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Old 05-31-2012, 06:58 PM   #1
Binker
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Default If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

Here's an idea that I was thinking about; okay, so we all know the No-Robin rule from Nolan on his Batman films, but has he or anyone else ever considered maybe not using that identity but the character(s)'s later identities? Like instead of Robin, Dick Grayson as Nightwing instead; or, Jason Todd appears as the Red Hood; Tim Drake as Red Robin, etc. Hell, Barbara Gordon as Oracle too, to add.

If this was done, I believe it would've work and made sense in Noan's world, and have a theme onto itself; a focus more on other people trying to be like Batman, but in their own way. Grayson was 12 when his parents died, but let's say he couldn't believe it was an accident for many years because he saw Zucco arguing with the manager, and like Gotham's Falcone, he couldn't prove Zucco was responsible, and if he did, it would go away and be left with nothing. Inspired by Batman, he became Nightwing (a "grown up" version of his Robin show from The Flying Graysons) and went on to fight mob criminal Zucco, for revenge.

For Red Hood: Jason Todd, like Bruce Wayne, hated the crime-ridden Gotham City that took his parents as well, leaving him as an orphan living on his own. And inspired by Batman, and maybe/maybe not because Batman was gone between TDK and TDKR; Jason, having a different opinion and approach on what had to be done, became the Red Hood. You could do the same to Tim Drake from Grayson, only make him a fan who is a better person and state of mind than the Sons of Batman group from The Dark Knight. And Barbara Gordon; she would've been Gordon's first child, before James, Jr., in Nolan's world, but she's paralyzed (maybe because she acted naive in regards to her father being a cop) and rebuilt herself into becoming a powerful ally for both Batman and her father; known, but never seen. Think Girl With The Dragon Tattoo, then again you can used that partnership as a perfect real world take on Batman with a partner (not just Catwoman in TDKR).

Before I sign off, there is an alternative I also thought about if the "No-Robin/Only Batman" rule still applies to the examples above; taking an influence from The Battle of the Cowl; these characters can be their own version of Batman. You can still have these characters (one or all), and their personalities reflected into their dual identities, but still keeping only one costumed hero, Batman, with the interest of seeing someone else's POV of the concept with their personal desires. Hell, this could also work as a way of "continue the legend" if the rumor is true and Batman is going to die in TDKR, and also making this Sons of Batman more literal, y'know?

I'm done, for now. Your thoughts?

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Old 05-31-2012, 07:01 PM   #2
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

Nolan has become this sort of weird style-filter......or like a trash compacter that begs you to try a bunch of different things through it.

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 05-31-2012, 07:03 PM   #3
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

TDKR is a film about Bruce Wayne and Batman. This is Nolan's last Batman film. The end of his Nolan-verse. The next film will be a reboot. Robin will not appear later, because there will be no later. This is it. Robin can appear in the reboot. He will not appear in TDKR... Full circle.

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Old 05-31-2012, 07:05 PM   #4
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

And the Reboot WILL have Dick leaping about the Batcave and it WILL NOT look silly and WILL be taken completely seriously. Nolan just didn't have the vision.

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Old 05-31-2012, 07:07 PM   #5
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

For all those who want to see some sort of "Nolan-ised" Robin, or Nightwing or Dick Grayson, John Blake will have enough similarities to tide you over, while having enough differences for those who do not like the character to see him as something completely independent.

Best of both worlds.

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Old 05-31-2012, 07:09 PM   #6
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

I don't see what's so Dickish about John Blake.

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Old 05-31-2012, 07:10 PM   #7
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

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I don't see what's so Dickish about John Blake.
He's there and he's a guy. That's plenty.

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 05-31-2012, 07:19 PM   #8
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

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Nolan just didn't have the vision.
Or you know, maybe he just didn't want to.

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Old 05-31-2012, 07:21 PM   #9
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

Thankful for both.

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 05-31-2012, 07:22 PM   #10
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

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Thankful for both.
How can you be thankful for not seeing the profound depth of a boy in his underpants doing gymnastics?

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Old 05-31-2012, 07:24 PM   #11
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

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How can you be thankful for not seeing the profound depth of a boy in his underpants doing gymnastics?
Alrighty....so how 'bout them Giants...?

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Plus, is the infatuation that teenage girls have with pseudo-vampires any less sad than your infatuation with men in spandex and Heath Ledger? Its probably more justifiable for them. :)
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Old 05-31-2012, 08:21 PM   #12
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

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I don't see what's so Dickish about John Blake.
Yeah, so far he seems like a guy of good character.

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Old 05-31-2012, 09:27 PM   #13
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

John Blake does have some Dick Grayson in him as a character, and i think that's enough. I think if anything Blake is set up to be the next Gordon of his generation though and not "Batman".

There's always a small chance that the orphan kid seen in the last trailer/set pics could be referred to as Richard or "Richard Grayson", it would be a cool nod, but i just can't see it happening. It could work because Nolan said at the time of TDK that "Dick Grayson is lying in his crib somewhere". The kid looks about 10 or 11? One little nod is all you'd get but i bet they didn't even care to think of the character.

Bale just doesn't really like Robin, and Chris doesn't want to adapt him even though it seems like he doesn't mind him in the comics.

It's not just "a no Robin rule"...looking at the other names u suggested like Red Hood, Oracle, Batgirl, whoever, they just don't fit the stories Nolan told or wants to tell. The story comes first with these movies. Batman having side-kicks and followers just seems cheesy. Closest thing you'll get until the reboot were the followers in the beginning of TDK (for one scene).

You can say the same as to why Nolan never went for Mr Freeze or Penguin, Riddler, Poison Ivy, who are all popular characters. They can be done seriously, and will be in the future, they just weren't on Nolans radar.

No worries because we'll get Robin in the reboot, and they'll treat him more seriously. He may even become Nightwing at some point.

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Old 05-31-2012, 10:03 PM   #14
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

I like what they did with Robin in Arkham City. Finally they are making Robin less of a campy character.

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Old 06-01-2012, 07:50 PM   #15
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

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Yeah, so far he seems like a guy of good character.
I suppose it was only a matter of time before that.

Personally, I agree that Robin doesn't fit in this universe, but that doesn't mean I dislike the character. On the contrary, I grew up with the character and still have a longbox of nothing but Tim Drake's solo series in my grandparents' garage. I would like to see Robin in a future film series, and a movie that had both Tim Drake Robin/Red Robin and Nightwing would be awesome. Probably won't happen, but it would be nice.

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Old 06-01-2012, 07:53 PM   #16
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Default Re: If not Robin, then why not the other identities?

I do see the problem though. A young Robin just doesn't work in live action. Because all people will see is Batman and a kid sidekick.

However, I see no reason why Bruce Wayne can't adopt a Dick Grayson or a Tim Drake and train him. Then perhaps, if the manor gets attacked, he can show off some fighting. And as an adult, or young adult, join Batman.

In a reboot of course.

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