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Old 04-09-2013, 08:05 PM   #701
Kevin Smith
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Originally Posted by Shikamaru View Post
That's exactly where I'm coming from. It is clearly obvious that that is what Bruce Timm was going for. He is very much treated like he is Hal. There are even lines like "The Guardians chose YOU to be the protector of this sector!", a line that you would only hear said to Hal despite there being more than one human GL. Also, the way John Stewart sometimes talked felt very Hal and so did his relationship with Flash. John Stewart feels just as much Hal Jordan in that show as Wally feels Barry. It is just far less noticeable with the Flash because a lot of Hal's traits like his bravery and lack of fear are things you can find in other Green Lanterns too thus Hal's traits in John feel a lot more natural than Barry's traits in Wally.
I can dig where you're coming from on this, and I know what line you're talking about, it bothered me at first but I don't take issue with it as much as I used to now. lol

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Personally, I don't think that the GL movie is that bad. It is by no means good or even decent but I wouldn't say it is bad either. It just feels incredibly half-ass. It feels like an incomplete project that they just threw on the big screen just to capitalize off of Green Lantern (which obviously backfired big time lol). However, I think the basic foundations they had on paper were good (except for Parallax) and I would even say that some stuff in the movie is very well done like Sinestro and the Green Lantern Corps (sadly they only have like 10 minutes of screen time - not enough to save the film). The main thing that ruined the movie was the acting and the fact that it came out too early IMO. Give it a few more years of development and a better cast for the human characters and we could've had something that was at least decent.
I really loved the first draft, that was damn near perfect. So much of it is retooled and missing from the final film you would not know the '09 script was for Martin Campbell's GL, and I guess the truth is it wasn't; that was Greg Berlanti's vision and the script he'd have shot. I often wonder what it would have been like had his version been made. I even liked the concept art for his better, lol. Mark Strong is enjoyable when he gets some screen time, I will give it that. And I really think Reynolds was just playing with what he had to work with which was "be Ryan Reynolds!", so I don't blame the crappy movie on him - I blame it mostly on Martin Campbell and WB for trying to make "Iron Man" when they should have been making "Rocketeer meets Star Wars". Parallax was cool, but Hector Hammond, if not how he was portrayed in the first half should have been cut out completely. That was just hard to watch for me. I just really hope WB will have enough faith in it to let someone revisit it someday because it could really be perfect. I think Zack Snyder could have done it for sure.

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I also think that GL is a perfect example of how the times have changed. There are many comic book movies that came out in the prior to the early 2000's that were very half-ass and portrayed the characters wrong - not necessarily just as half-ass as Green Lantern but still very half-ass - yet they got a pass and some were even considered great simply because there were so few comic book movies made that people were just happy whenever they got one. Due to that, movies like the first Spider-Man film became regarded as masterpieces and are still regarded as that today even though they don't deserve that title. I think Green Lantern is a perfect example of an early comic book movie like that that came out too late. Had it come out in the early 2000's prior to that, people would've thought it was at least decent and years down the road they would've criticized the vastly superior GL reboot for not being like the Reynolds GL movie purely due to their nostalgia and whenever people would criticize the Reynolds movie and list valid reasons why the reboot is superior, their defense would be "Well, it was one of the first comic book movies and did a lot for the superhero genre so cut it some slack!" This is not a defense for the Reynolds movie BTW. This is me making an analysis that compliments comic book fans in general. I think the fact that we are not willing to accept half-ass CBM's anymore like we did back in the early 2000's and prior to that is a huge achievement. I think this really shows how much comic book fans have grown over the years and the fact that GL bombed has made film studios realize the same thing - that they can't half-ass things anymore and expect the fans and GA alike to just buy into them .
That is a great ****ing post. I never even thought to look at it that way, and that is probably very, very true! Good way to look at the GL movie, I think I'll adopt that. lol...however I still think the first Spider-Man is great...but even as I write that I'm now asking myself if that's simply the nostalgia talking and if it were released today and there were no Spider-Man film before it, and the special fx were like they are today, would audiences have liked it as much? What would they have thought on it? I'm not sure what my conclusion is with this one, I'm going to have to think on it. Props to you though, sir, for raising the question!

