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Old 04-04-2012, 08:28 AM   #51
hopefuldreamer
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

I agree. The Justice League come together, not just because the world needs them to defeat some immediate threat, but because they are each looking for a way they can do 'more' on a long term basis.

They can see the benefits of working as a team to make real changes in the world start to happen. And they each come from different places and have different reasons - but they are all working towards the same goal.

Because of that, they have a bond. They have something in common that is really rare to find. They are each set apart from the world, which brings them closer to each other, as they can share in things that no one else is capable of.


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Old 04-04-2012, 08:37 AM   #52
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

A team like JL needs hierarchy, it is not like Avengers where Nick Fury is the brain and Captain America is the Leader, In case of JL the senior "core" members (or founders) have already established trust among themselves and they form strategies and guide the League and it's new members.

For this to happen Supes and Bats should have an understanding of each other before the League takes shape.

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Old 04-04-2012, 09:00 AM   #53
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

The Justice League is not a hierarchal structure. Superman is considered the first among equals. The reason others are recruited to it is because they are considered equals to Superman.

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Make a World's Finest movie first before making a Justice League movie, that way it can work.

No need to just include A-list superheros like Superman, Batman with 10 other B-list heroes in ensemble movie, it would just look ridiculous.
I would be fine with this, but the Justice League should never have a roster of ten on film. Go with:

Superman
Batman
Wonder Woman
Flash
Green Lantern
Martian Manhunter
Aquaman

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Old 04-04-2012, 09:03 AM   #54
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

They take votes.



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Old 04-04-2012, 09:18 AM   #55
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

The core members are the permanent members and they guide the rest though they are democratic in the selection process of their leader, inclusion process of new members and making major decisions.

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Old 04-04-2012, 09:28 AM   #56
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

The main seven members should be the only members on film.

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Old 04-04-2012, 09:33 AM   #57
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

I would prefer only five members -

Superman, Batman, Flash, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern.

Introduce Martian Manhunter at the end of First JL movie. Leave Aquaman out, his back story will take up a major chunk of screen time and it would make the movie expensive.

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Old 04-04-2012, 09:49 AM   #58
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

Introducing a character at the end of the film would seem like sequel bait. At least to me, that's going a bit too "Marvel Studios" for my liking.

If I were able to have some creative input, I'd say use Martian Manhunter as the catalyst that brings the rest of the league together, very much like in the DCAU. J'onn flees to Earth for help because the white Martians have been awoken. He calls together the rest of the league and the movie would be told largely from the view of him, Wonder Woman, Flash and Aquaman and their admiration for Batman/Superman.

Aquaman I feel should be included because he needs a good rep now. I'd up his power levels and to cross him over with Wonder Woman he'd be linked to Poseidon.

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Old 04-04-2012, 09:51 AM   #59
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

I would rather do something different than 'alien invasion'.

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I would prefer only five members -

Superman, Batman, Flash, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern.

Introduce Martian Manhunter at the end of First JL movie. Leave Aquaman out, his back story will take up a major chunk of screen time and it would make the movie expensive.
I'm actually okay with that roster. No offense to J'onn or AQM fans.

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Old 04-04-2012, 10:08 AM   #60
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Alien invasion seems to be their speciality: Brainiac, Darkseid, White Martians, Starro, Thanagarians, Crime Syndicate (sorta), Sinestro Corps, Imperiex, Anti-Monitor. I'm so used to it I never thought it would be cliché.

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Old 04-04-2012, 10:23 AM   #61
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

I wouldn't call it cliché. I'm actually kind of in the same boat as you I'm so used to them dealing with alien invasions, that it makes me want them to go in a different route.

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Old 04-04-2012, 10:29 AM   #62
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

Some stories to adapt from animated movies -

JL:Crisis on Two Earths.
JL: Doom
JL:Starcrossed.
JL:New Frontier
JL:Secret Origins.

