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Old 05-20-2012, 11:30 PM   #1
WalkingDeadMike
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Default X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

Fight takes place in Marvel movie New York. None of these characters have any prior knowledge of their opponents. Teams stand off 50 feet away from each other to start, except Xavier and Hawkeye who each start on the roof of a 3 story building 50 yards behind their allies, unbeknownst to their opponents. Who wins?

Magneto
Xavier
Beast
Havok
Banshee
Mystique

vs

Hulk
Thor
Iron Man
Captain America
Black Widow
Hawkeye

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Old 05-21-2012, 09:28 AM   #2
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

Good Matchup. At first I was going to go with the Avengers, but now leaning toward the X-men.

Magneto would take out Iron Man instantly, Xavier could potentially control the Hulk but I don't know if X would be mentally strong enough. X could also detect Hawkeye.

Hawkeye would pick off a few of the lightweights (1,2, or 3 of Havok, Banshee, Mystique)

I think the outcome depends on how strong X is and if he can control Hulk or some others, and if Magneto is willing to crumble the city and crush the Avengers with a NYC city block worth of buildings.

In the end, I don't see anything stopping Thor. I'd say Avengers 6-7/10 times.


Last edited by The_Shadow; 05-21-2012 at 09:34 AM.
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Old 05-21-2012, 09:52 AM   #3
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

can Magneto control (or atleast shield himself from) Mjolnir ?

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Old 05-21-2012, 07:27 PM   #4
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

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Good Matchup. At first I was going to go with the Avengers, but now leaning toward the X-men.
Thanks. The Avengers definitely have more overall power, but I could see the fight going either way. I'd favor the X-Men slightly.

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Magneto would take out Iron Man instantly
Agreed.

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Xavier could potentially control the Hulk but I don't know if X would be mentally strong enough.
I don't think he necessarily even has to fully control him. All he has to do is telepathically tell him, "Calm down. This is the happiest day of your life." And the Hulk transforms back into Banner and is out of the fight.

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Hawkeye would pick off a few of the lightweights (1,2, or 3 of Havok, Banshee, Mystique)
I think you may be underestimating Havok if you consider him a weak link.

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I think the outcome depends on how strong X is and if he can control Hulk or some others, and if Magneto is willing to crumble the city and crush the Avengers with a NYC city block worth of buildings.
I think it's pretty clear Mags would be willing to do whatever it takes to take out his opponent.

I think the outcome depends on how quickly the Avengers realize how powerful Xavier is, find him and if they take him out. Because without IM and Hulk, the Avengers are ****ed. Cap, Widow, and Hawkeye become much more of a liability than an asset with all of their metal weapons, and Thor can't solo these X-Men.

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can Magneto control (or atleast shield himself from) Mjolnir ?
It is debatable since in the comics it has been shown both ways. I honestly don't think he'd be able to in the movie-verse.

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Old 05-22-2012, 03:06 AM   #5
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

Thor solos. Don't see what any of the X characters can do to him. Xavier's mind control presumably doesn't work on Thor. We have no feats for it working on inter dimensional beings with different resistances and biologies. Magneto? We can't say whether his powers work on Thor's hammer or armour, because it's alien metals and Mags has no feats for manipulating alien metals.

So Thor just destroys the X team. He's faster than any of them. Physically stronger. And he's got the power of the weather.

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Old 05-22-2012, 05:48 PM   #6
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

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Thor solos.
You're funny.

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Old 05-23-2012, 07:27 AM   #7
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

I'm not joking, at all. Explain to me how any of them have any chance against Avengers Thor.

The guy was deflecting energy blasts that originated from about 5 meters away. That puts his reflexes at at least subsonic levels. He has supersonic flight speed.

How are any of them even hitting him?

And even if they do hit him, he got a slightly bloody nose from a punch from Hulk, who was one shotting giant leviathans that must weigh hundreds of tons. He was no selling repulsor blasts to the face from Iron Man. He didn't even get a scratch from being slammed into a mountain at like, 400 mph.

How are any of them hurting him?

