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Old 11-25-2011, 04:01 AM   #301
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

Laugh it up, but if it was the Greek Police, you bet your a&& they would've just patted his back and let him go!

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Old 11-25-2011, 04:08 AM   #302
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

The Joker could easily have been "disappeared" by the government. He's a terrorist, and he's not an American citizen as far as anyone knows, making him an enemy combatant with practically no rights. I doubt he'd even get a trial, much less successfully plea insanity.

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Old 11-25-2011, 07:09 AM   #303
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

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Originally Posted by Laderlappen View Post
We already know he is locked up. What you think the police did to him when they caught him in The Dark Knight? Gave him a warning and told him to not do that again?
Well my understanding was The Dark Knight Rises is going to be set 8 years after The Dark Knight, you mean to tell me in those 8 years the joker hasn't tried to escape, escaped, being caught again, died, etc. You think the joker is just gonna be sitting in a cell for eight years knitting?

And in addition what says he was locked up in The Dark Knight, sure we saw him hanging upside down when Batman left him, but lets remember this is the guy that escaped being held in the prison but hiding explosives in that guys stomach. In a twist of the story he could of escaped shortly after Bamtan left, the possibilities are endless.

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Old 11-25-2011, 07:20 AM   #304
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

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The Joker could easily have been "disappeared" by the government. He's a terrorist, and he's not an American citizen as far as anyone knows, making him an enemy combatant with practically no rights. I doubt he'd even get a trial, much less successfully plea insanity.
I could see this used as a method to explain utter lack of Joker in the new film and overall post TDK Gotham. Heck, it could be a bunch of angry cops that kill him during a transportation or something.
This way, their behavior could also be used as a tool by Bane. Police brutality, lack of a fair trial, government conspiracy and other things that Bane could feed to the masses.

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Old 11-25-2011, 07:41 AM   #305
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

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Well my understanding was The Dark Knight Rises is going to be set 8 years after The Dark Knight, you mean to tell me in those 8 years the joker hasn't tried to escape, escaped, being caught again, died, etc. You think the joker is just gonna be sitting in a cell for eight years knitting?
Thats what happens when serial-killers and terrorists are caught by the police.

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And in addition what says he was locked up in The Dark Knight, sure we saw him hanging upside down when Batman left him, but lets remember this is the guy that escaped being held in the prison but hiding explosives in that guys stomach. In a twist of the story he could of escaped shortly after Bamtan left, the possibilities are endless.
Since the movie is not about the Joker, why would they have him escape? When something unrealistic and absurd isnt mentioned in the movie, the audience is assuming that didnt happen. Like I dont need to be told that aliens havent attacked Gotham or that Alfred hasnt committed male rape in these 8 years, just as I dont need to be told that Joker hasnt escaped prison.

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Old 11-25-2011, 07:54 AM   #306
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

My point is that 8 years has passed sine the dark knight, and I don't think it hurts to give a little nod to the joker, when he was such a large part of the film I think it would be a little strange not to mention him at all, I mean the dark knight had the brief bit with the scarecrow at the beginning.

But I do see your point maybe Nolan, and even the audience have reserved the idea that the joker is now incarcerated and therefore dealt with. I just liked the way Nolans joker raised more questions than answered in the movie, I was just carrying that kind of thinking.

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Old 11-25-2011, 12:55 PM   #307
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

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My point is that 8 years has passed sine the dark knight, and I don't think it hurts to give a little nod to the joker, when he was such a large part of the film I think it would be a little strange not to mention him at all, I mean the dark knight had the brief bit with the scarecrow at the beginning.
I think it would be much stranger to throw out mentions to characters that arent in the movie for no reason. And I dont know if you remembered but Scarecrow escaped at the end of Batman Begins. His last scene was him riding away on a horse. You cant end one of the main villains with just have him ride away to freedom.

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But I do see your point maybe Nolan, and even the audience have reserved the idea that the joker is now incarcerated and therefore dealt with. I just liked the way Nolans joker raised more questions than answered in the movie, I was just carrying that kind of thinking.
To me it feels more like you are answering something that has already been answered.

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Old 11-25-2011, 02:28 PM   #308
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

If the Joker was killed offscreen that would be ridiculously stupid. It would ruin the entire point of not killing him in TDK.

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Old 11-25-2011, 04:46 PM   #309
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

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Laugh it up, but if it was the Greek Police, you bet your a&& they would've just patted his back and let him go!