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Old 04-04-2012, 10:33 AM   #63
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

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Ah, see. That's why people need to do a Justice League film right. The Justice League should not just be about we need the fastest smartest strongest and most powerful heroes to beat this foe. It should be the coming together of friends and the start of what becomes a familial bond.
I’m not saying a JL movie is 100% unworkable. But it wouldn’t be easy. So, yes, if the story was good… then it would be good. (And if my uncle had boobs she’d be my aunt.)

In action ensembles (like Mission: Impossible) you want to give each member a “specialty.” So, there’s the “brains,” the “muscle,” the “master of disguise,” etc. The pretext is that there are jobs in the caper-at-hand that are uniquely and plausibly suited to one member – which no one else can do (thus justifying their inclusion on the team). And it goes without saying that you’d try to avoid duplication (there’s no cause to have two “masters of disguise” on the team, for example).

So for JL, I think the first and biggest “problem” is Superman. Characters like WW, Flash, Aquaman and (arguably) Batman are derivative of Supes – he can do everything they can.

Now, you can rationalize the duplications on the basis that Supes can’t be everywhere at once. But that seems a tad weak. In the same way that you can fashion the narrative so that a team is necessary, you can fashion it so that it’s not. And if there was ever a character who could handle simultaneous crises, it’s Supes.

You can also rationalize things by depowering Supes. He can’t survive underwater or in outer space – so that gives purpose to Aquaman and GL. Or… Supes isn’t the sharpest knife in the drawer – so bring in Batman (“the brains”). But taking Supes down several pegs in order to justify the presence of others already starts to smell bad.

Perhaps a JL that is sans Supes is the way to go...?

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Old 04-04-2012, 10:44 AM   #64
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^ I agree that Supes can do whatever any other member of the team can, so one way to overcome this would be to make him less powerful, that is put limits to his powers, like - He cannot fly faster than light (leave that to a speedster like Flash, he is not resistant to magical weapons (that is where WW proves effective, Supes is not the greatest detective, so that Bats can step in, Supes cannot travel in Space - that is why GL is needed.)


And the other part is Supes' villains will design a plan to "neutralize" his threat, which is why a team is needed.

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Old 04-04-2012, 11:25 AM   #65
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The way they have been talking about doing a Justice League movie sucks in my eyes anyway.
The script for the aborted George Miller JL movie was reportedly well-received, but the reaction to the cast and the WGA strike not allowing a script polish before production was the fatal blow.

If WB decides to do a JL movie, they should probably use that script and just get a different director. I wouldn't mind seeing Cavill in a JL movie with a different actor as Batman...

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Old 04-04-2012, 11:39 AM   #66
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I’m not saying a JL movie is 100% unworkable. But it wouldn’t be easy. So, yes, if the story was good… then it would be good. (And if my uncle had boobs she’d be my aunt.)

In action ensembles (like Mission: Impossible) you want to give each member a “specialty.” So, there’s the “brains,” the “muscle,” the “master of disguise,” etc. The pretext is that there are jobs in the caper-at-hand that are uniquely and plausibly suited to one member – which no one else can do (thus justifying their inclusion on the team). And it goes without saying that you’d try to avoid duplication (there’s no cause to have two “masters of disguise” on the team, for example).

So for JL, I think the first and biggest “problem” is Superman. Characters like WW, Flash, Aquaman and (arguably) Batman are derivative of Supes – he can do everything they can.

Now, you can rationalize the duplications on the basis that Supes can’t be everywhere at once. But that seems a tad weak. In the same way that you can fashion the narrative so that a team is necessary, you can fashion it so that it’s not. And if there was ever a character who could handle simultaneous crises, it’s Supes.

You can also rationalize things by depowering Supes. He can’t survive underwater or in outer space – so that gives purpose to Aquaman and GL. Or… Supes isn’t the sharpest knife in the drawer – so bring in Batman (“the brains”). But taking Supes down several pegs in order to justify the presence of others already starts to smell bad.

