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View Poll Results: Should this Superman kill?
No. 133 70.00%
Yes, its about time 32 16.84%
He should Find a way to send them to the Phantom Zone 14 7.37%
Other (explain) 11 5.79%
Voters: 190. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-02-2013, 02:18 PM   #326
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

The problem I have with the end is that Superman fights Zod so hard that buildings come crumbling to the ground filled with thousands of people. Superman essentially creates 9/11 times 10 and doesnt stop to save even a person, yet one family is worth snapping zods neck over. He has thrown Zod through so many buildings by that point as well, he couldnt have just thrown Zod through the roof?

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Old 07-02-2013, 02:59 PM   #327
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

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Originally Posted by Gambits' Ace View Post
The problem I have with the end is that Superman fights Zod so hard that buildings come crumbling to the ground filled with thousands of people. Superman essentially creates 9/11 times 10 and doesnt stop to save even a person, yet one family is worth snapping zods neck over. He has thrown Zod through so many buildings by that point as well, he couldnt have just thrown Zod through the roof?
And then what? Continue to fight until Zod eventually gains the upper hand and goes on a killing spree? Yeah, he could have probably thrown Zod up through the roof, or heck, flown him out. But Zod's "Never." made it clear he would never rest. Like he said, there was only one way it could end, either Kal dies, or he does.

There was no Phantom Zone Projector, Kryptonite or another way to detain Zod. There was only one solution to keep the people of earth safe from an unhinged Zod and he had to make that difficult decision.

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Old 07-02-2013, 04:46 PM   #328
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

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There was only one solution to keep the people of earth safe
Keep the people of Earth safe? You mean all those thousands of people Superman left dead in the middle of Metropolis without even an attempt to save them. The problem with the death is Snyder doesn't earn it. He doesn't show Superman struggling to save people during the fight so he can ultimately learn he cant both save people and beat zod. The movie makes it seem he's only doing it to save this one family.

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Old 07-02-2013, 04:52 PM   #329
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

Except we've watched him the entire movie trying to keep people safe. Heck, he handed himself over to the authorities and left his fate in humanities hands. Yeah, they could have shown him trying to safe people during the battle with Zod, only for him to realize it's not possible unless he takes Zod out. But Zod was dictating the pace of the battle. He was either always trying to get a lock on Zod, or got sucker punched when he lost sight of him.

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Old 07-02-2013, 05:14 PM   #330
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

but thats the thing we haven't seen him try to keep people safe the entire movie. When did he actually physically save someone not named Lois?

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Old 07-02-2013, 05:16 PM   #331
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

Alright, this is where I just end the discussion.

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Old 07-02-2013, 05:21 PM   #332
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

Superman saves his mom, Pete Ross, several military people, plus the entire world by turning himself over to Zoe in the first place, and yknow, stopping the whole teraforming thing too.

But he does has a roundabout point; obviously, most of MoS is about Superman's need and desire to save others, but at the same time, the film really doesn't really attach a personal, human element beyond Lois and one or two of the rest of the supporting cast, and that lack of intimacy can very much give off the vibe that Superman - or rather, the entire film - doesn't really care much about anyone outside of their core group of characters.

As for the topic itself, I have no problem if Superman kills - at least in situations like the one in MoS. That whole morality of not killing in superhero comics is downright foolish and illogical to begin with.

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Old 07-02-2013, 05:24 PM   #333
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

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That whole morality of not killing in superhero comics is downright foolish and illogical to begin with.
Well, it wouldn't be so foolish, if criminals would just stay locked up in the comics. It definitely gets foolish when someone like the Joker escaped like the 10th time, and his death count just keeps climbing. In a Movie, you don't have that problem. Because villains either die, or stay locked up.

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Old 07-02-2013, 05:29 PM   #334
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

Pragmatically speaking, Superman should have killed each Kryptonian the second he could. But really, when he first fights them in Smallville, he seems rather out of his league, so it's somewhat understandable.

