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Old 06-26-2011, 12:22 PM   #1
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Default What would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

i really dont buy the idea that its because wolverine isnt in it, so what would give a sequel a chance to make more money?

like more action?, more special effects?, darker characters?, more fights?, Better marketing?

the dark knight was pretty much all story and somehow managed to do amazingly well, but what is expected of the X franchise?


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Old 06-26-2011, 12:30 PM   #2
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

Well, the quality of First Class helps first and foremost, as that lessens the doubt in people's minds that Fox can make a good X-Men movie. Other than that, I would say a better release date and better marketing.

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Old 06-26-2011, 12:33 PM   #3
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

Definetly better marketing, most of my friends didnt even know there was another X-men movie coming out lol.

And play up the big names a little that ARE in the movie.

Like Kevin Bacon. The marketing was atrocious I feel.

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Old 06-26-2011, 01:10 PM   #4
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

A better release date. They should book the Memorial Day weekend for 2014 and aim for that (the 2013 one has already been grabbed by Fast & Furious).

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Old 06-26-2011, 01:18 PM   #5
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

The sequel will make more movie.

So Im not worried about that.

Just add one or two known actors, better release date and a bit better marketing, and it will reach 400M worlwide easily. Hopefully more.

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Old 06-26-2011, 01:22 PM   #6
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

- Better release date away from major competition
- 3D will boost numbers. People might not want it, but it'll add another 15%+ to the overall gross
- Larger in scope
- Hire a 'name' for the villain
- The cast (Fassbender, Lawrence, McAvoy, Hoult) will all be more well known by 2013/14. Use them for promotion etc.

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Old 06-26-2011, 01:57 PM   #7
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

Three words: Super Bowl Spot.

I think if this movie had been advertised during the Super Bowl, more people probably would have seen it.

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Old 06-26-2011, 02:20 PM   #8
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

I agree that it boils down to marketing.

The X-Men franchise is big with the mainstream audience. To the general audience, there hasn't been a bad X-Men movie yet.

I think its lack of star power, and lack of marketing. Once the TV spots hit I saw tons of them, but outside of that, nothing.

Also, people are used to Stewart and McKellen in these roles. I wonder if it was just a bit of an adjustment for them? Idk. I dont buy that its cuz there was no Wolverine. He's bigtime, but I believe X-Men has name value itself too. Not just Wolverine.

I also wonder how much is burn out. We've had 2 movies now since the one called "The LAST Stand". I wonder how much of this is starting to feel forced to the public now. And how many times are they gonna make a movie about the difference between Magneto and Xavier? Im just guessing, but I have heard these concerns brought up.

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Old 06-26-2011, 02:21 PM   #9
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

X-men people have actually heard of.

I've heard consistent complaints about this, and about the characters having rather lame powers. A lot of which was directed at Darwin and Angel. Honestly I don't understand Darwin, I thought his powers could have been really cool. I feel like this limits repeat viewings at least. I mean Magneto is awesome and everything but we've seen what he can do, to death. Get some other mutants in there and have them have awesome power displays.

http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2011/6/8/

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Old 06-26-2011, 02:51 PM   #10
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fallenAngel View Post
X-men people have actually heard of.
Such as?

And if you're referring to Cyclops and Jean etc, then there's an argument that a) we've seen them in 3 films already b) they're not old enough to have been around in the 60s

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I've heard consistent complaints about this, and about the characters having rather lame powers. A lot of which was directed at Darwin and Angel.
We haven't seen either of those powers before (reactive adaptation and insect-winged flight). Neither have we seen Banshee and sonic powers either.

Quote:
Honestly I don't understand Darwin, I thought his powers could have been really cool. I feel like this limits repeat viewings at least.
The problem with Darwin is his powers are 'reactive'. We don't really know what he can do or what his limits might be, he reacts to each threat at the time. Makes him difficult to deploy in battle.

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I mean Magneto is awesome and everything but we've seen what he can do, to death. Get some other mutants in there and have them have awesome power displays.
What other mutants and power displays are you thinking of? Give us your suggestions.

