Avengers vs. X-Men: 2012 Event - Part 1

[Franklin Richards]

Originally Posted by roach

you sir have used continuity to silence me...I bow before you
(though they haven't tried to kill Phoenix the last couple of times it showed up)

Sometimes it's good to be old.

[roach]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

Sometimes it's good to be old.

i kick myself because I should have remembered this

[Harlekin]

Originally Posted by Shazam

Didn't Red Hulk knock out a Watcher??

http://www.comicbooked.com/wp-conten.../06/RULK11.jpg

Yes and that should be a reason not to follow him.

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by Harlekin

Yes and that should be a reason not to follow him.

Maybe....but a great reason to have him on your side!

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by Anubis

God you're annoying.

So are you.

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

The Beast actually.

Well....there you go....

[Mulholland '49]

I don't mind the characterizations being a little different for creative liberties, but the leading character's are suprisingly off.

[Havok83]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

The Beast actually.

good find

Originally Posted by roach

you sir have used continuity to silence me...I bow before you
(though they haven't tried to kill Phoenix the last couple of times it showed up)

I would guess this explains why Tony said he's been tracking the Phoenix energy signature since the Jean Grey incident. What it doesnt explain is if thats the case then where the heck were they the other times the PF has been back in the last 30 years of stories? He's been tracking since DPS and only NOW has been able to find it?

[Franklin Richards]

I think Rachel must be some sort of monkey wrench. Whether it's "Baby" Dark Phoenix power or Alternate Timeline Dark Phoenix Power... something about her manifestations must be "different".


Now I don't know what happened those other times. Who else besides Jean and Rachel have played around with it.

[Havok83]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

I think Rachel must be some sort of monkey wrench. Whether it's "Baby" Dark Phoenix power or Alternate Timeline Dark Phoenix Power... something about her manifestations must be "different".


Now I don't know what happened those other times. Who else besides Jean and Rachel have played around with it.

Madelyne Pryor. Its what gave her life force

The PF showed up in Inferno and returned the portion of Jean's life force it had taken and gave it back to her


Dont remember the details of the story by Xavier had it while he was with the Starjammers.

Jean had the Phoenix Force for the bulk of her run in New X-men

Several characters became temporary host to it in Endsong. The bird came to earth looking for a host (and ended up resurrecting Jean). Actually it kinda reminds me of AvX, but that story had the Shi'ar tracking it and looking to destroy it instead of the Avengers

Warsong had the Cuckoos possessing it

Rise and Fall of the Shi'ar Empire had it returned to Rachel as well as wielded by Korvus via his sword

Im guessing Tony's tech wasnt quite working well during any of those times. I guess the few times in space are understandable but the the PF has manifested itself over in NY near the Avengers several times over the years

[Franklin Richards]

Was Rachel one the undetectable X-Men after their resurrection?


I can see why Madeline might have been missed. Clone/Magic/Contruct confusion. And I can see why Iron Man might have missed things for a decade with that Virus and then of course the Civil War had him busy. Skrulls might have messed up everything involving SHIELD too.

Not to mention Prof. X. He might have actively kept knowledge of the Phoenix Force from important people when he wasn't in outer space or dead.


Anywho...


I want grown up Franklin and Rachel to show up and save the day.

[Havok83]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

Was Rachel one the undetectable X-Men after their resurrection?

I can see why Madeline might have been missed. Clone/Magic/Contruct confusion. And I can see why Iron Man might have missed things for a decade with that Virus and then of course the Civil War had him busy. Skrulls might have messed up everything involving SHIELD too.

Not to mention Prof. X. He might have actively kept knowledge of the Phoenix Force from important people when he wasn't in outer space or dead.

Rachel never went through the Siege Perilous. She was over in Excalibur during that storyline, so she woulndt fall under Roma's undetectable spell

But the tech tracks the PF power signature. Being a clnoe shouldnt matter. But let's say it did. Jean isnt a clone. It should have picked it up when the PF has manifested itself to her and definetly when she bonded with it

I dont see any benefit to why Prof X would actively hide knowledge of the PF and dont see how he could unless he was routinely altering the minds of people on it. It doesnt seem to make sense or serve a logical purpose. This is the same guy that had protocals on how to take out each and every X-men in the event they ever went evil. He'd want the knowledge of Phoenix out there if it ever became a problem again

[roach]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

I think Rachel must be some sort of monkey wrench. Whether it's "Baby" Dark Phoenix power or Alternate Timeline Dark Phoenix Power... something about her manifestations must be "different".


