Thanos Vs. Doctor Doom: Which is the greater villain within the Marvel Universe?

[BigThor]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

Because Doom is not an idiot. Thor has the advantage in hand to hand. Why would he engage in that without a plan? Doom would just travel back in time and make sure Donald Blake never found his cane. Or take over Ultron... or create Titania and Volcana... or drain the power of the Silver Surfer...

This isn't Over the Top... this is WAR!

Thor doesn't merely have the advantage, because there would be NO contest in one on one fight between Doom and Thor.


Thor's had the ability to time travel before so he could've just gone back in time and made sure Doom's parent never met, or he could just fly Doom to the center of the sun but that wouldn't be a "fight" would it?

[Franklin Richards]

No it's not. Molecule Man is Doom's minion.


Thanos is Death's minion.

[Captain Marvel]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

Everyone was humiliated by The Sentry. Ares was ripped in half. The only reason Thor beat the Sentry was because Bob was fighting The Void from the inside. So back that **** up.

And you posted a picture of Doom taking a full blast from the POWER GEM and not going down.

Yes, I did post a picture of Doom getting blasted and not dying straight away. I also don't seem to recall Doom accomplishing anything of note for the rest of the battle.

On the other hand, I posted several pictures of Thanos taking shots from TWO powerhouses with the Power Gem, and not only did he not go down, he won both those fights.

So how is it Thanos can win those two fights singlehandedly whereas Doom, who has the help of Thor, Captain America, the Hulk, Spider-Man, Iron Man, Quasar, Cyclops, Wolverine, Cloak, and a whole bunch of other people, can't accomplish the same feat?

[Franklin Richards]

Originally Posted by BigThor

Thor doesn't merely have the advantage, because there would be NO contest in one on one fight between Doom and Thor.


Thor's had the ability to time travel before so he could've just gone back in time and made sure Doom's parent never met, or he could just fly Doom to the center of the sun but that wouldn't be a "fight" would it?

You mean he'd fly one of Doom's robots into the Sun?

You do realize that Thor is a hero and if Doom really won, then there wouldn't be a Thor book anymore, right?

[Captain Marvel]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

No it's not. Molecule Man is Doom's minion.


Thanos is Death's minion.

Until he gained infinite power and became her master. And then later told her to piss off and started doing whatever the hell he wanted.

Besides, she's only his "master" only so far as he's been trying to nail her for years.

[Franklin Richards]

Originally Posted by Captain Marvel

Yes, I did post a picture of Doom getting blasted and not dying straight away. I also don't seem to recall Doom accomplishing anything of note for the rest of the battle.

On the other hand, I posted several pictures of Thanos taking shots from TWO powerhouses with the Power Gem, and not only did he not go down, he won both those fights.

So how is it Thanos can win those two fights singlehandedly whereas Doom, who has the help of Thor, Captain America, the Hulk, Spider-Man, Iron Man, Quasar, Cyclops, Wolverine, Cloak, and a whole bunch of other people, can't accomplish the same feat?

Death and Thanos with the Power Gem VS Doom, Thor, Cap, Hulk, Spidey, Iron man, Quasar, Cyclops, Wolverine, Cloak, and a whole bunch of other people you mean.

[Captain Marvel]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

Death and Thanos with the Power Gem VS Doom, Thor, Cap, Hulk, Spidey, Iron man, Quasar, Cyclops, Wolverine, Cloak, and a whole bunch of other people you mean.

Nope. Thanos with the Power Gem versus all those people all on his own. She was standing right there on the sidelines the whole time and did absolutely nothing to help. Hell, she later backstabbed him and attacked him. Or did you miss the screenshots which I posted earlier in which Death, along with Galactus, the Stranger, Kronos, the Celestials, Mephisto, Love, Hate, Order, Chaos, and Eon were all attacking him?

If you're going to be claiming that Death is helping him every fight because he got a one time power boost from him, then guess what? Doom can't claim to have ever won a victory on his own, either, since he apparently got a power boost from the Marquis, too. Only difference is, Thanos had already achieved omnipotence once with his own original powers before Death had given him a boost.

[BigThor]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

Everyone was humiliated by The Sentry. Ares was ripped in half. The only reason Thor beat the Sentry was because Bob was fighting The Void from the inside. So back that **** up.

And you posted a picture of Doom taking a full blast from the POWER GEM and not going down.

Yeah Bob did ask Thor to "kill him", but that doesn't change the fact that Thor was going toe to toe with the Void (not may character's can do that). Besides, they had a breif scuffle before Sentry voided out and it seemed fairly even which is still much more than we can say for Doom.

Besides there was also a "what if" fight scene between Thor and Sentry where Thor won by snapping his neck, I don't think it was canon but both characters had all of their abilities intact.

[Franklin Richards]

He had the Infinity Gauntlet! She couldn't take away the power she'd already granted him. And when it was over... she still didn't! He's still the man she made him.


