Discussion: Voting ID and Voting Rights

[TheInvisibleMan]

Originally Posted by dnno1

Yes, at the precinct. The state DMV should have the person's picture on record so, if need be they could verify that without having to require a voter to produce one. I am not saying that all states do that or that there are states that do that, but they do have that potential. Carrying photo ID is a nice and smart thing to do, but it shouldn't be mandatory in all cases (I think the 5th Amendment protects that). In most states that have voter ID laws, you don't have to produce a picture ID to be identified as a voter.

but don't you think, maybe that might be a good idea?

[mrvlknight21]

Originally Posted by Kelly

I've been asked to show my Driver's License every time I've voted...and is A LOT of voting....not a big deal.

^ This.

Originally Posted by Matt

I personally do not see the big deal about requiring an ID to vote. It seems like common sense, IMO..

^ And this.

[dnno1]

Originally Posted by TheInvisibleMan

but don't you think, maybe that might be a good idea?

No, I don't because it's not necessary. Like I said before, voter fraud, which is the reason people give for requiring photo ID's, is very rare and not enough to truly justify such a requirement. Furthermore, making it mandatory could and does disenfranchise voters, which is unconstitutional.

[dnno1]

Originally Posted by Kelly

What if that ISN'T his name....

How likely is that? I mean, are there that many people who would falsify their identity to sway an election? I don't think so.

[TheInvisibleMan]

Originally Posted by dnno1

No, I don't because it's not necessary. Like I said before, voter fraud, which is the reason people give for requiring photo ID's, is very rare and not enough to truly justify such a requirement. Furthermore, making it mandatory could and does disenfranchise voters, which is unconstitutional.

I think it only does that if you make it impossible for them to get a state ID, which is not the case

where I live, if you are below a certain income guideline the fee for a state ID is waived completely or extremely reduced

[dnno1]

Originally Posted by TheInvisibleMan

I think it only does that if you make it impossible for them to get a state ID, which is not the case

where I live, if you are below a certain income guideline the fee for a state ID is waived completely or extremely reduced

On the contrary. According to a study conducted by the Brenan Center for Justice, more than 5 million Americans could be affected by the new voter registration laws in Republican states. It would be ok if the state issued an ID for free, but if it requires the registrant to produce something that he has to pay for, then it might not be ok.

[chaseter]

Originally Posted by Kelly

Here in Texas they do the same...

When I voted in TX, they never asked for an id. Just walked in, handed them your registration card or gave them your name and addy.

[Kelly]

Originally Posted by chaseter

When I voted in TX, they never asked for an id. Just walked in, handed them your registration card or gave them your name and addy.

Not in Wichita Falls, or Houston...those are the places I have voted in for 24 years, and I have been asked every time, and every person in line before me was asked...if you did not, they sent you to another line....what happened over there, I have no idea...I always had an ID. I take that back I voted 2x in Richardson, Texas and I was asked there as well.

[dnno1]

Originally Posted by chaseter

When I voted in TX, they never asked for an id. Just walked in, handed them your registration card or gave them your name and addy.

Originally Posted by Kelly

Not in Wichita Falls, or Houston...those are the places I have voted in for 24 years, and I have been asked every time, and every person in line before me was asked...if you did not, they sent you to another line....what happened over there, I have no idea...I always had an ID. I take that back I voted 2x in Richardson, Texas and I was asked there as well.

There isn't a strict photo ID law in place in Texas right now. Although one was passed last year, it is waiting approval from the USDoJ.

[Kelly]

Originally Posted by dnno1

There isn't a strict photo ID law in place in Texas right now. Although one was passed last year, it is waiting approval from the USDoJ.

I understand that Dnno, I was simply saying....as did someone else here from New York....that we have been asked for ID each time we voted....

[Bathead]

Originally Posted by dnno1

Well, that should be information that the government should already know since they were the one who granted that status to the person. Why should the person show any more proof than his name?

Just as a headsup on my own case, I am already a registered voter (have been since the late 70's). I don't see why that wouldn't be good enough.

[Kelly]

Originally Posted by Bathead

Just as a headsup on my own case, I am already a registered vogtert (have been since the late 70's). I don't see why that wouldn't be good enough.

Well, you are fine, if they don't ask for ID....as soon as that happens, you may have a problem. But, that wouldn't keep me from trying....do you have your voter registration card?

[Bathead]

Originally Posted by Kelly

Well, you are fine, if they don't ask for ID....as soon as that happens, you may have a problem. But, that wouldn't keep me from trying....do you have your voter registration card?