Perhaps a JL that is sans Supes is the way to go...?
That's only a problem if you use the Superman from the 1960's, who was just a fancy deus ex machina who could pull a new power out of his arse and save the day. Superman is an all rounder character, everyone concedes to that point, but when you are an all rounder character, you have no specialities. Superman may be fast, but Flash has the Speed Force. If he wanted, he could prevent Superman from ever moving again, because through the Speed Force he essentially controls all kinetic movement in all of spacetime. Green Lantern is more powerful than Superman, his job is to protect thousands of planets from these kinds of disasters all the time, along with much greater threats, but when it comes to Earth suddenly he needs assistance. Martian Manhunter possesses more powers and more useful than Superman on an equal scale, he is at a very basic level, more powerful.

Superman is the character who is least depowered by being on the Justice League, because apart from Batman, Wonder Woman and Aquaman, he is the least powerful.


If I could recommend some reading on the Justice League I would say something by Grant Morrison. He consistently portrays Superman as the god he is, but he does so with every other character too. Here's a list of the feats he had them do:

Superman-
(Issue 3) Even while suffering from kryptonite poisoning, Superman grins to himself as Protex screams to his teammates, currently having their asses handed to them by you know who, “Batman! Batman! He’s only a man!”

(Issue 7) Uses his new powers to repel the moon away from the Earth, which it’s plummeting towards, and for an encore, wrestles an angel.

(DC One Million #4) Returns from the heart of the sun in the 853rd century, and uses the lost Green Lantern ring to crush what's left of Solaris.

(Issue #26) With most of the team downed by the Ultramarine Corps, he confronts the troops and casually absorbs every bullet they can fire, until they finally come to their senses and listen to what he has to say.
(Issue #41) Flies into Mageddon’s core and absorbs enough anti-sunlight to shut it down, then announces, “Armageddon is canceled until further notice.”

Batman-
(Issue #3) Batman discovers the truth about the Hyperclan and then starts taking them down one-by-one.

(Issue #11) Tells Robin that he knows Lex Luthor has targeted the JLA, and that Lex doesn’t realize he’s facing someone else very familiar with corporate takeover techniques...Bruce Wayne.

(Issue #13) Survives eight years in Desaad’s torture chambers, beats him, and then takes his place in Darkseid’s court.

(Issue #14) Tricks Metron into becoming human, knocks him cold, and pumps him full of hypnotic drugs.

(Issue #15) Places not one, but two undercover operatives inside the Injustice Gang.

(Issue #38) Takes down Prometheus and cheats to do it.

(Issue #41) Gives Superman the pep talk of his life, while attempting to rescue the Man of Steel from absolute despair deep within the bowels of Mageddon.

Martian Manhunter-
(Issue #4) Martian Manhunter punishes seventy white martians by brainwashing them into joining the human race they attempted to conquer.

(Issue #11) Enlarges the more irrational right hemisphere of his brain to navigate himself and Superman through a hard light holographic maze powered by the Joker’s thoughts.

(Issue #15) Painfully stops Superman from destroying the Philosopher’s Stone after receiving a telepathic alarm from Green Lantern.

(Issue DC One Million #3) Takes on Vandal Savage’s blitz engines.

(Issue DC One Million #4) The Manhunter from Mars IS Mars.

(Issue #37) With the team being dismantled by the Injustice Gang, returns to active duty, reactivates the team’s telepathic link, and announces that the counter-offensive has begun.

Green Lantern-
(Issue #7) Green Lantern and Flash construct and then power a giant tuning fork that cancels out the angels’ harmonic vibrations and expels them from the earthly plane.

(Issue #22) Sandman tells Kyle that he shouldn’t feel inferior to Hal Jordan...that he’ll surpass him and that he already knows things Hal never did.

(Issue DC One Million #4) After some convincing from Batman, Kyle creates a supernova within Solaris and contains the massive explosion that results though sheer force of will.

(Issue #31) Uses color theory to convince a fifth dimensional court to intervene on behalf of the third dimension.

(Issues #40-#41) Forces his sabotaged ring to work as Mageddon approaches. “Mageddon, huh? You and me, dude.”

Wonder Woman-
(Issue #7) Wonder Woman trashes an angelic chariot and then catches it before it falls onto the city below, even though just touching it sets her skin on fire.