And you need to dial down the petulance or this "friendly debate" will be minus one member.

[Captain Marvel]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

He had the Infinity Gauntlet! She couldn't take away the power she'd already granted him. And when it was over... she still didn't! He's still the man she made him.


And you need to dial down the petulance or this "friendly debate" will be minus one member.

The petulance? You're the one making ridiculous assertions. You're trying to draw parallels between a power source and completely separate individuals with their own power sets. You may as well claim that Spider-Man has never won any battles on his own, either, because he got his powers from a radioactive spider, and that the radioactive spider deserves some credit as well. Or that Magneto never won a battle on his own, as he got his power thanks to evolution, and the forces of evolution deserves credit, too.

He got a power boost from Death, just as Doom got a power boost from the Marquis, but it was a one time thing. The method of acquiring the power doesn't matter so long as you got it, you have it, and it's yours to do with as you please.

Having gotten power, though, isn't at all the same as claiming that a wholly separate individual is part of that persons assets. Especially when the Molecule Man was working for Doom only under unusual circumstances. I certainly haven't noticed him bunking in Castle Doom on a regular basis.

A friendly debate is fine, but if you're going to be disingenuous, then expect to get called out on it.

[BigThor]

Well I'm pretty sure Doom steal's powers from characters on a regular basis, so when has he ever won an important fight using his own abilities?

Oh and yeah Thor's most likely going to be dropping a Doombot off into the sun instead of Doom, but that just goes to show who Doom thinks will win in an actual fight (here's a hint, not Doom).

[Captain Marvel]

Originally Posted by BigThor

Well I'm pretty sure Doom steal's powers from characters on a regular basis, so when has he ever won an important fight using his own abilities?

Yeah, Thor #606 had Doom going at it with Thor not with his own equipment or technology, but with a copy of an Asgardian device.

And he still lost.

[Franklin Richards]

I'm being disin---?

So slaves and servants don't count but divine intervention does? You are the one being arbitrary and a sophist. Your condescension is palpable.

"Did you not see the screenshot?"

Yeah.. I saw it. The one where he was using the Infinity Gauntlet. Not his own powers or even the ones he GOT from Death. Just like the Silver Surfer is Galactus' sire, Thanos is Death's. Now if you don't agree that's one thing, but don't dismiss my assertions out of hand, because when we're talking about fictional characters written by hundreds of different writers over the years, everything is hypothetical.

[Franklin Richards]

Ok gang. Tired of getting ganged up on. Especially when the argument is "Who is GREATER."

Doom is A list. Thanos is C. That makes him "greater". Period.

[Captain Marvel]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

I'm being disin---?

So slaves and servants don't count but divine intervention does? You are the one being arbitrary and a sophist. Your condescension is palpable.

"Did you not see the screenshot?"

Yeah.. I saw it. The one where he was using the Infinity Gauntlet. Not his own powers or even the ones he GOT from Death. Just like the Silver Surfer is Galactus' sire, Thanos is Death's. Now if you don't agree that's one thing, but don't dismiss my assertions out of hand, because when we're talking about fictional characters written by hundreds of different writers over the years, everything is hypothetical.

I'm being arbitrary? So when someone fights the Silver Surfer, Firelord, Morg, Terrax, Air Walker, or they fighting them alone, or are they fighting Galactus, too? According to your argument, yes, they're fighting Galactus, too.

Except that, no, they're not. And anyone with an ounce of common sense would know that that's a ridiculous argument. Likewise, it'd be ridiculous to say that anyone who's fighting Doom is also fighting the Marquis. By the same token, it's ludicrous to say that anyone fighting Thanos is also fighting Death.

And yes, he was using the Infinity Gauntlet, which was power which, again, he acquired on his own. So how is it that Doom acquiring the Beyonder's power is a valid demonstration of his feats but Thanos acquiring the Infinity Gauntlet isn't? The entire argument you've come up with ridiculous double standards which you never hold up against Doom. And you think I'm being arbitrary? I'm holding them both up to the same exact standard. At no point did I ever try to make a ridiculous distinction and claim "It's Doom + the Marquis Vs. X". That was your argument.

There's a big, BIG difference, though, between one person having power which he learned/acquired/attained from someone else, and a wholly separate person with their own will and agenda present. For the short while that they were on Battle World Doom talked the Molecule Man into working for him, but that was it. It was never a permanent arrangement, and the Molecule Man certainly wasn't Doom's slave. Likewise, Ultron got out from Doom's thumb as well, and has since gone on to become a cosmic threat.

You claim I'm arbitrary, but if you were to ask anyone else what's the more reasonable viewpoint and 9/10 people would agree with me.

[Captain Marvel]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

Ok gang. Tired of getting ganged up on. Especially when the argument is "Who is GREATER."

Doom is A list. Thanos is C. That makes him "greater". Period.