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Originally Posted by ThePhantasm View Post
If the Joker was killed offscreen that would be ridiculously stupid. It would ruin the entire point of not killing him in TDK.
Exactly... I think I prefer the version where he's been using Arkham as a revolving door for...well, 8 bloody years.

I'd love to hear Bruce and Alfred talk about what the Joker winning or not in the long run, especially during Bruce's "Never Again" phase. That line where he said "But the Joker cannot win" was perhaps one of the most profound convictions you heard out of him... much like "it's what separates us from them" from Begins.

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Old 11-25-2011, 05:04 PM   #310
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

[QUOTE=Laderlappen;21934059To me it feels more like you are answering something that has already been answered.[/QUOTE]

Well if it's that cut and dry why are people still asking about the joker situation? Just because your opinion seems to be he should not have any mention in the next film it does not mean that fans and even the writers are not gonna want some kind of mention to him. I understand your points on the logical ending in the dark knight, but you must understand there are a fair amount of people that want some sort of mention to him. I also think it's not a matter of answering anything, because it's all just a matter of opinion at the present time as we haven't even seen the film yet, so there is no way to have any kind of answer unless you've access to the script of course.

So to end this in short I wish to have a mention of the joker in the dark knight rises, if that doesn't match your opinion then fair play agree to disagree.

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Old 11-25-2011, 05:33 PM   #311
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

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Well if it's that cut and dry why are people still asking about the joker situation? Just because your opinion seems to be he should not have any mention in the next film it does not mean that fans and even the writers are not gonna want some kind of mention to him. I understand your points on the logical ending in the dark knight, but you must understand there are a fair amount of people that want some sort of mention to him. I also think it's not a matter of answering anything, because it's all just a matter of opinion at the present time as we haven't even seen the film yet, so there is no way to have any kind of answer unless you've access to the script of course.

So to end this in short I wish to have a mention of the joker in the dark knight rises, if that doesn't match your opinion then fair play agree to disagree.
I have no idea why? People are not confused of where he is, there are no loose ends untied about the Joker. People are not asking for some sort of explanation about the Joker or something else. Some people just want the word Joker to be uttered in the movie. Thats what I dont understand. Why is it so important to say Joker? Do yo get some sort of kick of it?

And Im not saying he shouldnt be mentioned. Im saying there is already answered questions shouldnt be answered again, and dont add things or conversations in the movie that has no point or relevance in the story.

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Old 11-25-2011, 05:48 PM   #312
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

this whole 8 years thing seems like a good way of bypassing the joker thing, if he's been batman for 8 years, we could surmize that they've had their back and forths and it's taken just as much out of batman in the films as it has in the comics. It doesn't cheapen the wonderful line from joker at the end of the film "we were meant to do this forever" (or something like that) and it manages to avoid having joker in the actual film.

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Old 11-25-2011, 06:44 PM   #313
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

The joker will probably be mentioned this time around.

A line like bane is different from the joker. Something like that.

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Old 11-25-2011, 07:04 PM   #314
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

Look what The Joker did to Bruce/Batman the first time round when they met. He killed the Police Commissioner, a high profile judge, several police officers as well as killing Rachel and corrupting the DA, not any DA, but Gotham's White Knight. His effect was such that the National Guard had to be called in.

I think it would be pretty shoddy if it was suggested that The Joker had escaped and been recaptured and escaped and been recaptured again in the 8 years prior to TDKR's narrative. It doesn't increase the character's standing but diminishes it if these subsequent jail breaks were lesser attempts that didn't result in any allies being harmed, or any changes to Bruce's thinking on the nature of his mission.

What happened in TDK between Batman and The Joker was perfect. Why mess with it?

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Old 11-25-2011, 07:38 PM   #315
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

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Look what The Joker did to Bruce/Batman the first time round when they met. He killed the Police Commissioner, a high profile judge, several police officers as well as killing Rachel and corrupting the DA, not any DA, but Gotham's White Knight. His effect was such that the National Guard had to be called in.

I think it would be pretty shoddy if it was suggested that The Joker had escaped and been recaptured and escaped and been recaptured again in the 8 years prior to TDKR's narrative. It doesn't increase the character's standing but diminishes it if these subsequent jail breaks were lesser attempts that didn't result in any allies being harmed, or any changes to Bruce's thinking on the nature of his mission.

What happened in TDK between Batman and The Joker was perfect. Why mess with it?
I'm with you on this one actually, but I guess in order to uphold the belief that joker and batman are in fact sworn enemies destined to fight again and again, some hints could be given. But you are right in thinking that Joker's one attack in TDK is better left alone as the singular event that changed the course of batmans career. Maybe it should stay that way.

