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View Poll Results: When will the fans turn on TDK Trilogy in Mass?
When a reboot or JL film is announced 32 39.51%
When we get a poster/stills of the reboot/JL film 11 13.58%
The new Trailer(s) 20 24.69%
Week of Release 18 22.22%
Voters: 81. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-23-2013, 02:34 PM   #501
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Default Re: How long before the fan community turns on the Nolan films?

That's why I think Devin's such a phony. It's clear he didn't even really like TDK that much and takes a lot of issue with what it stands for, but probably felt somewhat pressured to give it a respectable score based on all the accolades it was getting and Ledger's Joker in particular. He spends that whole review hammering away at it, as if to justify the 1.5 points he's subtracting and to stick it in the face of everyone who loves the film.

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Old 03-23-2013, 03:00 PM   #502
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Devin sucks.

'Nuff said.

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Old 03-23-2013, 03:02 PM   #503
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Default Re: How long before the fan community turns on the Nolan films?

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Originally Posted by MessiahDecoy123 View Post
Most people didn't turn on Richard Donner but he didn't direct a disappointing third movie like Raimi and, to a lesser extent, Nolan did.

To fanboys you're only as good as your last movie.

I myself, disliked Nolan and Raimi's interpretation since day one, so I'm not surprised when someone realizes how overrated they can be.
That's a ridiculous way of thinking. Nolan is ****ing awesome and Raimi is ****ing terrible? No thanks. Nolan is incredible and so is Raimi(who would have given us a great third entry if Sony/Arad didn't stick their nose into everything).

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Old 03-23-2013, 04:02 PM   #504
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Default Re: How long before the fan community turns on the Nolan films?

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That's a ridiculous way of thinking. Nolan is ****ing awesome and Raimi is ****ing terrible? No thanks. Nolan is incredible and so is Raimi(who would have given us a great third entry if Sony/Arad didn't stick their nose into everything).
There was backlash because of a disappointing third entry from Nolan and Raimi's trilogies.

Do they still have loyal fans no matter how bad their third entry was? Yeah

Would there have been any backlash against them if all their entire trilogies were considered nearly flawless? Highly unlikely.

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Old 03-23-2013, 04:10 PM   #505
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Default Re: How long before the fan community turns on the Nolan films?

The difference is, with SM-3 even the people who do enjoy it still admit that it's heavily flawed.

TDKR has actual hardcore fans who will stick their neck out for it and defend it. Find me a dedicated SM-3 fan that adores that movie on the level that people adore TDKR.

It's probably like an 80/20 split hate/love split on Spider-Man 3 (maybe 70/30 but that's probably being generous). TDKR is probably more like 50/50, maybe 60/40 in terms of people being disappointed vs. not disappointed. And even a large percentage of the disappointed crowd still likes the movie and might even rank it as their second favorite of the trilogy.

There's no comparison. And it's not fair to compare either. It's not like Raimi even deserved the backlash considering it was the studio and Avi Arad that compromised his vision for the film very early in the process.

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Old 03-23-2013, 04:15 PM   #506
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Default Re: How long before the fan community turns on the Nolan films?

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Originally Posted by MessiahDecoy123 View Post
There was backlash because of a disappointing third entry from Nolan and Raimi's trilogies.

Do they still have loyal fans no matter how bad their third entry was? Yeah

Would there have been any backlash against them if all their entire trilogies were considered nearly flawless? Highly unlikely.
You'll find backlash for anything when it comes to the end of a trilogy. Return of the Jedi, The Last Crusade, Return of the King, The Bourne Ultimatum, The Dark Knight Rises, Die Hard With a Vengeance, Back To The Future: Part III, The Good, The Bad and the Ugly, Toy Story 3.

It's impossible to find a film that doesn't have backlash against it, trilogy ending or not.

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Old 03-23-2013, 04:44 PM   #507
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I'm not arguing whether the backlash is fair or not.

I'm simply saying if your latest effort is disappointing on some level you can expect a backlash.

It's pretty much unavoidable unless you end on a high note.

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Old 03-23-2013, 04:52 PM   #508
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I don't remember The Dark Knight getting this much criticism in the spring of 2009. I think the biggest disappointment and argument was, "YOU KILLED TWO-FACE, YOU BASTERDS". That was pretty much it other than, "how did the Joker plant that stuff". There was still a aura of good feelings and discussions and people still eating it up. The biggest thing on people's minds were, "where will it go next", "will there be a sequel", well that and all the gushing at all the "new" production pictures that would come are way from various sources.