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Old 06-26-2011, 02:53 PM   #11
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

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Originally Posted by Electrix View Post
- Better release date away from major competition
- 3D will boost numbers. People might not want it, but it'll add another 15%+ to the overall gross
- Larger in scope
- Hire a 'name' for the villain
- The cast (Fassbender, Lawrence, McAvoy, Hoult) will all be more well known by 2013/14. Use them for promotion etc.
What do you mean by 'larger in scope'?

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Old 06-26-2011, 03:08 PM   #12
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

The first couple are more others complaints than mine. Yes, Cyclops, Jean, Wolverine Storm etc are going to get butts in the seat a lot more than Banshee, Havok, Angel Salvadore. I understand and except why the big names weren't used, as do a lot of people but at the end of the day its what keeps me from really caring much about this movie. And I think other people agree, it was the original turn off for most fans that Cyclops and Jean weren't going to be in this movie.

Some people have said that after four Wolverine movies this is the first true X-men movie. I disagree, this is basically X-men Origins: Magneto still.

I personally like Banshee, always thought he was silly but I thought he was unique.

As far as power displays, Storm and especially Ice man I always felt could have been much more satisfying than what we got. The X-jet tornado battle was the only Storm power display that I felt was pretty epic. I don't remember much about Storm in the last stand other than I couldn't stand her dialogue. I think she made a wave or something that looked cheap and didn't really make sense.

Magneto has done everything from pull iron out of someones blood stream to killing someone with a coin, to pulling a submarine out of the ocean and ripping the golden gate bridge out and flying it over to Alcatraz. He is the only character besides maybe Xavier and Wolverine who I really got a sense that they truly lived with these powers and knew how to use them. There is a lot of creativity when it comes to Magneto using his power too. Very versatile. We've gotten a wide variety of what they can do. Other mutants, like Rogue, seem to stand out and be like "Hey this is the scene where I can use my power, look fans, I'm using my power." Magneto just uses his power, kills his opposition and moves on.

Cyclops in the first movie kind of showed the different ways he could use his power, but he never got a chance to do anything particularly cool. Nightcrawler's opening scene showed his handle on things and Shaw had some cool power displays.

When watching the movies themselves I can see why some characters are more impressive than others, but the original question was how to get people more interested in a sequel. There is a reason why the end of the first trailer was the image of Mags raising the submarine. Green Lantern may have shown that people aren't just interested in special effects and in fact can be turned off by the overuse of it, but wow moments will stand out more. If they keep just using Magneto for the wow factor though it will eventually burn itself out. They need to get other omega level mutants in there and show what they can truly do.

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Old 06-26-2011, 03:15 PM   #13
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

I can kinda understand where fallenangel is coming from tho.

Darwin was kind of a unique power. But Angel? "Insect wing flight" is grasping at straws of the highest level. We've already seen people with wings, and Angel was much more memorable than Salvadore. Havok is presented the same as Cyclops, just through a chest plate instead of a visor. We've seen Beast. We've seen Magneto. We've seen mystique. We've seen Xavier (though his new take on his powers was cool).

Banshee was new, but screaming powers aren't the most impressive. As a fan I loved watching him fly though.

Emma? We've seen telepathy and skin powers. Shaw was the most visually impressive non Magneto power. Aza,el? We've seen Nightcrawler. Riptide was Storm on a much smaller scale.

But if we want huge power displays (and im just saying "if" - I get fqllenangels point but I thought First Class was fine as is.), im not sure whose left to bring in.

Bishop is the same as Shaw powers wise, and his story might not work. Psylocke? Psychic blades could be bad ass. I dont know who would work tho.

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Old 06-26-2011, 03:24 PM   #14
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

Well there is always Apocalypse.

I don't know, they can get creative. But as it stands they are eventually going to have to double dip (bring in Scott, Jean, Storm or reboot completely and bring in whoever) or keep the franchise going with an X-men 4. Because with the exception of Magneto, the other characters powers are going to become boring, and like I said I feel like they've already explored Magneto's powers pretty well.

