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Old 07-03-2011, 08:04 PM   #101
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Default Re: The Official X-Men: First Class Rate and Review Thread: Third Edition

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Super 8 was the best movie all summer. And Thor was ****ing amazing.

And so was this.
Good to see the summer is already over.

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Worst part of the movie: When it was over
Best Part: the whole movie.

I think the movie has a lot of symbolism and depth than we think.

Example: The coin revealing the title of the movie. The coin title itself reveals that Magneto will face his choice of becoming as bad as a Nazi or becoming an X men.

The "blood and honor" knife contradicts what the ex nazi satement that they were just following orders.

I thought it was way better than TDK, more genuine, more human, deep without being too serious, a lot more fun, better acting (I am looking at you Bale with your Vader voice). TDK is symbolism for dummies because the writers tell you what they are, FC does it without words and it feels a lot more memorable.


And then there is Oldman, Caine, Freeman, Eckhart, and yes Bale, his growling and all.

I really like FC. It is nowhere near TDK or Batman Begins. You want to talk symbolism for dummies? See "Mutant and Proud".

I also find it hard to call something genuine when I watch how the final beach scene plays out after "the accident". If something like that happened to my only friend for something like 15-20 years, I wouldn't shed about two tears and then act like nothing happened.

H

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Old 07-03-2011, 09:11 PM   #102
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I really like FC. It is nowhere near TDK or Batman Begins. You want to talk symbolism for dummies? See "Mutant and Proud".
I prefer First Class to both those Batman movies because it's more rounded and 'enjoyable', but it's fair to say Nolan's work overall is more solid and never feels compromised in any way (though it's also very 'male').

Batman films are always going to have the advantage over X-Men because a) Batman is more well-known b) there is only one main character in a Batman film, whereas X-Men by its very nature has a team (and therefore needs a team of opponents, thus doubling the character numbers)

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I also find it hard to call something genuine when I watch how the final beach scene plays out after "the accident". If something like that happened to my only friend for something like 15-20 years, I wouldn't shed about two tears and then act like nothing happened.
Erik was portrayed as a loner full of bitterness and the desire for revenge; he always had his own agenda, he always wanted to kill Shaw regardless of what Xavier hoped for. Their brief friendship in the film makes his abandonment of Xavier feel more natural than if they had known each other for years at that point. Plus, Magneto was not aware Xavier was paralysed at the time he left.

In addition, Magneto was quite prepared to leave Xavier to die in the dam in X2. This is a man driven by his own ideological agendas, not by any emotional attachment to anyone else.

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Old 07-03-2011, 09:33 PM   #103
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I prefer First Class to both those Batman movies because it's more rounded and 'enjoyable', but it's fair to say Nolan's work overall is more solid and never feels compromised in any way (though it's also very 'male').
I don't understand the "more rounded" comment.

As to the enjoyable part. I don't see it. As a one off, thrilling experience, there really isn't anything like TDK. Both it and Begins hold up in a very special way. The dry and at times dark sense of humor is brilliant and keeps you smiling.

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Batman films are always going to have the advantage over X-Men because a) Batman is more well-known b) there is only one main character in a Batman film, whereas X-Men by its very nature has a team (and therefore needs a team of opponents, thus doubling the character numbers)
Nolan's Batman has handled more fully realized characters in two films then 5 X-men films put together.

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Erik was portrayed as a loner full of bitterness and the desire for revenge; he always had his own agenda, he always wanted to kill Shaw regardless of what Xavier hoped for. Their brief friendship in the film makes his abandonment of Xavier feel more natural than if they had known each other for years at that point. Plus, Magneto was not aware Xavier was paralysed at the time he left.

In addition, Magneto was quite prepared to leave Xavier to die in the dam in X2. This is a man driven by his own ideological agendas, not by any emotional attachment to anyone else.
You have seen First Class right? Why do you think I was talking about Erik? They haven't even known one another for 6 months, much less 15-20 years.

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Old 07-04-2011, 12:28 AM   #104
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I guess so.

Maybe, I prefer when a movie leaves certain things to our interpretation.