Now I don't know what happened those other times. Who else besides Jean and Rachel have played around with it.

but wasn't Rachel getting the PF in part because it couldn't find Jean and found she was the closest thing to her...i seem to recall in a X-men/X-factor cross over rachel gave up the PF to Jean who now had memories of everything it had did while she was sleeping.

[roach]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

Not to mention Prof. X. He might have actively kept knowledge of the Phoenix Force from important people when he wasn't in outer space or dead.

if this is the case why would they leave the files in the Avengers computers

[Havok83]

Originally Posted by roach

but wasn't Rachel getting the PF in part because it couldn't find Jean and found she was the closest thing to her...i seem to recall in a X-men/X-factor cross over rachel gave up the PF to Jean who now had memories of everything it had did while she was sleeping.

No that was Inferno and the PF returned the portion of Jean's life force it had taken. During that story, it's consciousness along with Maddie's fused with Jean's and she had 3 sets of memories for the 3 personalities living inside her head. Occasionally Maddie and Phoenix would take over but Jean finally got complete control at the end of Judgement War and it hasnt been an issue since. Rachel was over in Excalibur during all of this and never gave up the PF. It wasnt removed from her till she got lost in the timestream back in the mid 90s

[Manic]

Don't forget that Jean started slowly manifesting the Phoenix again in the late 90's, fully turning into the Phoenix again right around the time Xorn (pretending to be Magneto pretending to be Xorn) wrecked Manhattan.

Also, why couldn't Tony detect the presence of the Phoenix inside of the Stepford Cuckoos? They had it for months on end. And considering this happened around the time of Civil War when Tony was keeping an extra careful eye on the X-Men in case they took a side...

[roach]

Originally Posted by Havok83

No that was Inferno and the PF returned the portion of Jean's life force it had taken. During that story, it's consciousness along with Maddie's fused with Jean's and she had 3 sets of memories for the 3 personalities living inside her head. Occasionally Maddie and Phoenix would take over but Jean finally got complete control at the end of Judgement War and it hasnt been an issue since. Rachel was over in Excalibur during all of this and never gave up the PF. It wasnt removed from her till she got lost in the timestream back in the mid 90s

sorry i was typing that from memory....but I guess we are all in agreement that the Avengers have no reason to fear the PF...as the X-men have no reason to worship it

[JewishHobbit]

Originally Posted by Manic

Don't forget that Jean started slowly manifesting the Phoenix again in the late 90's, fully turning into the Phoenix again right around the time Xorn (pretending to be Magneto pretending to be Xorn) wrecked Manhattan.

Also, why couldn't Tony detect the presence of the Phoenix inside of the Stepford Cuckoos? They had it for months on end. And considering this happened around the time of Civil War when Tony was keeping an extra careful eye on the X-Men in case they took a side...

Maybe because the Cuckoos never actually used it, right? I don't recall much about Warsong but other than that I don't think it ever came up that they had it until they lost it.

[Franklin Richards]

Originally Posted by roach

sorry i was typing that from memory....but I guess we are all in agreement that the Avengers have no reason to fear the PF...as the X-men have no reason to worship it

No. The pages I posted show us that Cap and the Avengers fear the Phoenix Force.


"Heaven help us all."

[roach]

Originally Posted by Franklin Richards

No. The pages I posted show us that Cap and the Avengers fear the Phoenix Force.


"Heaven help us all."

I agree...and if the PF never showed up after that I would agree there is something to fear....However the PF has shown up many times in the 616 and hasn't shown any desire to eat suns and kill broccoli people...in fact it has proven pretty heroic ever since.

[Spider-Nerd]

Just saw the art from AvX2. I strongly prefer it to JR's stuff. I just can't get into Romita's rectangular heads.

[Texas]

Do you mean art from AVX VS #1 (OF 6) due out next week?

[Havok83]

Darkchylde is back and she tricked Dr. Strange into going into Limbo to rumble. Thats gonna be a GOOD fight

Oh and I wouldnt be surprised if Storm and Panther get a divorce after this

Overall great issue for #2 even if I do feel aot of them are being irrational and the fighting shouldnt have happened. As for the ending, I didnt expect to see

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:

Hope activate her Phoenix powers so soon. The times the power signature has manifested, its been accidental and not of her own control. She seems to be able to actually wield it now

[Spider-Nerd]

Originally Posted by Texas

Do you mean art from AVX VS #1 (OF 6) due out next week?

Nah, my mistake for lack of clarity. The preview was from #2 due out May 16th. This is for the "VS" tie in. So it's AvX: VS.

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?p...eview&id=12119

[Panthro]

Originally Posted by kguillou

Oh, I think Cap's got this.

That is an awesome picture.