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Old 07-15-2011, 10:42 PM   #26
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

lets see some costume designs

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Old 07-15-2011, 10:56 PM   #27
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

Having frequently dealt with people who were convinced that they were vampires, I can honestly say Kurosawa is easily one of the most delusional folks I've seen in a while.

Here's a question for you, Kurosawa: if sales are directly proportional to quality, then how do you explain Twilight?

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Old 07-15-2011, 10:59 PM   #28
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Not mine, found it on DeviantArt


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Old 07-15-2011, 11:18 PM   #29
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

Not bad

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Old 07-15-2011, 11:21 PM   #30
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

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Having frequently dealt with people who were convinced that they were vampires, I can honestly say Kurosawa is easily one of the most delusional folks I've seen in a while.

Here's a question for you, Kurosawa: if sales are directly proportional to quality, then how do you explain Twilight?
Twilight connects with a particular audience.

Nice personal insults since you cannot debate my facts, by the way. The point that I have made, and so many of you guys fail to understand, is that Superman was once successful and when they went AWAY from his core ideals, people lost interest in the character. How is a cookie cutter wanna be Marvel Superman interesting when one can just read a real Marvel character? Comics sales indicate the answer: not very.

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Old 07-15-2011, 11:53 PM   #31
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

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Not mine, found it on DeviantArt

Make this suit out of tights so those muscles are real and not molded armor, and you have a winner. It's slightly changed while still looking VERY Superman. And it isn't ugly!

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Old 07-16-2011, 12:00 AM   #32
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

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Nice personal insults since you cannot debate my facts, by the way. The point that I have made, and so many of you guys fail to understand, is that Superman was once successful and when they went AWAY from his core ideals, people lost interest in the character. How is a cookie cutter wanna be Marvel Superman interesting when one can just read a real Marvel character? Comics sales indicate the answer: not very.
So you don't think that has anything whatsoever to do with the fact that people's interests, taste's, and what they expected out of the genre changed?
You think that if they had just stayed with that tried and true but out of style formula, that if Superman had just planted himself firmly in the ground to stand against the wave of sweeping change the past few decades brought to comics.........he'd still be number one?


.........Really?

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Old 07-16-2011, 12:05 AM   #33
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Not mine, found it on DeviantArt

Take the \S/ off the belt and that's a nice update.

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Old 07-16-2011, 12:09 AM   #34
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

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So you don't think that has anything whatsoever to do with the fact that people's interests, taste's, and what they expected out of the genre changed?
You think that if they had just stayed with that tried and true but out of style formula, that if Superman had just planted himself firmly in the ground to stand against the wave of sweeping change the past few decades brought to comics.........he'd still be number one?


.........Really?
I think Superman should be recognizably developed based in his core principles like Batman is. Batman flourished when he was taken back to his roots as a grim detective. Superman likewise needs to go back to his roots. They need to return to what made people like the character in the first place.

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Old 07-16-2011, 12:20 AM   #35
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I think Superman should be recognizably developed based in his core principle like Batman is. Batman flourished when he was taken back to his roots as a grim detective. Superman likewise needs to go back to his roots. They need to return to what made people like the character in the first place.
Yeah, that's all well and good, but that doesn't answer my question.

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Old 07-16-2011, 12:28 AM   #36
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Yeah, that's all well and good, but that doesn't answer my question.
Whatever tastes have changed in people, the things they have been doing with Superman over the last 25 years obviously haven't connected with them. What I DO know is before they went away from Superman's core principles, the character was popular. Since they have went away from them, the character has declined. So yes, much like has been done with Batman to great success, I think Superman should be returned to those original principles.

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Old 07-16-2011, 12:45 AM   #37
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

Alright Kuro I went and did some comic book sale research. This is thing Kuro. After about 95, anything that wasn't Marvel or Image wasn't selling. This a fact. This was the dark age and only titles that were dark and had a gimmick sold big after 95. Thats a fact. Another Fact is before 97 Superman was always in the top 25. After the horrible Superman:Red and Blue fiasco Superman dropped off bigtime. This is understandable due to the fact it was GODAWFUL. Also at comic sales were starting to slack anyway. Superman was hugely popular in comics for 10 years after the relaunch. Also looked at it this way. Theirs a reason they call it the "DARK AGE". Due you truly think silver age Superman would have done any better than 90's Superman who outsold Batman for half the decade. This was a time when people characters like Spawn and X-MEN. Silver Age Superman wouldn't have worked in that period at all. Silver Age Superman in that era would have sold ten times as worse and that is in arguable simply due to the nature and want people wanted out of that period. I'll be back with info on Superman in the 2000's. You can check my info here. http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales.html