Am I the only getting the impression that this is how the Star Wars prequels should have been ? God, I was glad when Anakin burned like a crisp. In FC, there are times when I found myself agreeing with Magneto. Who would not ?

I found an interesting analysis of the movie.
http://andmysidearm.wordpress.com/20...rik-lehnsherr/
I... I just could not even finish reading that article. It is just so far out there I can't even begin to lend it any credibility.

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Old 07-04-2011, 12:32 AM   #105
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I don't understand the "more rounded" comment.

As to the enjoyable part. I don't see it. As a one off, thrilling experience, there really isn't anything like TDK. Both it and Begins hold up in a very special way. The dry and at times dark sense of humor is brilliant and keeps you smiling.



Nolan's Batman has handled more fully realized characters in two films then 5 X-men films put together.



You have seen First Class right? Why do you think I was talking about Erik? They haven't even known one another for 6 months, much less 15-20.
Meh, call me bias (I am a huge X-Men fan, where I don't feel the same level of attachment for Batman), but I'd much prefer any of the X-Men films over either of Nolan's Batman films. They are good. But really, the only thing about those movies that's truly memorable to me is Ledger's Joker.

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In addition, Magneto was quite prepared to leave Xavier to die in the dam in X2. This is a man driven by his own ideological agendas, not by any emotional attachment to anyone else.
I thought this was shown rather well in X-Men: The Last Stand. The respect Magneto has for Xavier is obvious, but when he states "My only regret is that he had to die for our dream to live" to me really shows that above that respect is his willingness to sacrifice anything and everything for his cause. His cause is above all else, even his close friends.

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Old 07-04-2011, 01:34 AM   #106
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One of my few nitpicks is the relationship between Erik and Charles as well. It was just so short. I wish they would have been friends for years before their fallout.
Yeah but I guess they just had strong feelings for each other. Professor X knew everything about Magneto in a very short time. Magneto's first mutant friend was Professor X.

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Old 07-04-2011, 01:51 AM   #107
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Default Re: The Official X-Men: First Class Rate and Review Thread: Third Edition

Right. Charles was capable of knowing someone their entire lives through the use of his telepathy. And because Charles knew Erik's struggles and could relate to him by knowing his past, Erik trusted him. And when someone is so lacking that balance, it can instantly form a very genuine bond. It was short, but extremely impactful on them both.

On an unrelated note: This is a review thread. We can post our own reviews, critics' reviews or any other reviews. We are allowed to discuss said reviews, but there is no reason to insult someone's review in any manner. You can argue points and opinions in a mature and civil manner, but no hostile arguments will be tolerated. Everyone should be welcomed to post their review whether it be a -10/10 or a 100,000,000/10.

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Old 07-04-2011, 01:57 AM   #108
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I cant believe I've seen this 6 times. I can't believe I haven't seen this in 2 weeks.


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Old 07-04-2011, 02:06 AM   #109
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Default Re: The Official X-Men: First Class Rate and Review Thread: Third Edition

I'm impatiently waiting for the DVD already.

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Old 07-04-2011, 02:21 AM   #110
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Yeah, I need the DVD now. And a digital copy for my iPod.

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Old 07-04-2011, 04:17 AM   #111
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Default Re: The Official X-Men: First Class Rate and Review Thread: Third Edition

I really can't wait for the Blu Ray, I watched X2 on Blu Ray yesterday and that looked awesome in High Def. So FC is surely gonna look awesome.

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Old 07-04-2011, 06:00 AM   #112
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I don't understand the "more rounded" comment.
The world of the Dark Knight is very...well, obviously, dark. And serious. There was more of a spectrum of emotion, more soul, more warmth and more of character journeys in First Class.

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As to the enjoyable part. I don't see it. As a one off, thrilling experience, there really isn't anything like TDK. Both it and Begins hold up in a very special way. The dry and at times dark sense of humor is brilliant and keeps you smiling.
I am not one of the fanboys who believe TDK is the best film ever made. It's good, but also bleak. On my second viewing, I went to see it with someone who really disliked it. I can just imagine how that person would get treated on here.

I also completely disagree that TDK is memorable for its humour and for keeping people smiling.


