Official Relationship Thread: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly

[amazingfantasy15]

Originally Posted by Nave 'Torment'

See that's just it! You want that sort of emotional independence first before you get involved in any relationship. I don't mean this as a reference to pot-head girl but about the way I'm looking at myself socially. I'd rather be that 110% committed to work until I've reached that place where I don't feel like I need someone to be okay with myself. Y'know what I'm talking about: to overcome this reclusive sense of loneliness that only someone else can fulfill? I want to overcome that by myself. It... I don't know Anita, it kinda seems important for self-growth. Most people get over that in an instant, they have a good life. I don't for whatever reason, and yes I've always felt detached or out of place or just not really part of a group and it's been damning when i was younger. I need to get over that on my own. Getting into a relationship before that would be destructive because I'd constantly be depending on this other person to not feel alone or isolated or just plain happy. See what I mean by immature?

You're looking at things the wrong way, you need to find a happy balance of everything in your life. You seem to think it's all or nothing. When I met my wife I was very comfortable in my own skin, I had a job I wasn't happy with, but it paid the bills and afforded me a fun life, had a good group of friends, but also had my own things going on too. It's not about burying yourself in one single thing and putting all your effort into that, it's about being okay with yourself, knowing that if you don't find someone that's okay, but it'd be a lot better if you had someone to share experiences with. I was cool with being by myself, but also knew if I wanted to hang out with people they were there.

Originally Posted by Nave 'Torment'

Yeah trust me I'm not :P the other day I was having this same discussion with a friend who was very much about societal function. His idea goes that women do want a guy they can rely on, especially in Bangladesh where it's kinda unsafe to go outside for anybody, as it's traditionally conservative, women here (apparently) expect their men to be able to do the things they can't, usually the stuff of the great outdoors. And his idea was that this expectation isn't only limited to our culture but goes beyond it, and while there may be those who are exceptions, it's "safer" to assume that in a relationship you're expected to fit into culturally-assigned roles. Masculine or otherwise. And I'm thinking okay so that goes the other way too doesn't it? If women expect men to be "men" then those same men are also expecting their partners to act like "womenly women." In other words, the making sandwich time It's not something anyone should be aspiring towards. At least not when you're talking about the ideal relationship. Take that back to the idea of all relationships inherently being "complimentary" where one partner compliments the other -- and it's a very romantic notion -- but then it would mean exactly that sort of cultural-designation of roles.

I think you missed Anita's point, it's not about filling traditional roles, it's about that person having your back. Knowing that when the chips are down there's someone there that will help pick you up. Like when she's having a bad day or week or month at work, just listening to her as she unloads her feelings and interjecting every so often to try and help her work through the problem. Or when either of you are sick, letting that other person take care of you, not because they feel obligated, but because they care and it makes them feel good to help you get better. It's not gender roles, just helping and having the other's back.

Originally Posted by Nave 'Torment'

And... I think I've officially done overthinking about this for today. Lol. But no to answer your question, no I'm certainly not expecting that. Can't say that for the girls around me though. And if that's the case. I'm screwed.

I know I ought to give pot-head girl the chance, and I dunno, maybe underneath all that acid lies a heart of a romantic but good god do I really want to go there?!

I dunno. She's scary. She even has those scary eyes that are actually kind of arousing if you think about it...

You seem to have an attraction to her and are just too scared to let your guard down and open yourself up in the fear of getting hurt. However, you miss 100% of the shots you don't take.

Originally Posted by Nave 'Torment'

Which is great actually, because what you have with your fiance (based on this example alone, because I don't presume to know what your relationship is like with him other than this, of course) is compatibility. The two of you are compatible, that's why you get "support." And it's a beautiful thing. Something I hope I'll have someday with my fiancee. If ever.

Ah... didn't catch the reference...

The thing is when you listen to Anita's story of what it took to get that compatibility is taking the risk. Saying what the hell, I'll give this guy a try, she didn't give up right off the bat. That's the thing you've got to be willing to take the risk, yeah, you might get hurt, but at some point you'll find the person you're compatible with.