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Old 11-25-2011, 10:38 PM   #316
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

Come on people! I mean Really? There are actually some of you who think The Joker shouldn't be mentioned in this film? That's the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard. The Joker was the WHOLE reason The Dark Knight did the kind of business it did. If it was not for him, the movie would have done well, but wouldn't have went on to break records like it did. Thus, the whole reason many people will be seeing TDKR is because of guess who? The Joker! It would be a massive mistake by the film makers to completely ignore Joker like he never happened. You can get away with doing that to someone like Ras Al Ghul, but not someone like Mister J who changed things in Gotham as we know them. Joker will get his mention, and it probably won't be nearly as subtle as some of you are thinking. Nolan's smart enough to know who made him his money in TDK. If you think he's going to ignore him in this movie, you're sadly mistaken.

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Old 11-25-2011, 10:43 PM   #317
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

It would be a big mistake? People are gonna skip the movie if their friend tells them they don't mention Joker?

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Old 11-25-2011, 11:05 PM   #318
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

Joker's iconic status was no doubt instrumental to TDK's widespread acclaim, but ultimately his participation strengthens the BATMAN brand. Goodwill has already extended to TDKR regardless of whether or not Joker is in.

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Old 11-25-2011, 11:06 PM   #319
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

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It would be a big mistake? People are gonna skip the movie if their friend tells them they don't mention Joker?
Some people hate these movies because they don't like the suit and don't like Bale's voice. And even if the suit were blue & gray and Bale dubbed by Kevin Conroy they'd still hate it. That's how shallow and vapid some people are, so I wouldn't be surprised if a few idiots did skip the film based solely on the lack of a Joker reference.

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Old 11-25-2011, 11:09 PM   #320
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Uncle Joker escaped custody soon after TDK, fled to a Pakistan compound and hid for 8 years. Navy SEALS shot and killed him, and dumped the body at sea. How's that for referencing current day politics?

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Old 11-25-2011, 11:42 PM   #321
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

I don't need the Joker mentioned in this movie at all. Neither do all of you.
Christopher Nolan is the best thing to happen to this trilogy, not Heath's Joker. Heath is in 1 out of 3 films, and the sum of this trilogy's parts will be far better than a single character's presence.

In other words, yes, the Joker might have given TDKR some wings, but it's ultimately Nolan who is creating the hype for TDKR. Think about it, there's nothing to promote here other than the fact that this is Nolan's last Batman film. This man is still hot off the smash of Inception AND The Dark Knight, which are hailed as masterpieces by pretty much everybody.

TDKR will be just fine. It's the movie of 2012, maybe even the decade.

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Old 11-25-2011, 11:45 PM   #322
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I don't need the Joker mentioned in this movie at all. Neither do all of you.
You don't speak for anyone except yourself. I want Joker mentioned.

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Old 11-25-2011, 11:58 PM   #323
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You don't speak for anyone except yourself. I want Joker mentioned.
You most likely won't get it, in my opinion. Except as a passing line of dialogue.

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Old 11-26-2011, 12:00 AM   #324
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You most likely won't get it, in my opinion. Except as a passing line of dialogue.
I think he's guaranteed a mention if this is anything to go by:



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Old 11-26-2011, 05:05 AM   #325
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Default Re: The Joker sized elephant in the room

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Come on people! I mean Really? There are actually some of you who think The Joker shouldn't be mentioned in this film? That's the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard. The Joker was the WHOLE reason The Dark Knight did the kind of business it did. If it was not for him, the movie would have done well, but wouldn't have went on to break records like it did. Thus, the whole reason many people will be seeing TDKR is because of guess who? The Joker! It would be a massive mistake by the film makers to completely ignore Joker like he never happened. You can get away with doing that to someone like Ras Al Ghul, but not someone like Mister J who changed things in Gotham as we know them. Joker will get his mention, and it probably won't be nearly as subtle as some of you are thinking. Nolan's smart enough to know who made him his money in TDK. If you think he's going to ignore him in this movie, you're sadly mistaken.
This is not The Dark Knight. This is a completely different movie with different characters. The Joker is not in this and has no part of this story. His story ended in The Dark Knight and we know what happened to him. There are no unanswered questions. Why is it then so important to talk about the Joker when he has no part of this story? The most ridiculous thing you have heard is that a character that isnt in the movie wont be mentioned?

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