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Nolan's Batman has handled more fully realized characters in two films then 5 X-men films put together.
Nolan has fewer characters to handle. Batman = one main hero. X-Men = five or six times that many.


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You have seen First Class right? Why do you think I was talking about Erik? They haven't even known one another for 6 months, much less 15-20.
You did read what I said, right? Yes, they haven't known each other for six months, which is why Magneto's abandonment of Xavier is more believable - because they didn't have a bond created by many years. If they had, you might be more justified in asking why he would leave him.

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Old 07-04-2011, 07:59 AM   #113
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I'm sure the poster was referring to Mystique, not Eric.

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Old 07-04-2011, 08:13 AM   #114
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The world of the Dark Knight is very...well, obviously, dark. And serious. There was more of a spectrum of emotion, more soul, more warmth and more of character journeys in First Class.



I am not one of the fanboys who believe TDK is the best film ever made. It's good, but also bleak. On my second viewing, I went to see it with someone who really disliked it. I can just imagine how that person would get treated on here.

I also completely disagree that TDK is memorable for its humour and for keeping people smiling.




Nolan has fewer characters to handle. Batman = one main hero. X-Men = five or six times that many.




You did read what I said, right? Yes, they haven't known each other for six months, which is why Magneto's abandonment of Xavier is more believable - because they didn't have a bond created by many years. If they had, you might be more justified in asking why he would leave him.
Technically they DID know each other 6 months, or very near it. Assuming the movie follows the historical TIMELINE accurately at least, Charles and Erik meet in April ("I'm more interested in the Jupiter missiles America is currently placing in Turkey") and go their separate ways in October, when the ship standoff happened.

I got the impression from their relationship though that it was very deep very fast. The link posted above about their Romantic Tragedy is far-fetched to be sure but I definitely believe that the actors portrayed the bromance ambiguously on purpose. The timeline is short whether you follow history (6 months) or the "feel" of the movie (what, a month, two tops?) so they had to find a way to bump the friendship up to make the ending more tragic. I wasn't sad when Raven left Charles, despite the fact that they had been "siblings" for what, 15-20 years. I was devastated when Erik left Charles because their short friendship was so intense. I felt during the beach that if Charles had said "yes I agree, humans are douchebags", Erik would have taken Charles and Charles alone. I'm not saying this from an "OMG they're in loooove" standpoint either, but their friendship was intense and gave the impression they were all the other really needed in a person.

I think the poster is referring to Raven, not Erik. I agree X-Maniac, Raven just saying "yeah bye" didn't fit to me. It really bugged me in fact. A friend of mine had an interesting perspective on it: Had Charles not said anything, she would have stayed. She would have stayed, wanting to go with Erik the whole time but refusing to leave her paralyzed brother out of sympathy and guilt (especially because though she is angry at him, she is not angry enough to ditch him under those circumstances). And that desire would have eaten away at him, at both of them, until they grew to resent each other. This is the last thing Charles would want. HE is the one who encourages Raven to go with Erik. And he makes her (and Erik) go without letting either one of them know the depth of his wound. Don't forget, when Erik pulls out the bullet it is BLOOD-FREE and smashed in. The suits were designed to be bulletproof, I'd wager that the bullet never even touched his skin. It just happened to hit at just the right place and right amount of pressure to break his spine. As far as Erik and Raven know, he's just had the wind knocked out of him.

ANYWAY! Film review stuff. This movie gets a 9/10 for me. I loved it! I thought Michael Fassbender stole the show. I loved that there were no heroes in the movie, just complicated characters who think they're in the right. I loved that saintly wise Xavier was a flirtatious spoiled rich kid with a full head of (lovely, lovely) hair. I would LOVE to see him really lose it in the next movie. I would love to see him get angry about the loss of his legs, at Raven, and especially at Erik. I'd love to see him get to a really dark place with his powers as a result and juuuust barely pull out of it in time.