[Nave 'Torment']

Originally Posted by Anita18

It just sounds like you're getting too emotionally invested before a relationship has actually developed.

There's a difference between caring about somebody (like, making sure they're safe, which is a smidge more than what a casual friend would normally do), and worrying that they don't like you as much as you like them. Caring is giving. It's an outward attitude. Being "emotionally invested" the way that you're describing yourself is a defensive, self-protecting maneuver.

Thanks. I'll remember that

I don't know if I would describe it as immature. Maybe a little naive. I think that's what a lot of young folks think they have to do - hold off on relationships until they are 110% okay with themselves, and then they are ready!

But that's not exactly how life works. My friend told me when I was single and still nursing some low self-esteem, "It's not that you have to be 100% perfect before you go into a relationship. You just need to find someone who's on the same path as you and will complement you."

True. I mean, the only part I can disagree with there is you using the word "compliment" but since it's actually about compatibility, then yeah, that's sound advice right there...

...BUT IT'S JUST SO DAMN HARD! You want to be 100% and then get into it.

It's fine to look at attractive pothead girl and think, "She's hot, but she's not on the same path as me and I don't want to go down her road." But that has to be a purposeful kind of decision, or else you'll be second-guessing yourself the whole time.

It's also very likely that some workaholics use their career as a crutch. You can't use work as your entire identity either. There always has to be a balance.

So what you're saying is that, objectively at least, don't go out with pot-head girl since she's pot-head girl, but don't lock myself out either and wait for the "right moment" for me and just be open towards other people?

Coz that makes sense. Even though I'll probably prefer to go to that 100% and then proceed.

[QUOTE]Also, it's fine to be an introverted hermit. [...] Being afraid of getting into a relationship because you're afraid of the other person being a social crutch mostly means that you aren't comfortable with this whole introverted thing yet. That's how I felt when I was surrounded by extroverts. ]/QUOTE[

I get that. What I want to do is first be okay with it.

I have no idea how diverse Bangladesh is. Is it really that conservative? Even among upper-middle class Americans, it can run the gamut. My uncle pays for his family's lifestyle. He's definitely the breadwinner and they're the more conservative of my relatives. My family is not as well-off as them, but we put more emphasis on life fulfillment and not prestige. In fact, my mom made also twice as much as my dad when I was in high school.

My coworker is also part of a very traditional marriage (or at least her husband hoped that it would be more traditional, instead of her doing things behind his back all the time ), and that's a whole other world compared to the rest of the workgroup. It's very interesting how such differing viewpoints could exist in such a small geographical area....

So I don't know what the reality is for you. But in my experience, if you believe an unsurmountable obstacle is there, then it will be there. If you don't believe there is one (or even if it's just a minor inconvenience instead), you'll find a way around it.

Well that's really a question for another time but no Bangladesh is diverse enough to not make people have those very traditional/conservative views all the time. I mean, less about the social norms is the idea of social safety, this is after all a third-world country and I think most young girls do want some level of "security" from their guys (when they do have guys). Which is fine I mean as long people don't become chauvinistic about it. I'm not that outdoorsy myself, hell I still haven't gotten around to knowing my way around town all that well (just the places where I frequent so yeah), so I'm sure that's a downer for any girls I meet around here. Hell I'm convinced that's not even a cultural thing, right?

Originally Posted by Nell2ThaIzzay

She talks to me

She's even gotten mad at me, accusing me of ignoring her because I don't go out of my way to talk to her. I basically make her put forth any effort at talking and communication.

She's a "friend" in terms of we talk on the phone / text / talk in person when we see each other, and there is a level of a relationship there between us. If you're asking if I'm "friend zoned", I highly doubt that.

What exactly do you mean my "invest"? I mean, I talk to her in a "keeping options open" kind of way, so I guess on that level I "invest".