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Old 07-16-2011, 12:57 AM   #38
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

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Alright Kuro I went and did some comic book sale research. This is thing Kuro. After about 95, anything that wasn't Marvel or Image wasn't selling. This a fact. This was the dark age and only titles that were dark and had a gimmick sold big after 95. Thats a fact. Another Fact is before 97 Superman was always in the top 25. After the horrible Superman:Red and Blue fiasco Superman dropped off bigtime. This is understandable due to the fact it was GODAWFUL. Also at comic sales were starting to slack anyway. Superman was hugely popular in comics for 10 years after the relaunch. Also looked at it this way. Theirs a reason they call it the "DARK AGE". Due you truly think silver age Superman would have done any better than 90's Superman who outsold Batman for half the decade. This was a time when people characters like Spawn and X-MEN. Silver Age Superman wouldn't have worked in that period at all. Silver Age Superman in that era would have sold ten times as worse and that is in arguable simply due to the nature and want people wanted out of that period. I'll be back with info on Superman in the 2000's. You can check my info here. http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales.html
Top 25 is not top ten. And while a straight Silver Age Superman might not have been a top ten seller in that era, a more Bronze Age Superman would have. Bronze Age Superman is what the modern Superman should be.

Check out the 60's sales on that link. Here's a sample: 1965:

1) Superman DC 823,829
2) Superboy DC 672,681
3) Superman's Girlfriend Lois Lane DC 556,091
4) Superman's Pal Jimmy Olsen DC 554,931
5) Action Comics DC 525,254
6) Adventure Comics DC 520,440
7) Archie Archie 467,552
8) World's Finest Comics DC 465,842
9) Batman DC 453,745
10) Walt Disney's Comics & Stories Gold Key 410,209

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Old 07-16-2011, 01:01 AM   #39
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

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Not mine, found it on DeviantArt

overall, this isn't bad. But, I really dislike the "speedo" trunk look.

IF you are going to use trunks, imo, you need to make them longer ( like wrestler trunks that extend halfway down the thighs ). you need to get away from the "underwear" or "speedo" or "diaper/granny panties" look in order for it to not look too silly.

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Old 07-16-2011, 01:02 AM   #40
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

Superman was in the 10's many times before 97. But come on Kuro your kidding yourself now. Marvel was taking DC behind the woodshed during that era. DC usually only had 4 comics in the top 25 and Superman was usually one of them before 97.

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Old 07-16-2011, 01:04 AM   #41
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

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Not mine, found it on DeviantArt

I like it!

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Old 07-16-2011, 01:09 AM   #42
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

Those 60's numbers are impressive but that was a totally different era and you know it. Superman had to be modernize to survive in the 90's and did really well at a time where DC wasn't selling at all and he was still in the 25. Don't argue bs like a more bronze age Superman title would have worked in the 90s when thats bs. JLA was the only DC to regularly get in the top 10 from DC in the 90's. Thats a fact. Nothing from DC was selling so that "failure" stuff is bs and bias. Jimmy Olsen was gonna sell in the 90's and neither will now. Bronze age Superman wouldn't have sold any better than post crisis Superman. Its a bias and BS argument on your part.

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Old 07-16-2011, 01:18 AM   #43
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

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Those 60's numbers are impressive but that was a totally different era and you know it. Superman had to be modernize to survive in the 90's and did really well at a time where DC wasn't selling at all and he was still in the 25. Don't argue bs like a more bronze age Superman title would have worked in the 90s when thats bs. JLA was the only DC to regularly get in the top 10 from DC in the 90's. Thats a fact. Nothing from DC was selling so that "failure" stuff is bs and bias. Jimmy Olsen was gonna sell in the 90's and neither will now. Bronze age Superman wouldn't have sold any better than post crisis Superman. Its a bias and BS argument on your part.
Top 25 is not top ten. And it's entirely subjective if a more classic Superman would have sold or not, because that's not the version they went with. What they did go with was a middle of the pack seller. The fans they alienated would have made the difference between top 25 and top 10.