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Not to sound rude but it really doesn't make much sense to me. I heard people say that when it was the other way around - when their first exposure to a character was a bad portrayal of them and that made them not like any version of that character after that - but I never heard anyone who is a hardcore fan of a character say that they can't stand the character anymore because of a bad movie. My advice to you is to not let that movie ruin your love for GL. Try to remember that the reason GL was a fail is not because GL can't properly be adapted but because WB just half-assed the movie. Also, GL is not beyond saving. After Batman & Robin, Batman pulled himself up from the ground to having the most successful comic book movies and Batman & Robin was far worse than Green Lantern. Superman also looks like he will pull himself from the ground this year, and he has had TWO previous movies that are considered to be just as bad or worse than Green Lantern. As a fan of the character, you should never lose hope .
Well I don't mean that I "can't stand" him now by any means at all, I apologize if my post came off that way because that was not my intention haha, so that may be a bit of an exaggerated account, Hal Jordan is still one of my all time favorite CB characters, it's just my enthusiasm and zeal for the GL comics kind of went down a little after the movie, like going to a party you were looking forward to for MONTHS and then it sucks, that bummed out feeling haha, and I no longer keep up with the current books as much, post the movie, particularly because I hated it so much I felt like there was GL over-saturation and it would break my heart seeing it everywhere so in a weird way I was just like "**** this I'm not gonna participate in it". lol. Plenty of bad Batman and Superman movies, this is true, but there are also plenty of GOOD Batman movies that more than counteract that for me. After Batman & Robin and before Begins we still had the 89 Batman, one of the all time best CBMs to this day to remember Batman by in addition the the great animated series and animated movies, same for Superman, 3 & 4 are terrible movies, and I don't really like 2 either but for one or two parts (about the same amount of parts I like in Superman 3 strangely enough), I think it's pretty awful, but we still had Superman: The Movie, and I even like Superman Returns a little bit, and plus there were the great animated shows to remember him by, and I had comics for both and multiple eras to choose from for favorite takes. GL just had the movie and then the animated show, and the current comics are hit and miss but still the best as far as that character goes. It's weird but the movie did sour things a bit for me in that regard. BUT - I digress, I still love the character, each and every one of them, and will ALWAYS hope well for the future.






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Old 04-09-2013, 08:42 PM   #702
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I can dig where you're coming from on this, and I know what line you're talking about, it bothered me at first but I don't take issue with it as much as I used to now. lol
I don't hate John in the show completely. I do like a lot of what they did with him like his relationship with Hawkgirl. But overall, Hal is just a more interesting character IMO (and in yours as well).

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I really loved the first draft, that was damn near perfect. So much of it is retooled and missing from the final film you would not know the '09 script was for Martin Campbell's GL, and I guess the truth is it wasn't; that was Greg Berlanti's vision and the script he'd have shot. I often wonder what it would have been like had his version been made. I even liked the concept art for his better, lol. Mark Strong is enjoyable when he gets some screen time, I will give it that. And I really think Reynolds was just playing with what he had to work with which was "be Ryan Reynolds!", so I don't blame the crappy movie on him - I blame it mostly on Martin Campbell and WB for trying to make "Iron Man" when they should have been making "Rocketeer meets Star Wars". Parallax was cool, but Hector Hammond, if not how he was portrayed in the first half should have been cut out completely. That was just hard to watch for me. I just really hope WB will have enough faith in it to let someone revisit it someday because it could really be perfect. I think Zack Snyder could have done it for sure.
Wasn't the first draft a lot more of a comedy film and would've had Jack Black as Hal? I remember hearing that somewhere and shocking me immensely.

Also, we didn't get much Sinestro and Corps scenes due to budget issues. That was literally the main reason why, even though WB is the biggest film studio around (Disney is a close second).