I don't "invest" in terms of waiting around for something to happen. I have too many other things going on in my life, both romantically and otherwise, to wait around for some girl to figure out which dude she wants in her life. I've even flat out told her that I'm not going to be her walking ego boost that she can turn to when she's not happy with her man.

you're flirting with her, she's someone you know, you're not friendzoned yet. I know why I'm not asking pot-head girl out but what's your deal bro?

[Anita18]

Originally Posted by amazingfantasy15

I think you missed Anita's point, it's not about filling traditional roles, it's about that person having your back. Knowing that when the chips are down there's someone there that will help pick you up. Like when she's having a bad day or week or month at work, just listening to her as she unloads her feelings and interjecting every so often to try and help her work through the problem. Or when either of you are sick, letting that other person take care of you, not because they feel obligated, but because they care and it makes them feel good to help you get better. It's not gender roles, just helping and having the other's back.

Yeah I missed that part of Nave's post. Lucky for him too, or else I would have brought out the big time!

Supportive doesn't mean "physically taking care of me," although he is better at killing spiders than I am. I'm more comfortable walking around at night by myself than he is, for one. It's not really a traditional role.

I think everyone's goal for a relationship is to form a partnership such that the whole of it is greater than the sum of its parts. I'd be fine without him, but I acknowledge that he makes me a better person. And vice versa.

And I dunno, I don't have much respect for the whole "filling traditional roles" thing. Like my coworker has a fairly traditional marriage, but she's career-ambitious too! So she ends up doing both her work stuff and all the home-stuff, and resents her husband for bossing her around like she doesn't have enough to do! He's holding her back, he won't let her fulfill her potential, and for that reason alone, I don't think they should be together. Your partner should not hold you back from your dreams.

Originally Posted by Nave 'Torment'

So what you're saying is that, objectively at least, don't go out with pot-head girl since she's pot-head girl, but don't lock myself out either and wait for the "right moment" for me and just be open towards other people?

Coz that makes sense. Even though I'll probably prefer to go to that 100% and then proceed.

What do you mean by 100%? Cause I assure you, it's a very very rare relationship that starts at 100%. They can certainly progress very quickly (I do know people who got married within a year of meeting), but I don't know anyone who met their partners and was immediately committed to marrying them. That's just like....incredibly unrealistic.

It all starts with getting to know them first. You can't go 100% in without getting to know the person.

Originally Posted by Nave 'Torment'

Well that's really a question for another time but no Bangladesh is diverse enough to not make people have those very traditional/conservative views all the time. I mean, less about the social norms is the idea of social safety, this is after all a third-world country and I think most young girls do want some level of "security" from their guys (when they do have guys). Which is fine I mean as long people don't become chauvinistic about it. I'm not that outdoorsy myself, hell I still haven't gotten around to knowing my way around town all that well (just the places where I frequent so yeah), so I'm sure that's a downer for any girls I meet around here. Hell I'm convinced that's not even a cultural thing, right?

Could be a niche sort of culture. Just because it isn't applicable to an entire area doesn't mean it's not culture.

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

Originally Posted by Nave 'Torment'

you're flirting with her, she's someone you know, you're not friendzoned yet. I know why I'm not asking pot-head girl out but what's your deal bro?

She has a boyfriend.

[ComicChick]

Originally Posted by Anita18

I was well into my 20s when I figured out that nobody is "better" or "out of their league" than anyone else. There's only "does this person think in the wavelength I do."

i'm finally getting to the point where i am realizing that i need to slow down and quit working myself into the grave (being sent from work to the ER saturday helped emphasize that point)

but for the first time in a long time i actually feel like i'd be ok dating, but the only guys hitting on me are engaged, married, 10+ years older than me and i'm not interested in pursuing that at all. the guys i do like, i start to feel... inadequate and then i kinda just let it sit on the back burner.

i don't want to settle for less than i deserve or want, but sometimes that debbie downer voice in the back of my head tries to tell me that that might be all i'm gonna get :/

[TheAQU4M4N]

Not sure if im stepping on any toes, but How many people on here have lost their virginity at an early age? Like in the early teens?