Story and character development is key, but lets face it we all want cool/unique/interesting powers and action as well. There is a reason why a lot of non comic fans like the Last Stand the Best.

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Old 06-26-2011, 03:25 PM   #15
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

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What do you mean by 'larger in scope'?
Well it needs to be bigger overall. The Dark Knight felt bigger than Batman Begins. X2 felt bigger than X1. Up the stakes etc.

They've set up the new characters now and they can just run with it. Vaughn himself said the sequel will be more 'epic'. People like 'epic' in their summer movies.

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Old 06-26-2011, 03:26 PM   #16
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

Your last sentence is key. X-Men was great. But X2 upped the ante thanks in no small part to Nightcrawler, a visually stunning character with an incredible power that they were able to utilize to great use.

The comic book timeline was thrown out a long time ago, First Class being the worst offender of putting characters in respective time periods they didn't belong in. Its time to forget the comic timeline and bring in an A-list, B-list character that can be used like an absolute badass. I think there's huge potential for a character like Psylocke. Stay away from some of the goofier aspects of her character, but I see loads of potential for her to be a fan favorite. I dont know why im on a psylocke kick suddenly, but its just an idea.

I'd be more than happy to ignore her X3 "appearance" to see her done right.

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Old 06-26-2011, 03:37 PM   #17
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

So I was just thinking. Its funny because the controversial inclusion Gambit got a lot of people in line to see XMOW. A lot of people were really excited about this and from the trailer it was obvious the marketing team knew it.

But on the note of power displays he did somethings I'm not sure Gambit can actually do, or should be able to do. The whole movie I actually kind of felt they were stretching what wolverine could get away with. I don't know what my point is bringing this up, but I found it interesting to wonder about how this played into having the movie earn its gross while simultaneously diminishing its overall quality.

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Old 06-26-2011, 03:42 PM   #18
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

How so? I didn't really notice anything out of line for Gambit.

His alley leap was certainly cheesy, but part of Gambit's mutation is increased agility and stuff.

And him hovering the cards, I've seen him do stuff like that in other things as well.

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Old 06-26-2011, 03:46 PM   #19
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

Mainly when he launched himself into the air at the end and destroyed the falling tower. I'm not a Gambit fan so I can stand corrected. I didn't realize he also had increased agility and stuff. I thought that was part of him being a trained thief and such which he didn't really seem to be in the movie.

But this and Wolverine's launch to take down the helicopter made me raise some eyebrows, maybe more for the questionable physics than anything else.

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Old 06-26-2011, 03:48 PM   #20
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

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Originally Posted by Nell2ThaIzzay View Post
I can kinda understand where fallenangel is coming from tho.
Sure, I wasn't trying to be argumentative, i just wanted more information and constructive suggestions.

Quote:
Darwin was kind of a unique power. But Angel? "Insect wing flight" is grasping at straws of the highest level. We've already seen people with wings, and Angel was much more memorable than Salvadore.
Well, we haven't seen an insect mutant before. She served several purposes - interesting power visually; a flying mutant on the side of the baddies to fight flying mutant Banshee on the good side; and ethnic diversity. On the downside, we've seen all she can do now.

Quote:
Havok is presented the same as Cyclops, just through a chest plate instead of a visor. We've seen Beast. We've seen Magneto. We've seen mystique. We've seen Xavier (though his new take on his powers was cool).
Yes, but since this was an origin story, then the beginnings of Beast, Magneto and Mystique were the reason, not cool powers.

Quote:
Banshee was new, but screaming powers aren't the most impressive. As a fan I loved watching him fly though.
Well, they added in the sonar angle to make his powers more interesting than just screeching.

Quote:
Emma? We've seen telepathy and skin powers. Shaw was the most visually impressive non Magneto power. Azazel? We've seen Nightcrawler. Riptide was Storm on a much smaller scale.
I guess so, though Riptide's powers were more immediate than those of Storm. I encountered a group of 'Storm haters' at the press screening; they found her boring because it took too long for her powers to get going!