Hmm, I wonder which character is going to end up as the ultimate villain in the Avengers movies? Not somebody which Marvel considers C-List, that's a fact. A C-List villain, after all, isn't one who's been the center of several major story events, moreso than Doom, who for the most part is the archnemesis of a single super team, and who's considered to be a universal threat. And when that villain makes his appearance, my guess? He won't be played by this guy.

[BigThor]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

Ok gang. Tired of getting ganged up on. Especially when the argument is "Who is GREATER."

Doom is A list. Thanos is C. That makes him "greater". Period.

I agree that Doom is an "A list" characters, but Thanos is definately "B list" at the least not C list.

[Franklin Richards]

First of all... you're talking out your ass. You don't know who the villain will be. If Easter Eggs were proof then Franklin Richards would have been in X-Men 3.

B. Doom has been the center of tons of things in the 616. He's made appearances in every major mag...











...and even the not so well known ones.



... and finally Doom inspired Vader. Thanos is a rip off of Darkseid.

Doom for the win.

[BigThor]

Yeah Dr. Doom is a solid A lister within the Marvel Universe, there's certainly no denying that.

[Captain Marvel]

Yeah, it's true that Doom's made more frequent appearances, but there're two good reasons for that.

1) He's been around for 10 more years than Thanos.

2) He's weaker. He can show up in the X-Men, Spider-Man, whatever because it's possible for the heroes in those titles to either beat him or overcome his plans, even if they can't beat him.

The same isn't true for Thanos. He showed up in Captain Marvel and what happened? Captain Marvel had to call in the Avengers. He shows up in Warlock and what happens? He kills Warlock. He shows up in Silver Surfer and what happens? Surfer has to call in every superpowered being in existence that's still living. He shows up in Guardians of the Galaxy and what happens? The Guardians have to collapse a universe onto him.

So yeah, Thanos hasn't appeared as often, but that's because writers can't reasonably write him into your average issue of Spider-Man without coming up with a reason why Thanos just doesn't kill Spider-Man. It's the same reason why people like Galactus don't show up as villains more often. Because there's no way most of Marvel's lineup can hold their own with the likes of Galactus, or Thanos.

As for the prop, do you really think they made the prop for no good reason whatsoever? Watch the movies. All those Easter Eggs matter. So yeah, Thanos is going to be in the Avengers movies and if he's half as awesome as he is in the comics then he's going to absolutely kill. Personally speaking, I'm looking forward to seeing Thanos on film.

[Franklin Richards]

Didn't he show up and fight Spider-man in a dune buggy?

[Captain Marvel]

Originally Posted by BigThor

Yeah Dr. Doom is a solid A lister within the Marvel Universe, there's certainly no denying that.

He certainly is. I certainly have never denied that Dr. Doom is awesome. Doom 2099 was one of my favorite comics and frankly I loved seeing him reconquer Latveria, then conquer Myridia, and even the US. Although sadly that story turned out to be a pretty big disappointment. What can I say? I'm just not a fan of Warren Ellis. I really wish John Francis Moore stayed on. Hell, he even popped into the last issue of Ravage 2099 and killed Ravage IN HIS OWN TITLE! How awesome is that?

That being said, there's a big difference between popularity and being A-List, and being a threat in-universe. There's no question that the Joker is also an A-List villain. He's probably the most wellknown and popular comic book villain ever. But by the same token, no one can seriously make an argument that he's a huge threat within the universe he exists in. Against people like Wonder Woman, Superman, Captain Marvel (Heh), and others, he pretty much stands no chance.

Likewise, as awesome as Doom is, he's just not a universal level threat the way that Thanos is. He has his moments where he's punching above his weight class, like Secret Wars, but for the most part he lays one or two levels below the top tier on Earth, powerwise, which is itself a couple tiers below the cosmic level. Thanos is clearly above that.

If you want to argue that Doom is (Currently, anyway. Let's see how things shake out when Avengers 3 comes out) the more popular of the two, then yeah, Doom wins that discussion hands down. But who's the most powerful in-universe? Who's the bigger threat in-universe? Which character is more likely to make the heroes crap themselves in-universe?

That'd be the villain who had a universe collapsed on his head to stop him.

[BigThor]

Thanos IS definately going to appear as a villain in one of the Avengers sequels and there's even HEAVY speculation that he's going to make an appearance in the post credits scene in The Avengers.

[Franklin Richards]

Doom has got a Tower of Babel type plan for everyone. I'm sure he's got some really cool Thanos Protocols.

I bet his avenue of attack is his bionics. There's some sort of obsolete tech still in Thanos out of pride that Doom has a final contingency for.

He's that kind of Magnificent Bastard.

[Spider-Aziz]

Originally Posted by Captain Marvel

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:

The immediate aftermath for Galactus.



The Nova Corps entry on Thanos.



Thanos wipes out the Cancerverse.

This guy is so scary, I'd faint before him before I soil my pants