Yes, I do, but from my understanding, in Pa, that's not enough, a photo ID is required.
Just as an aside, the Association of Republican Lawyers (I may have that title wrong, I'm not sure), sponsors of the voter ID law, have themselves admitted that the inicidences of voter fraud have totalled 340 in the last ten years in the whole of the USA.
Hardly convincing evidence that voter ID laws are necessary.

[Kahran Ramsus]

Originally Posted by Bathead

Yes, I do, but from my understanding, in Pa, that's not enough, a photo ID is required.
Just as an aside, the Association of Republican Lawyers (I may have tthat title wrong, I'm not sure), sponsors of the voter ID law, have themselves admitted that the inicidences of voter fraud have totalled 340 in the last ten years in the whole of the USA.
Hardly convincing evidence that voter ID laws are necessary.

One is too many.

[MessiahDecoy123]

The "one is too many" argument may seem noble but in practice it would be silly.

"My kid fell on some scissors, time to pass some anti-running-with scissors laws."

Public policy that everyone must follow shouldn't be implemented due to isolated incidents. Especially if those policies might cause more problems than they solve like these voter ID requirements may do.

[Kahran Ramsus]

The difference being that voter fraud is already illegal. This is merely to prevent it. Your example doesn't work because there is no law against running with scissors in the first place.

[dnno1]

Originally Posted by Kahran Ramsus

One is too many.

One is not enough to sway an election. Not even 340 may be enough.

[dnno1]

Originally Posted by Kahran Ramsus

The difference being that voter fraud is already illegal. This is merely to prevent it. Your example doesn't work because there is no law against running with scissors in the first place.

It shouldn't be at the expense of those who can legitimately vote though.

[Kahran Ramsus]

Originally Posted by dnno1

One is not enough to sway an election. Not even 340 may be enough.

I see the lessons of 2000 are forgotten already.

It shouldn't be at the expense of those who can legitimately vote though.

What expense? All of us in support on this board have acknowledged the problems with how it has been implemented, and that there should be a free option for ID for those who cannot afford it. I do agree that if it can't be done right for 2012 (and I don't think there is enough time to do so), then it shouldn't be. But for 2014 or 2016, absolutely.

[MessiahDecoy123]

Originally Posted by Kahran Ramsus

I see the lessons of 2000 are forgotten already.

Bush won by 537 votes in the closest presidential election in history.

340 bad votes in ten years stretches how thin across the entire country? One bad votes per state election?

This voter ID is a solution to a contrived issue and it will cause more problems than it will solve.

[dnno1]

Originally Posted by Kahran Ramsus

I see the lessons of 2000 are forgotten already.



What expense? All of us in support on this board have acknowledged the problems with how it has been implemented, and that there should be a free option for ID for those who cannot afford it. I do agree that if it can't be done right for 2012 (and I don't think there is enough time to do so), then it shouldn't be. But for 2014 or 2016, absolutely.

There wasn't voter fraud in the 2000 election. Not all the votes were counted. Furthermore, this isn't an issue of getting a free ID, but the expense of getting the proof that you are either a citizen or a resident of a state.

[BoredGuy]

Ive never been ID'd when voting

These laws are bulls**t

[SV Fan]

Originally Posted by Kahran Ramsus

I see the lessons of 2000 are forgotten already.

Actually no they aren't forgotten, why do you think the Republicans are trying to suppress the vote every way possible. Bush nearly lost the election if it wasn't for the Supreme Court stepping in, they don't want to make the same mistake twice.

[Bathead]

Just as an extra bit of news, in Pennsylvania, where I live, and has enacted a photo voter ID law, the state of Pennsylvania itself has said there has never been any case of voter fraud recorded in Pennsylvania, and that there is no evidence that in person voter fraud is likely to occur in Nov. 2012 in the absence of the photo ID law (docket no.330 md 12, Commonwealth Court of PA.) and Pa. state rep. Mike Turzai (R) has flat out stated the voter ID laws are what will get Romney the win in Pennsylavania.
Again, if you think these laws are to prevent voter fraud, then you are being extremely naive.

[Kelly]

Originally Posted by Bathead

Just as an extra bit of news, in Pennsylvania, where I live, and has enacted a photo voter ID law, the state of Pennsylvania itself has said there has never been any case of voter fraud recorded in Pennsylvania, and that there is no evidence that in person voter fraud is likely to occur in Nov. 2012 in the absence of the photo ID law (docket no.330 md 12, Commonwealth Court of PA.) and Pa. state rep. Mike Turzai (R) has flat out stated the voter ID laws are what will get Romney the win in Pennsylavania.
Again, if you think these laws are to prevent voter fraud, then you are being extremely naive.

Do you have a source of the comments? I'd like to read that....