Quote:
But if we want huge power displays (and im just saying "if" - I get fqllenangels point but I thought First Class was fine as is.), im not sure whose left to bring in.
i shall consult my X-Men Encyclopaedia. But I've a feeling there isn't that much left that we haven't seen in some shape or form. Avalanche perhaps? Magma? Scarlet Witch? Dazzler? someone who can interact with technology? Shrinking/enlarging? Intangibility? Metamorphosis into animals (like Snowbird)? It's also got to be a power that's useful. It's no good having a mutant who has the amazing ability to stop your toenails from growing.

Quote:
Bishop is the same as Shaw powers wise, and his story might not work. Psylocke? Psychic blades could be bad ass. I dont know who would work tho.
Purple psychic knives might be interesting, although difficult to explain, or they might seem hokey. Bishop has been covered by the movie version of Shaw.

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Old 06-26-2011, 04:06 PM   #21
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

Apart from other good advices to how improve the story as a marketing tool, I'd recommend Fox to fire the whole stuff from its marketing department. Their promotional strategy for X:FC was one of the worst of this year. Not only they showed the teaser in Feberuary, just four months prior to the release date, but also threw out all clips right befor ethe film opened. It didn't make sense at all and only damaged the movie.

This time there MUST be no rushed production AT ALL. In addition the promo photos and first footage should be released at least 10 months before the release of the film. With X:FC it was shameful that we got leaked photos which completely sucked and drew attention of many away from the film until the teaser, which did its best to improve the whole situation. So, first photos and footage AT LEAST 10 months before the release. Moreover, there must be a good panel at C-Con, as its audience grows bigger and bigger every year. And, I would suggest Fox to put quotes from critics' reviews in TV-spots and increase their frequency on TV. The dumbest thing they did with X:FC was to keep silent with a sureprising critical acclaim the film initially received from teh press screenings. And posters! My God, the worst posters ever! Fox has to hire some really good artists and photoshop experts to make at least decent looking posters this time. What's the point of releasing anything flawed if it only harms the film's outcome?!?

Uh, we've figured out Fox can release some good films. Now it HAS to fully change its marketing thinking.

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Old 06-26-2011, 04:08 PM   #22
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

^

Avalanche is an obvious choice. His power displays could potentially be huge in scope and very visual. It seems unlikely the brotherhood would get another mutant, though.

Someone like Boom Boom could be interesting to look at visually but I suppose the power displays wouldn't be epic in scope. Same with someone like Dazzler or Jubilee. #

We still have room left for a proper psychic battle, however, since that has so far been skipped from the series. That has potential for an epic feeling.

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Old 06-26-2011, 04:13 PM   #23
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

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Originally Posted by fallenAngel View Post
Mainly when he launched himself into the air at the end and destroyed the falling tower. I'm not a Gambit fan so I can stand corrected. I didn't realize he also had increased agility and stuff. I thought that was part of him being a trained thief and such which he didn't really seem to be in the movie.

But this and Wolverine's launch to take down the helicopter made me raise some eyebrows, maybe more for the questionable physics than anything else.
Well the part with the tower leap was that he used his kinetic powers to pole vault himself, with his powers causing an energy release through the staff that launched him. That's how that worked.

Yea wolverine launching to the helicopter was a bit corny, but I chalked that up to creative fudging with real world physics over fudging with Logan's powers.

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Old 06-26-2011, 04:14 PM   #24
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The first couple are more others complaints than mine. Yes, Cyclops, Jean, Wolverine Storm etc are going to get butts in the seat a lot more than Banshee, Havok, Angel Salvadore. I understand and except why the big names weren't used, as do a lot of people but at the end of the day its what keeps me from really caring much about this movie. And I think other people agree, it was the original turn off for most fans that Cyclops and Jean weren't going to be in this movie.
It was a turn-off for the hardcore militant fanboys, yes. But I don't know how much more we can see of Cyclops' blasts and Jean's powers either.