(Issue #14) Takes on both Darkseid and the monstrous Grandmother Boxx, giving the resistance enough time to complete their impossible mission.

(Issue #41) Leads the armies of man against Mageddon.

The Flash-
(Issue #3) In a race/fight around the world, Wally beats the Martian speedster Zum using a “Flash Fact”.

(Issue #7) Green Lantern and Flash construct and then power a giant tuning fork that cancels out the angels’ harmonic vibrations and expels them from the earthly plane.

(Issue DC One Million #4) Using a strategy engine from the 853rd century, Flash thinks faster than the universe's ultimate computer.

(Issue #25) Hobbled by shrapnel in his calf, he lends Aquaman a bit of the Speed Force so they can outrun the building falling down on their heads.

(Issue #40) Returns with the last survivor of Wonderworld who escaped Mageddon by running perpendicular to time.

Aquaman-
(Issue #13) One of the last members of the JLA still alive in a word conquered by Darkseid, Aquaman leads the last-ditch superhero assault on Desaad’s Vegas stronghold.

(Issue #17) Manually diverts the water from his personal tanks into the Watchtower after Prometheus sets a fire that burns away the station’s air supply.

(Issue #23) Routes a telepathic signal from Martian Manhunter through the alien conqueror that convinces It the Earth is too toxic to be conquered and that It should run before it’s too late.

(Issue #41) Emerges from the ocean with the armies of Atlantis and declares that he’s the “sworn protectorate of over fifteen thousand submarine states.”

Miscellaneous-
(Issue #5) Hitman shows up to the JLA recruitment drive for the sole purpose of checking out Wonder Woman with his x-ray vision, does it, and then immediately leaves.

(Issue #9) Green Arrow Connor Hawke saves the JLA and probably the entire world using his late father’s trick arrows.

(Issue #14) The Atom breaks into Darkseid’s brain and then destroys it.

(Issue #15) Aztec deactivates twelve nuclear warheads teleported onto the Watchtower in less than four minutes.

(Issue JLA 1000000) Steel leads the Justice League into battle against their highly advanced counterparts in the Justice Legion A. Later considers unleashing the secure security systems on them, but chooses instead to trust their intentions. Even later, his time engine is used to activate Solaris’ quantum softdrive.

(Issue DC One Million #3) The Atom figures out how to beat the Hourman Virus while broadcasting live from Oracle’s lymphatic system.

(Issue DC One Million #3) Huntress thinks of a way to save the future---by burying the weapons they’ll need to win in the past.

(Issue DC One Million #4) The Superman of the future punches his way through the time barrier to make it back to the 853rd century.

(Issue #31) Stripped of his armor by Triumph, Steel crawls through the maintenance ducts until he reaches his laboratory and is able to step into a new suit of armor...the entire JLA Watchtower.

(Issue #39) Oracle is given a Mother Boxx from Metron, which upgrades all of her equipment and gives her digital telepathy to better coordinate the worldwide offensive against Mageddon.

(Issue #41) Zauriel dies on the Watchtower for the express purpose of returning to Heaven and rallying angelic support to defend Earth from Mageddon.

(Issue #41) Animal Man has the idea that saves the world.

(Issue #41) Aztek unleashes four-dimensional energy inside Mageddon, hurting the primordial annihilator but killing himself.

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Old 04-04-2012, 11:53 AM   #67
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To answer the thread question, it won't be with this movie. Maybe the next. As far as a JL movie goes, the way I see it working is with no origin of the League. You can use flashbacks but an origin movie imo would be unnecessary. Have them already established and in battle when the movie kicks off. And the threat has to be so large that it couldn't be wrapped up in 1 movie. That's a huge fear for me with The Avengers. It needs to be a series with this cataclysmic event that draws all of these heroes together and that way, you can actually work in some of the other Leaguers in minor roles throughout the series.

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Old 04-04-2012, 12:29 PM   #68
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No shared Universe by the sounds of it.