With TDKR, it's pretty much the exact opposite with all this criticism from folks who were disappoint and we don't even have another film to look forward to since this is "the end".

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Old 03-23-2013, 04:59 PM   #509
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Well milost, no offense but no duh. Even for me who absolutely loves the film, it has still been rather bittersweet and melancholic saying goodbye to the franchise, and I miss looking forward to another film like you have no idea. Just a different feeling altogether.

It was the same for me in the leadup to the film. For TDK, it couldn't come soon enough. But TDKR, I was very patient. I was in no rush for July 20th to come because I knew it'd be all over.

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Old 03-23-2013, 07:08 PM   #510
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Default Re: How long before the fan community turns on the Nolan films?

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There was backlash because of a disappointing third entry from Nolan and Raimi's trilogies.

Do they still have loyal fans no matter how bad their third entry was? Yeah

Would there have been any backlash against them if all their entire trilogies were considered nearly flawless? Highly unlikely.
Putting Nolan and Raimi in the same boat is just too damn laughable. TDKR sure has some "hate" and you can see that on the forums, but to put S-M 3 and TDKR in the same boat? C'mon man, even if you hated Nolan's and Raimi's trilogies from the beginning, you're blinded by your biased views to put them in the same boat. TDKR is a very well liked film and third installment and while some think it's a weak film, it at least has higher ratings than BB so it stays strong in the middle between BB and TDK while S-M 3 has ratings that is WAY low than even the first Spider-Man film.

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Old 03-23-2013, 11:51 PM   #511
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Default Re: How long before the fan community turns on the Nolan films?

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The difference is, with SM-3 even the people who do enjoy it still admit that it's heavily flawed.

TDKR has actual hardcore fans who will stick their neck out for it and defend it. Find me a dedicated SM-3 fan that adores that movie on the level that people adore TDKR.

It's probably like an 80/20 split hate/love split on Spider-Man 3 (maybe 70/30 but that's probably being generous). TDKR is probably more like 50/50, maybe 60/40 in terms of people being disappointed vs. not disappointed. And even a large percentage of the disappointed crowd still likes the movie and might even rank it as their second favorite of the trilogy.

There's no comparison. And it's not fair to compare either. It's not like Raimi even deserved the backlash considering it was the studio and Avi Arad that compromised his vision for the film very early in the process.
I won't speculate percentages, but suffice it to say that among general moviegoers the overwhelming majority liked TDKR (though I would not use the word love, then again that would go for all fanboy movies of the last decade save for LOTR, TDK and Harry Potter). Around 80% of critics liked it.

It is just fanboys turn on everything. When it came out it was 80/20 liked it. By the time a reboot rolls around, 80/20 will hate it. It is just the way the fan community is about all things.

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Old 03-23-2013, 11:55 PM   #512
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I don't remember The Dark Knight getting this much criticism in the spring of 2009. I think the biggest disappointment and argument was, "YOU KILLED TWO-FACE, YOU BASTERDS". That was pretty much it other than, "how did the Joker plant that stuff". There was still a aura of good feelings and discussions and people still eating it up. The biggest thing on people's minds were, "where will it go next", "will there be a sequel", well that and all the gushing at all the "new" production pictures that would come are way from various sources.


With TDKR, it's pretty much the exact opposite with all this criticism from folks who were disappoint and we don't even have another film to look forward to since this is "the end".
You just cut to the heart of it. Granted TDK is better, but really it is fanboys want the new fix, the new toy. When TDKR came out most liked it. However, unlike the previous movie, it has a pretty closed ending. Supposedly there are no more films with this Batman to come. That means there is nothing to speculate on. That means it is time to speculate on a new Batman franchise. And that means focusing on all the minutia that you disliked about Nolan's vision.

Enter fanboys picking the movie to death and when they are done, they start moving on to the rest of the Nolan trilogy. By the time the reboot, if it is one, comes around, most of this board will be filled with people promising that they always hated Nolan's vision and the whole series was vastly overrated. You can count on it.

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Old 03-24-2013, 12:06 AM   #513
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You just cut to the heart of it. Granted TDK is better, but really it is fanboys want the new fix, the new toy. When TDKR came out most liked it. However, unlike the previous movie, it has a pretty closed ending. Supposedly there are no more films with this Batman to come. That means there is nothing to speculate on. That means it is time to speculate on a new Batman franchise. And that means focusing on all the minutia that you disliked about Nolan's vision.