It's easier to list the things I didn't like about the movie:
-Moira. I've heard she has a million deleted scenes but there's a reason for it. She did nothing to push the plot forward. Her deleted romantic scenes with Charles wouldn't push things forward either... his development is entirely thanks to Erik.
-January Jones. I'm sorry, i found NOTHING appealing about this woman. It felt like she was playing the role as a favor to someone. She wasn't even attractive in it.
-Magneto's costume. Ohhh myyyyy godddddddddd. Like people have already mentioned, it was so ugly and didn't make sense at all from a character perspective. Erik in his nicely fitted suit-hat outfits to the bank, his suave turtleneck-leather jacket combo, his slacks and tucked in polos, his baggy shirt with oversized pants tucked into boots and a cape made from a blanket and a red and purple helmet with a bug on the front.... one of these things is not like the other. I really liked the silver and white helmet. I get that they were nodding to the comics but I sincerely hope they ditch this one and go for something classier like SIM had in X-Men.
-Beast in the hangar and his lack of lip sync. So bad, SO bad.

Other than that though, this film was excellent. Way to refresh the series!


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Old 07-04-2011, 09:17 AM   #115
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Their brief friendship in the film makes his abandonment of Xavier feel more natural than if they had known each other for years at that point.
No it doesn't. It didn't feel natural to me. Otherwise, why would he forget all about the missiles and run to Charles when he was shot?
Although I admit it was the only moment he seemd to care about Charles. It lasted 2 minutes, tops. Earlier he didn't give a damn about Charles having to go through some excruciating pain and painful moral decision for him to kill Shaw.
Anyway, the abandonment felt contrived, because after all, that man lying at the beach had cared a great deal about him, and even saved his life. But Erik still had time to make a recruiting speech instead of worrying about his "friend" pain and health condition. All this before leaving in a red puff with the only way of transport there was. How many hours it took for the team to be rescued so that they could take Xavier to a hospital? It's awful even to think about it.

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Plus, Magneto was not aware Xavier was paralysed at the time he left.
Does it matter? He was shot in the back, wasn't it grave enough for him to care?

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In addition, Magneto was quite prepared to leave Xavier to die in the dam in X2. This is a man driven by his own ideological agendas, not by any emotional attachment to anyone else.
X2 is at least 40 years later, so...
What I'm trying to say is that Xavier's abandonement in FC didn't match Erik's desperate reaction when he was shot. He seemed pretty much involved, and then...*bamf*.

It's amazing how this film managed to make Magneto's point of view the only important one, the only one we should care about. Peace is never an option indeed.

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Old 07-04-2011, 09:34 AM   #116
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Technically they DID know each other 6 months, or very near it. Assuming the movie follows the historical TIMELINE accurately at least, Charles and Erik meet in April ("I'm more interested in the Jupiter missiles America is currently placing in Turkey") and go their separate ways in October, when the ship standoff happened.

I got the impression from their relationship though that it was very deep very fast. The link posted above about their Romantic Tragedy is far-fetched to be sure but I definitely believe that the actors portrayed the bromance ambiguously on purpose. The timeline is short whether you follow history (6 months) or the "feel" of the movie (what, a month, two tops?) so they had to find a way to bump the friendship up to make the ending more tragic. I wasn't sad when Raven left Charles, despite the fact that they had been "siblings" for what, 15-20 years. I was devastated when Erik left Charles because their short friendship was so intense. I felt during the beach that if Charles had said "yes I agree, humans are douchebags", Erik would have taken Charles and Charles alone. I'm not saying this from an "OMG they're in loooove" standpoint either, but their friendship was intense and gave the impression they were all the other really needed in a person.

I think the poster is referring to Raven, not Erik. I agree X-Maniac, Raven just saying "yeah bye" didn't fit to me. It really bugged me in fact. A friend of mine had an interesting perspective on it: Had Charles not said anything, she would have stayed. She would have stayed, wanting to go with Erik the whole time but refusing to leave her paralyzed brother out of sympathy and guilt (especially because though she is angry at him, she is not angry enough to ditch him under those circumstances). And that desire would have eaten away at him, at both of them, until they grew to resent each other. This is the last thing Charles would want. HE is the one who encourages Raven to go with Erik. And he makes her (and Erik) go without letting either one of them know the depth of his wound. Don't forget, when Erik pulls out the bullet it is BLOOD-FREE and smashed in. The suits were designed to be bulletproof, I'd wager that the bullet never even touched his skin. It just happened to hit at just the right place and right amount of pressure to break his spine. As far as Erik and Raven know, he's just had the wind knocked out of him.
Good points, i'm not going to rake over all that, you put your view in depth.