From last March:

We asked Snyder about the plans for the Justice League movie and how his Superman fitted in with that? This is what he said,

"It doesn’t. Like what Chris Nolan is doing and what I’m doing with Superman, what they’ll do with Justice League will be it’s own thing, with it’s own Batman and own Superman. We’ll be over here with our movie. They’ll kinda get to do it twice which is kinda cool."

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Old 04-04-2012, 12:32 PM   #69
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

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Make a World's Finest movie first before making a Justice League movie, that way it can work.

No need to just include A-list superheros like Superman, Batman with 10 other B-list heroes in ensemble movie, it would just look ridiculous.
Agreed World's Finest before Justice League, I'd even love a Trinity film.

On JL, I'd like to see the members be the Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern (Hal Jordan) and the Flash (Barry Allen) but have Martian Manhunter have a role in like in Secret Origins (JL TAS) where he's captured by the Government and at the end the team can officially become a team.

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Old 04-04-2012, 02:28 PM   #70
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A Trinity movie leading into Justice League movies would be great! I also like the idea of JL movie continuity being separate from the solo movies like it is, for the most part, in comics. The whole argument about audience confusion is bs to me.

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Old 04-04-2012, 03:04 PM   #71
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I'll say one thing - and yes I say this without seeing a single second of footage from MOS, because I have faith in this aspect - If they do a JL movie and cast a new Superman, I don't want to see it. I rather have no JL movie for the next 10 years or so in this case. Because from everything I've seen and heard, Henry is going to be a fantastic Superman and It would make me sad and mad to see WB piss on that and cast an inferior actor. I don't want to see 2 different Superman co-exist on the big screen at the same time frame.

And honestly, I want to see a GOOD Wonder Woman and Flash movies first. I have no faith in WB pulling off a JL movie at this point, though I think they could pull of a World's Finest movie. But of course, they have to ´´reboot`` Batman first, sigh...

Saying that, I wouldn't mind MOS dropping a few lines that acknowledge the existence of other DC heroes. I really don't see how that would in any way hurt the movie, but Nolan obviously thinks otherwise so I can't see even that much happening. Hope im wrong.
I pretty much agree with everything you've said...I really don't want to see them cast a new Superman in a Justice League movie 1 or 2 years after Man of Steel hits theaters. I won't be going to go see that film if they do. I also agree that dropping a few hints to other heroes in Man of Steel isn't a bad idea, yet Nolan thinks having any hero interact with the other in the same universe is a bad idea...which is why I'm beyond tired of his **** and can't wait to see the day he leaves comic book movies behind. I'll be perfectly content if it's another 5 or 10 years before we see a new Batman film after Nolan's latest entry. He makes good movies but the way he ****s on other characters I can't stand. I just hope he doesn't wipe his ass with Man of Steel

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Old 04-04-2012, 03:46 PM   #72
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Default Re: Is a Shared DC Universe Possible for MOS?

also, I wouldn't mind seeing the Justice League go up against the OMACS

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Old 04-04-2012, 05:09 PM   #73
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He makes good movies but the way he ****s on other characters I can't stand. I just hope he doesn't wipe his ass with Man of Steel
Same here. I'd take some comfort in that he said his involvement with MOS was done when he handed things to Snyder but somehow I don't think Nolan is the most honest guy around so I don't have any hopes of MOS getting different treatment to the Bat flicks in this regard. But on the other hand, im really just more concerned with getting a great Superman movie, that's all that matters at this point. Sometimes we're thinking too far ahead when the quality and success of MOS is still a question mark. But that's how it is when there's no news.

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Old 04-05-2012, 12:24 AM   #74
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Same here. I'd take some comfort in that he said his involvement with MOS was done when he handed things to Snyder but somehow I don't think Nolan is the most honest guy around so I don't have any hopes of MOS getting different treatment to the Bat flicks in this regard. But on the other hand, im really just more concerned with getting a great Superman movie, that's all that matters at this point. Sometimes we're thinking too far ahead when the quality and success of MOS is still a question mark. But that's how it is when there's no news.
I really don't care if they mention Batman or anyone else in this movie...I'd prefer that they didn't. But in sequels hell yeah...I'd be a little pissed if they didn't

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