Hopefully in future movies, he'll be less reluctant to use lethal force. If he had snapped Zod's neck earlier, he would have saved hundreds if not thousands of lives.

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Old 07-02-2013, 05:57 PM   #335
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

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Well, it wouldn't be so foolish, if criminals would just stay locked up in the comics. It definitely gets foolish when someone like the Joker escaped like the 10th time, and his death count just keeps climbing. In a Movie, you don't have that problem. Because villains either die, or stay locked up.
That's just because it hasn't happened yet.

Let's see how long Loki stays locked up in the Marvel Film Universe.

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Old 07-02-2013, 08:59 PM   #336
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

I say it would have been better if he just lobotomize him and then turn him in to answer for his crimes against humanity S.T.A.R. labs will find a prison for him bathed with red sun all day and night just drooling. A fitting end for a criminal despot.

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Old 07-03-2013, 01:12 AM   #337
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

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Originally Posted by Gambits' Ace View Post
The problem I have with the end is that Superman fights Zod so hard that buildings come crumbling to the ground filled with thousands of people. Superman essentially creates 9/11 times 10 and doesnt stop to save even a person, yet one family is worth snapping zods neck over. He has thrown Zod through so many buildings by that point as well, he couldnt have just thrown Zod through the roof?
Well, let's think about this for a minute.

If Superman had turned his attention away from Zod for even a second, what do you think would have happened?

Zod would have raced off, and killed a bunch of people.

Right?

So, basically, what I'm getting from you is that you felt the film wasn't even violent enough. You actually wanted to force Superman to feel the agony of going to save one person, and then being faced with the reality that his distraction cost the lives of many, many more.

Go get the novel. It might make you feel better. In the book, Clark is very angsty over the death toll, and tries to check for survivors as he's fighting.

And just so you know, Superman did not snap Zod's neck for "just one family". He snapped Zod's neck because he knew without a doubt that Zod was too dangerous to the people of earth. Not just four people...but 7 billion people.

I fail to see how Superman killing Zod (which he does in the comics too, so stop whining that he killed someone) was somehow Clark being heartless.

Just a general note to all fans of comic books:

If you go into a movie with preconceived notions of who and what you think the character should be, prepare to be disappointed.

The movies are not going to retell the same stories over and over. They are going to change the stories, they are going to change the characters, particularly to fit into our current circumstances.

Instead of deciding before you go into a film what your idealized vision would be, allow the creators to share their vision with you. You will be happier for it, and you may even learn to see your beloved characters from a totally new perspective.

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Old 07-03-2013, 02:26 AM   #338
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Default Re: Should this Superman kill? - Part 1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tempest
Well, let's think about this for a minute.

If Superman had turned his attention away from Zod for even a second, what do you think would have happened?

Zod would have raced off, and killed a bunch of people.

Right?

So, basically, what I'm getting from you is that you felt the film wasn't even violent enough. You actually wanted to force Superman to feel the agony of going to save one person, and then being faced with the reality that his distraction cost the lives of many, many more.

Go get the novel. It might make you feel better. In the book, Clark is very angsty over the death toll, and tries to check for survivors as he's fighting.

And just so you know, Superman did not snap Zod's neck for "just one family". He snapped Zod's neck because he knew without a doubt that Zod was too dangerous to the people of earth. Not just four people...but 7 billion people.

I fail to see how Superman killing Zod (which he does in the comics too, so stop whining that he killed someone) was somehow Clark being heartless.

Just a general note to all fans of comic books:

If you go into a movie with preconceived notions of who and what you think the character should be, prepare to be disappointed.

The movies are not going to retell the same stories over and over. They are going to change the stories, they are going to change the characters, particularly to fit into our current circumstances.

Instead of deciding before you go into a film what your idealized vision would be, allow the creators to share their vision with you. You will be happier for it, and you may even learn to see your beloved characters from a totally new perspective.
Um, I'm going to take this post & put it on another forum...

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