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ANYWAY! Film review stuff. This movie gets a 9/10 for me. I loved it! I thought Michael Fassbender stole the show. I loved that there were no heroes in the movie, just complicated characters who think they're in the right. I loved that saintly wise Xavier was a flirtatious spoiled rich kid with a full head of (lovely, lovely) hair. I would LOVE to see him really lose it in the next movie. I would love to see him get angry about the loss of his legs, at Raven, and especially at Erik. I'd love to see him get to a really dark place with his powers as a result and juuuust barely pull out of it in time.
He might well get frustrated about losing his legs. In some ways, it's a shame it happened so soon but in terms of the character arc, it had to happen.


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It's easier to list the things I didn't like about the movie:
-Moira. I've heard she has a million deleted scenes but there's a reason for it. She did nothing to push the plot forward. Her deleted romantic scenes with Charles wouldn't push things forward either... his development is entirely thanks to Erik.
-January Jones. I'm sorry, i found NOTHING appealing about this woman. It felt like she was playing the role as a favor to someone. She wasn't even attractive in it.
-Magneto's costume. Ohhh myyyyy godddddddddd. Like people have already mentioned, it was so ugly and didn't make sense at all from a character perspective. Erik in his nicely fitted suit-hat outfits to the bank, his suave turtleneck-leather jacket combo, his slacks and tucked in polos, his baggy shirt with oversized pants tucked into boots and a cape made from a blanket and a red and purple helmet with a bug on the front.... one of these things is not like the other. I really liked the silver and white helmet. I get that they were nodding to the comics but I sincerely hope they ditch this one and go for something classier like SIM had in X-Men.
-Beast in the hangar and his lack of lip sync. So bad, SO bad.
I think Moira will be back if there is a sequel. It's easy to see her being thrown out of the CIA. I would imagine Emma Frost will be back too. We'll see if Ms Jones returns. And I agree Magneto needs a better costume next time. Never noticed Beast's lips

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Old 07-04-2011, 09:38 AM   #117
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The problem with Magneto's costume had everything to do with terrible lighting, and a bad choice of an underhead shot.

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Old 07-04-2011, 09:52 AM   #118
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Meh, call me bias (I am a huge X-Men fan, where I don't feel the same level of attachment for Batman), but I'd much prefer any of the X-Men films over either of Nolan's Batman films. They are good. But really, the only thing about those movies that's truly memorable to me is Ledger's Joker.
That is fine. I just find it hard to consider any of the X-men films superior to what Nolan has created so far in the Batman universe. Doesn't mean I don't enjoy other lesser films more.

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The world of the Dark Knight is very...well, obviously, dark. And serious. There was more of a spectrum of emotion, more soul, more warmth and more of character journeys in First Class.
Completely disagree. There is plenty of warmth and soul in Nolan's Batmanverse, and more importantly genuine emotions. The way Alfred and Gordon are utilized is brilliant.

The journey of the rooftop trio in TDK is a demonstration of characters journeys that are not damaged by the edit monster.

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I am not one of the fanboys who believe TDK is the best film ever made. It's good, but also bleak. On my second viewing, I went to see it with someone who really disliked it. I can just imagine how that person would get treated on here.

I also completely disagree that TDK is memorable for its humour and for keeping people smiling.
"How about a magic trick?"

"No. I kill the bus driver."

"Oh, excuse me, I want to drive!"

"If you want to kill a public servant, Mr. Maroni, I recommend you buy American."

"You... complete me."

"Like a submarine, Mr. Wayne. Like a submarine. "

"Never start with the head, the victim gets all fuzzy."

I could go on for days.

As to the best film ever made? Of course not. But both it and Begins are far beyond anything made in the superhero genre imo.

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Nolan has fewer characters to handle. Batman = one main hero. X-Men = five or six times that many.
Having fewer characters doesn't mean you leave some characters completely mute and the rest half built. There is an actual purpose to every character in Begins and TDK.

