far as to create movie specific characters and storylines. For instance, off the top of my head, when did Henri Ducard and Ra’s Al Guhl become the same person? And when did Bruce Wayne receive training from Ra’s and the League of Assassins, who have been renamed the League of Shadows for the movie, and when was Ra’s the person who instilled the notion that Wayne needs to become something more than just a man to combat his opponents? And who is childhood friend and district attorney Rachel Dawes, and why is she in the movie at all???

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Old 05-16-2011, 03:22 AM   #80
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

Heh, he's got you there.

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Old 05-16-2011, 06:21 AM   #81
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

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This movie takes liberties, changing Origins and such but what they change it too never happened in any of the comics or i the ydid it was a minor story or an alternate universe the Core origin stories don't change that much.
But the x-men movies arent trying to retell the comics, theyre making thier own universe.

Just like how the Ultimate comics, completely changed characters origins and how the video games change origins.

I dont understand this notion that the Movies are supposed to be an exact retelling of the comics.

and I hear a lot of people hoping for the rights to go back to Marvel.
But even if Marvel did remake the x-films, theyre never gonna just use the O5. and characters would be moved around and changed.

Final words...

They use the comics as inspiration, that is all.

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Old 05-16-2011, 06:46 AM   #82
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

Agreed, movies and comics just are never going to be the same thing. To be honest, they'd be kind of boring if they were. hell, even practically shot-per-shot adaptations like Sin City and Watchmen had their own little changes or additions. Because let's face it, as a movie audience, we WANT some kind of surprise. I don't want to pay to see something I could just stay home and read for free... And even so, even if a person DID adapt straight from the comic, look at all the people still complaining about Sin City and Watchmen.

Lol I know I'm going to get it where it counts for this, but, IMO one of best adaptations from comics to film is The Crow, and look at how much they changed that! The film and the comic are two totally different things! Both are still relatable, still comparable, but are very different... and Yet? Both are still held very high for each being their own things. THAT'S what I want out of an x-men film, or any comic adaptation for that matter.

Something where I can say "Haha, I recognize that! I remember that from the comic! Oh I totally got that reference!" but at the end of it all, can say that the film surprised me in many ways, and was an experience that kept me in suspense for the thrill of seeing what happens on the next page..., only without having to actually turn the page to get there, because I'm watching a movie, not reading a comic book.

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Old 05-16-2011, 08:42 AM   #83
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

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Heh, he's got you there.
I was the setup

It's the greatest tool ever on here. I use it all the time. People who come on here to complain about comic accuracy 99.9% of the time take out their junk when watching Nolan's Batman even though Batman Begins and TDK change so many things from the comics and graphic novels it's hilarious. Nolan made an adaptation and two good movies but he somehow gets a pass from fanboys when it comes to accuracy.

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Old 05-16-2011, 12:18 PM   #84
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

I can list you plenty of things the Nolan batman films,the Marvel Studios films,and
the Sam Rami Spider-Man films changed yet I only hear about what Bryan Singer
changed.

People forget

a;Singer revived the genre
B:he had to work with a very small budget
C:He had to make X-Men when Hollywood was down on Superheroes after the Batman
and Robin fiasco
D:He payed the way for those like Chris Nolan and Jon Favraru
E:Kevin Feige has said Without the work on X-Men Marvel studios wouldn't be making
their own films

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Old 05-16-2011, 01:43 PM   #85
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

um, everything you just said about singers film but even more appropriate when applied to the always overlooked Blade movie.

Remove it from history and things would be very different right now. Not only was it a serious take on the genre, it was restricted.
(and yes, had the very first use of bullet time gosh darn it)

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Old 05-16-2011, 01:48 PM   #86
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

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Originally Posted by chaseter View Post
I was the setup

It's the greatest tool ever on here. I use it all the time. People who come on here to complain about comic accuracy 99.9% of the time take out their junk when watching Nolan's Batman even though Batman Begins and TDK change so many things from the comics and graphic novels it's hilarious. Nolan made an adaptation and two good movies but he somehow gets a pass from fanboys when it comes to accuracy.
that was pretty funny

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Old 05-16-2011, 02:00 PM   #87
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um, everything you just said about singers film but even more appropriate when applied to the always overlooked Blade movie.

Remove it from history and things would be very different right now. Not only was it a serious take on the genre, it was restricted.
(and yes, had the very first use of bullet time gosh darn it)
Blade got the ball rolling.

But X-Men took the ball and RAN with it.

and the ball hasn't stopped yet.

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Old 05-16-2011, 02:57 PM   #88
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

Yes Blade deserves some credit but Blade was greenlighted and was filming before
Batman and Robin came out.Blade was originally suspose to come out In early 1998
but was delayed to august.Few thought it would be a success and the fact It was based
on a comic was not very promated.

So much of the genre today we owe to X-men.

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Old 05-16-2011, 10:12 PM   #89
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

I see your point about batman, had I been as big a fan of batman as I am of the Xmen i probably would have complained about that as well but Even with all the flaws it had it was SO well done that you could look past most of them.

I didnt like that they made R'as Al Ghul and Henri Ducard the same Person but I dont remember that much about Henri Ducard to begin with other than he trained Bruce Wayne and popped up every once in a while, think him and Robin had something goin at one time as well. As i said I wasnt as big into batman as i was the Xmen.

But also R'as al ghul was always shady, and possesed differnt people throughout the stories I thought it was kinda cool they took that idea to sort of another level with what I remember to be a minor character (Henri) and made him bigger in the movie by sort of making it a dual role.