In his own movie he let off an attack that destroyed a land mass that was about the size of a city. He's a city buster. In Avengers he squashed Stark's armour with one hand like it was a tin of baked beans. He put Hulk on his ass and dazed him with a Mjolnir strike. He used his lighting to explode two Leviathans almost instantly.

How are any of them surviving his attacks?

I mean seriously, Beast, Mystique, Banshee and Havok might as well not even turn up to the fight. Charles and Erik have no feats for mind controlling a being with different natural resiliencies and biology, or manipulating alien metals.


Last edited by The Morningstar; 05-23-2012 at 07:31 AM.
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Old 05-26-2012, 06:22 PM   #8
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

^I'm inclined to agree with morning star.

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Old 05-26-2012, 07:52 PM   #9
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

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It is debatable since in the comics it has been shown both ways. I honestly don't think he'd be able to in the movie-verse.
ok if he can't control Thors hammer, what about Cap's shield? we saw what happens when Thor puts the hammer on his shield... so even if he couldn't control or deflect Mjolnir, he could at least block it with the shield


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Old 05-26-2012, 07:57 PM   #10
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

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Originally Posted by The Morningstar View Post
The guy was deflecting energy blasts that originated from about 5 meters away. That puts his reflexes at at least subsonic levels. He has supersonic flight speed.

How are any of them even hitting him?
Where were those subsonic reflexes when Hulk was beating his ass?

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How are any of them hurting him?
A) Xavier will be mind-controlling the Hulk. Hulk had no problem hurting Thor.

B) We saw that Thor is vulnerable to being stabbed. The fight takes place in Marvel New York. There is an abundance of metal for Magneto to manipulate and he obviously has the power and skill to do so.

C) Mag's new toy (Cap's shield) would be a devastating bludgeoning weapon. When you add the fact that it can deflect a Mjolnir shot, I see no chance in hell of the Odinson soloing.

If you want to argue the Avengers would win, fine. To say that Thor would solo is ridiculous.

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Old 09-01-2012, 04:48 AM   #11
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

I think that the X-Men has the potential to win this: if it's old Xavier and old Magneto then they'd easily put an end to it in a heart-beat. Xavier, using cerebro, could mind-freeze everyone in place. Let's not forget that given the right incentives, Xavier could do exactly what Loki does in the helicarrier, they're both extremely cerebral fighters and would use one Avenger against another. And in full-force, he would have no problem dealing with Widow, Hawkeye, Cap, and Hulk. The only one who wouldn't be effected is Thor and Iron Man since Asgardian physiology differs from human, making Thor impervious to Xavier's telepathy and JARVIS in the Iron-tech wouldn't be effected either.

Leaving Magneto and the rest to handle a demigod and Ironman. Old Magneto could easily put Ironman down, but he'd have to struggle with Thor...

As Xavier and Magneto are dealing with the others, it'd be up to the rest of the X-Men to bring down Thor which, I think, is next to impossible unless you have Storm on the team to match him at his battle. With Wolverine and Jean Grey, it'd be a total game-changer. Wolverine could be sent to healing-factor-heaven, berserker rage or not, with one super-charged blow from Mjolnir. Jean's telepathy is moot, but she'd be using her telekinesis to an advantage. With Storm, Jean, Cykes and Magneto the thunderer might be overwhelmed. He could use a tornado to keep the projectiles out, but it'd be a contest of control with Storm involved, a contest which could be stretched long enough for any of the others to put him down.

But it'd still be a battle though. Thor's strong enough, and with Mjolnir, stronger than any of the X-Men in one-on-one battle. Knowing the tactical thinker that the X-Men are, they'd want to get Mjolnir out of his hand, and Cykes would assign this to Jean's telekinesis. It'd be a moot point again since it's Mjolnir we're talking about, but it'd keep her busy, which means Thor could just as easily knock Magneto and Cykes out. Optic blasts could be effective but the hammer can deflect them at ease. Mjolnir can also create earthquakes, which could prove fatal for the rest of them. Which means it'd be down to Storm to take on the thunderer, and honestly, God of Thunder > mutant babe with weather-controlling abilities every day. So even at their best, the X-Men would succumb to the Avengers.