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That is a great ****ing post. I never even thought to look at it that way, and that is probably very, very true! Good way to look at the GL movie, I think I'll adopt that. lol...however I still think the first Spider-Man is great...but even as I write that I'm now asking myself if that's simply the nostalgia talking and if it were released today and there were no Spider-Man film before it, and the special fx were like they are today, would audiences have liked it as much? What would they have thought on it? I'm not sure what my conclusion is with this one, I'm going to have to think on it. Props to you though, sir, for raising the question!
Feel free to adopt it . Glad I can shine some light on certain things on these boards .

For the record, I'm not saying that the first Spider-Man film is as bad as Green Lantern but the same idea applies. I think that the movie is ok but the fact that it's considered to be a masterpiece and one of the greatest comic book movies ever made is a big stretch IMO. One that I don't think had existed if it came out today and didn't have that nostalgia going for it. Not many people would approve of a mute Spider-Man over a wisecracking one and of a villain that could use better motivations and is watered down big time in comparison to his comic book counterpart. lol

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Well I don't mean that I "can't stand" him now by any means at all, I apologize if my post came off that way because that was not my intention haha, so that may be a bit of an exaggerated account, Hal Jordan is still one of my all time favorite CB characters, it's just my enthusiasm and zeal for the GL comics kind of went down a little after the movie, like going to a party you were looking forward to for MONTHS and then it sucks, that bummed out feeling haha, and I no longer keep up with the current books as much, post the movie, particularly because I hated it so much I felt like there was GL over-saturation and it would break my heart seeing it everywhere so in a weird way I was just like "**** this I'm not gonna participate in it". lol. Plenty of bad Batman and Superman movies, this is true, but there are also plenty of GOOD Batman movies that more than counteract that for me. After Batman & Robin and before Begins we still had the 89 Batman, one of the all time best CBMs to this day to remember Batman by in addition the the great animated series and animated movies, same for Superman, 3 & 4 are terrible movies, and I don't really like 2 either but for one or two parts (about the same amount of parts I like in Superman 3 strangely enough), I think it's pretty awful, but we still had Superman: The Movie, and I even like Superman Returns a little bit, and plus there were the great animated shows to remember him by, and I had comics for both and multiple eras to choose from for favorite takes. GL just had the movie and then the animated show, and the current comics are hit and miss but still the best as far as that character goes. It's weird but the movie did sour things a bit for me in that regard. BUT - I digress, I still love the character, each and every one of them, and will ALWAYS hope well for the future.
Fair enough. I understand where you're coming from then. You do have a point that there aren't a lot of good GL adaptations outside the comics and thus that makes the movie hurt more but keep in mind that a well done rebooted GL for the Justice League may just be the antidote to that.

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Badass .

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Old 04-09-2013, 09:22 PM   #703
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Wasn't the first draft a lot more of a comedy film and would've had Jack Black as Hal? I remember hearing that somewhere and shocking me immensely.
No, not from Greg Berlanti and Michael Green. Michael Green wrote for the show heroes and wrote some of thebest Superman/Batman: World's finest stories a few years ago, I have the script, I'll send you a copy for it if I can locate it and you like.

But it was a Jack Black comedy years ago. Wonder if that would have bombed as bad. lol

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Also, we didn't get much Sinestro and Corps scenes due to budget issues. That was literally the main reason why, even though WB is the biggest film studio around (Disney is a close second).
Yeah, possibly, I'm also thinking that's the reason why so much of what's in the draft I have is cut, like at the end of the original script Hal faces Parallax on OA with the GLC and jumps into the Central Power battery with 10 rings on his fingers from other fallen dead Lanterns, and when he emerged his temples were graying somewhat - it would have been epic. They really butchered this script.

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Feel free to adopt it . Glad I can shine some light on certain things on these boards .

For the record, I'm not saying that the first Spider-Man film is as bad as Green Lantern but the same idea applies. I think that the movie is ok but the fact that it's considered to be a masterpiece and one of the greatest comic book movies ever made is a big stretch IMO. One that I don't think had existed if it came out today and didn't have that nostalgia going for it. Not many people would approve of a mute Spider-Man over a wisecracking one and of a villain that could use better motivations and is watered down big time in comparison to his comic book counterpart. lol
Eh...I thought Raimi's Spidey joked enough, in the first film at least, I also prefer the first two films to TASM, which I think's biggest advantage is the special fx as far as superiority goes. The shots of Spider-Man swinging through the city at night were so big and panoramic and beautiful and well worth the price of admission that I went to see it in the theater multiple times. I get what you're saying there though.