But they never messed with batman, they didnt change his origin or his backstory or who he was they just built on it and added to it, made it better.
Im complaining about Xmen because (again i could be wrong im just basing this off of trailers and previews) they are completely changing who some of the characters are.

its not like batman where you have 1 central character that everybody knows and loves, for me Xmen itself is a character all of its own and all the Team members are a part of it. When you say you are doing qn origin of the team you cant take parts out and change them around you have to show things how it started and then build on that.

It would be like if they made batman a woman or a teenager, kept his parents alive and gave him down syndrome. It wouldnt be the same character

I dont mind that they are creating there own story that is cool its all the character changes i am against.

Like im not against new stories an character additions and all that, i know not everything can translate directly i wouldnt mind if all they were doing was you know adding some background info or adding additional members or events but they are completely rewriting and replacing almost everything.

I think its BS to say this fits into one of the alternate universes or series because then that just gives them free reign to write whatever they want and completely disregard everything. They should have done this as a reboot with the original team then branch out in the sequels and bring in other characters an story lines.

Dont rewrite everything so they can fit in the characters they want.

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Old 05-17-2011, 12:37 AM   #90
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

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It would be like if they made batman a woman or a teenager, kept his parents alive and gave him down syndrome. It wouldnt be the same character.
Aaaaaand right there.Thats when all your crediability goes down the drain

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Old 05-17-2011, 12:43 AM   #91
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

Ha!

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Old 05-17-2011, 02:16 AM   #92
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Hows that lol? just trying to make a point if you change who the characters are, if you change there backstory, origin, there families, there experiences, how they got to where they are then they arnt that character anymore they are just shells of what they should be, thats all im saying.

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Old 05-17-2011, 02:42 AM   #93
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You honestly cant compare things like Shaw's slightly different powers (which are still about absorption of energy) or not having jean or scott or iceman in the first class to changing Batman into a teenaged girl with parents who suffers from down syndrome. There are ALWAYS changes when you take something from comic to film, thats why it's called an ADAPTION, some things simply dont work on film, and sometimes concessions have to be made.But seriously even with the differences,the vital essence of the characters reamain intact.

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Old 05-17-2011, 04:08 AM   #94
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

From what ive seen there doing alot more than changing powers a little bit. and again yes not having Scott, Jean, Iceman and Angel IS a big deal at least for me, they ARE the first class they are the original Xmen and theres no reason to change that.

from what ive read they are apparently completely rewriting some characters and changing there families or mixing the bloodlines all around which is not cool, theres no reason for it, other than them trying to force it into the other movies continuity which is BS.

Like i said im cool with change, I understand some change is needed when adapting to film but im not cool with changing the Core Characters and the Team, it could have been avoided.

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Old 05-17-2011, 04:46 AM   #95
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

Comics often scramble up character backgrounds for the sake of the story as well, not to the same extent as they may be for this movie but nevertheless characters are often edited to fit with the plot. I think comes down to the fact that two artists are going to depict a character in two different ways, two writers will write a character in two different ways and two different actors will portray a character in two different ways. Although they have made a few bid changes to the characters in First Class I don't feel that they've done any damage to the characters themselves, Alex is still going to be Alex, regardless of whether they decide to link him to Scott in any way. It's like a paper mâché, the inside is going to be made of the same newspaper and glue it always was, it's only the little details on the outside that change.

Granted changes in bloodlines and families are huge but I think with the right cast and the right script and plot the X-Men feel won't be lost.

Of course this is just my measly little opinion XD

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Old 05-17-2011, 06:22 AM   #96
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

Ummm Banshee, Beast, Havok, Mystique and Emma look amazing!

It totally feels like an X-Men movie to me.

Not every X-movie should have Cyclops or Wolverine.

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Old 05-17-2011, 10:25 AM   #97
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

Yes because these movies had such an overload of Cyclops. They need to stop because we've seen way too much of him.

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Old 05-17-2011, 11:37 AM   #98
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I know what you're getting at, but I'm sure that when he mentions Cyclops, he's not talking about exposure, but rather the appearance itself.

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Old 05-17-2011, 12:49 PM   #99
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

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From what ive seen there doing alot more than changing powers a little bit. and again yes not having Scott, Jean, Iceman and Angel IS a big deal at least for me, they ARE the first class they are the original Xmen and theres no reason to change that.

from what ive read they are apparently completely rewriting some characters and changing there families or mixing the bloodlines all around which is not cool, theres no reason for it, other than them trying to force it into the other movies continuity which is BS.

Like i said im cool with change, I understand some change is needed when adapting to film but im not cool with changing the Core Characters and the Team, it could have been avoided.

Well it was always impossible to have the O5 anyway because of X-men 1. So it was obvious we'd never get the comic first class.

I always loved the proposed movie first class more anyway (Jean, Cyclops, Beast and Storm) and I know were gonna be seeing that if/when they make sequels. So Im fine thing that.

I believe the only family etc. that is being changed is Havok and Cyclops relationship. But apparently theyre still brothers, just ages switched around.

and yes the characters may appear a little different in this movie. but its when they are all younger. We've not seen much about Xavier etc. when they were young in the comcs.
So Xavier may have been a bit of a player,

Im actually struggling to think of differences in characters. obviously the events around them are different, but the characters are still the same as they are in the comics. Apart from Xavier sleeping around, which at first I found a little weird.

Im just curious what your ideas would have been for this film Zelkar, while still keeping it in continuity? (I know you prefer reboot)

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Old 05-17-2011, 05:08 PM   #100
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Default Re: "This movie does not feel X-Men"

But even of Cyclops and Havok aren't family Alex's character isn't going to be completely unfaithful to the comics...he'll still be Havok.

Anyways, the movie looks fine to me. I don't think it was ever meant to be a perfect reenactment of the comics.

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