On the other hand, for the First-Class roster since Thor has no idea of Mystique, she'd be able to distract him long enough for Beast to figure out a way to get his hammer away from him, but he's formidable even without it.

I dunno, in all scenarios I'll have to give this to the Avengers. Especially if it's X-Men First Class where both Charles and Magneto have more limited powers.

Their Brotherhood roster would probably be a better match:

We have Shaw, Magneto, Emma, Mystique, and Azazel to outgun the Avengers:

- Azazel seeing Hulk's massive advantage could teleport him out of the battlefield.
- Emma could use her telepathy to keep Widow & Hawkeye in an infinite loop / she could play them against each other.
- Shaw would have an easy advantage over Thor and Mjolnir, depriving the Norse God to a halt.
- Magneto (with his limited powers) would go toe-to-toe with Ironman

This only leaves Mystique and the Captain on a physical contest, which I think could go either way. They're both extremely agile and strong. Cap has his shield but Mystique can easily get that away from him (and to Magneto to hold off Stark) if she gets close enough. Cap's got his super-healing but that's a moot point in a contest where one can be defeated. Moreover, if Mystique uses her shift-changing powers it'd keep Cap off-guard long enough for Mystique to knock him out.

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Old 09-01-2012, 04:10 PM   #12
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

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Originally Posted by WalkingDeadMike View Post
A) Xavier will be mind-controlling the Hulk. Hulk had no problem hurting Thor.

B) We saw that Thor is vulnerable to being stabbed. The fight takes place in Marvel New York. There is an abundance of metal for Magneto to manipulate and he obviously has the power and skill to do so.

C) Mag's new toy (Cap's shield) would be a devastating bludgeoning weapon. When you add the fact that it can deflect a Mjolnir shot, I see no chance in hell of the Odinson soloing.

If you want to argue the Avengers would win, fine. To say that Thor would solo is ridiculous.
Those are all excellent points! Though hey, saying that Thor could do solo is not ridiculous, it's still a valid line of argument. Thor was stabbed by an alien blade, we don't know if ordinary metal can harm him. In addition, if Magneto's using Cap's shield, Thor could still Mjolnir to start a thunderstorm -- by generating or regulating electrical impulses he could even dismantle his magnetism for a brief period (dunno if it works like that, but it's a thought). The thunderstorm could also distract both Hulk and Xavier long enough for him to subdue everyone else involved. It's Manhattan but it's a warzone, as he doesn't have prior knowledge of the X-Men he might as well could go for the kill.

If he's being distracted by the Hulk, that's another problem -- knocking out the goliath would take more time by which the X-Men could take him down. But no, even solo the thunderer has a fighting chance against the X-Men.

His privy to the brains though -- we don't know if telepathy works on an Asgardian, but both Xaiver and Beast could easily figure out that isolating him from Mjolnir would make him more earth-bound. The trick is to keep him confused long enough for the killing blow, like they did with Shaw. Given enough time the X-Men might get the upper hand but seriously, how do you put down a god?

(P.S. This is an excellent match-up dude! )

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THE JUSTICE BULLETIN published some of my thematic analysis on the symbolism in Nolan's superhero saga.
I call it Heroic Archetypes. You can read the parts on Batman Begins in the following links:
(pt 1; pt 2; pt 3; pt 4; pt 5; pt 6; pt 7)



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Old 09-01-2012, 04:47 PM   #13
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

Actually, now that I'm thinking more about this, Magneto's got the same catastrophe ability that Mjolnir can generate. Even if the others are put down, Thor would have to face him early on to put a stopper on it.