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Fair enough. I understand where you're coming from then. You do have a point that there aren't a lot of good GL adaptations outside the comics and thus that makes the movie hurt more but keep in mind that a well done rebooted GL for the Justice League may just be the antidote to that.
Let's hope so.

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Old 04-09-2013, 09:25 PM   #704
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Originally Posted by Shikamaru View Post
Wasn't the first draft a lot more of a comedy film and would've had Jack Black as Hal? I remember hearing that somewhere and shocking me immensely.
It wouldn't have been Hal. Sinestro fiddled with the ring so it would choose Jack Black's character, think the name was Jed something, instead of Hal because of a prophecy that told him Hal would defeat him.

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Old 04-09-2013, 09:38 PM   #705
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It wouldn't have been Hal. Sinestro fiddled with the ring so it would choose Jack Black's character, think the name was Jed something, instead of Hal because of a prophecy that told him Hal would defeat him.
Really? I did not know Sinestro would have even been in it. I would love to read that actually if it's available somewhere lol.

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Old 04-09-2013, 11:41 PM   #706
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Both Hal and John are interesting (though John's voice actor in JLU made him sound superrr boring)

But Hal gets the awesome buddy-cop dynamic with Sinestro, my favourite thing in Green Lantern. (I hope we get to see this in the reboot, picking up from where GL1 left off)

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Old 04-09-2013, 11:58 PM   #707
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Pretty sure that was an episode of duck dodgers with Daffy Duck. Like dd finds Hal's ring or steals it and ridiculousness ensues. As long as jack black said "skadooshh" I'm sure it would've been a box office smash. One must wonder what they were thinking even considering the idea. Gl should've been dc's ironman, not widely known but waiting to burst out and get noticed, didn't happen. Giant diarrhea clouds do not a villain make.
...honestly, I have no idea what this thread was when I wrote this

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Old 04-10-2013, 12:07 AM   #708
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I still wanna know what you guys are eating to make your poo look like Parallax...

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Old 04-10-2013, 12:09 AM   #709
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Both Hal and John are interesting (though John's voice actor in JLU made him sound superrr boring)

But Hal gets the awesome buddy-cop dynamic with Sinestro, my favourite thing in Green Lantern. (I hope we get to see this in the reboot, picking up from where GL1 left off)
Yeah, but Sinestro is supposed to be a villain though. That's his ultimate role/dynamic for GL: archnemesis. Also, I REALLY want to see his classic blue and black threads on film and I like them 100 times better than his Sinestro Corps suit, I miss it in the comics and am sick of seeing his Sinestro Corps War suit everywhere lately.

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Old 04-10-2013, 12:11 AM   #710
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I still wanna know what you guys are eating to make your poo look like Parallax...
Fear?...or will power. I'm never really certain. Maybe carrots.

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Old 04-10-2013, 12:12 AM   #711
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Pretty sure that was an episode of duck dodgers with Daffy Duck. Like dd finds Hal's ring or steals it and ridiculousness ensues. As long as jack black said "skadooshh" I'm sure it would've been a box office smash. One must wonder what they were thinking even considering the idea. Gl should've been dc's ironman, not widely known but waiting to burst out and get noticed, didn't happen. Giant diarrah clouds do not a villain make.
...honestly, I have no idea what this thread was when I wrote this
You're fine, bro.

That's a great episode hahah I have it on DVD and VHS. lol "The Green Loontern" it's called. I would watch an animated show with how the GLs were portrayed in that episode actually, I think it'd be awesome. And Kevin Smith voices Hal! How sweet is that?

GL was all around pretty bad, I agree. They should have been trying for more Star Wars with a touch of Rocketeer instead of Iron Man in the first place, but it should have been the Iron Man "surprise" hit for them.

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