[Charlie Boy]

What do you consider to be "early teens"?

[TheAQU4M4N]

Originally Posted by Charlie Boy

What do you consider to be "early teens"?

Lol like 13-16

[Anita18]

Originally Posted by ComicChick

i'm finally getting to the point where i am realizing that i need to slow down and quit working myself into the grave (being sent from work to the ER saturday helped emphasize that point)

but for the first time in a long time i actually feel like i'd be ok dating, but the only guys hitting on me are engaged, married, 10+ years older than me and i'm not interested in pursuing that at all. the guys i do like, i start to feel... inadequate and then i kinda just let it sit on the back burner.

i don't want to settle for less than i deserve or want, but sometimes that debbie downer voice in the back of my head tries to tell me that that might be all i'm gonna get :/

Grargh, the ER?! Are you doing okay?

Being worked into the grave is IMO never good. IIRC isn't a non-managerial retail job? Being worked like that is not worth it ESPECIALLY for a job like that! You're young, you shouldn't be suffering so much for a job that isn't your lifelong dream/passion.

I know what you mean about the inadequacy thing. I'm super-shy in person and would never be able to ask someone out, or flirt without knowing if they were attracted to me first. That's why they invented online dating.

And IMO someone is only settling if they're with someone who treats them like crap. Obviously that includes already-attached people, cheaters, abusers, etc. If someone isn't as attractive as you (which is always subjective anyway) or makes as much money as you, but they treat you exceedingly well, is that really settling? And that's not something you can sense right away.

[Charlie Boy]

Originally Posted by xMaNiAx

Not sure if im stepping on any toes, but How many people on here have lost their virginity at an early age? Like in the early teens?

I was 16. Why do you ask?

[bonoferox]

This has most likely been brought up countless times, but why is it that someone will still carry an attachment to a person who treated him or her like complete *****? I'm in a starting relationship with an amazing girl, but we're still not official with one reason being that she's having a hard time getting over her ex.
This guy is a treat who never wanted her while he had her, but now that she's attached to someone else, he wants nothing more than to keep tearing her down. He's literally like a 5-year old who never played with a toy but then throws a fit once it gets taken away. While he was with her, he cheated on her, did nothing but criticize her, only went to see her once and made the burden lie on her to drive 9 hours to see him. Meanwhile, he would say everything was her fault and still does to this day. He even went as far as creating accounts on forums that I frequent to spy on me (chances are, he's spying on this forum and is most likely reading this).

She knows she needs to cut him out, for herself and her own well-being if nothing else, but still can't tell him to go ***** himself like she should especially since he's proven that he only cares about his ego.

[Erzengel]

She might have jumped too soon into a new relationship if she's still harboring feelings for her ex.

If you want to be somewhat understanding right now, and supportive while she makes this transition because you two are just starting out I think that's fine.

However, there's going to come a point where she's going to pretty much have to choose. Either cut the cord with him or with you.

[hopefuldreamer]

I always feel really sad when I miss this much discussion! It's too late to jump in, but it looks like it's been a lot going on!

The one thing I will say, is that a lot of what Nave is saying mirrors how I feel.

I guess the only difference is I AM the girl on the wrong side of the tracks. But at least I WANT to straighten up and fly right.

That's half the problem for me though. I'm still in this messy, ****** up world of mine. Moving town was supposed to help. But I guess you can't outrun the problems on the inside. And I feel like until I sort myself out properly, there is no point in even looking... cause the only people who are going to be attracted to me in my current screwed up state, are people who are just as screwed up or people who want to 'save me'.

So in that way, yeah I wanna feel like I am 110% sorted before I start including someone else in my life, letting them in, sharing with them.