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I call it Heroic Archetypes. You can read the parts on Batman Begins in the following links:
(pt 1; pt 2; pt 3; pt 4; pt 5; pt 6; pt 7)


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Old 12-12-2012, 08:22 PM   #14
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

Sorry for bringing it up but

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Where were those subsonic reflexes when Hulk was beating his ass?
PIS I suppose? Cause he has the geat. also, You call one punch, then throwing someone twice an ass beating? If anything, Thor won that fight. Landed more blows, showed fighting skill. The one time he struck hulk with his hammer, he knocked him on his ass. Not to mention he held back, and tried talking to him. If thor was cutting loose, or if they were outside, Thor puts down hulk



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A) Xavier will be mind-controlling the Hulk. Hulk had no problem hurting Thor.
Again, lets see Hulk hurt thor when he is flying at super sonic speeds or up in the air. It took hulk a good 2 and a half seconds to jump up 200 feet, that's PLENTY of time for thor to react

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B) We saw that Thor is vulnerable to being stabbed. The fight takes place in Marvel New York. There is an abundance of metal for Magneto to manipulate and he obviously has the power and skill to do so.
again. Asgardian blade + Loki's strength. Unless mags can find some asgardian metal, he isn't hurting thor.

C) Mag's new toy (Cap's shield) would be a devastating bludgeoning weapon. When you add the fact that it can deflect a Mjolnir shot, I see no chance in hell of the Odinson soloing.

If you want to argue the Avengers would win, fine. To say that Thor would solo is ridiculous.
it's really not. The issue would be charles mind controlling hulk.

Thor will be distracted while the others attack him. But what can they do? As thor flies at fast speeds keeping himself away from hulk, he takes out banshee and the other little kids quickly. Leaving Mags and Charles, and Hulk, Thor scoops charles up in the air in a tornado when he gets away from hulk, we saw how quickly he could do that. Charles in the air, he won't survive. He'll die on impact. Though as soon as he is in the air, he looses grip on hulk. Thor and Hulk against Mags. Either are capable of soloing him. Again, thor can solo, given the circumstances. Assuming he can't, is ridiculous

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Actually, now that I'm thinking more about this, Magneto's got the same catastrophe ability that Mjolnir can generate. Even if the others are put down, Thor would have to face him early on to put a stopper on it.
really? When did mags prove to be a city buster?

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Old 12-29-2012, 11:27 AM   #15
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

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A) Xavier will be mind-controlling the Hulk. Hulk had no problem hurting Thor.
Xavier has always failed mind controlling The Hulk in the comics. I doubt the movie version would fare any better.

I think The Hulk pretty much rolls over the entire first class by himself. No problem.

In the comics, he took on every X-Man at the same time during WWH, and won.

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Old 01-21-2013, 12:12 AM   #16
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

Hulk and Thor Solo. Cap does much better than we expected

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Old 01-24-2013, 03:50 AM   #17
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

People seem to forget that Loki's blade is Asgardian they LOVE acting as if it's just a normal knife.

They also seem quite fond of over playing Hulk's attacks on Thor.

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Old 01-24-2013, 04:11 PM   #18
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Default Re: X-Men (First Class) vs Avengers (movie)

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People seem to forget that Loki's blade is Asgardian they LOVE acting as if it's just a normal knife.

They also seem quite fond of over playing Hulk's attacks on Thor.
Ding Ding. Thor completely played to Hulk's advantages, and he still, in a way, won the fight. Hulk and Thor were both standing at the end, so looking at the fight, Thor showed to laand more blows than hulk did, he showed ot dodge more attacks. Thor landed 4 blows, hulk landed 3. Hulk punched thor away, and thor responded to him by knocking him on his ass. To which Hulk had to shake it off. People seem to think hulk picking up thor twicce and throwing him means he won. Thor was fine after the fight, and had a better showing through out. Just cause hulk is big enough to fit thor in his hand, and throw him...TWICE, doesn't mean he is actually hurting Thor.

All this while hulk has advantages, and thor was holding back, it was a great showing for thor. Given Hulk's ability in that fight, and seeing his damage threshold in the final fight, if Thor fights Hulk with the aggression, strength, and power he did in the frost giant fight, Hulk goes down...hard. No hero in the MCU has shown that much raw power yet. So people need to stop thinking Hulk will be knocking thor out in 4 blows. lol

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