Enter fanboys picking the movie to death and when they are done, they start moving on to the rest of the Nolan trilogy. By the time the reboot, if it is one, comes around, most of this board will be filled with people promising that they always hated Nolan's vision and the whole series was vastly overrated. You can count on it.

Could be, could be.


I can't see a day where The Dark Knight is hated though, I simply can't. We'll see I guess.


And I also don't think that the criticisms towards TDKR are without reason and simply spite. I really don't. Maybe some of it, for some people, but not everyone. It's not like I went into TDKR looking to rip it. I went in, as excited as anyone else for this new Batman film and came out disappointed. That's it really, for me anyway (doesn't apply to everyone).

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Old 03-24-2013, 12:34 AM   #514
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Some have legitimate problems with the movie, as well as the trilogy as a whole. But the reason that has changed from a small minority to already a 50/50 split is because it is over and it is time for something new. The winds will continue to change. Then in about ten years or so, there will be some swing back from people who have their new series and can view Nolan in a different context. When Batman Begins came out, though I preferred it to the Burton films, I stood practically alone in defending those movies from those who wanted to trash them and tear them down to raise Begins up. Now, Burton has fans again as it is a piece of fan and character history and less a popularity threat to the new toy that is playing in theaters.

Just a thought.

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Old 03-24-2013, 12:44 AM   #515
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So you think it just won't be with TDKR? It'll spread to the others? I guess I can't really argue with any of that because it's mostly true if you look back at other films. That is what tends to happen unfortunately, especially when we don't know what's ahead in terms of Batman's cinematic future. In with the new, out with the old. Put em down, raise em up. "They were never that special".


That'll be the day when we see The Dark Knight ripped to hell and back, like Batman '89, Raimi's first two Spider-Man films or other successful comic book films that "everyone" used to seemingly love. I can't really see it, but then again, back in the day I never thought ahead and saw it happening to those that have been trashed on.


In the end, all that matters really is how YOU, the individual feels. As long as we're honest with our selves about these things, then who cares what others might think.

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Old 03-24-2013, 12:44 AM   #516
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Default Re: How long before the fan community turns on the Nolan films?

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Some have legitimate problems with the movie, as well as the trilogy as a whole. But the reason that has changed from a small minority to already a 50/50 split is because it is over and it is time for something new. The winds will continue to change. Then in about ten years or so, there will be some swing back from people who have their new series and can view Nolan in a different context. When Batman Begins came out, though I preferred it to the Burton films, I stood practically alone in defending those movies from those who wanted to trash them and tear them down to raise Begins up. Now, Burton has fans again as it is a piece of fan and character history and less a popularity threat to the new toy that is playing in theaters.

Just a thought.
And to take that point even further, even the 60s series is having a bit of resurgence now with all the new merch they're releasing.

I think you're spot on about the way fandom operates with this kind of thing. There's an initial backlash, but no matter what, Nolan created a Bat-phenonemon and it will be looked back upon with nostalgia by many.

I used to nitpick the crap out of Burton's films, but now I don't care about all those little issues as much because they're not the only cinematic representations of Batman. When I put on 89 or Returns, it's because I'm in the mood to "go back there" and revisit that feeling of awe and wonder I had as a kid when I watched them. It'll be the same eventually when I got back to watch a Nolan Bat-film in 10 years, only to revisit the hype and passion I had as a teen/20something who was blown away by a bold new interpretation of the mythos.

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Old 03-24-2013, 12:46 AM   #517
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Default Re: How long before the fan community turns on the Nolan films?

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That's a ridiculous way of thinking. Nolan is ****ing awesome and Raimi is ****ing terrible? No thanks. Nolan is incredible and so is Raimi(who would have given us a great third entry if Sony/Arad didn't stick their nose into everything).
Raimi is a sellout. Exhibit A: Oz the mediocre Disney merchandising vehicle.

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Old 03-24-2013, 12:47 AM   #518
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Raimi is a sellout. Exhibit A: Oz the mediocre Disney merchandising vehicle.
If he does Evil Dead 4, all is forgiven

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Old 03-24-2013, 12:49 AM   #519
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Default Re: How long before the fan community turns on the Nolan films?

Drag Me to Hell was good.

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Old 03-24-2013, 12:54 AM   #520
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When I put on 89 or Returns, it's because I'm in the mood to "go back there" and revisit that feeling of awe and wonder I had as a kid when I watched them. It'll be the same eventually when I got back to watch a Nolan Bat-film in 10 years, only to revisit the hype and passion I had as a teen/20something who was blown away by a bold new interpretation of the mythos.
Same here.