Originally Posted by xMaNiAx

Lol like 13-16

I didn't personally. Lost mine at 19. But 19 was considered weird... I felt like I was much too old and was constantly fretting about it and wishing it would come along soon (but I was just really adamant that I had to be in love first). Most of my friends lost theirs at 14-16.

Of course, while I was in love when I lost it, and in a sense that memory is a good one and everything I wanted it to be... later finding out the truth of the relationship, and that he'd cheated on me a week before with another man, has made me feel like I should have been happier to wait and not been so adamant that he was THE guy I wanted to loose it with just cause it was the first time i'd been in love and he seemed to love me back.

[bonoferox]

Originally Posted by Erzengel

She might have jumped too soon into a new relationship if she's still harboring feelings for her ex.

If you want to be somewhat understanding right now, and supportive while she makes this transition because you two are just starting out I think that's fine.

However, there's going to come a point where she's going to pretty much have to choose. Either cut the cord with him or with you.

I agree. We do spend quite a bit of time together, but we are still taking it slow right now until these obstacles get out of the way. Some days can be easier than others. She finally blocked him on fb, but still(yet rarely) answers his phone calls even though they always turn into shouting matches with her pissed at him.

It's just appalling how insecure he is about himself and yet he feels he has to blame others for it.

[Erzengel]

I mean if this guy lives 9 hours away. I'm sure after a while of being with you, it should resolve itself. If she wants to go see him OR if he's in town, you guys really need to have a conversation.

[bonoferox]

He's not in town, luckily. She and I live about 6 hours away, but still get to see eachother quite often and do talk every day (a lot of it about how she needs to get over him). There seems to be progression at times, but other times, not so much.

But yeah, an ultimatum may be the only option down the road as much as it may pain me to think of losing a possible future with her.

[Erzengel]

How far does he live from her?

[Anita18]

Originally Posted by hopefuldreamer

I always feel really sad when I miss this much discussion! It's too late to jump in, but it looks like it's been a lot going on!

The one thing I will say, is that a lot of what Nave is saying mirrors how I feel.

I guess the only difference is I AM the girl on the wrong side of the tracks. But at least I WANT to straighten up and fly right.

That's half the problem for me though. I'm still in this messy, ****** up world of mine. Moving town was supposed to help. But I guess you can't outrun the problems on the inside. And I feel like until I sort myself out properly, there is no point in even looking... cause the only people who are going to be attracted to me in my current screwed up state, are people who are just as screwed up or people who want to 'save me'.

So in that way, yeah I wanna feel like I am 110% sorted before I start including someone else in my life, letting them in, sharing with them.

You said on Fb you'd get help if you couldn't sort it out yourself...and you fell off that wagon pretty quickly. Are you still planning to get help? Are there support groups where you are? I'm betting that there are people in the exact same boat as you. You just need to find them, and lift yourselves up together. It's as you said - if your f***ed up world is all you know, it's impossible to get out. You need to have oases in your life.

[bonoferox]

Originally Posted by Erzengel

How far does he live from her?

He lives 9 hours away from her.

He's made the mistake of putting a lot of his immature rants into texts and emails, which she has saved for future use against him.

[Erzengel]

Originally Posted by bonoferox

He lives 9 hours away from her.

He's made the mistake of putting a lot of his immature rants into texts and emails, which she has saved for future use against him.

Well good luck.

I mean, it's hard enough being near someone who's not over an ex but someone who lives 6 hours away, let's just say she has a lot of time alone to think and be bothered.

[bonoferox]

Thanks. And definitely. I'll just continue to be there for her as well as I can.

[knowsbleed]

For those who don't usually have extensive relationship problems, what's the longest you've gone between relationships? I'm trying to get a gauge/establish a baseline here... help me out.

[Erzengel]

A year?

[knowsbleed]

Are you sure?

[TheAQU4M4N]

Originally Posted by knowsbleed

For those who don't usually have extensive relationship problems, what's the longest you've gone between relationships? I'm trying to get a gauge/establish a baseline here... help me out.

Almost two years.