MCU: Phase II - Part 1

[DrCosmic]

You can downgrade a foe if you end the story arc. You can't just defeat Thanos and drop Ultron in the middle of Annihilation and still build tension.

[Chewy]

I was referring to the notion that Ultron is inherently a downgrade from Thanos, which is not the case.

And actually you could defeat Thanos and have Ultron work his way up into Annihilation whilst building tension. It wouldn't necessarily be my preference but I can easily see how it would work. At the end of the day Thanos is still a flesh and blood being, the notion of something whose "life" is not defined by its physical form gaining unlimited power is fairly tense.

[DrCosmic]

Oh, yeah, that's true. It's natural for Ultron to be less powerful, but he can always gain some alien power, as I assume he did in Conquest.

But I think, honestly, whenever they do address Ultron, I think it'll be a lower-level story. There's little reason or reward in trying to top Thanos ripping apart the universe or whatever shenanigans he gets up to. I don't think Avengers will stay cosmic indefinitely.

[Brian Braddock]

I could be wrong here, but with the Ulton/Pym/Vision arc there's every chance that 'lower-level story' may just have the heartstring-tugging emotional impact on the audience to counter the 'bigger scale' Thanos cosmic tale.

Avengers 2 = comic scale, big universe-spanning spectale at every turn.
Avengers 3 = more personal, yet still having dashes of visual awesomeness.

[DrCosmic]

I agree, but I see it differently.
Avengers 1,2 & 3 - cosmic scale, big spectacle, minor character arcs
Avengers 4, 5 and 6 - Much more personal and subdued, with minor spectacle

[Dr Tactics]

Originally Posted by DrCosmic

Avengers 4, 5 and 6 - Much more personal and subdued, with minor spectacle

4.5.and 6?? Man, we need at least a Harry Potter/ LOTR two parter like Avengers EMH pt 1 and 2 if they're doing a Avengers movie every 3 years..

[Chewy]

More like

All solo movies - Much more personal and subdued, with strong character arcs as the focal point
Avengers movies - Big spectacle, more subtle character arcs

That's, like, the entire point of the Avengers movies. They're like the big splash-page filled finales to comic arcs, the action-packed finales to television seasons.

[Dark Raven]

I think the idea behind the individual movies is so that they can develop the characters more and won't feel like they're cheated out of that when it comes to the team up. With the team up movie, it's more about the group dynamic and the character arc of the group more so than the individual character arcs (although there is bound to be a little of that there too).

[Hawkingbird]

I'd like them to go street Avengers with Luke Cage.

[the gael]

Originally Posted by Hawkingbird

I'd like them to go street Avengers with Luke Cage.

Yes, street avengers (The New avengers) with Iron fist, Daredevil, mockingbird, Jessica Jones and Luke Cage as their leader would be cool. And it would complete the MCU

[Dark Raven]

Originally Posted by the gael

Yes, street avengers (The New avengers) with Iron fist, Daredevil, mockingbird, Jessica Jones and Luke Cage as their leader would be cool. And it would complete the MCU

Or just have a Heroes For Hire or Marvel Knights movie instead.

[Brian Braddock]

Yeah, a more gounded-and-gritty 'Marvel Knights' movie would be great, although I'm thinking that TV would be a better format for that.

[KangConquers]

Originally Posted by Dark Raven

Or just have a Heroes For Hire or Marvel Knights movie instead.

This. There are still far too many actual Avengers stories to do without giving up and having Luke Cage and his cronies fight the Hood.

[MovieMaster]

Phase II is a go!

http://www.unleashthefanboy.com/?p=31209

[DrCosmic]

Hmmmm... not a fan of the Hood, but New Avengers *are* actual Avengers. Would love to see Luke Cage, and calling it 'New Avengers' or 'Heroes For Hire' won't have much effect overall, I don't think.

[Whiskey Tango]

Originally Posted by Dark Raven

Or just have a Heroes For Hire or Marvel Knights movie instead.