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You did read what I said, right? Yes, they haven't known each other for six months, which is why Magneto's abandonment of Xavier is more believable - because they didn't have a bond created by many years. If they had, you might be more justified in asking why he would leave him.
I didn't think it was that hard to realize I was talking about Raven.

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Old 07-04-2011, 10:03 AM   #119
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Technically they DID know each other 6 months, or very near it. Assuming the movie follows the historical TIMELINE accurately at least, Charles and Erik meet in April ("I'm more interested in the Jupiter missiles America is currently placing in Turkey") and go their separate ways in October, when the ship standoff happened.

I got the impression from their relationship though that it was very deep very fast. The link posted above about their Romantic Tragedy is far-fetched to be sure but I definitely believe that the actors portrayed the bromance ambiguously on purpose. The timeline is short whether you follow history (6 months) or the "feel" of the movie (what, a month, two tops?) so they had to find a way to bump the friendship up to make the ending more tragic. I wasn't sad when Raven left Charles, despite the fact that they had been "siblings" for what, 15-20 years. I was devastated when Erik left Charles because their short friendship was so intense. I felt during the beach that if Charles had said "yes I agree, humans are douchebags", Erik would have taken Charles and Charles alone. I'm not saying this from an "OMG they're in loooove" standpoint either, but their friendship was intense and gave the impression they were all the other really needed in a person.

I think the poster is referring to Raven, not Erik. I agree X-Maniac, Raven just saying "yeah bye" didn't fit to me. It really bugged me in fact. A friend of mine had an interesting perspective on it: Had Charles not said anything, she would have stayed. She would have stayed, wanting to go with Erik the whole time but refusing to leave her paralyzed brother out of sympathy and guilt (especially because though she is angry at him, she is not angry enough to ditch him under those circumstances). And that desire would have eaten away at him, at both of them, until they grew to resent each other. This is the last thing Charles would want. HE is the one who encourages Raven to go with Erik. And he makes her (and Erik) go without letting either one of them know the depth of his wound. Don't forget, when Erik pulls out the bullet it is BLOOD-FREE and smashed in. The suits were designed to be bulletproof, I'd wager that the bullet never even touched his skin. It just happened to hit at just the right place and right amount of pressure to break his spine. As far as Erik and Raven know, he's just had the wind knocked out of him.

ANYWAY! Film review stuff. This movie gets a 9/10 for me. I loved it! I thought Michael Fassbender stole the show. I loved that there were no heroes in the movie, just complicated characters who think they're in the right. I loved that saintly wise Xavier was a flirtatious spoiled rich kid with a full head of (lovely, lovely) hair. I would LOVE to see him really lose it in the next movie. I would love to see him get angry about the loss of his legs, at Raven, and especially at Erik. I'd love to see him get to a really dark place with his powers as a result and juuuust barely pull out of it in time.

It's easier to list the things I didn't like about the movie:
-Moira. I've heard she has a million deleted scenes but there's a reason for it. She did nothing to push the plot forward. Her deleted romantic scenes with Charles wouldn't push things forward either... his development is entirely thanks to Erik.
-January Jones. I'm sorry, i found NOTHING appealing about this woman. It felt like she was playing the role as a favor to someone. She wasn't even attractive in it.
-Magneto's costume. Ohhh myyyyy godddddddddd. Like people have already mentioned, it was so ugly and didn't make sense at all from a character perspective. Erik in his nicely fitted suit-hat outfits to the bank, his suave turtleneck-leather jacket combo, his slacks and tucked in polos, his baggy shirt with oversized pants tucked into boots and a cape made from a blanket and a red and purple helmet with a bug on the front.... one of these things is not like the other. I really liked the silver and white helmet. I get that they were nodding to the comics but I sincerely hope they ditch this one and go for something classier like SIM had in X-Men.
-Beast in the hangar and his lack of lip sync. So bad, SO bad.

Other than that though, this film was excellent. Way to refresh the series!
I think that is obviously why Charles wants her to go, yes. However, I do not think Raven's reaction makes much sense, even in that scenario.