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Old 07-16-2011, 01:26 AM   #44
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

No its not subjective at all. JUST LOOK AT WHAT WAS SELLING!
The Amazing X-Men 1 $1.95 Marvel 229.5 2 The Astonishing X-Men 1 $1.95 Marvel 223.7 3 Weapon X 1 $1.95 Marvel 213.9 4 Mutants: Generation Next 1 $1.95 Marvel 194.1 5 Gambit & The X-Ternals 1 $1.95 Marvel 178.9 6 Factor-X 1 $1.95 Marvel 167.8 7 X-Man 1 $1.95 Marvel 159.4 8 Spawn 28 $1.95 Image 206.6 9 X-Calibre 1 $1.95 Marvel 147.2 10 X-Men: Chronicles 1 $3.95 Marvel 148.8 11 Angela 2 $2.25 Image 144.3 12 Wetworks 5 $2.50 Image 135.0 13 Rogue 3 $2.95 Marvel 133.7 14 Wildcats Adventures Sourcebook 17 $2.50 Image 119.4 15 Bishop 4 $2.95 Marvel 114.6 16 Batman 516 $1.50 DC 110.9 17 Batman vs. Predator II: Bloodmatch 4 $2.50 DC 106.4 18 Pitt 8 $1.95 Image 106.3 19 Azrael 2 $1.95 DC 104.5 20 Team 7 4 $2.50 Image 103.5 21 Superman 98 $1.50 DC 101.7 22 Amazing Spider-Man 399 $1.50 Marvel 100.0 23 Adventures of Superman 521 $1.50 DC 100.0 24 Superman: The Man of Steel 42 $1.50 DC 99.2 25 Action Comics
Oh my goodness This is from 95 Look at this. Their is no DC title in the top 10. Seriously I don't know what I have to show you to prove that it didn't matter what Superman they put in Action Comics in the 90's that he wasn't breaking the 10 ten monthly. I can post more if you want but this sales figures that you always want to bring up proves that Superman wasn't a failure. This proves that people didn't wanna read DC in the freaking 90's.

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Old 07-16-2011, 01:29 AM   #45
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

1
Spawn 37 $1.95 Image 245.67 2 Gen 13 6 $2.50 Image 216.23 3 Witchblade 1 $2.50 Image 132.41 4 WildC.A.T.s 24 $2.50 Image 109.16 5 Star Wars: Heir to the Empire 1 $2.95 Dark Horse 102.18 6 Shi Senryaku 2 $2.99 Crusade 100.56 7 Batman 525 $1.95 DC 100.00 8 X-Files 10 $2.95 Topps 98.45 9 Superman 107 $1.95 DC 98.17 10 X-Files 11 $2.95 Topps 97.37 11 Star Wars: Empire's End 1 $2.95 Dark Horse 96.28 12 Action Comics 716 $1.95 DC 95.82 13 Adventures of Superman 530 $1.95 DC 95.52 14 Superman: The Man of Steel 51 $1.95 DC 94.85 15 Detective Comics 692 $1.95 DC 88.67 16 Evil Ernie: Straight to Hell 1 $2.95 Chaos 88.49 17 Avengelyne Power 1 $2.50 Maximum 88.48 18 Superman: The Man of Tomorrow 3 $1.95 DC 86.99 19 Ripclaw 1 $2.50 Image 86.66 20 Vampirella Strikes
Im just posting random sales charts from the nineties now. This is from October 95. Superman breaks the 10.

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Old 07-16-2011, 01:39 AM   #46
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

People didn't read DC in the 90's because they were trying to be Marvel. Why read fake Marvel? Read real Marvel instead.

Regardless, this crap is all off topic. The previous costume pics are certainly a desirable update.

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Old 07-16-2011, 01:43 AM   #47
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

That doesn't matter. Because before 97 Superman was still selling even when DC wasn't popular so your failure is utter crap.

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Old 07-16-2011, 01:47 AM   #48
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

Also DC had to become more like Marvel since before Marvel most of their character were walking hero sterotypes. Back in the 60's Hal Jordan and Barry Allen had the exact same personality. They did have deep mythologies I'll give you that but they were boring characters and after Stan Lee Kirby starting give superheroes issues and personalities, DC had to become more marvel or risk being a relic of a forgotten age.

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Old 07-16-2011, 01:53 AM   #49
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

Let me put it like this. Archie use to outsell Superman. Theirs a reason for that. Times have changed and Archie hasn't.

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Old 07-16-2011, 01:58 AM   #50
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Default Re: The Official Costume Thread - Part 9

Archie outsold all those Marvel titles too, so what?

Lee-Kirby FF was outsold by Archie. But Superman had 1-6 titles in 65 and had 6 titles in the top ten through most of the 60's.

If it wasn't for the lawsuit, Grant would take Superman completely back to his roots and he's taking him back as close as he can get anyway. I bet it sells.

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