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Old 03-24-2013, 12:57 AM   #521
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So you think it just won't be with TDKR? It'll spread to the others? I guess I can't really argue with any of that because it's mostly true if you look back at other films. That is what tends to happen unfortunately, especially when we don't know what's ahead in terms of Batman's cinematic future. In with the new, out with the old. Put em down, raise em up. "They were never that special".


That'll be the day when we see The Dark Knight ripped to hell and back, like Batman '89, Raimi's first two Spider-Man films or other successful comic book films that "everyone" used to seemingly love. I can't really see it, but then again, back in the day I never thought ahead and saw it happening to those that have been trashed on.


In the end, all that matters really is how YOU, the individual feels. As long as we're honest with our selves about these things, then who cares what others might think.
Yep, that is why I can still defend TDKR on this board as it becomes ever more popular.

The one board that I think will turn into complete anarchy next year is the X-board. It will be Vaughn fans and Singer fans lining up for war, I figure.

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Old 03-24-2013, 01:00 AM   #522
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Are there currently Vaughn vs. Singer fanwars? I honestly had no idea, I just figured everyone was happy that FC was better than X3 haha. I'm a fan of the movies but I don't really touch those boards for whatever reason so pardon my ignorance.

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Old 03-24-2013, 01:01 AM   #523
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And to take that point even further, even the 60s series is having a bit of resurgence now with all the new merch they're releasing.

I think you're spot on about the way fandom operates with this kind of thing. There's an initial backlash, but no matter what, Nolan created a Bat-phenonemon and it will be looked back upon with nostalgia by many.

I used to nitpick the crap out of Burton's films, but now I don't care about all those little issues as much because they're not the only cinematic representations of Batman. When I put on 89 or Returns, it's because I'm in the mood to "go back there" and revisit that feeling of awe and wonder I had as a kid when I watched them. It'll be the same eventually when I got back to watch a Nolan Bat-film in 10 years, only to revisit the hype and passion I had as a teen/20something who was blown away by a bold new interpretation of the mythos.
Thanks. I appreciate Burton now for the nostalgia and context, as well. It was harder to see that when BB came out and it was so much better, at least for many of us. The '60s series is also seeing a resurgence to counter the "darkness" of Nolan, it's even getting its own comic line this year. I expect the Nolan trilogy will be hated on something fierce for the next five years. But then that too will fade. "Why do we fall, Master Bruce?"

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Raimi is a sellout. Exhibit A: Oz the mediocre Disney merchandising vehicle.
He has always been more a showman than artist to me. Evil Dead is not exactly known for its plot. Darkman is not a deep movie.

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Old 03-24-2013, 01:03 AM   #524
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The one board that I think will turn into complete anarchy next year is the X-board. It will be Vaughn fans and Singer fans lining up for war, I figure.

Which will be nuts considering it's smashing the old and new and mashing it together, a first for this type of thing. The boards will be insane.

It'd be like if they made a film that combined all the Batman film universes (from the past 24 years). Some crazy elseworlds movie that has a world that's inhabited by a Keaton Batman and a Bale Batman.



It'll no doubt be interesting to watch though. These comic book movies and the hype that precedes them are always fun.

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Old 03-24-2013, 01:07 AM   #525
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Are there currently Vaughn vs. Singer fanwars? I honestly had no idea, I just figured everyone was happy that FC was better than X3 haha. I'm a fan of the movies but I don't really touch those boards for whatever reason so pardon my ignorance.
I have only strayed there once in like a year. But it is more based on the news. It is kind of clear Singer forced Vaughn out, intentionally or not, from the XFC sequel. Now, DOFP sounds like it is not even a sequel to XFC, but X-Men 4. He is dropping everyone from the XFC cast except for Fassbender, Lawrence, MacAvoy and Hoult (sorry Banshee, Moira, CIA, Havoc, Angel II and Emma Frost fans ) and is seeming to put the whole emphasis back onto Rogue and Wolverine form X1.

I am mixed on it, myself. I am happy he is salvaging Rogue (clearly a favorite of his) after Ratner ruined her. However, I would be lying if I did not say XFC was my favorite. No A-listers or not, that movie was much more entertaining for me than Singer's own films. Since he is kind of throwing most of it out, I imagine there will be a fanboy war over that.

Time will tell.

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