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Old 11-23-2013, 09:36 PM   #1
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Default X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

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Old 11-23-2013, 10:22 PM   #2
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

RE: Spider-Man

I think Marvel likes the arrangement they have with Sony in regards to Spider-Man in that they get merchandising rights to Spider-Man and his entire crop of characters. Marvel also gets the animated rights to Spider-Man.

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Old 11-24-2013, 12:46 AM   #3
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

this is fine by me - Spider-Man and Wolverine should never have joined the Avengers in the comics, either.

X-Men for the most part have been their own sub-group at Marvel - so I do not miss them as part of the Marvel Studios films.

While Spider-Man has no business as a member of the Avengers, it would be nice to see him pop up or cross over in some Marvel films - DD, with the FF's Torch, etc. - but I am happy enough with what Sony has been doing.

What NEEDS to be a part of the MU to be properly presented on screen is the Fantastic Four and all the supporting characters that are associated with them!

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Old 11-24-2013, 02:07 AM   #4
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

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In my estimation the rights issues have actually worked out perfectly for Marvel movies.

X-Men has always been its own sub-universe and I actually wish it was separate even in the comics. It never really made much sense for mutants to be persecuted and all the other heroes being treated like... heroes. Anybody with superpowers would be feared by the public. Doesn't matter how they got them.

So its great that the X-Men are separate from the rest of the Marvel universe. Its let them do mutant specific stories without all these other superheroes running around complicating things. And honestly as great as we think an X-Men/Avengers movie would be I think it would just be overload. That's why I'm actually concerned about DOFP and its gigantic cast.

As for Spider-Man he has always been Marvel's #1 Premier character so its only fitting that he is separate too. Grouping him in with other heroes would not give him his proper due.
Batman and Superman's place in the JL argue with this logic.

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Old 11-24-2013, 05:08 AM   #5
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

they're the leaders though

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Old 11-24-2013, 05:29 AM   #6
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

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Batman and Superman's place in the JL argue with this logic.
The JL is completelly different though, Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman and Justice League are each basically their oun franchises, with Marvel they're almost separated as he Avengers, Fantastic Four, X-Men and Spider-Man, Iron Man and Wolverine are in a way sub-franchises, which is why it can be a little weird when a member of one franchise becomes the member of another

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Old 11-24-2013, 10:02 AM   #7
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

The FF is the only thing that might do better if at Marvel, and we'd have to give up GOTG to have it, so I'll pass.

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Old 11-24-2013, 08:43 PM   #8
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The FF is the only thing that might do better if at Marvel, and we'd have to give up GOTG to have it, so I'll pass.
Why would GOTG have to suffer - the FF covers a lot of ground that GOTG does not, and vice versa...

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Old 11-25-2013, 07:22 AM   #9
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

I'm fine with the "X-Universe" remaining a separate entity at Fox, because I agree that it's never made sense that mutants have always been treated differently than other supers in the Marvel U; but Spidey and the FF definitely deserve their rightful place in the MCU. As the MCU delves deeper into the cosmic side of Marvel, the lack of the FF and its mythos becomes even more problematic. And with the "Marvel Knights" titles coming to Netflix starting in 2015, some crossover/cameo recognition with Spidey and his mythos are almost essential, especially regarding Kingpin and Daredevil.

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Old 11-25-2013, 08:25 AM   #10
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

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Why would GOTG have to suffer - the FF covers a lot of ground that GOTG does not, and vice versa...
Limited number of franchises they can maintain, and they don't need two franchises about a team exploring other planets dealing with cosmic forces.

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Old 11-25-2013, 08:50 AM   #11
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

Aren't there three other threads dealing with this same topic?

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Old 11-27-2013, 05:22 PM   #12
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

Not having the film rights to Spider-Man & the X-Men is probably the best thing that ever happened to Marvel - it forced them to dig deeper into their catalog of characters and take chances on them, and now Iron Man, Thor, Captain America & the Avengers brand enjoy a pop culture prominence they didn't have before.

Odds are if Marvel had X-Men, more specifically if they had Wolverine and Spider-Man, it'd be the same situation with DC & WB - milking those properties for all their worth while other characters languish in Development Hell, which is why most DC characters have no relevance in this day & age. Or we'd Wolverine being forced into the Avengers film along with Spider-Man, even though they have no business being Avengers in the first place.

Also, with things the way they are, we're spared the banality of a live action adaptation of Avengers Vs. X-Men.

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Old 11-27-2013, 06:34 PM   #13
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

Them not having the rights at the moment was great for them, but I for one wouldnt mind them getting the rights back and leading up to a big civil war type film.

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Old 11-27-2013, 07:28 PM   #14
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

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I'm fine with the "X-Universe" remaining a separate entity at Fox, because I agree that it's never made sense that mutants have always been treated differently than other supers in the Marvel U; but Spidey and the FF definitely deserve their rightful place in the MCU. As the MCU delves deeper into the cosmic side of Marvel, the lack of the FF and its mythos becomes even more problematic. And with the "Marvel Knights" titles coming to Netflix starting in 2015, some crossover/cameo recognition with Spidey and his mythos are almost essential, especially regarding Kingpin and Daredevil.
That's pretty much exactly how I feel. Spider-Man and the Fantastic Four should be put into the MCU but leave the X-Men out of it.

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Old 11-27-2013, 08:31 PM   #15
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

It about them being in the same Universe, not automatically joining The Avengers as full time members.

Why can some people not understand that.

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Old 11-27-2013, 09:39 PM   #16
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

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Them not having the rights at the moment was great for them, but I for one wouldnt mind them getting the rights back and leading up to a big civil war type film.
Meh, I don't think I'd want that, considering what a dumb story Civil War was. There are other, better stories more deserving of the cinema treatment than CW.