Quote:
Some people have said that after four Wolverine movies this is the first true X-men movie. I disagree, this is basically X-men Origins: Magneto still.
It was the Magneto origin to some extent (though missing what happened to him between 1944 and 1962). But it also became a movie about the formation of the X-Men, which the X-Men Origins: Magneto screenplay was not.

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I personally like Banshee, always thought he was silly but I thought he was unique.
It's a power we haven't seen on screen

Quote:
As far as power displays, Storm and especially Ice man I always felt could have been much more satisfying than what we got. The X-jet tornado battle was the only Storm power display that I felt was pretty epic. I don't remember much about Storm in the last stand other than I couldn't stand her dialogue. I think she made a wave or something that looked cheap and didn't really make sense.
She only made a wave in the 'deleted scenes'. I thought it was great, but it didn't make it into the movie.

There's so much more Storm and Iceman can do, of course, though we didn't get to see it. Iceman froze a cup of coffee anyway.

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Magneto has done everything from pull iron out of someones blood stream to killing someone with a coin, to pulling a submarine out of the ocean and ripping the golden gate bridge out and flying it over to Alcatraz. He is the only character besides maybe Xavier and Wolverine who I really got a sense that they truly lived with these powers and knew how to use them. There is a lot of creativity when it comes to Magneto using his power too. Very versatile. We've gotten a wide variety of what they can do. Other mutants, like Rogue, seem to stand out and be like "Hey this is the scene where I can use my power, look fans, I'm using my power." Magneto just uses his power, kills his opposition and moves on.
Yes, they have indeed been creative with Magneto's powers, I agree.

Quote:
Cyclops in the first movie kind of showed the different ways he could use his power, but he never got a chance to do anything particularly cool. Nightcrawler's opening scene showed his handle on things and Shaw had some cool power displays.
Yes, though Cyclops has a rather limited power overall.

Quote:
When watching the movies themselves I can see why some characters are more impressive than others, but the original question was how to get people more interested in a sequel. There is a reason why the end of the first trailer was the image of Mags raising the submarine.
Well, yes, but many people have cited other scenes as their favourite moments in the film. I agree, though, that epic power moments are necessary.

Quote:
Green Lantern may have shown that people aren't just interested in special effects and in fact can be turned off by the overuse of it, but wow moments will stand out more. If they keep just using Magneto for the wow factor though it will eventually burn itself out. They need to get other omega level mutants in there and show what they can truly do.
I can agree with that. The question is who and also how powerful they make these people.

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Old 06-26-2011, 04:20 PM   #25
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Default Re: what would improve a sequels chance of making more money?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy the Poet View Post
Apart from other good advices to how improve the story as a marketing tool, I'd recommend Fox to fire the whole stuff from its marketing department. Their promotional strategy for X:FC was one of the worst of this year. Not only they showed the teaser in Feberuary, just four months prior to the release date, but also threw out all clips right befor ethe film opened. It didn't make sense at all and only damaged the movie.

This time there MUST be no rushed production AT ALL. In addition the promo photos and first footage should be released at least 10 months before the release of the film. With X:FC it was shameful that we got leaked photos which completely sucked and drew attention of many away from the film until the teaser, which did its best to improve the whole situation. So, first photos and footage AT LEAST 10 months before the release. Moreover, there must be a good panel at C-Con, as its audience grows bigger and bigger every year. And, I would suggest Fox to put quotes from critics' reviews in TV-spots and increase their frequency on TV. The dumbest thing they did with X:FC was to keep silent with a sureprising critical acclaim the film initially received from teh press screenings. And posters! My God, the worst posters ever! Fox has to hire some really good artists and photoshop experts to make at least decent looking posters this time. What's the point of releasing anything flawed if it only harms the film's outcome?!?

Uh, we've figured out Fox can release some good films. Now it HAS to fully change its marketing thinking.
I agree. And i think the 'rushed' production and the lack of marketing are connected. Without completed material to market, the marketing could not get under way. Also, i think they were trying to keep down marketing costs in this tougher economic climate, possibly because more money had to go towards getting the film done on time!

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