[Lord]

Seems like Joss Whedon isn't going with his idea of Smaller and more personal for Avengers 2.

[Captain Marvel]

Originally Posted by Chewy

Funny you should say that... Thanos was the bad guy in Annihilation, and Ultron was the bad guy in its sequel, Annihilation: Conquest

Did you ever read those stories? ANNIHILUS was the bad guy in Annihilation. Thanos was only a side character in that.

[Chewy]

Originally Posted by Captain Marvel

Did you ever read those stories? ANNIHILUS was the bad guy in Annihilation. Thanos was only a side character in that.

Um, yes. Annihilius and Thanos were both villains in Annihilation. Sorry that I upset you by only mentioning the one that was relevant to this conversation.

[DrCosmic]

Originally Posted by Lord

Seems like Joss Whedon isn't going with his idea of Smaller and more personal for Avengers 2.

I think he will. If Feige's hint about the culmination of phase III actually refers to the question he was being asked, we may see Thanos in a more personal way in Avengers 2, much like we saw Vader in Empire Strikes Back. You open up your living room door/answer the doorbell. Boom. Thanos. Problems.

I think the thing he was emphasizing with that old quote was that the goal was *not* to top Avengers, he later clarified that there would still be spectacle, but the goal of the original quote was to dig deeper into the emotional relationships instead of trying to make bigger action, like the second movie of every successful mega-franchise has done.

[Lord]

Originally Posted by DrCosmic

I think he will. If Feige's hint about the culmination of phase III actually refers to the question he was being asked, we may see Thanos in a more personal way in Avengers 2, much like we saw Vader in Empire Strikes Back. You open up your living room door/answer the doorbell. Boom. Thanos. Problems.

I think the thing he was emphasizing with that old quote was that the goal was *not* to top Avengers, he later clarified that there would still be spectacle, but the goal of the original quote was to dig deeper into the emotional relationships instead of trying to make bigger action, like the second movie of every successful mega-franchise has done.

I thought about that too, it would be cool to have Thanos beat them in Avengers 2 and then have 3 be an all out war, if this trilogy is a storyline then i would hope for them to hold on Ultron until after Avengers 3

[PyroChamber]

Since Phase 1 started off in the first Iron Man with the Fury cameo, what do you think will or could happen in IM3 that would signal the start of Phase 2, especially being that it will be in the cosmic corner of the Marvel universe?

[TheHeatKitchen]

Originally Posted by the gael

Yes, street avengers (The New avengers) with Iron fist, Daredevil, mockingbird, Jessica Jones and Luke Cage as their leader would be cool. And it would complete the MCU

Originally Posted by Dark Raven

Or just have a Heroes For Hire or Marvel Knights movie instead.

Originally Posted by Brian Braddock

Yeah, a more gounded-and-gritty 'Marvel Knights' movie would be great, although I'm thinking that TV would be a better format for that.

That's all very funny because you guys went down the EXACT SAME thought pattern my cousin and I had one day. I was hoping instead of the SHIELD tv show, we would be getting a Heroes for Hire deal with the same team listed at the top, minus Jessica Jones.

Just scary seeing my conversation at my cousin's house basically dictated by three other guys.

[Captain Marvel]

Originally Posted by Chewy

Um, yes. Annihilius and Thanos were both villains in Annihilation. Sorry that I upset you by only mentioning the one that was relevant to this conversation.

Relevant how? Thanos wasn't the principal villain. He wasn't even really a villain. He was just playing the role of a minion because he was bored. He was hardly the prime mover or shaker in the storyline, and he wasn't even aware of what Annihilus was planning until the end, at which point he switched sides. There's an enormous difference between following up a story in which Thanos is playing a minor role and one in which Thanos is the main villain. So yeah, your comparison was completely irrelevent to the conversation.

[Hawkingbird]

Originally Posted by Dark Raven

Or just have a Heroes For Hire or Marvel Knights movie instead.

I'd rather just have New Avengers. Be interesting to see a film with 2 teams; the Mighty Avengers and New Avengers.