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Old 11-27-2013, 10:39 PM   #17
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

I think dwelling on pipe dream fantasies about corporations putting aside minor differences like hundreds of millions of dollars and holding hands to make the fans happy is why Allan Moore, douchebag that he is, has ascribed the term "sub-normal" to us.

If X-Men and Spider-Man revert? Great. But I'm not losing sleep over it.

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Old 11-27-2013, 11:23 PM   #18
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

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I think dwelling on pipe dream fantasies about corporations putting aside minor differences like hundreds of millions of dollars and holding hands to make the fans happy is why Allan Moore, douchebag that he is, has ascribed the term "sub-normal" to us.

If X-Men and Spider-Man revert? Great. But I'm not losing sleep over it.
This is usually my first reactions to these threads.

And even the overall result. "Oh, well, the Avengers can't fight Galactus." What a crushing blow...

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Old 11-28-2013, 12:06 AM   #19
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

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It about them being in the same Universe, not automatically joining The Avengers as full time members.

Why can some people not understand that.
I'm not a big fan of Spidey, Wolverine, or any of the Four joining the Avengers, either; but the people who *do* want to see that aren't playing pie-in-the-sky wish magic, either. There's ample canonical reasons for a lot of these guys to join the Avengers, since they've all spent a good deal of time on that team, either in this century or farther back: Spider-Man, Wolverine, Beast, all Four of the Fantastic, Rogue, Sunfire, Sunspot, Cannonball, Havok, Luke Cage and Iron Fist, War Machine, Falcon, Dr. Strange, Namor....

It's easier to name Marvel heroes that *haven't* been Avengers than the reverse. At some point, *everybody* got called up to the All-Stars.

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Old 11-28-2013, 12:14 AM   #20
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

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This is usually my first reactions to these threads.

And even the overall result. "Oh, well, the Avengers can't fight Galactus." What a crushing blow...
The only legitimate blow is Galactus, Silver Surfer and Anihilus being excluded from an Annihilation type film.

Anyone who claims "The Avengers isn't the same without Doctor Doom/ Galactus" simply knows **** all about the Avengers and their actual rogues gallery.

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Old 11-28-2013, 07:40 AM   #21
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

Fantastic Four really needs to revert. I would much prefer FOX solely focusing on the X-Men universe and Marvel introducing the Fantastic Four into the MCU. Won't happen, but I can dream.

I love Singer's X-Men and couldn't be happier with his return to the franchise. I hope he hangs around and the series grows further.

As far as Spider-Man goes, I'd be more interested in him if Marvel had the rights now, but I enjoyed the Raimi trilogy and am quite content with that.

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Old 11-28-2013, 07:51 AM   #22
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

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I'm fine with the "X-Universe" remaining a separate entity at Fox, because I agree that it's never made sense that mutants have always been treated differently than other supers in the Marvel U; but Spidey and the FF definitely deserve their rightful place in the MCU. As the MCU delves deeper into the cosmic side of Marvel, the lack of the FF and its mythos becomes even more problematic. And with the "Marvel Knights" titles coming to Netflix starting in 2015, some crossover/cameo recognition with Spidey and his mythos are almost essential, especially regarding Kingpin and Daredevil.
I think 'sam hit the nail on the head here.

As the OP stated, Marvel's world of X-Men and that of superheroes never really meshed even in the comics. And for everyone who wants to see Fox's current cinematic X-Verse intersect with the MCU... THIS MAKES LITERALLY ZERO SENSE!!!

On to Spidey. Now, most of the arguments against Spider-Man in the MCU revolve around "I hate that he's now an Avenger in the comics"*. Yes, I agree, Spider-Man as a card-carrying Avengers member in the MCU would seem a little forced. However, Avengers =/= MCU. While it probably won't happen, I think Sony's TASM universe can be included into the MCU with negligible retconning at this point. Whether it's Sony's current incarnation, or a post-Garfield version, an MCU with Spidey swinging along somewhere is far more interesting than a Spidey-less MCU.

And regarding the FF, I think it is pretty much universally acknowledged that the FF and their associated characters would be a perfect fit in the MCU. So, I don't think this point even needs to be debated. Disney, just buy the rights back already.

* As an aside, I've basically stopped paying attention to the comics' Avengers roster(s) as I'm sure it includes a third of the world's population by now.

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Old 11-28-2013, 10:11 PM   #23
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

I wish Marvel had all the rights, since that's where they belong. All the characters in one universe. But as I stated earlier, I'm not losing any sleep over the rights issues.

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Old 12-05-2013, 03:15 AM   #24
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

All Marvel characters belong to MARVEL. but for now, I'm glad how the things are working out...

but considering DC are gonna have 1 big cinematic universe in 4-5 years to come (they have all their characters under WB, right?),
So, I really wish someday we also could have an opportunity to see ONE big Marvel universe in cinematic format.


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Old 12-05-2013, 09:15 AM   #25
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Default Re: X-Men and Spider-Man will never join The Avengers - And That's Great!

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All Marvel characters belong to MARVEL. but for now, I'm glad how the things are working out...

but considering DC are gonna have 1 big cinematic universe in 4-5 years to come (they have all their characters under WB, right?),
So, I really wish someday we also could have an opportunity to see ONE big Marvel universe in cinematic format.
I'm sure we all do, at heart; but for now, I'm glad that multiple studios means more chances of seeing different and new heroes on the big screen. If they were all under one umbrella, especially Marvel Studios with their 2-a-year release schedule, there'd be a TON of major characters/teams that would get shelved and never get a chance to get their own film.

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