Charles can't get up. It seems pretty obvious, because the entire conversation between Charles and everyone else occurs with him on his back, being held up by the nearest warm body. Charles and Raven were the only thing each other had for nearly 20 years. If you care one tiny bit about a person, you don't just leave. You don't get up, smile and have your last words be to anyone but him. You don't suddenly put on a smirk and act straight villain the next time we see you. No matter how annoyed one is with another, you don't do that to family. Unless of course you are just truly evil. There was no indication of Raven being so in this film.

Erik knows exactly how "bad" it is. He doesn't run to Charles or tries to choke the life out of Moira because Charles got the wind knocked out of him.

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Old 07-04-2011, 10:15 AM   #120
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I think that is obviously why Charles wants her to go, yes. However, I do not think Raven's reaction makes much sense, even in that scenario. (...)
Erik knows exactly how "bad" it is. He doesn't run to Charles or tries to choke the life out of Moira because Charles got the wind knocked out of him.
Couldn't agree more. It's quite clear that Charles was in a terrible shape.
The resolution of the scene made the powerful emotional moment that came before seem wasted. With Erik and Raven's little speeches about brothers and sisters and being mutant and proud while a real "brother" - Charles - was going through the worst moment in his life. How awful.

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Old 07-04-2011, 11:02 AM   #121
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That is fine. I just find it hard to consider any of the X-men films superior to what Nolan has created so far in the Batman universe. Doesn't mean I don't enjoy other lesser films more.



Completely disagree. There is plenty of warmth and soul in Nolan's Batmanverse, and more importantly genuine emotions. The way Alfred and Gordon are utilized is brilliant.

The journey of the rooftop trio in TDK is a demonstration of characters journeys that are not damaged by the edit monster.



"How about a magic trick?"

"No. I kill the bus driver."

"Oh, excuse me, I want to drive!"

"If you want to kill a public servant, Mr. Maroni, I recommend you buy American."

"You... complete me."

"Like a submarine, Mr. Wayne. Like a submarine. "

"Never start with the head, the victim gets all fuzzy."

I could go on for days.

As to the best film ever made? Of course not. But both it and Begins are far beyond anything made in the superhero genre imo.



Having fewer characters doesn't mean you leave some characters completely mute and the rest half built. There is an actual purpose to every character in Begins and TDK.



I didn't think it was that hard to realize I was talking about Raven.
I'm really not sure why threads on this forum keep turning into Dark Knight vs X-Men arguments. It's very bizarre... Time to stick to 'rate and review' THIS movie, i think.

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Old 07-04-2011, 11:04 AM   #122
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Couldn't agree more. It's quite clear that Charles was in a terrible shape.
The resolution of the scene made the powerful emotional moment that came before seem wasted. With Erik and Raven's little speeches about brothers and sisters and being mutant and proud while a real "brother" - Charles - was going through the worst moment in his life. How awful.
Your beloved Xavier did actually TELL Raven to go with Magneto.

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Old 07-04-2011, 11:05 AM   #123
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Your beloved Xavier did actually TELL Raven to go with Magneto.
Yep, everyone always does what the injured man on the floor says. Especially when they have been your only companion for nearly two decades.

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Old 07-04-2011, 11:07 AM   #124
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Yep, everyone always does what the injured man on the floor says. Especially when they have been your only companion for nearly two decades.
It was a crucial turning point in the movie. What happened was fine. All this fussing and over-analysing is pointless.

Go and re-shoot that scene and we'll see if we prefer your version.

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Old 07-04-2011, 11:14 AM   #125
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It was a crucial turning point in the movie. What happened was fine. All this fussing and over-analysing is pointless.

Go and re-shoot that scene and we'll see if we prefer your version.
So you don't agree, and thus I must bend my knee to your opinion?

Yeah, not really. It isn't fussing, it isn't over-analyzing and the scene certainly wasn't fine. You don't play up a relationship and then speed right through it at the most crucial of moments.

Raven gasps, cries two tears, chooses Charles, and then after a 15 second conversation, leaves with Erik, with her last words being to Hank. They are brother and sister. You don't do that to a sibling.

This is forgetting the fact they just left them on an island that was just attacked by US and Soviet fleets. How exactly are they suppose to get off the island? They can't call for help and could be attack again at any moment.

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